New Stadium Locations

[ArgosFanEastSide]

As a resident of Pickering, I think our city should be considered. There is tons of room near the newly renovated GO station (where the large secondary parking lot is which the city is planning to remove for "growth"), that is 30 minutes from downtown on the express Lakeshore East line (40 minutes non-express). This area is also literally right off the 401 (making it a 20-30 minute drive for anyone in Toronto that lives near the 401). It would also be relatively easy to build a 401 off ramp right at the location. For anyone who is unfamiliar with the area, use Google Maps to check the travel time to the intersection of Liverpool and Bayly. I bet it's not that long of a time. The location would be very easily accessible for anyone near the Lakeshore GO line or the 401, which is a very large portion of people. It would also be able to draw on Durham Region's 500k+ population, the northern suburbs of Markham, Richmond Hill and Vaughan, and would undoubtedly draw people from as far east as Peterborough. I'd argue that the western side of the Toronto, and Mississauga, are too close to Hamilton as well.

Just another idea to consider.

Edit: What the area looks like right now: https://maps.google.ca/?ll=43.833575...12,233.52,,0,0. The other side of that dead end is the 401.

[doubleblue]

That would be great for me but I expect a new Stadium will be more central. Either BMO or more north central.

[paulwoods13]

I'd argue that the western side of the Toronto, and Mississauga, are too close to Hamilton as well.

So the Argos should abandon fans in those regions? We should all become Ticat fans?

[Neely2005]

As a resident of Pickering, I think our city should be considered. There is tons of room near the newly renovated GO station (where the large secondary parking lot is which the city is planning to remove for "growth"), that is 30 minutes from downtown on the express Lakeshore East line (40 minutes non-express). This area is also literally right off the 401 (making it a 20-30 minute drive for anyone in Toronto that lives near the 401). It would also be relatively easy to build a 401 off ramp right at the location. For anyone who is unfamiliar with the area, use Google Maps to check the travel time to the intersection of Liverpool and Bayly. I bet it's not that long of a time. The location would be very easily accessible for anyone near the Lakeshore GO line or the 401, which is a very large portion of people. It would also be able to draw on Durham Region's 500k+ population, the northern suburbs of Markham, Richmond Hill and Vaughan, and would undoubtedly draw people from as far east as Peterborough. I'd argue that the western side of the Toronto, and Mississauga, are too close to Hamilton as well.

Just another idea to consider.

Edit: What the area looks like right now: https://maps.google.ca/?ll=43.833575...12,233.52,,0,0. The other side of that dead end is the 401.

Sure if all the games are on Saturday or Sunday. On a weekday during the afternoon rush hours triple it.

The 401 through Toronto is the busiest stretch of highway in all of North America.

[ArgosFanEastSide]

So the Argos should abandon fans in those regions? We should all become Ticat fans?

I guess I wasn't clear on what I meant. Rather, that the suburbs west of Toronto/Mississauga are more likely to be Tiger-cats fans than those on the eastern side. Taking the GO train from south Mississauga/Etobicoke, or taking the 401 from the north to Pickering would not be too long of a trip on the weekends.

Sure if all the games are on Saturday or Sunday. On a weekday during the afternoon rush hours triple it.

The 401 through Toronto is the busiest stretch of highway in all of North America.

I don't see any reason why all of their games couldn't be played on Saturdays and Sundays. I'm sure a significant factor in why they play on weekdays is because they are in the Rogers Center. If we're making the assumption that they are going to start many of their games during rush hour on weekdays, I think you can write off any area outside of downtown.

I laugh anytime anyone proposes the stadium be located in their backyard.

I'm not sure why. People who live in the area are much more likely to know fine details relating to it. I never said any other ideas weren't better, I was simply suggesting a new location that no one else had discussed.

[Neely2005]

I guess I wasn't clear on what I meant. Rather, that the suburbs west of Toronto/Mississauga are more likely to be Tiger-cats fans than those on the eastern side. Taking the GO train from south Mississauga/Etobicoke, or taking the 401 from the north to Pickering would not be too long of a trip on the weekends.



I don't see any reason why all of their games couldn't be played on Saturdays and Sundays. I'm sure a significant factor in why they play on weekdays is because they are in the Rogers Center. If we're making the assumption that they are going to start many of their games during rush hour on weekdays, I think you can write off any area outside of downtown.



I'm not sure why. People who live in the area are much more likely to know fine details relating to it. I never said any other ideas weren't better, I was simply suggesting a new location that no one else had discussed.

TSN Friday Night Football?

Vaughan, Downsview and eventually Richmond Hill will all be accessible via TTC Subway. They're already accessible via GO Train and Bus / High Speed Bus and aside from Downsview they have better highway access and are in Toronto or closer to Toronto.

[ArgosFanEastSide]

TSN Friday Night Football?

Vaughan, Downsview and eventually Richmond Hill will all be accessible via TTC Subway. They're already accessible via GO Train and Bus / High Speed Bus and aside from Downsview they have better highway access and are in Toronto or closer to Toronto.

Friday Night Football is just a title, it could literally instantly be changed to TSN Saturday Night Football.

I can think of equal negatives to all of those locations. None of them are along the GO Lakeshore line, which is how a very significant amount of Argos fans currently get to the games. Getting to those locations during rush hour (if you're sticking to the weekday games argument) for anyone driving would be just as awful.

In the end, none of the locations are perfect. Someone is always going to disagree with the decision, and yet I think any of those locations would do well. I just believe that Pickering would work just as well.

[paulwoods13]

Friday Night Football is just a title, it could literally instantly be changed to TSN Saturday Night Football.

There is no way TSN would eliminate the brand equity it has built up with FNF, and in any event the network is always going to need multiple days to show games. Fridays will always be part of that. I suppose the Argos could be exempted from hosting games on Fridays (as Montreal seems to be because of its agreement with McGill) but I can't see the other teams agreeing to let Toronto have only weekend home dates while everyone else has to do Fridays and some Thursdays. Montreal has home games on Thursdays as well as weekend days.

I can think of equal negatives to all of those locations. None of them are along the GO Lakeshore line, which is how a very significant amount of Argos fans currently get to the games. Getting to those locations during rush hour (if you're sticking to the weekday games argument) for anyone driving would be just as awful.

In the end, none of the locations are perfect. Someone is always going to disagree with the decision, and yet I think any of those locations would do well. I just believe that Pickering would work just as well.

You are right that there are a lot of fans on the Lakeshore Go line, and that there is no location that will make everyone happy. The Argos' challenge is to choose a location that minimizes the erosion of existing fans and maximizes the influx of new fans. I have a hard time seeing how a stadium at either far extreme of the Lakeshore line (i.e. in Pickering or Burlington) would achieve that goal.

I guess I wasn't clear on what I meant. Rather, that the suburbs west of Toronto/Mississauga are more likely to be Tiger-cats fans than those on the eastern side.

Yes, the western suburbs are more likely to be Ticats fans than Argo fans, but it's a pretty meaningless statistic. My perception is that there are very few Ticat fans in Mississauga, a few more (but still a small number) in Oakville, and relatively equal support for both teams in Burlington. There may be no Ticat fans whatsoever in Oshawa/Whitby/Pickering, which would make the "more likely" statement true, but if there is one Ticat fan in Mississauga and none in Pickering, that doesn't make it worth abandoning the comparatively much larger group of Argo fans in Mississauga.

[intoronto]

I don't agree BMO Field is the best option for the Argos. BMO Field is a soccer specific facility and should be left as is (besides the FC fans are objecting the idea already). What the Argos need is a 25,000-30,000 seat facility built somewhere accessible by transit. York University maybe?

[paulwoods13]

I don't agree BMO Field is the best option for the Argos. BMO Field is a soccer specific facility and should be left as is (besides the FC fans are objecting the idea already). What the Argos need is a 25,000-30,000 seat facility built somewhere accessible by transit. York University maybe?

Welcome to the site. Feel free to peruse the many threads that have dealt with this issue and continue to do so. Here is a summary of the salient points:

Everyone seems to accept that York is not an option. The team itself has said the footprint for a potential stadium there is too small.

Some fans believe the best options are in the North (such as Downsview, Woodbine, Vaughan or Markham) because they are easily accessible by car. Other say no location requiring a drive is truly easily accessible in Toronto's congested traffic.

Some fans say BMO is ideal because it accessible by highway and transit from all directions. (This of course is predicated on the stadium being rebuilt to accommodate Cdn football.) Others say BMO is a pain in the a-- to get to by car and transit.

Some fans believe that direct public transit from all directions must be available, as it is now. Others say it's OK to have one or two transit options (such as subway and Viva or whatever the regional public transit is called in the north) but not necessary to make the game easily accessible to those who now take GO Transit on the Lakeshore line.

A few other ideas have been floated (such as stadium in Mississauga, Oakville or now Pickering) but there does not seem to be any consensus in favour of those.

Some fans say they are sure that Braley will build his own stadium in the North. Others say they are sure Braley will not spend his own money on a stadium.

Some fans think being bought by MLSE (and moving into BMO) would be ideal because the team would have wealthy owners who would make merchandise available and support the team regardless. Others say being owned by MLSE would be a complete disaster because its teams never win.

Have I forgotten anything?

[Neely2005]

Welcome to the site. Feel free to peruse the many threads that have dealt with this issue and continue to do so. Here is a summary of the salient points:

Everyone seems to accept that York is not an option. The team itself has said the footprint for a potential stadium there is too small.

Some fans believe the best options are in the North (such as Downsview, Woodbine, Vaughan or Markham) because they are easily accessible by car. Other say no location requiring a drive is truly easily accessible in Toronto's congested traffic.

Some fans say BMO is ideal because it accessible by highway and transit from all directions. (This of course is predicated on the stadium being rebuilt to accommodate Cdn football.) Others say BMO is a pain in the a-- to get to by car and transit.

Some fans believe that direct public transit from all directions must be available, as it is now. Others say it's OK to have one or two transit options (such as subway and Viva or whatever the regional public transit is called in the north) but not necessary to make the game easily accessible to those who now take GO Transit on the Lakeshore line.

A few other ideas have been floated (such as stadium in Mississauga, Oakville or now Pickering) but there does not seem to be any consensus in favour of those.

Some fans say they are sure that Braley will build his own stadium in the North. Others say they are sure Braley will not spend his own money on a stadium.

Some fans think being bought by MLSE (and moving into BMO) would be ideal because the team would have wealthy owners who would make merchandise available and support the team regardless. Others say being owned by MLSE would be a complete disaster because its teams never win.

Have I forgotten anything?

That's a pretty good summary. I think that the only thing that you forgot to mention is the TTC Subway extension that will be opening in Vaughan.

I keep seeing this $200 million number. It seems to be the general consensus. Can anyone tell me why? BMO Field's construction cost was $67.6 million and everyone is saying that set up would be fine. I mean sure, if you're going to throw all the bells and whistles on it will cost more, but I think it could be done for less.

I don't think that there were any land costs for BMO though.




The commissioner talks about a new stadium for the Argonauts:

http://www.thestar.com/sports/argos/...ce_cox.bb.html

[Argo57]

I don't agree BMO Field is the best option for the Argos. BMO Field is a soccer specific facility and should be left as is (besides the FC fans are objecting the idea already). What the Argos need is a 25,000-30,000 seat facility built somewhere accessible by transit. York University maybe?

Hence the $100 million BMO renovation being discussed, I see a pretty decent amount of Argonaut fans taking the Go Train from Burlington and increasing (as Paul stated) as you go east. Stadium has to be centrally located to suit the masses, I wouldn't be remotely interested in travelling to Pickering to see them play.
FC fans can object all they want but if the hypothetical MLSE purchase comes to fruition then it will become a dual purpose stadium.

[intoronto]

Thanks for the welcome !

Hence the $100 million BMO renovation being discussed, I see a pretty decent amount of Argonaut fans taking the Go Train from Burlington and increasing (as Paul stated) as you go east. Stadium has to be centrally located to suit the masses, I wouldn't be remotely interested in travelling to Pickering to see them play.
FC fans can object all they want but if the hypothetical MLSE purchase comes to fruition then it will become a dual purpose stadium.

Wouldn't you rather spend $100 million on a new stadium?

The York University site is not the current Pan Am Stadium. There is lands surrounding the university where a stadium can easily be sloted in. Two transit slots are there and its very close to a highway. I think its a win win as its accessible by car and transit, while being close to the 905.

Woodbine could also work, as the Woodbine Live redevelopment didn't work out, however its only accessible by car. What if someone doesn't have a car? A site needs to cater to people with cars and those who will commute with transit.

[Argo57]

Thanks for the welcome !




Wouldn't you rather spend $100 million on a new stadium?

The York University site is not the current Pan Am Stadium. There is lands surrounding the university where a stadium can easily be sloted in. Two transit slots are there and its very close to a highway. I think its a win win as its accessible by car and transit, while being close to the 905.

Woodbine could also work, as the Woodbine Live redevelopment didn't work out, however its only accessible by car. What if someone doesn't have a car? A site needs to cater to people with cars and those who will commute with transit.

A new stadium would cost $200 million or more, if MLSE chooses to purchase the Argos and spend $100 million on the Reno so be it.