Argos at BMO Field

[Invader]

I think what you guys are failing to see here is that people aren't (and haven't in the past) been lining up to buy the Argos. I think that $20 million is a ridiculously high number to ask for a team that each of the last 2 owners have not paid a dime to take over. Braley has put money into it, but the fact remains, he took it over from C&S for nothing, just as they took it over from the league for nothing. If there was a bidding war for the team, I can understand the asking price. Unfortunately, there is no evidence to suggest that there is a bidding war or that there is even more than 1 interested party.

I frankly doubt Mr. Braley didn't pay a dime to take over the Argos. Cynamon has said they paid a couple of million to buy the Argos (which was likely used to pay key creditors). Braley likely called in his Line of Credit he held with C & S. They either had to pay off the loan or turn over the Argos to Braley, which was held as security for the loan. So Braley probably had to eat that loan (i.e. $2.5 million), then pay off outstanding creditors to keep the operation going. So to say they bought the Argos for nothing is likely false. Cynamon was very upset about losing the team and said in a recent article he wouldn't answer the phone if Braley called. It was also reported that S. Shwartz also paid a couple of million to buy the Argos.

The franchise valuation benchmark was set with the Flames purchase of the Stamps. They paid a widely-reported $15 million to increase their ownership stake from 5% to 70%...which puts the Stamps value at $20 million. This is for a club which had turned a consistent $1 million to $3 million profit for about 10 years.

Braley pegged the value of the Lions at $25 million, which had turned similar profits to the Stamps, but were the prime tenant in $800-million retractable dome stadium.

What are the Argos worth? Only what somebody is willing to pay for them. I can almost guarantee MLSE wanted to buy the Argos for nothing (or better yet have Braley give them a $2M LOC for the privilege of MLSE taking over the team) MLSE stated goal was to bring a NFL team to Toronto...and the TFC fan experience must be improved with any move of the Argos to BMO (but that conversation hasn't even started.) So we can see where the Argos would fit into the MLSE hierarchy.

I believe the Argos have been losing $1-3 million over the past few years (not including Grey Cup profits of a reported $10M to $12M), but the organization has been swimming in quicksand. The Rogers/MLSE monopoly had blocked and diminished the Argos chances of regaining a foothold in the market. But with MLSE onside, important doors could be opened, if only a crack, if they chose to do so.

That is the risk and also the reward.

[ArgoGabe22]

I think $15M is a more realistic price and is what other teams have sold for recently (Stampeders).

[AngeloV]

I think $15M is a more realistic price and is what other teams have sold for recently (Stampeders).

Yes, but historically, the Stamps have been purchased for real dollars in the past as well. Sig Gutcshe (sp?) paid for them, then Federik paid for them, then the Forzani Group paid for them, and most recently the Flames organization also paid for them. When money changes hands on every ownership change, then the value has been established. Can't say the same about the Argos.

[Neely2005]

Bob McCowan was talking about the Argonauts moving into the BMO Field during the 4 PM hour today. I'll post a Link once it's up.

[Treblecharger1]

anyone have a recap of what was said?

[Neely2005]

anyone have a recap of what was said?

He doesn't think that MLSE will buy the Argonauts and move them into BMO Field.

[bluto]

He doesn't think that MLSE will buy the Argonauts and move them into BMO Field.

you spelled "He is praying fervently that MLSE won't" wrong

[Jarid]

MLSE can want an NFL team all they want but that doesn't mean the other 31 team owners will approve the sale. (If it happens) The NFL doesn't like corporately owned teams (Packers are grandfathered in) The NFL wants a team in LA and even London well before Toronto.

[T-Bone]

I would think it would take more time than 2015

Agreed. I can't see a move happening that fast.

you spelled "He is praying fervently that MLSE won't" wrong

Either way, they will buy or they won't. They do, then BMO Field becomes a much more realistic option. They don't, I highly doubt we will see the Argos there.

I'll wait to see where the chips fall.

Same.

[Neely2005]

ARGOS REMAIN IN BMO FIELD PLANS

BMO Field will once again be one of the best places to play in Major League Soccer, MLSE CEO Tim Leiweke said.
But that doesn’t mean expansion plans won’t include the Toronto Argonauts one day.


“That’s a commitment that is a legal obligation to the city and the province,” Leiweke said of the CFL possibly coming to BMO Field. “We will honour that commitment.”


MLSE will be hosting a ground-breaking ceremony of sorts on Tuesday as construction to upgrade BMO Field is already under way.
“If you want to see a testament to the growth of MLS, go look at what our stadium was when it opened to what it is today,” Leiweke said. “We’ve fallen so far behind it’s shocking.”

http://www.torontosun.com/2014/09/18...-on-tfc-issues

[T-Bone]

MLSE will be hosting a ground-breaking ceremony of sorts on Tuesday as construction to upgrade BMO Field is already under way.

They have invited TFC season ticket holders to BMO Field Tuesday for the ground-breaking ceremony. I assume we will get to the see the finalized renovation plans for stage one at least.

[GiVENS38]

Many are wondering where the Argos will be located at BMO Argos Field........ well I'm part of the construction side of this so I'd gladly let you all know that the ARRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGOOSSSSS bench will be located on the east side of the building and the ARRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGOOSSSSS locker room is located on the north east side of the building where I currently keep my tools on a daily basis. For the most part, Part of phase 2 of construction at BMO Argos Field is for the ARRRRRRRRGGGGGOOSSSSS. When the locker room is being built. The will be entering the field from an underground tunnel from the locker room so that way they do not disturb the fans walking through the building. It's pretty much the most possible location for the team to be set up. The visiting team (bums) will be set up in the visiting team dressing room located on the west side of the building. Can't lie, it's nothing pretty and it's pretty cheap. Still better than the set up and Ivory Wyn Stadium. Hopefully this helps out some people who are still trying to sort out their setting area. I wouldn't be too concerned. I'm sure the organization will sort out s day for season ticket holders to get an idea of what seats would work best for them. At the end of the day it's the season ticket holders who for the most part have kept this kept alive. Thanks for the following owners who have lost a crap loaf of cash but the season ticket holders have held on and kept strong with them club. For all those season ticket holders, please make sure you use those vouchers that the club has offered us for the home opener and LET'S GET AS MANY PEOPLE in the Dome for the hone opener as possible. ARRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGOOSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[PullTogether73]

Damn!
Well, I guess I'll be sitting on the visitors' side of the field.
I'm not sitting on the east side and having the sun in my eyes for all of any afternoon games.

[Neely2005]

@CFL_News: .@TSNDaveNaylor & @simmonssteve want to form #Argos group. Sounds similar to @BoxJBoys for #Ticats. That kinda deal. Very cool. #CFL

https://twitter.com/CFL_News/status/649724081240178689

[Tobythor]

I'm very interested in this concept, hopefully tickets in this section won't be too expensive. I'm geared up to be loud and proud and party!

[Rocket]

@CFL_News: .@TSNDaveNaylor & @simmonssteve want to form #Argos group. Sounds similar to @BoxJBoys for #Ticats. That kinda deal. Very cool. #CFL

https://twitter.com/CFL_News/status/649724081240178689

Yeah sounds like a great idea I am sure they got the idea from tfc supporter section. That group has made a huge difference when you go to watch soccer games at bmo field. I hope the Argos could do the same.
Nice to see Simmons and Taylor getting involved I am sure that Argos management had a talk with them and might even give them a bonus for there effort. Nice to see Argo owners doing something for a change then to be sitting around doing nothing.

[Neely2005]

Bob McCowan was talking about the Argonauts moving into the BMO Field during the 4 PM hour today. I'll post a Link once it's up.

Here's the Link:

Listen Prime Time Sports - December 2 - 4pm
Monday, 4 pm: Listener calls.

---

There were actually two questions yesterday on McCown's show about the Argos/CFL (contrary to his statement that he never gets questions about the Argos). He repeated that the Argos "lose money," and that there is no way they go to BMO for less then $40 million in needed renovations. Of course, this seemed much more hopeful than based on facts. He mentioned that he thought they should go somewhere "north." But his overall tone was that the Argos don't matter, and have little hope.

He also talked about how they (I presume him and fellow traveler Brunt) are still "investigating" (I suppose an ATIP request) the money the federal government gave to the Grey Cup in 2012, as though there is something here. It is really is pathetic. He clearly hates Braley.

But I also think he knows something is afoot, but does does not want to make it a story.

Also, today it was announced that Braley has resigned/is resigning from the Senate; who knows what that means to the Argos/Lions....?

Careful now that's not what he said. He said that it had been months since they had gotten an unsolicited phone call about the Argonauts in regards to an On Field / Football question - so not about the business, attendance, stadium... side of things.

[Ballstothewall]

I got a tip and did some fishing and pretended I knew more than I did with some people on the in and with some really on the in. I' am not going to debate this but it sounds like I atleast will stop guessing. Looks like we will be at BMO field for 2015 season. I also got that the Argos will be on the road for a bit during the start of the season. My guess is that is because of a retro-fit. MLSE will own the Argos. Braley is the problem but the deal will get done.

If am wrong I will host a tailgate where we end up for the ACTIVE current members on this form.

it looks like you are correct. from what i was told, MLSE never thought Braley would have the stones to build a new Home for the Argos. Then they found out how serious Braley was and that it was going to be a muliti purpose stadium, with a bubble for the winter. He was very close to a deal with Markham and or Mississauga. Once MLSE heard this, they approched him. Now Braley wants big bucks, This deal would have been done 3 months ago. MLSE offered up 8 million. Braley came back with 20 Million. This is all about controling football in T.O and stoping Braley from building a stadium. Now from what i hear, Bralley is demanding first rights to buy back the Argos and the option of a small ownership stake if MLSE does attract a NFL team. I think MLSE will own the Argos in 2014 and if they do, we will be playing at a revamp BMO

[1argoholic]

I really hope this is all a bunch of crap. I really don't want MLSE owning the Argonauts. Just another feather in their caps. I doubt they'll really give a crap about the team. I doubt they'd make the stadium into a real little gem of of place that fans would be proud of. Plus do they really want one of their teams fans at war with the other. I really don't need to trip into town for a game to hear TFC protesters treating us like Bomber or Rider fans have in the past. By that I mean total CRAAAP. 91 Grey Cup and 97 will always stick in my mind. Never been treated worse. By the way we didn't just sit back and take the abuse. At this point I could see TFC fans being very pissed if the Argos move in. I haven't heard anything to change my thoughts.

[Neely2005]

it looks like you are correct. from what i was told, MLSE never thought Braley would have the stones to build a new Home for the Argos. Then they found out how serious Braley was and that it was going to be a muliti purpose stadium, with a bubble for the winter. He was very close to a deal with Markham and or Mississauga. Once MLSE heard this, they approched him. Now Braley wants big bucks, This deal would have been done 3 months ago. MLSE offered up 8 million. Braley came back with 20 Million. This is all about controling football in T.O and stoping Braley from building a stadium. Now from what i hear, Bralley is demanding first rights to buy back the Argos and the option of a small ownership stake if MLSE does attract a NFL team. I think MLSE will own the Argos in 2014 and if they do, we will be playing at a revamp BMO

Markham would work well, Richmond Hill would be better and Vaughan would be the best location if close to 400 & 7.

(IMO)