Fire Creehan immediately.

[argotom]

After today's debacle and since it's getting worse every game, the defence in many categories remains dead last in the league.
Talk to Cory Chamblin or even though he left earlier this year under suspicious circumstances I would make a call to Tim Burke.

[ArgoGabe22]

Burke left on his own (reasons unknown) so I really doubt he'll be back unless he sorted out whatever the issue was.

[1argoholic]

Creehan didn't sign guys who were CRAP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[argotom]

Creehan didn't sign guys who were CRAP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yes but it's his horrid schemes.

[ArgoRavi]

Here is the million dollar question with the defence: Is it the scheme or is it the personnel or is it both? I personally don't have a lot of faith in Creehan given his past in this league. Whatever the issues are, the Argos have to use the upcoming bye week to start straightening things out. While the offence had its struggles today, the biggest problem with this football team is the defence.

[Argo]

Here is the million dollar question with the defence: Is it the scheme or is it the personnel or is it both? I personally don't have a lot of faith in Creehan given his past in this league. Whatever the issues are, the Argos have to use the upcoming bye week to start straightening things out. While the offence had its struggles today, the biggest problem with this football team is the defence.

It's both. However, Creehan's body of work is, to put it charitably, underwhelming.

[argotom]

It's not like there has been improvement, in fact the last 3 games the teams have burned us for more then 300 yards passing.
Today it was 400 plus.

[ArgoRavi]

It's both. However, Creehan's body of work is, to put it charitably, underwhelming.

I was wary of Creehan's hiring as well. Can his defence work better with the likes of Muamba, Ball and Carter or do we need to send Creehan out the door also? I suspect that the scheme is a greater problem than the personnel but I really don't know for sure.

[Argo57]

It's not like there has been improvement, in fact the last 3 games the teams have burned us for more then 300 yards passing.
Today it was 400 plus.

Both
Schemes and defensive secondary play were a total joke today, they had no answers for Hamilton's offence whatsoever.
Worst part is the D players seemed increasingly frustrated as the game went on, I wonder if they are starting to figure out the fact that their DC has no clue.

[Argo]

It's not like there has been improvement, in fact the last 3 games the teams have burned us for more then 300 yards passing.
Today it was 400 plus.

We can look forward to 500 passing yards next week.

[doubleblue]

Can not recall in a while, so many receivers being so wide open. Creehans zone defense is not working.

[R.J]

Here is the million dollar question with the defence: Is it the scheme or is it the personnel or is it both? I personally don't have a lot of faith in Creehan given his past in this league. Whatever the issues are, the Argos have to use the upcoming bye week to start straightening things out. While the offence had its struggles today, the biggest problem with this football team is the defence.

Both, while Creehan is easily the biggest problem, there are some personnel issues as well. Jefferson and Black are the only bonafide starters in the backfield, sam lb is a issue and the dline can't seem to create any pressure.

[Will]

Well as most of you know from the @argofans twitter account that I'm not too crazy about Creehan so I cannot back down now. The blitzing schemes don't seem creative in the slightest, and blown coverage throughout the entire first half is brutal even by his standards. As much as I think that Milanovich is a better coach than Cortez, I do still think that Creehan has the potential to sink the Argos like the 2012 Ticats were sunk under his watch. I realize that the way he ascended to DC wasn't the easiest from the Argos perspective, but he's shown me nothing to make me suggest he isn't the failure like he was in Hamilton and Winnipeg.

The personnel also deserve some of the blame for certain--but doesn't that also fall at the feet of Barker? Barker does a decent job of recruiting offensively, but his defensive recruiting hasn't been nearly as good.

My heart says Creehan's go to go, but my head knows it, unfortunately, isn't as simple as that.

[paulwoods13]

Barker does a decent job of recruiting offensively, but his defensive recruiting hasn't been nearly as good.

That appears to be correct, altho I'd like to see what some of these guys could do in a different scheme. At this point I'm inclined to think the problem is 50% scheme and 50% personnel, but that's a guess.

[Argo57]

Well as most of you know from the @argofans twitter account that I'm not too crazy about Creehan so I cannot back down now. The blitzing schemes don't seem creative in the slightest, and blown coverage throughout the entire first half is brutal even by his standards. As much as I think that Milanovich is a better coach than Cortez, I do still think that Creehan has the potential to sink the Argos like the 2012 Ticats were sunk under his watch. I realize that the way he ascended to DC wasn't the easiest from the Argos perspective, but he's shown me nothing to make me suggest he isn't the failure like he was in Hamilton and Winnipeg.

The personnel also deserve some of the blame for certain--but doesn't that also fall at the feet of Barker? Barker does a decent job of recruiting offensively, but his defensive recruiting hasn't been nearly as good.

My heart says Creehan's go to go, but my head knows it, unfortunately, isn't as simple as that.

I loved Creehan in Hamilton because he was one of the most brutal coordinators I have seen and Hamilton's D in 2012 was terrible, little did we expect that 3 years later he would be in Toronto screwing us up.
AF87 correct, he is shaping up to being a major factor in sinking this ship, there is still 8 games left now and many signs are pointing to Toronto being life and death to qualify for the playoffs, Ottawa and Montreal are right there as well.
The Argonaut secondary has actually been pretty shitty since the 2012 Grey Cup, player turnover (for many reasons) and coaches moving on have all contributed to this but this talent level simply isn't there, explains why stiffs like Agnew and the like are taking the field week after week.

[R.J]

Are people seriously blaming Barker for the defense ?

[Argo57]

Are people seriously blaming Barker for the defense ?

Depends what you think the issue is, lack of talent or crappy defensive system.

[gilthethrill]

Just watching the Calgary Edmonton game on PVR. Last week James Franklin looked all world (TSN was in love with him), but today he looked ordinary to say the least....pulled in the 3rd quarter.

[Argo]

Fire Creehan and promote Younger to acting DC.

Why not? It cannot get any worse, and this change in personnel may become the start of something good.

[ArgoRavi]

Are people seriously blaming Barker for the defense ?

I am not sure that Barker is to blame. We have had three different defensive coordinators in three years which is not a recipe for success on defence no matter how good recruiting is. Lack of continuity has hurt enormously IMO. If Burke had remained defensive coordinator this year I think that we would be much further ahead on defence.

Conversely, our offence - which is still one of the better ones in the league despite what some might think - has had continuity in coaching and schemes for the last three to four years.