Week 1: Hamilton TigerCats @ Toronto Argonauts, June 23, 2016 @ BMO FIELD Game Thread

[R.J]

Glenn over Ray ? Seriously ?

[AngeloV]

Glenn over Ray ? Seriously ?

Sounds reasonable to me. Think Montreal would go for the deal? Or would we have to throw a draft pick their way too?

[ArgoGabe22]

Just looked out the window, the sky hasn't fallen. All is good.

[R.J]

Sounds reasonable to me. Think Montreal would go for the deal? Or would we have to throw a draft pick their way too?

Ray and 1st rounder for Glenn and a bad contract sounds about right.

[Rich]

Even the greatest players hit a decline at some point. For some players it comes earlier, for others the drop comes faster. Peyton Manning played one season too long but still got lucky.

Ricky Ray hasn't played a good football game in two years. Who's got any evidence he's still capable of playing at an elite level?

[1971GreyCup]

Don't misunderstand me. The point I was trying to make was, if Ricky Ray were to go down, we don't have a seasoned QB to step in! We had a shot at Kevin Glenn several times over the last few years. We have now seasoned two QBs and lost them to East rivals. We are one injury to Ray away from a lost season. Am I wrong here?

It looks like CFL teams this year are as good as the #1 & #2 QBs.

[Ron]

I was in the keep Harris over Ray camp. I also believe SM offensive game plan hasbeen figured out by most teams in the league, and contributed to Harris’s poorplay in the last few games.
But that ship has sailed, so we’ll have to see what SMand Ray do the next few games.

Therefore ... SM offensive game plan has been figured out by most teams in the league, and contributed to Ray's poor play in the last few games.

[Ron]

Don't misunderstand me. The point I was trying to make was, if Ricky Ray were to go down, we don't have a seasoned QB to step in! We had a shot at Kevin Glenn several times over the last few years. We have now seasoned two QBs and lost them to East rivals. We are one injury to Ray away from a lost season. Am I wrong here?

It looks like CFL teams this year are as good as the #1 & #2 QBs.

Don't know if you're wrong here until we see Kilgore play. He may be the reason they let Harris go.

[Argo]

Don't know if you're wrong here until we see Kilgore play. He may be the reason they let Harris go.

Barker clearly indicated in a recent interview that Kilgore has (in his and, I assume Milanovich's, opinion) lots of potential; however, he remains unproven, unlike Harris (and Collaros, for that matter).

In our league, I definitely prefer a mobile QB; be that as it may, Ray himself has to demonstrate that he can play at anywhere near the level that he used to.

(BTW, did anyone else find Ray's pre-game presser rather odd? That is, he never stop fiddling around with his right arm!)

[1971GreyCup]

Ron, Kilgore was fourth on the depth charts last season. He has a year on the practice squad and maybe 4 quarters of CFL exhibition game experience. I think he has lots of future potential. Trevor Harris was with the team since 2012 and finally matured in the 2015 season.

I just think Barker has rolled the dice in the offseason. I'd give him low grades for risk management. Ricky Ray may be MVP this year and we may win the Grey Cup. But in the Grey Cup year 2012 Ricky Ray was injured and Jarius Jackson, Zach Colleras critically all carried the team during Ricky Ray's 4 games absence. I would like a little more QB insurance especially since his passing has been limited to 800 yards since 2013.

Last thing I want is another frustrating season.

[paulwoods13]

It looks like CFL teams this year are as good as the #1 & #2 QBs.

That is based on four out of 81 games, in which two out of eight teams were pressed into using their backup. I'll wait for a longer sample size.

[paulwoods13]

But in the Grey Cup year 2012 Ricky Ray was injured and Jarius Jackson, Zach Colleras critically all carried the team during Ricky Ray's 4 games absence.

For the record, Collaros played only half of the last (meaningless) game in 2012. Jackson carried the entire load when RR was injured.

[paulwoods13]

Barker clearly indicated in a recent interview that Kilgore has (in his and, I assume Milanovich's, opinion) lots of potential; however, he remains unproven, unlike Harris (and Collaros, for that matter).

But exactly like Harris and Collaros were when they were our No. 2 QBs.

[Argo57]

At this point in time, I would take Glenn over Ray in a heartbeat.

Ray's mobility was never any good, but i think it's worse than ever. I think a QB with even average mobility would have been able to avoid a couple of those sacks. One guy getting through puts a hand on Ray and he's down.

I would have zero interest in Glenn under any circumstance.

[Argo57]

It is an 18-game season, Edm looked awful against us last year in Week 1, and won the Grey Cup. I'm not planning on panicking until we lose at least two more games as badly as we lost this one. And I honestly don't expect that to happen.

And yes, Stevoman, the Ticats' unis have gotten worse. Not only the logo on the sleeve, but the unitard pyjama pants are big steps backward.

I for one am not suggesting any sort of panic, my main point is a quarterback with Ray's mobility needs superb O-Line play ahead of him (to give him time to make the necessary reads and more importantly limit any hits).
A mobile QB would mask many of the O-Line deficiencies, with Ray behind centre their play must improve (for the reasons above).
Let's see what happens in the next 2-3 games.

[Argo57]

Even the greatest players hit a decline at some point. For some players it comes earlier, for others the drop comes faster. Peyton Manning played one season too long but still got lucky.

Ricky Ray hasn't played a good football game in two years. Who's got any evidence he's still capable of playing at an elite level?

Right now there is no evidence Rich, we have no choice but to see what happens in the next 3-4 games but I admittedly wonder sometimes.

[Neely2005]

I guess you didn't read all the experts on this site who said that Harris' play in his last 4 games last year was proof that he was not a viable long-term option, and not worthy of a big contract offer. Never mind the fact those 4 games included "home" games in another city in front of 3,000 people in which the entire team was justifiably flat as a pancake.

And never mind the fact that Harris was arguably the League MVP for the first 3/4 of the season, leading the CFL in TD passes and completion% even at season's end. No, he played badly in the last 4 games so the early part of the season must have been a fluke, let's let the guy walk for nothing.

Can anybody seriously doubt today that Trevor Harris will be an effective QB in the CFL for years to come?

Harris was offered a contract, apparently they offered him the same incentive based contracts to both Ray and Harris.

So they did not let him walk. He chose to leave.

[marcwagz]

Ray has played 1 game.
I will wait until he's had a couple bad starts in a row to start worrying.
he somehow ended up with 282 yards even though he looked awful (and a 102 qb rating)

[KCargosfan]

That is based on four out of 81 games, in which two out of eight teams were pressed into using their backup. I'll wait for a longer sample size.

Common sense posting like this has no place on this board.

[ArgoGabe22]

It was frustrating to watch but I'm still surprised that Ray only had 10 incompletions. And only one interception that took a deflection. All in all, tough to criticize Ray at the moment. I would think the OC, coaching should take more of the heat than Ray is getting.