Argos at BMO Field

[T-Bone]

I mean care about the stadium being soccer specific, or what the playing surface is like. Honsetly, and it's not just TFC, I think we tend to over estimate how many fans attending any sporting events actually care as in depth as those of us die hards do. Die hard fans are in the minority of any sporting team.

Perhaps. The fact that a natural surface was installed at a greater expense means someone cared though. If not the fans, than management at the time. The reality is the playing surface effects the game of soccer more than it does football. I understand people wanting the surface to be the best it can be. Unfortunately people are overacting on both the Argos and TFC sides of the fence (More on the TFC side) and it is going to continue for quite some time. If the Argos move into BMO Field and everything works out hopefully it will stop.

[Fumblitis]

I mean care about the stadium being soccer specific, or what the playing surface is like. Honsetly, and it's not just TFC, I think we tend to over estimate how many fans attending any sporting events actually care as in depth as those of us die hards do. Die hard fans are in the minority of any sporting team.

I don't know about that. The other night was the first time the Leafs haven't sold out in eons. I hardly consider that a "minority of diehards" considering the Leafs have been mediocre at best for years.

[johnnyice]

Good point about the Blizzard. Don't forget, Argolio, that a perfectly good football stadium in old Exhibition Stadium had to be reconfigured for the Blue Jays in the mid-1970s and I don't recall Argos fans being up in arms over that although I was fairly young at the time.

When the MLB purists rolled into The EX , it was a helluva lot tougher to sneak in a jug of passion elixir; other than that , no complaints.....

[Will]

Nobody even knows the details about how BMO will be configured to accommodate both Toronto FC and the Argonauts. So really isn't anyone complaining either way just blowing hot air at this point? I had a thought, maybe sports fans wouldn't be at each other's throats in this city if the teams weren't stinking up the joint.

[1argoholic]

Well when The Argonauts were kings of CNE Stadium not one fan I knew was pissed when we shared the field with The Toronto Blizzard (hell I even went to see them) or when the Jays came to town. The Jays were welcoming big time to TO and now it's owners turn around and shite all over the Argonauts.

Problem is that the young TFC fan base comes from that me me generation who believes they are owed everything because they are so special. Their stadium, their red seats, their grass, they're a$$holes!!!!

Screwed sports city with fractured fan bases who all have issues with one another. The worst sports city in North America by far. Hopefully being near anything MLSE doesn't turn the Argos into crap. MLSE is great at that. Proves that mega bucks doesn't mean winning products. What it does mean is good marketing to suck fools in. I wouldn't pay year in and year out to see non playoff teams.

[Fumblitis]

.

Problem is that the young TFC fan base comes from that me me generation who believes they are owed everything because they are so special. Their stadium, their red seats, their grass, they're a$$holes!!!!

Never chalked that BMO fiasco up to the "me generation" but a good observation nonetheless.

[T-Bone]

The Toronto Argonauts Have No Place on the Pitch

[Godfather]

I'm convinced that the Argos in BMO is part of MLSE's plan to pay for the stadium upgrades (MLSE ownership of the argos is part of that as well). This could be why Braley is playing hardball. He knows what having the argos at BMO is worth to MLSE in terms of stadium naming rights, Grey Cups etc. All this will pay the BMO upgrades over time.

The TFC fans just don't see this. They keep crying about the field but don't realize that the BMO upgrade (more seats, roof, restaurant etc) is only happening because the argos will become a tenant.

They actually believe that a $100m stadium upgrade is happening for a team that draws 18,000 per game, hasn't ever made the playoffs, and gets a TV audience of 20K per game. MLSE will never get their money back on the BMO upgrade without the argos playing there.

[T-Bone]

I'm convinced that the Argos in BMO is part of MLSE's plan to pay for the stadium upgrades (MLSE ownership of the argos is part of that as well). This could be why Braley is playing hardball. He knows what having the argos at BMO is worth to MLSE in terms of stadium naming rights, Grey Cups etc. All this will pay the BMO upgrades over time.

The TFC fans just don't see this. They keep crying about the field but don't realize that the BMO upgrade (more seats, roof, restaurant etc) is only happening because the argos will become a tenant.

They actually believe that a $100m stadium upgrade is happening for a team that draws 18,000 per game, hasn't ever made the playoffs, and gets a TV audience of 20K per game. MLSE will never get their money back on the BMO upgrade without the argos playing there.

Do you honestly believe the upgrades are only being made because the Argos are going to BMO Field? The upgrades are geared at cooperate clients and to host a Winter Classic. Argos will add an additional revenue stream but aren't the sole purpose of the upgrades.

[AngeloV]

Do you honestly believe the upgrades are only being made because the Argos are going to BMO Field? The upgrades are geared at cooperate clients and to host a Winter Classic. Argos will add an additional revenue stream but aren't the sole purpose of the upgrades.

Grey Cups will likely bring in more than a winter classic, which may be just a 1 time event. I may be wrong, but I don't believe any city has hosted multiple winter classics with the exception of New York, that hosted 2 in the same week. You may see one every 10 years or so, and I would guess you would see a Grey Cup every 5 years, especially if the market became a strong one.

This could be why Braley is playing hardball

If he was ever trying to get in the driver's seat as far as selling the team, don't you think it would be wise to do some work and sell some tickets? That would be the #1 thing he can do to get his asking price.

[T-Bone]

Grey Cups will likely bring in more than a winter classic, which may be just a 1 time event. I may be wrong, but I don't believe any city has hosted multiple winter classics with the exception of New York, that hosted 2 in the same week. You may see one every 10 years or so, and I would guess you would see a Grey Cup every 5 years, especially if the market became a strong one.

Do you believe the upgrades to BMO Field are only being made for the Argos? Personally, I think the Argos at BMO Field would have been a done deal by now if that were the case.

[AngeloV]

Do you believe the upgrades to BMO Field are only being made for the Argos?

No I don't. But I think they are a major reason for it. They definitely will need to fill more dates to justify it. Unless MLS really takes off from a TV point view down south, they will never make enough money to justify the marquee contracts they are paying out. At least the CFL has a true salary control to limit the risk.

[T-Bone]

No I don't. But I think they are a major reason for it. They definitely will need to fill more dates to justify it.

I won't be surprised if the Leafs have an outdoor game every year. Grey Cups would defiantly help but I think that falls in the bonus column if it happens.

[AngeloV]

I won't be surprised if the Leafs have an outdoor game every year. Grey Cups would defiantly help but I think that falls in the bonus column if it happens.

Don't think the League will grant the Leafs a game every year. The admitted to going overboard on the number of games last year, and want to keep it as a special event, meaning likely 1 or 2 a year. They would also want to move it around, so I can't see more than 1 every 10 years or so.

[Ballstothewall]

Done...and I actually did it without being rude to the TFC fans that feel entitled.

**EDIT**

I love how these TFC hardcore fans are tweeting that this will stop him from being re-elected. In a city of over 2,000,000, do they really think that the 20-30k of them have that big a say? And let's be honest, there probably are only a few hundred or so that would genuinely be that upset.

Good job Angelo, let them know we Argo fans are out here

[rdavies]

Grey Cups will likely bring in more than a winter classic, which may be just a 1 time event. I may be wrong, but I don't believe any city has hosted multiple winter classics with the exception of New York, that hosted 2 in the same week. You may see one every 10 years or so, and I would guess you would see a Grey Cup every 5 years, especially if the market became a strong one.

I might be wrong but I was under the impression that the PTB saw how succesfull the Grey Cup was in Toronto and that sparked the idea of an annual week long hockey festival. Kind of a combination Grey Cup and Hockey Day in Canada culminating in a Leafs outdoor game.

[1argoholic]

If the Leafs are involved in an outdoor game they'll have to drop the Classic from the title.haha. It'll be The Outdoor Hockey Game.

The way I look at it is MLSE will do to the field what they like and TFC players and fans will have to deal with it. The Argos just show up and practice and play where they are told. Hell they've practiced at high school fields from Oakville to Etobicoke as well as U of T Erindale, York U, covered play fields, gyms and who knows were else. Through some of the toughest times they still won a Championship.

[Godfather]

Do you honestly believe the upgrades are only being made because the Argos are going to BMO Field? The upgrades are geared at cooperate clients and to host a Winter Classic. Argos will add an additional revenue stream but aren't the sole purpose of the upgrades.

I suggest you re-read my post as I never said the argos are the only reason for the BMO upgrade.

Just a point on the winter classic and Grey Cup. If MLSE were to own the argos the cfl would likely grant them the Grey Cup every five or six years. MLSE selling 40K seats at BMO and Toronto being the easiest city to get to in Canada shouldn't be a problem. The Grey Cup is an additional event that will bring in millions - all net new revenue. While the winter classic is also a big event it won't generate as much money as people think because in order to host a winter classic at BMO that would mean the game would be moved from the ACC. So if each leaf game at ACC, with 20K seats, produces revenue of $3million (let's say) then the Winter Classic, at 40K seats, would only be considered profitable or worthwhile beyond the $3million revenue plus the costs of putting an ice rink on a football surface (something that is expensive I'm sure). While the Winter Classic would be a huge success it won't generate the net revenue that the Grey Cup would. Also I can't see the leafs holding more than 1-2 of these. The NHL in their greed have gone overboard with Winter Classics and I think people are getting bored with it.

[1argoholic]

It's time to play an NHL game on a frozen lake or pond. Now that's old school.

[AngeloV]

I suggest you re-read my post as I never said the argos are the only reason for the BMO upgrade.

Just a point on the winter classic and Grey Cup. If MLSE were to own the argos the cfl would likely grant them the Grey Cup every five or six years. MLSE selling 40K seats at BMO and Toronto being the easiest city to get to in Canada shouldn't be a problem. The Grey Cup is an additional event that will bring in millions - all net new revenue. While the winter classic is also a big event it won't generate as much money as people think because in order to host a winter classic at BMO that would mean the game would be moved from the ACC. So if each leaf game at ACC, with 20K seats, produces revenue of $3million (let's say) then the Winter Classic, at 40K seats, would only be considered profitable or worthwhile beyond the $3million revenue plus the costs of putting an ice rink on a football surface (something that is expensive I'm sure). While the Winter Classic would be a huge success it won't generate the net revenue that the Grey Cup would. Also I can't see the leafs holding more than 1-2 of these. The NHL in their greed have gone overboard with Winter Classics and I think people are getting bored with it.

Great points...and your point about the winter classic is pretty well what I meant to say..you just said it better.