Why has Argonauts Home Game Attendance declined so much in 1 year? (2013-2014)

[ArgoRavi]

Torontonians have always been into the new deal in town. Marketing works like a charm, too bad the Argos and Braley are lacking HUGE in that department. As I've posted in the game day link. I was disappointed as hell last night and not because of the game. 40'000 blue empty seats don't cheer very loud. From what I understand we were all but sold to MLSE except the fact that Braley wanted all future Toronto Grey Cup profits. Cheap, yet greedy arse. He couldn't give a shit about Toronto, the Argonauts or us the fans. All the fans I talked to last night felt the same. We are watching the slow, sad, painful death of our Argonauts.

Out of curiosity, 1argoholic, how would you compare the current situation, regarding attendance and interest in the team, to the one that you left in 2002? Do you see a lot of similarities? I think that you are in a unique situation given that you have been away for the last decade plus.

[1argoholic]

Last night seemed to be the worst crowd I've ever seen at a home game. No way was there 16 odd thou there. Everyone I talked to had the same feelings of doom and gloom. Friends that had continued going during the time that we were away. I feel sad for my wife as she couldn't enjoy her teams win because I felt so down.
I wish Cohon or Braley would just open up about what if anything is being done.

[LLB997]

lets not forget last yr they offered a free tickets/survey thing that a lot of people took advantage of. The 3 games that were offered were capacity in the section the free tix were in. that's a couple of thou a game at least.

[tennyis]

Ottawa Redblacks may have something to do with it as well. I was a Renegades fan before the Argos, when they folded I went to the Argos. I'm sticking with the Argos BUT now I have 4 options to watch the Argos Play

1. Rogers Center (2.5 hr drive)
2. Hamilton (4 hr drive)
3. Ottawa (1.5 hr drive)
4. TV

I plan on going to a game in Hamilton and Ottawa this year to see the new stadiums. The rest I will watch on TV. Last game the Rogers center we had some problems with the staff as well, which I had posted about on here. If the redblacks hadn't come back I would have likely bought a flex pack again but this year my dollars are going to the other teams stadiums, partly due to the new stadiums. We are a family of 5, so it only makes up 10-15 ticket sales (typically do 3 games a year) but I can't help but wonder how many others are in a similar boat? how many Renegades fans are now cheering for the Redblacks instead of the Argos?

[Neely2005]

Last night seemed to be the worst crowd I've ever seen at a home game. No way was there 16 odd thou there. Everyone I talked to had the same feelings of doom and gloom. Friends that had continued going during the time that we were away. I feel sad for my wife as she couldn't enjoy her teams win because I felt so down.
I wish Cohon or Braley would just open up about what if anything is being done.

I agree, I've been going to Argonauts games for about 20 years and Saturdays game was the worst crowd that I've ever seen.

Ottawa Redblacks may have something to do with it as well. I was a Renegades fan before the Argos, when they folded I went to the Argos. I'm sticking with the Argos BUT now I have 4 options to watch the Argos Play

1. Rogers Center (2.5 hr drive)
2. Hamilton (4 hr drive)
3. Ottawa (1.5 hr drive)
4. TV

I plan on going to a game in Hamilton and Ottawa this year to see the new stadiums. The rest I will watch on TV. Last game the Rogers center we had some problems with the staff as well, which I had posted about on here. If the redblacks hadn't come back I would have likely bought a flex pack again but this year my dollars are going to the other teams stadiums, partly due to the new stadiums. We are a family of 5, so it only makes up 10-15 ticket sales (typically do 3 games a year) but I can't help but wonder how many others are in a similar boat? how many Renegades fans are now cheering for the Redblacks instead of the Argos?

Apparently the concessions at TD Place are better and a lot cheaper too. I was told that a King Can of beer is only $3, I'll confirm on Friday.

[LLB997]

Apparently the concessions at TD Place are better and a lot cheaper too. I was told that a King Can of beer is only $3, I'll confirm on Friday.

wow, 3 bucks?. Clearly the new owners in Ottawa give a shite about the fans and are looking to build a foundation of strong support. good on em

[Gill The Thrill]

I don't see how trashing another franchise, it's players and fans are going to help the situation. Or is it just sour grapes there was more attending the TFC game and behaving like this is therapy that helps your mind?

I won't let someone attempt to misinform about the Argonauts and conversely I will call anyone out who incorrectly makes claims against our other sports franchises. Defoe is a big deal, kind of like when the Argos signed Ricky Williams. Bradley was criticized for some giveaways in the cup, but he was far from terrible. He is a great talent and TFC, as would any MLS team, are proud to have him control the midfield. I don't see how anyone could blame Cesar for the collapse of Brazil. The Germans seemed to be toying with the defense. He is a great goalie, who unfortunately will not be returning to TFC.

Now imagine if the venues were swapped for this weekends games? I'd imagine it would be a dull soccer game in a half empty dome, while the Argonauts in front of near sellout at BMO, were narrowly beaten by the Stamps as the crowd pushed them on to a close game. The Argonauts would be perceived as thriving, while people would question how TFC couldn't even fill the lower part of the dome after a fantastic World Cup. It's all perception. The negativity starts to snowball and attendance suffers.

How did the Ricky Williams signing workout for the Argos...oh yah, it didn't, so just because you sign a big name, it does not build a foundation for success. Dafoe is big because MLSE does what they always do to hide the fact they don't know what they're doing, they're sprinkling money around and telling the media, "look at us, we just threw this much money for this guy," They do the same with their hockey franchise (David Clarkson...anyone) even though they've been at that business for decades, so don't give me this misinforming line.

Trashing another franchise, it's players and fans must help the situation if you use TFC as an example, that's all I saw from their fansites when it came comments regarding the Argos moving to BMO. They make it seem as if they own the stadium even though it was specifically slated to be a multipurpose stadium suitable for soccer and football.

For the playoff game yes, for the regular season game no I don't think so.

Then why did the Argos get nowhere near 29,000 for another game...I was at that game and there were a ton of ticat fans, easily 10-12,000.

As for the playoff game, that was even worse. I think there were easily 17 -21,000 Ticat fans. It was practically their home game even though it was in Toronto.

[Neely2005]

wow, 3 bucks?. Clearly the new owners in Ottawa give a shite about the fans and are looking to build a foundation of strong support. good on em

Yeah Jeff Hunt seems to be doing things the right way. Here's an article on the Menu for TD Place Stadium:

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/Joanne+...221/story.html

Then why did the Argos get nowhere near 29,000 for another game...I was at that game and there were a ton of ticat fans, easily 10-12,000.

As for the playoff game, that was even worse. I think there were easily 17 -21,000 Ticat fans. It was practically their home game even though it was in Toronto.

I was at all of the home games against Hamilton last season and I disagree with your estimates.

[AngeloV]

Another reason that the ST's (and probably overall attendance) are down is likely the price increase this year. I have mentioned this before, but I didn't renew my tickets until March (as I always do), and even though I was warned about a price increase after the early bird renewal, not in my wildest dreams did I expect about a 30% increase. I have bronze seats, and my ticket went from $280 to $367.50 this season.

[T-Bone]

Another reason that the ST's (and probably overall attendance) are down is likely the price increase this year. I have mentioned this before, but I didn't renew my tickets until March (as I always do), and even though I was warned about a price increase after the early bird renewal, not in my wildest dreams did I expect about a 30% increase. I have bronze seats, and my ticket went from $280 to $367.50 this season.

I didn't think of this but it's a very good point.

[AngeloV]

I didn't think of this but it's a very good point.

I can totally understand if someone that wasn't a diehard fan would walk away from such an increase.

[T-Bone]

I can totally understand if someone that wasn't a diehard fan would walk away from such an increase.

Also knowing you can get any ticket you want game day because the place is not full does not help season ticket sales. I wonder how many people buy single tickets in the end zone and move also.

[AaronInToronto]

We get "the movers" in our section as well. A few came down to visit, then by the end of game, the section was nearly full. I couldn't care less as it means more people sitting close to the field, and making noise.

[T-Bone]

We get "the movers" in our section as well. A few came down to visit, then by the end of game, the section was nearly full. I couldn't care less as it means more people sitting close to the field, and making noise.

It's not my place to enforce seating arrangements so it doesn't bother me either but ultimately it probably does lead to some lost revenue for the team though.

[AngeloV]

It's not my place to enforce seating arrangements so it doesn't bother me either but ultimately it probably does lead to some lost revenue for the team though.

I don't think it really does. People are going to pay what they want to pay for tickets. If seating is properly enforced, these movers would just stay in the seats they bought. I feel it's more of a slap in the face to people that paid actual price to sit in the better (more expensive) seats than it is to the team.

[AaronInToronto]

Most of the "movers" aren't balsy enough to sneak into the double blue and platinums. Its typically brone 2nd level to bronze or silver 1st level. Not a huge deal if it's in the second half. If they are there from the beginnning, I know it's a little off, I'll call foul.

[herrington2828]

Most of the "movers" aren't balsy enough to sneak into the double blue and platinums. Its typically brone 2nd level to bronze or silver 1st level. Not a huge deal if it's in the second half. If they are there from the beginnning, I know it's a little off, I'll call foul.

I am a STH and when I bring friends I buy endzone wth my STH discount and then they cme sit with us

I also think that it is too expensive at the bottom end. $20 for endzone should be good .. not the $36 that is currently being charged. Family of four, you're hitting $150 just for tickets ... something maybe you or I can afford, but the families or less priviledged, that's two days of work once you add in a pop, transportation and more

[AngeloV]

I am a STH and when I bring friends I buy endzone wth my STH discount and then they cme sit with us

I also think that it is too expensive at the bottom end. $20 for endzone should be good .. not the $36 that is currently being charged. Family of four, you're hitting $150 just for tickets ... something maybe you or I can afford, but the families or less priviledged, that's two days of work once you add in a pop, transportation and more

And that is where the problem is. If you don't get families coming, how do you build a future base of ticket buyers? You are so right on this.

[ArgoFan1]

The price increase I think is a major factor this season. I don't know if the Argos set that on their own, or if Rogers has anything to do with it, since they get some of that revenue, I assume. I was thinking that the other day when I see all of those boxes sitting empty and they are still asking a fortune for people to rent them out. What is it with this country and city that makes businesses always try to take as much as possible. You should be trying to make up in volume what you lose in price increases.

I still think another big factor is the weekend games, which never did work here in Toronto. Too many people go away and there are too many other things going on.

My real pet peeve and I think the biggest problem the Argos have is the guys on sports radio who only talk about American sports and try to sound like analysts from south of the border and have them on all the time. They will talk hours about certain players on a team like the Raptors or Blue Jays and never, ever spend more than 30 seconds mentioning the Argos. I heard one guy on TSN radio going on about how the Blue Jays had the sports market all to themselves in the summer because there was nothing else going on. Every time I hear something like that, my blood boils. I think that is the biggest problem for the Argos. It is good that at least Mike Hogan will talk about them, but there is no one beyond him. Sports radio will go on for hours breaking down an NFL game or trade but never once talk about the CFL. They may claim there is little interest.... and they are right.. except that it means there is little interest in their little room, so they decide what gets talked about.

[ArgoZ]

How did the Ricky Williams signing workout for the Argos...oh yah, it didn't, so just because you sign a big name, it does not build a foundation for success. Dafoe is big because MLSE does what they always do to hide the fact they don't know what they're doing, they're sprinkling money around and telling the media, "look at us, we just threw this much money for this guy," They do the same with their hockey franchise (David Clarkson...anyone) even though they've been at that business for decades, so don't give me this misinforming line.

Trashing another franchise, it's players and fans must help the situation if you use TFC as an example, that's all I saw from their fansites when it came comments regarding the Argos moving to BMO. They make it seem as if they own the stadium even though it was specifically slated to be a multipurpose stadium suitable for soccer and football.

I never said Williams worked out, but it's proof that the Argos are guilty of doing the same things that you dislike about TFC. Luckily for TFC, Defoe is performing so far. Your knowledge just confirmed you are all sour grapes. I understand your frustration and I am not defending some TFC fans, but no need to stoop to their level and don't get mad at me for calling you out on your bull.