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Thread: Argo Sale

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    Quote Originally Posted by Argo57 View Post
    Beggars can't be choosers, I you think someone will ante up $200+ million for another new stadium your dreaming, especially with a viable solution and location staring the Argos in the face.
    I agree. How many stadiums (circuses) does one Canadian city require? There is an endless supply of far more important issues (bread) to address, once rationality and integrity reappear.

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    From Steve Simmons, April 26 column...

    ... After much discussion and some tension, it’s now just a matter of when before Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment buys the Toronto Argonauts from David Braley ...

    http://www.torontosun.com/2014/04/26...nder-pat-quinn

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    Yippy I'm so bloody excited. I just love when very few companies own everything. Really there's only five or six big companies in Canada and they own everyone and everything. The rest is owned by very few American companies. You know the ones who have their names across the chest of all the lemming or sheep people.

    I keep hoping that I win the big one and buy my team. It would be the place to be in TO once we built the first 100 thou underwater stadium. Argos playing on the field with fish swimming around the glass bubble. The 9th wonder of the world or whatever wonder we'd be up to.

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    You know, I can see some benefit by the MLSE group ownership.
    Obviously the synergy with their other teams.
    Equally as important, when I see the Maple Leaf Square showing the Craptors and Leaf important games or playoffs, the same could be true with our Argos.
    That kind of stuff plays large in the media and on the local newscasts as every channel here had a reporter on the scene and showed the crazy fans as the lead story.
    It's the old snowball effect, which sadly has been lacking, other then the one off of GC win, then back to nothing the next year.

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    Quote Originally Posted by argotom View Post
    You know, I can see some benefit by the MLSE group ownership. Obviously the synergy with their other teams. Equally as important, when I see the Maple Leaf Square showing the Craptors and Leaf important games or playoffs, the same could be true with our Argos. That kind of stuff plays large in the media and on the local newscasts as every channel here had a reporter on the scene and showed the crazy fans as the lead story. It's the old snowball effect, which sadly has been lacking, other then the one off of GC win, then back to nothing the next year.
    So you are finally coming around, AT! I have not been an MLSE fan myself but the reality is that they are the only ones out there who can and are willing to buy the Argos, put them in a stadium that is better suited to them, pay for that stadium, likely fill that stadium, increase the team's profile, increase the availability of merchandise, etc., etc. All of that will ensure the viability of the Argos for many years to come. Can we really ask for anything more than that?
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArgoRavi View Post
    So you are finally coming around, AT! I have not been an MLSE fan myself but the reality is that they are the only ones out there who can and are willing to buy the Argos, put them in a stadium that is better suited to them, pay for that stadium, likely fill that stadium, increase the team's profile, increase the availability of merchandise, etc., etc. All of that will ensure the viability of the Argos for many years to come. Can we really ask for anything more than that?
    Agreed Ravi.
    Who would have thought that a faceless corporation with a ton of money and of course no personality, will be the best thing going forward here in the big smoke?

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    So Tim L was on TSN 1050 and was talking about the plans for BMO have got Bigger and better.... hmmm wonder what he means by that?? This coupled together with Stevie Simmons comment makes me think they are going to buy the Argos and put even more money into the venue. Should be an interesting couple of days.

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    It would be nice if the Argos got a piece of the TOR media treatment as the line between simply reporting on a team (Leafs and Jays being the obvious and Raptors lately)and promoting them outright has become permanently blurred. MLSE buying them is the only way to get it.
    Sale goes through and interest in Argos/CFL among media will mysteriously increase as if by magic.
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    Quote Originally Posted by zontar View Post
    It would be nice if the Argos got a piece of the TOR media treatment as the line between simply reporting on a team (Leafs and Jays being the obvious and Raptors lately)and promoting them outright has become permanently blurred. MLSE buying them is the only way to get it.
    Sale goes through and interest in Argos/CFL among media will mysteriously increase as if by magic.
    Agreed, entirely. Simply by being part of MLSE, the Argos profile in the city will increase significantly. Inevitable when the team owner is also the main media outlet(s).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Treblecharger1 View Post
    So Tim L was on TSN 1050 and was talking about the plans for BMO have got Bigger and better.... hmmm wonder what he means by that?? This coupled together with Stevie Simmons comment makes me think they are going to buy the Argos and put even more money into the venue. Should be an interesting couple of days.
    Hopefully BMO Field is going to get bigger and better beyond what the current upgrade plans call for.

    Quote Originally Posted by zontar View Post
    It would be nice if the Argos got a piece of the TOR media treatment as the line between simply reporting on a team (Leafs and Jays being the obvious and Raptors lately)and promoting them outright has become permanently blurred. MLSE buying them is the only way to get it.
    Sale goes through and interest in Argos/CFL among media will mysteriously increase as if by magic.
    Hopefully our ticket prices don't also mysteriously increase too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Neely2005 View Post
    Hopefully our ticket prices don't also mysteriously increase too.
    There won't be any mystery to it. If ticket demand rises (as I expect it will in the new facility) and there are 6,000 fewer tickets available, prices will rise. It's both inevitable and acceptable, IMO. No one likes to pay more, but we all want the team to succeed financially. If the Argos can sell out their stadium and provide a small profit to MLSE every year, that's a win-win.

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    Quote Originally Posted by paulwoods13 View Post
    There won't be any mystery to it. If ticket demand rises (as I expect it will in the new facility) and there are 6,000 fewer tickets available, prices will rise. It's both inevitable and acceptable, IMO. No one likes to pay more, but we all want the team to succeed financially. If the Argos can sell out their stadium and provide a small profit to MLSE every year, that's a win-win.

    what makes you think it will be a small profit?? lets suppose they sell out all home games at bmo with the highest priced tix in the CFL which is textbook MLSE. With lets say a 4.6 mil salary cap in place and streamlined revenue generating , this team will be making cash hand over fist. MLSE said they will lose for the next few yrs with TFC due in large part to those new huge salaries but expect to be back in black by 2017. This underestimating the Argos ability to generate revenue in the right hands needs to stop . MLSE does not believe in charity. By sports leagues of this size as a standard. the Argos are ripe to be near the top. MLSE is doing their part to show the Argos to be nothing but a broken bicycle with a rusty chain to get them on the cheapcheap with no mention whatsoever of POTENTIAL!!!!!!. From the lips of Leiwek himself "we solve the Argos Problem". ticket prices could remain within league averages and this team will turn a profit but MLSE prefer the skys the limit approach. Seems even Argos fans are drinking the koolaid. The words "small profit" are not in MLSE's vocabulary.

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    Quote Originally Posted by paulwoods13 View Post
    There won't be any mystery to it. If ticket demand rises (as I expect it will in the new facility) and there are 6,000 fewer tickets available, prices will rise. It's both inevitable and acceptable, IMO. No one likes to pay more, but we all want the team to succeed financially. If the Argos can sell out their stadium and provide a small profit to MLSE every year, that's a win-win.
    History tells us that MLSE will not stop at a small profit and that's not acceptable.

    Be careful what you wish for with MLSE. You just might get priced right out of the stadium.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LLB997 View Post
    what makes you think it will be a small profit?? lets suppose they sell out all home games at bmo with the highest priced tix in the CFL which is textbook MLSE. With lets say a 4.6 mil salary cap in place and streamlined revenue generating , this team will be making cash hand over fist. MLSE said they will lose for the next few yrs with TFC due in large part to those new huge salaries but expect to be back in black by 2017. This underestimating the Argos ability to generate revenue in the right hands needs to stop . MLSE does not believe in charity. By sports leagues of this size as a standard. the Argos are ripe to be near the top. MLSE is doing their part to show the Argos to be nothing but a broken bicycle with a rusty chain to get them on the cheapcheap with no mention whatsoever of POTENTIAL!!!!!!. From the lips of Leiwek himself "we solve the Argos Problem". ticket prices could remain within league averages and this team will turn a profit but MLSE prefer the skys the limit approach. Seems even Argos fans are drinking the koolaid. The words "small profit" are not in MLSE's vocabulary.
    Considering that the Argos have likely lost money on operations every year since 1990, I am not going to get too worried about MLSE (or anyone else) suddenly making money "hand over fist" on the backs of Argo ticket buyers. Inherent in the notion that they will gouge fans to make windfall profits is the notion that the building will sell out regardless of what price is charged. It seems to me that if they treat the Argos as a cash cow by raising prices beyond reasonable levels, demand for tickets will drop off and they won't achieve that goal. If thinking this makes me a Kool-Aid drinker, yummy!

    Quote Originally Posted by Neely2005 View Post
    History tells us that MLSE will not stop at a small profit and that's not acceptable.

    Be careful what you wish for with MLSE. You just might get priced right out of the stadium.
    Yeah, of course I wish for high prices.

    Look, if I get priced out of the stadium, that will only be because there are enough fans to fill it without me at whatever rate they are charging. That in turn would mean the team's in good shape financially and I'd have to make do with watching on TV.

    Whatever price they charge, either they will sell enough tickets to make it work financially or they won't. Market forces will apply. I have a hard time figuring out why the building would suddenly be full at gouging prices when it has not been even close to full at reasonable prices.

    Do you think that simply having the MLSE stamp on it will cause people who haven't gone to Argo games to suddenly be willing to pay $150 or $200 a ticket? I don't.

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    Quote Originally Posted by paulwoods13 View Post
    Look, if I get priced out of the stadium, that will only be because there are enough fans to fill it without me at whatever rate they are charging. That in turn would mean the team's in good shape financially and I'd have to make do with watching on TV.
    i don't wish for this to happen either... but then, would having my club's finances on very stable ground paired with only attending say half of the games and watching the remainder on my 60" from my lay-z-boy be all that bitter a pill?
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulwoods13 View Post
    Yeah, of course I wish for high prices.

    Look, if I get priced out of the stadium, that will only be because there are enough fans to fill it without me at whatever rate they are charging. That in turn would mean the team's in good shape financially and I'd have to make do with watching on TV.

    Whatever price they charge, either they will sell enough tickets to make it work financially or they won't. Market forces will apply. I have a hard time figuring out why the building would suddenly be full at gouging prices when it has not been even close to full at reasonable prices.

    Do you think that simply having the MLSE stamp on it will cause people who haven't gone to Argo games to suddenly be willing to pay $150 or $200 a ticket? I don't.
    Totally agree with you. The market will decide the price. TFC under MLSE has proven this. People left, prices fell.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Neely2005 View Post
    History tells us that MLSE will not stop at a small profit and that's not acceptable.

    Be careful what you wish for with MLSE. You just might get priced right out of the stadium.
    Or nobody steps up to buy the team and they disappear, what I wish for is stable ownership that will make our team relevant to the masses again. What Paul, T-Bone and many others have touched on is supply and demand will ultimately set the correct market price in due time, having said that I have a personal threshold regarding what I will pay for my 4 season tickets, if they go beyond it I can give them up.

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    I am not sure there is a perfect or even a decent balance here, as MLSE has shown with ownership of anything the inevitability becomes gauge pricing.

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    Love the economics /supply & demand wisdom/lessons - thanks for that: Go MLSE Arrrgooooos ! - they will be front & center on the TO sports map in short order, soon enough.

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    Given recent experience with Raptor tickets (highest playoff prices in the NBA) and of course Maple Leaf tickets (highest prices all round in the NHL), I'm not totally indifferent to the concern that MLSE likes to gouge. And I think saying "the market will take care of it" can obviate corporate responsibility for things that are more than just an ordinary product. Spectator sports are a public good that more or less all working people should be able to afford in their own city. It's not clear that MLSE shares that goal given the way they treat their marquee teams.

    That said, I don't see the gouging happening with the Argos barring a major upswing in demand. MLSE is not going to take a comparatively fragile ticket base that barely numbers in the five digits and try to squeeze it dry. Getting games up to a 25k sellout regularly (rather than just when Hamilton's in town) will be an initial goal. If it is met, prices might rise modestly. As others have noted, that would be a sign of health not alarm.

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