Jonathan Williams

[gilthethrill]

Williams who started several games last year for the Argos and was drafted early in the Ottawa Expansion draft no longer is listed on the Redblacks roster. I count 3 early picks Ottawa used that are no longer with them, the others being Marwan Hage and AV's favorite QB Kevin Glenn....seems like poor selections.

[ArgoGabe22]

They also lost out on Kohlert, as expcted

[Argo]

Marcel... "benefit of the d o u b t"

[OV Argo]

Marcel... "benefit of the d o u b t"

We shall see. Can he ****-up the RedBlacks as much as Tillspin was incompetent for the Renegades ?

[ArgoRavi]

We shall see. Can he ****-up the RedBlacks as much as Tillspin was incompetent for the Renegades ?

As long as Rick Campbell isn't anywhere near as bad as Joe Paopao was, he should be okay. Tillman's hiring of Paopao and his work in Edmonton have sullied his reputation somewhat in recent years. Yes, Saskatchewan won a Grey Cup under his watch but how much of that was due to the work that Roy Shivers had already done?

[OV Argo]

As long as Rick Campbell isn't anywhere near as bad as Joe Paopao was, he should be okay. Tillman's hiring of Paopao and his work in Edmonton have sullied his reputation somewhat in recent years. Yes, Saskatchewan won a Grey Cup under his watch but how much of that was due to the work that Roy Shivers had already done?

And the Garden Gnome won a GC as Esks' HC = big deal: Shivers was/is an over-rated, myopic CFL good ole boy clown - how's he doing now in BC, or Vegas, or wherever it is ?

[paulwoods13]

If Williams is actually a free agent, I'd bring him back for a second go-round here. He showed promise last season.

[jerrym]

If Williams is actually a free agent, I'd bring him back for a second go-round here. He showed promise last season.

I agree totally.

[doubleblue]

Jonathan Williams is still listed on the RedBlacks Roster. Number 75 DT. But I agree they don't keep things updated completely. They have announced OT J. McCuller signed a while back and he still isn't on their roster. With Kevin Glenn moving on to BC Ottawa should be annuoucing another QB signing in the near future. Maybe they will bring back their first QB signing Faulkner for TC. Another early signing LB Turnbull has disappeared form the roster. Mini Camp probably weeded some out.

[argotom]

As long as Rick Campbell isn't anywhere near as bad as Joe Paopao was, he should be okay. Tillman's hiring of Paopao and his work in Edmonton have sullied his reputation somewhat in recent years. Yes, Saskatchewan won a Grey Cup under his watch but how much of that was due to the work that Roy Shivers had already done?

I am not so sure.
You guys are tough on Tillman.
It has been documented how the Renegades fractured ownership was so brutal throughout and especially the third year they basically pulled the rug under Tillman and Paopao.
I recall how kind Joe had to use his own visa to pay the players flight or was it the meal.
Meanwhile, the scouting was greatly reduced and ET had to go with only 2 QB's.
They were on track and would have likely cracked the yearly winning percentages.

[Argo]

I am not so sure.
You guys are tough on Tillman.
It has been documented how the Renegades fractured ownership was so brutal throughout and especially the third year they basically pulled the rug under Tillman and Paopao.
I recall how kind Joe had to use his own visa to pay the players flight or was it the meal.
Meanwhile, the scouting was greatly reduced and ET had to go with only 2 QB's.
They were on track and would have likely cracked the yearly winning percentages.

Argos fans - especially those whose youth is fairly far behind them - should be able to easily relate to "ownership ... so brutal".

[ArgoRavi]

I am not so sure.
You guys are tough on Tillman.
It has been documented how the Renegades fractured ownership was so brutal throughout and especially the third year they basically pulled the rug under Tillman and Paopao.
I recall how kind Joe had to use his own visa to pay the players flight or was it the meal.
Meanwhile, the scouting was greatly reduced and ET had to go with only 2 QB's.
They were on track and would have likely cracked the yearly winning percentages.

Paopao used his own credit card back in 1996 with B.C. IIRC, he never had to use it in Ottawa. Furthermore, Paopao stabbed Tillman in the back, at least according to Tillman, which is why Tillman had no power in 2004 and Paopao was there through the end of the '05 season while Tillman was back at the CBC. Yes, there were ownership issues too but the ultimate bad decision that Tillman made which bit him in the behind in a huge way was hiring Paopao to be his head coach.

[gilthethrill]

Jonathan Williams is still listed on the RedBlacks Roster. Number 75 DT. But I agree they don't keep things updated completely. They have announced OT J. McCuller signed a while back and he still isn't on their roster. With Kevin Glenn moving on to BC Ottawa should be annuoucing another QB signing in the near future. Maybe they will bring back their first QB signing Faulkner for TC. Another early signing LB Turnbull has disappeared form the roster. Mini Camp probably weeded some out.

Odd...I checked the Redblacks roster before I posted this thread & did not see him there....the premise of my thread is out the window...

Paopao used his own credit card back in 1996 with B.C. IIRC, he never had to use it in Ottawa. Furthermore, Paopao stabbed Tillman in the back, at least according to Tillman, which is why Tillman had no power in 2004 and Paopao was there through the end of the '05 season while Tillman was back at the CBC. Yes, there were ownership issues too but the ultimate bad decision that Tillman made which bit him in the behind in a huge way was hiring Paopao to be his head coach.

In an interview Tillman stated the team hired a "Bean Counter" near the end, so he had no $$ to run the team properly (see C&S in 2009 I believe). I am still a huge fan of ET...signing a former NFL db to be your qb who eventually wins the league MOP award? Not a bad judge of talent.

[ArgoRavi]

Gilthethrill, maybe you alerted Desjardins to a clerical error regarding their roster and they have put Williams on as a result of your find. As for Tillman, I have always liked him myself. His stint in Edmonton did not end well although it did start well before he traded Ray to the Argos. The Renegades did go from 4-14 in '02 to 7-11 in '03 before ownership and Paopao undercut him in '04. However, I still believe the fatal mistake he made was hiring Paopao to be his head coach and I suspect that Tillman would admit that today. Tillman did a good job keeping the Riders competitive and as a contender during his time there but the '07 team was largely built by Roy Shivers although Shivers and Danny Barrett could not get that team over the hump while Tillman and Kent Austin did.

[gilthethrill]

Gilthethrill, maybe you alerted Desjardins to a clerical error regarding their roster and they have put Williams on as a result of your find. As for Tillman, I have always liked him myself. His stint in Edmonton did not end well although it did start well before he traded Ray to the Argos. The Renegades did go from 4-14 in '02 to 7-11 in '03 before ownership and Paopao undercut him in '04. However, I still believe the fatal mistake he made was hiring Paopao to be his head coach and I suspect that Tillman would admit that today. Tillman did a good job keeping the Riders competitive and as a contender during his time there but the '07 team was largely built by Roy Shivers although Shivers and Danny Barrett could not get that team over the hump while Tillman and Kent Austin did.

I honestly forgot about the Ricky Ray trade....not one of ET's best moves...

[paulwoods13]

Aside from trading RR, Tillman grated beyond belief when he sprinkled every broadcast interview he ever did with repeated phrases and words like "truthfully" and "let me be frank," implying that, unlike other sports managers, he could actually be trusted to always tell the truth. It's a shameful and inherently false way to ingratiate yourself with the audience, and comes off (ironically) as completely insincere to any astute listener/viewer.

[argotom]

I honestly forgot about the Ricky Ray trade....not one of ET's best moves...

I also like ET, who remains as the Ticats are finding out very well connected throughout the US for talent.
Also, like it or lump it he is not gun shy to pull the trigger on a trade like Ricky Ray which was not the best.
Meanwhile, moving Kerry Joseph just after his best before date which created the Darien Durant era is one of the best.

[AngeloV]

I also like ET, who remains as the Ticats are finding out very well connected throughout the US for talent.
Also, like it or lump it he is not gun shy to pull the trigger on a trade like Ricky Ray which was not the best.
Meanwhile, moving Kerry Joseph just after his best before date which created the Darien Durant era is one of the best.

He's a very good scout, but became too arrogant as a GM. The Ray trade was nothing but arrogance on his part. I guess he figured QB isn't an important position in the grand scheme of things, because he replaced an aging Kerry Joseph after a Grey Cup season. In his mind, why would things be different if he traded Ray?