October 30, 2015: BC Lions vs. Toronto Argonauts

[ArgoRavi]

If they keep playing like this they will be lucky to get 5000 fans for their playoff game.

Unless Hamilton sweeps Ottawa, the Argos won't be playing a playoff game at home this year.

[Will]

I understood on one hand why Ricky Ray was starting this game. Trevor Harris had struggled two games in a row and Scott Milanovich wanted to see if he couldn't spark this offense. However, in complete retrospect, I don't understand the logic in it for one reason and that is Ricky Ray is seemingly incapable due to his injuries to execute this offense to it's fullest. It's either Ray can't throw downfield or our receivers have not been able to get open downfield for three weeks in a row. I really do believe that he shouldn't have been in this game by the second half. That TD drive late in the second quarter possibly extended his time in the game. I do not buy the factor that the Argos needed to see what they had in Ray because week 19 of the season is not the time to be doing this. The offense as a whole aside from the QB situation should be of great concern as well. The right side of that OL is going to have to rebuilt over the off-season that's for certain. The Big Three have also gone into a disappearing act similar to that losing streak earlier in the season.

I said on the site Twitter feed that special teams cannot be causing you games in October. Well, special teams helped cost this team a game in October. Special teams were awful, awful, awful tonight from the punting to place kicking to returns. British Columbia started out at or around midfield so many times and with Ray arguably limited that played to their advantage. Even if BC didn't produce on the drive they could pin the Argos deep and due to the Argos inept punting they just handed that field position right back. Jake Rogers should not be doing the punting and kicking chores for this football team next week.

I'm going to openly wonder whether any of the DC, OC or ST coordinator will be back next season. As for Scott Milanovich, I really haven't understood several of his calls over the past couple of weeks. I get that he's had to put up with a lot of shit in his time in Toronto, but this is the first time in his tenure that I've really felt frustrated about his coaching. The sequence in the third quarter with the team taking penalty after penalty, I realize that he's not on the field physically doing the stuff that leads to the flag, but a lack of discipline has been a hallmark of his administration. But, part of that might fall on having too many 1st year players on the team year-after-year. But, even that's a vicious cycle because this team has way too much turnover in the secondary and when you keep having to bring in new guys the same patterns emerge.

[PullTogether73]

R

Just another terrible performance by this team and the coaching staff.
Coaching....Why is Ray playing in the 2nd half.....he can hardly throw the ball and when he does it's a 5 yard pass.
Offensive line......offensive
Defensive line.......offensive
Kicking team........offensive
Specialty teams.....offensive
Discipline......unbelievable.....how long will they continue to take unnecessary penalties
If they keep playing like this they will be lucky to get 5000 fans for their playoff game.

????
Special team blocked a punt and returned it for a touchdown, and also blocked a field goal.
One of the best performances I've seen from an Argos special team.

Also, defensive line stuffed the league's leading rusher all night.

[Double Dare]

It seemed like BOTH teams didn't actually want to win this game.

Milanovich sucked as usual. Laughing with the ref on the sidelines while Brandon Isaac was doing his job for him.

[Argo57]

This year is turning out to be mirror of Grey Cup 2012 Argos. 2015 started hot & collapsed in time for playoff stretch run. Although no difference when it comes to Argos penalties. Four years and we haven't got the discipline instilled?

In 2012 you had the feeling they were capable of putting it together to make a run at it, personally this season I don't think it is even a remote possibility.

[Argo]

Milanovich --> Mehlanovich

[gilthethrill]

If you install a pass first offence & are unable to protect the qb, it really does not matter who is at the helm. For the second game in a row the best Argo blocker was Brandon Whittaker. How does Marcus Brady stick with the game plan when protection breaks down constantly?

LB Brandon Isaac showed that he is a real pro & why it is important to have CFL veterans on your team. Despite not getting any pressure on Jennings, I thought the Argo D line was great in stuffing Harris over & over again. Despite an up & down year, I thought Creehan put together a solid game plan.

Special teams gave BC a short field all night long due to poor punting. I thought I heard on the Argo post game show he (Jake Rogers, not to be confused with Ted) did not even punt in the NCAA, so why is being asked to do that now? Delbert Alverado was tweeting this past week as to why he is not being given an opportunity in the CFL. I along with others on the forum have been wondering the same thing.

Extremely disappointed the Argos most likely will not be hosting the ESF this year. I doubt Winnipeg, now eliminated & coming off a bye will feel much like playing next Friday night. Should end up with a 10 win season, which is really quite remarkable despite all the warts this team still displays.

[paulwoods13]

I saw no evidence that RR can throw the deep ball, other than the Bates TD which was OK. But in warmups he was firing pretty crisp passes 35 yards. From what I can see our receivers are not getting open anywhere on the field, and of course our o-line is truly awful, so a deep passing game is naught but a theory at this point. The o-line factor may require us to go back to Trevor since he can at least do a bit of running under pressure.

Obviously Rogers is just horrendous, possibly the worst kicker the Argos have employed in my lifetime. People are pissed that we let Pfeffer go, and I get that, but we also had Michael Palardy who had a good game as a punter and kickoff man. I know it was a ratio decision (altho I think there may have been more to it than that -- i.e. a promise to let him go back to the U.S. if offered an NFL tryout) but jeez. Of all the kicks Rogers made last night -- punts, FGs, converts and kickoffs -- maybe three were passable. And many were utterly atrocious.

Not much else to say at this point, except we can still finish second if Ham sweeps Ott and we bat Wpg. Possible, especially if Burris is out. But I wouldn't bet on us beating the Bombers.

[OV Argo]

Did the "Rogers sucks" chant ever get going inside the SkyDump last night? - I was really looking forward to hearing that on TV.

Another very poor outing IMO, and this team has one reg. season game to go to get it together or else they will probably get slaughtered in the East semi.


Kicking game, O-line and D-backfield are real weak spots IMO, along with the same old simpleton offence (2 best plays other than the jump ball TD grab by that new receiver, were the sweeps to Spencer and Coombs for good gains - otherwise, it's the same old dink & dunk, checkdown $h*t, with one simple run play thrown in once in awhile); is Ray's arm really not ready or well under 100% so that he can't throw downfield ? - he did have plenty of time to throw on several plays but had to throw the ball away - i'm not so sure with the factors of clueless play-calling and a porous O-line limiting him in this game?

This coaching staff - particularly on the offensive side of the ball - looks really dumb at times, and it falls on Milanovich; so does the constant lack of discipline and stupid penalties; and the questionable roster moves ... HC & OC are huge issues with this team IMO.

[argolio]

We did a fantastic job on Andrew Harris AND won the turnover battle, but if you can't pressure the opposing QB (we were mediocre at best) and protect your own (we were terrible at best), you're generally screwed in today's football. We may need a major o-line overhaul for 2016 considering their play in recent games.

The Lavelle Hawkins catch was a huge play late in the game. AJ Jefferson cheated just a bit towards Arseneaux, and Jonathan Jennings made a great read and throw. The extra field position from an incomplete pass might have been enough to get us in FG range.

[timlb01]

The two most frustrating things about the game was 1) We cannot find a kicker... my Grandmother is a free agent!!!! What the hell and 2) Rickey cannot or appears cannot through the deep ball. Come on man, this was brutal!!!!! This season maybe a write off.

Man, the kicking game over the past few weeks has shown proved how important this role is and how underrated it is. Surely we should have had a 2 people for the kicking roles giving up another roster position.

[Argo57]

I have been a huge Milanovich supporter since he has arrived in Toronto but his coaching has really slipped this season.
Keep hearing that he has a "brilliant" offensive mind and quite frankly when watching this team I don't see it.
I also believe the "big three" as a unit lack speed, and as OV and other have touched on our O-Line and DB's are not anywhere championship quality.
Here's what I see heading into the playoffs, one and done, if this happens I would expect the new ownership group to make changes.
The question is how deep will they go with these changes, co-ordinators and positional coaches or a complete housecleaning??

[Rocket]

Might be time to let go or reconstruct chad Owens contract next time around this guy has not done much the last couple of years besides the one catch in Ottawa this year other then that he has gone unnoticed. Just think that we would be able to find a bigger receiver with better hands who doesn't drop the ball on the run as much as owens does. Having Andre durie injured has not really helped out either. Always nice to have him in the game where you can count on him to get the yardage needed.
Don't know what to do now with the quarterback situation as Trevor Harris has looked awful last couple of games.

[Argo57]

Might be time to let go or reconstruct chad Owens contract next time around this guy has not done much the last couple of years besides the one catch in Ottawa this year other then that he has gone unnoticed. Just think that we would be able to find a bigger receiver with better hands who doesn't drop the ball on the run as much as owens does. Having Andre durie injured has not really helped out either. Always nice to have him in the game where you can count on him to get the yardage needed.
Don't know what to do now with the quarterback situation as Trevor Harris has looked awful last couple of games.

CFL defences still fear Owens due to his big play ability, TSN flashed a comparison of Owens stats with Ray and Harris starting, he is much more productive with Ray at the helm, simply different QB's see the game slightly differently than others and develop their own chemistry with certain guys, doesn't mean he has lost it
8 other teams would jump at the chance to add Owens talents and passion for the game.

[gilthethrill]

I have been a huge Milanovich supporter since he has arrived in Toronto but his coaching has really slipped this season.
Keep hearing that he has a "brilliant" offensive mind and quite frankly when watching this team I don't see it.
I also believe the "big three" as a unit lack speed, and as OV and other have touched on our O-Line and DB's are not anywhere championship quality.
Here's what I see heading into the playoffs, one and done, if this happens I would expect the new ownership group to make changes.
The question is how deep will they go with these changes, co-ordinators and positional coaches or a complete housecleaning??

Are you aware that both Barker and Milanovich were extended for 3 years earlier this season? That is an endorsement by the new ownership group. I like the idea of continuity at the top.

[Argo57]

Are you aware that both Barker and Milanovich were extended for 3 years earlier this season? That is an endorsement by the new ownership group. I like the idea of continuity at the top.

Yes, earlier this season when they were playing well, contract extensions don't always guarantee they will be kept around especially when the fan base is subjected to the shit performances we have been lately.
I'm not advocating a change however results are what ultimately matters and if the Argonauts lose in the semi final who knows what will happen.
Brady and Creehan should be nervous more than anyone.

[OV Argo]

Are you aware that both Barker and Milanovich were extended for 3 years earlier this season? That is an endorsement by the new ownership group. I like the idea of continuity at the top.

I don't like the idea of continued mediocrity and some horrible roster moves/decisions. But maybe all will be well with the new ownership and new home.

[Blue90]

Might be time to let go or reconstruct chad Owens contract next time around this guy has not done much the last couple of years besides the one catch in Ottawa this year other then that he has gone unnoticed. Just think that we would be able to find a bigger receiver with better hands who doesn't drop the ball on the run as much as owens does. Having Andre durie injured has not really helped out either. Always nice to have him in the game where you can count on him to get the yardage needed.
Don't know what to do now with the quarterback situation as Trevor Harris has looked awful last couple of games.

I agree that Owens has definitely lost a step and really appears to be injury prone. It seems like every time he's hit hard, he ends up on the ground and then limps off the field. I love Owens as a competitor, but he is definitely not the player he was a couple of years ago. I wouldn't mind seeing Diontae Spencer take his spot as a receiver next year.

It appears that maybe Ricky Ray is done also. After one year he doesn't appear to have recovered from his shoulder injury. Yesterday's game was sad. At 36 years old maybe this should be his last season. Injuries seem to have taken a toll on him, similiar to Owens.

[ArgoRavi]

In 2012 you had the feeling they were capable of putting it together to make a run at it, personally this season I don't think it is even a remote possibility.

When the Argos were 7-9 in 2012, I don't recall anyone on this forum believing that they would win the Grey Cup and many didn't believe they would make the playoffs.

[Argo57]

When the Argos were 7-9 in 2012, I don't recall anyone on this forum believing that they would win the Grey Cup and many didn't believe they would make the playoffs.

Fair point Ravi, hindsight is a wonderful thing, however this 2015 Argo team is nowhere close in talent and also coaching when compared to the 2012 team.
No indication that any late season heroics are in store this season.