TV ratings

[Tau Ceti]

I don't know where you are getting your info from but based on my observations in western Canada (BC - MB) is that there is little interest in the NBA and even less in the Raptors. I've been to sports stores in all Western Canadian cities and you would be hard pressed to find any NBA/Raptors gear there. On the sports stations the talk is overwhelmingly NHL, followed by CFL/NFL, MLB and then Jr Hockey before anything comes up about NBA/Raptors.

I was actually reminded of an article I read a few months back: http://business.financialpost.com/20...only-one-team/. I've also read the exhibition game in Montreal is doing quite well.

[VANRIDERFAN]

I was actually reminded of an article I read a few months back: http://business.financialpost.com/20...only-one-team/. I've also read the exhibition game in Montreal is doing quite well.

Bit of a fluff piece IMO.

Q: The NBA has seen some significant growth in Canada. Can you break down how you measure that?
A: Broadcast numbers is one way people do it. Overall, broadcast numbers are up about 19% over last year. - 19% of SFA is still SFA!
merchandise sales (adidas Canada NBA apparel sales are up 103% over last year), - Again 103% of SFA is still SFA!
We saw some data recently that showed basketball participation between 2010 and 2012 jumped 16%, which is a faster growth rate than both soccer and hockey. - Basketball has always been popular at the highschool, college and university level in Canada that still doesn't transfer automatic popularity to the NBA.

But then again this is just my opinion and like the old saying, everyone has one. To quote a recently unemployed head coach - "WHAT SAY YOU?"

[argotom]

My response would be that the TV ratings show that you're wrong.

Yes 100% and for years as well. On top of which, our TV numbers are a close second overall to the NHL.

[ArgoZ]

How do you figure the Raptors have good attendance number. They officially quote 16,000 and change for ther posted attendance aver. This is for a 19,000 and change building. Take away Leaf season ticket holders and there in trouble. I have been to Raptor games, were whole sections are empty, only to claim 16,500. Real number would be closer to 10,000. Media does not comment on the fake attandance numbers for Raptors or TFC game, due to them being owned by MLSE. No sports editor wants his/her reporter to get there access to the Leafs cut off.

Ok, as someone who attended many Raps games last year, I must call you out on your unfounded claims. Despite having a bad record, they were near the top attendance wise in the NBA. The people are there, it doesn't matter where they got tickets, they attended. The games constantly have over 16 000 and it is a very full place. Only the top corners will sometimes be missing fans, hardly whole sections.

What is with the hate on for other Toronto teams by some members? It's ok to like TFC, Raptors, whoever, and like Argos too. Sheesh.

My response would be that the TV ratings show that you're wrong.

Excellent response! I appreciate a fact based reply, rather than the put downs or trashing of another franchise or sport.

Yes 100% and for years as well. On top of which, our TV numbers are a close second overall to the NHL.

ArgoTom. Anyone can take unfounded shots at a team or sport. I didn't appreciate you calling the Raps a joke, crap basketball and only family and friends following. It's just as easy, maybe easier for people to say that about our Argos, and I would defend them too.

[argolio]

Yes 100% and for years as well. On top of which, our TV numbers are a close second overall to the NHL.

2nd overall, I'll buy. When a regular season Argo game gets over 2 million, then I'll buy close.

[T-Bone]

Ok, as someone who attended many Raps games last year, I must call you out on your unfounded claims. Despite having a bad record, they were near the top attendance wise in the NBA. The people are there, it doesn't matter where they got tickets, they attended. The games constantly have over 16 000 and it is a very full place. Only the top corners will sometimes be missing fans, hardly whole sections.

What is with the hate on for other Toronto teams by some members? It's ok to like TFC, Raptors, whoever, and like Argos too. Sheesh.

If you ask me flutie02 crushed his credibility with this:

Enough said, down to 200 season ticket holder and of course TFC does not inflate their attendance

His opinions about teams other than the Argos are slanted by his bias.

[Ballstothewall]

If you ask me flutie02 crushed his credibility

I did not pull the TFC comment about being down to 200 season ticket holders out of thin air, that quote was from the CFO Leiweke himself
http://washpost.bloomberg.com/Story?...80ALNQDKIUG97F

As Far as the Raptors go, I go to over 25 Raptors game a year, I will start posting photos if that what it takes. The ACC seats over 19,000 and they claim an average of 16,000 and change on their own site. They got 54,000 watching their season opener and their TV ratings suck. The Raptors get why more media coverage then they deserve for their small fan base, that's is what I am commenting on

[Tau Ceti]

Bit of a fluff piece IMO.

Q: The NBA has seen some significant growth in Canada. Can you break down how you measure that?
A: Broadcast numbers is one way people do it. Overall, broadcast numbers are up about 19% over last year. - 19% of SFA is still SFA!
merchandise sales (adidas Canada NBA apparel sales are up 103% over last year), - Again 103% of SFA is still SFA!
We saw some data recently that showed basketball participation between 2010 and 2012 jumped 16%, which is a faster growth rate than both soccer and hockey. - Basketball has always been popular at the highschool, college and university level in Canada that still doesn't transfer automatic popularity to the NBA.

But then again this is just my opinion and like the old saying, everyone has one. To quote a recently unemployed head coach - "WHAT SAY YOU?"

No need to shout Vanriderfan! I can hear you all the way over here just fine!

Admittedly that piece reads a little like sponsored content but that doesn't mean the numbers are wrong. A kinder way of saying "SFA" is that they're starting from a relatively low base and, at least in some respects, appear to be improving. There's obviously a tremendous amount of grassroots interest in basketball and I think it's cool we're producing draft picks now. I don't know if we'd have seen that if the NBA had never come to town. (And I'm not even particularly a fan.)

Incidentally, Forbes values that Raptors at $405 MIL. That's a long way from a disaster.

What is with the hate on for other Toronto teams by some members? It's ok to like TFC, Raptors, whoever, and like Argos too. Sheesh.

I don't get it either. There seems to be an attitude that pissing on other teams will make the Argos look good in comparison. I think it makes the board seem petty and cantankerous.

[T-Bone]

I did not pull the TFC comment about being down to 200 season ticket holders out of thin air, that quote was from the CFO Leiweke himself
http://washpost.bloomberg.com/Story?...80ALNQDKIUG97F

Yes but your bias lead you to belive that TFC only has 200 season ticket holders total left instead of reading the quote again and coming to the realization that most did that, that can't be right.

Its once-loyal fan base of ‘Red Army’ season ticketholders has dropped to 200 from 800 in recent years, Leiweke said.

[ArgoRavi]

I don't really see the relevance but according to this it was under 150,000.

I think that it is relevant because all of the other major pro sports teams' TV ratings for their home openers were listed in that article other than TFC.

[VANRIDERFAN]

Jim Lang was on the Sportscage today (Regina radio) and he stated that the Raptors demographic was the 40 and younger crowd while the Argo demographic was the 50 and over crowd. He also said the Raptors are pretty much ignored outside of the GTA while the Argos are ignored inside the GTA.
Would you guys agree or disagree with his analysis?
Link:
http://www.620ckrm.com/media/com_pod..._4_podcast.mp3
go to the 1:10.00 mark for the interview

[Mulder]

O
What is with the hate on for other Toronto teams by some members? It's ok to like TFC, Raptors, whoever, and like Argos too. Sheesh.

No. This is wrong. This is an Argo Forum and anyone who posts here is only allowed to like the Argo's. Even though we have an Other Sports area which clearly states to talk about other sports. Doing so would upset the purists.

/Sarcasm

[T-Bone]

Jim Lang was on the Sportscage today (Regina radio) and he stated that the Raptors demographic was the 40 and younger crowd while the Argo demographic was the 50 and over crowd. He also said the Raptors are pretty much ignored outside of the GTA while the Argos are ignored inside the GTA.
Would you guys agree or disagree with his analysis?
Link:
http://www.620ckrm.com/media/com_pod..._4_podcast.mp3
go to the 1:10.00 mark for the interview

I would say that is probably accurate. I'm sure it's been discussed here before that for whatever reasons the Argos seem to have difficulty attracting younger fans. Also these TV numbers that people keep posting here are national numbers correct? I would really like to see a break down of those numbers by region. How many people in Toronto are actually watching the games on TV? Don't get me wrong the TV numbers are impressive but that is just one aspect of the existence of this team. I know there has been many comments about CFL haters in Toronto but if you ask me those people are the minority. The majority are indifferent and couldn't care less if the team exists or not. That to me is worse than the hater because at least the haters are paying some attention.

[paulwoods13]

Yes but your bias lead you to belive that TFC only has 200 season ticket holders total left instead of reading the quote again and coming to the realization that most did that, that can't be right.

I interpreted Leiweke's statement to mean that a specific group of fans known as Red Army had dropped from 800 to 200. I inferred that Red Army is just one of many fan "tribes" the team has and caters to. Red Patch Boys being another, and I assumed there were several of these groups (as well as "unaffiliated" season-ticket holders), but only Red Army had shown such a drop. T-Bone, is that correct?

[T-Bone]

I interpreted Leiweke's statement to mean that a specific group of fans known as Red Army had dropped from 800 to 200. I inferred that Red Army is just one of many fan "tribes" the team has and caters to. Red Patch Boys being another, and I assumed there were several of these groups (as well as "unaffiliated" season-ticket holders), but only Red Army had shown such a drop. T-Bone, is that correct?

It was discussed in the TFC thread and it appears Leiweke made a mistake and referred to the Red Patch Boys supporters club (They're not called tribes.) as the Red Army. Apparently it was their paid membership that dropped from 800 to 200 over the past seven years. I'm sure not all 800 of those RPB members had TFC season tickets to begin with and not all 600 that dropped their RPB membership dropped their TFC season tickets. At last count TFC season ticket holders are upwards of 15,000.

[paulwoods13]

It was discussed in the TFC thread and it appears Leiweke made a mistake and referred to the Red Patch Boys supporters club (They're not called tribes.) as the Red Army. Apparently it was their paid membership that dropped from 800 to 200 over the past seven years. I'm sure not all 800 of those RPB members had TFC season tickets to begin with and not all 600 that dropped their RPB membership dropped their TFC season tickets. At last count TFC season ticket holders are upwards of 15,000.

Thanks for that additional info. I didn't mean "tribes" as a pejorative, by the way, but apologize if any offence was taken.

[T-Bone]

Thanks for that additional info. I didn't mean "tribes" as a pejorative, by the way, but apologize if any offence was taken.

No problem and no offence taken, just clarifying. There is a TFC supporters group called Tribal Rhythm Nation.

[Neely2005]

I don't really see the relevance but according to this it was under 150,000.

Thank you. It's relevant in the context of the article that listed the ratings for all of the Toronto home openers.

Ok, as someone who attended many Raps games last year, I must call you out on your unfounded claims. Despite having a bad record, they were near the top attendance wise in the NBA. The people are there, it doesn't matter where they got tickets, they attended. The games constantly have over 16 000 and it is a very full place. Only the top corners will sometimes be missing fans, hardly whole sections.

What is with the hate on for other Toronto teams by some members? It's ok to like TFC, Raptors, whoever, and like Argos too. Sheesh.

It matters if they're giving away a lot of tickets for free (like the Bills in Toronto games do) Paid Attendance is what's important.

Jim Lang was on the Sportscage today (Regina radio) and he stated that the Raptors demographic was the 40 and younger crowd while the Argo demographic was the 50 and over crowd. He also said the Raptors are pretty much ignored outside of the GTA while the Argos are ignored inside the GTA.
Would you guys agree or disagree with his analysis?
Link:
http://www.620ckrm.com/media/com_pod..._4_podcast.mp3
go to the 1:10.00 mark for the interview

Well almost all of the Argonauts fans that I know are well under 50, myself included.

[T-Bone]

Well almost all of the Argonauts fans that I know are well under 50, myself included.

Ok, but what is the average age of people that attend Argos games? I would not hesitate to guess that the average age is mid to late 40's.

[Neely2005]

Ok, but what is the average age of people that attend Argos games? I would not hesitate to guess that the average age is mid to late 40's.

You could be right, I've never paid much attention to that. I do notice that there always seems to be lots of kids at the games though. I'll try to pay more attenton at the Eastern Final.