Sep. 5: Argonauts at Tiger-Cats

[R.J]

Whether Milanovich challenged or not isn't the problem - CFL officiating and the new rules are the bigger problem. The Fantuz flop was embarrassing, and receivers are now continually running into DB's just to the get the illegal contact flag. Worse yet, the illegal contact on Gurley should have been a PI because Gurley was the target.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again: Fire Johnson and Ireland, and get rid of illegal contact. No more challenging everything - just Offensive and defensive pass interference. Continue to automatically review points scored, and turnovers, add in review for in and out of bounds (but only if called in by the head referee). The eye in the sky should correct calls and correct ball placement. Lastly, each team is given only one challenge, if successful the team will get one more (only one more though, no matter if successful on the 2nd challenge), and if the call isn't overturned, the team automatically loses 1 or all timeouts, a loss of down (turnover if 3rd down), and a 25 yard delay of game penalty.

[paulwoods13]

Calgary successful on 0% of their challenges. They definitely have the formula!

[R.J]

Calgary successful on 0% of their challenges. They definitely have the formula!

How many games have they won this season again Paul ?
Or better yet, what's there record since Hufnagel took over ?

[paulwoods13]

Or better yet, what's their formula so we can all emulate it? If it's Hufnagel, then only one team at a time can have the formula.

[ArgoZ]

Or better yet, what's their formula so we can all emulate it? If it's Hufnagel, then only one team at a time can have the formula.

Hard to argue the point you are making. Fans like to bitch and complain (I do too), but the answers and solutions are not so easy. Circumstances beyond control change outcomes of games and seasons (injuries, contracts, NFL departures, bad calls, etc) Play this season over and we might have a winning record with minumum changes of luck. Next to no one gave the Argos any chance these last two games. The team has had more than a chance and at least been competitive, but somehow, everyone is more upset? How does that make sense? Maybe it's heartbreak.

[ArgoRavi]

Hard to argue the point you are making. Fans like to bitch and complain (I do too), but the answers and solutions are not so easy. Circumstances beyond control change outcomes of games and seasons (injuries, contracts, NFL departures, bad calls, etc) Play this season over and we might have a winning record with minumum changes of luck. Next to no one gave the Argos any chance these last two games. The team has had more than a chance and at least been competitive, but somehow, everyone is more upset? How does that make sense? Maybe it's heartbreak.

They have certainly been better these past two games and have played with great intensity which seemed to be missing vs. both Winnipeg and Edmonton. They just need to win a game right now. If they can beat Hamilton on Sunday, the outlook will seem much brighter. While they are still suffering some injuries, they are generally getting healthier and getting much closer to fielding the team that they have wanted to field since the start of the season.

IMO, the biggest issue still is the defensive backfield. However, I don't think that lack of talent is the issue. They need to line up the same five guys for a few games consecutively and I think that we will see some substantial improvement. The defensive backfield and the offensive line are two areas where it seems especially important to have continuity as communication between players is so critical.

Speaking of the offensive line, it needs to be better but I do wonder sometimes if it is as bad as we think that it is. I would love to see the stats on sacks and pressures against and compare the Argos with the other 8 CFL teams.

[FenderGuy69]

Speaking of the offensive line, it needs to be better but I do wonder sometimes if it is as bad as we think that it is. I would love to see the stats on sacks and pressures against and compare the Argos with the other 8 CFL teams.

Ask and you shall receive. Data through Week 11.

	SACKS	DROP BACKS	%	SACK PER DROP	RANK
BC	23.0	368	6.25%	16.00	5
CGY	10.0	378	2.65%	37.80	1
EDM	20.0	407	4.91%	20.35	2
HAM	25.0	414	6.04%	16.56	3
MTL	32.0	386	8.29%	12.06	9
OTT	31.0	401	7.73%	12.94	8
SSK	28.0	418	6.70%	14.93	6
TOR	26.0	379	6.86%	14.58	7
WPG	24.0	393	6.11%	16.38	4

CFL doesn't track "pressures" as of yet.

Very High Correlations with respect to this stat & winning/losing percentage. Greater than .6. in fact.

I will add a personal opinion here. Common perception is that a good offensive line makes a Quarterback better and while this is probably very true, much research south of the border is now showing that good-great-elite QB's make average-mediocre-poor offensive lines look much better. I would say it's somewhere in between but I think QB play; pocket awareness, release, ability to read & check down ... has a very significant impact. For instance average release is just under 3 seconds in NFL. The more elite QB's have even quicker releases around 2.5-2.6 with poor QB's having around & over 3.

I think Toronto's #'s above are most likely skewed in the games Kilgore started/played. I will have to compare the sack #'s in those versus the ones that Ricky started/played.

(Note: I just went back & checked)

In the games versus OTT, WPG, EDM ... The number of Drop Backs Per Sack was 24.6 or 4.07% of the time ... that's better than the Argos' total season-to-date numbers illustrated above. This came to me as a surprise to be honest quite frankly. Kind of dispels my theory that the better QB makes the line better.

[Argo57]

Or better yet, what's their formula so we can all emulate it? If it's Hufnagel, then only one team at a time can have the formula.

Here's the only formula that matters Paul.
Calgary 8 1 1
Toronto 4 6

[R.J]

Was listening to Tatti and Marsh today, and it was brought up that we've already hit last seasons challenge flag total. We're only at the halfway point of the season!

[REAL]

Will never go back to Tim Horton' Field to watch Argos vs TiCats. worst fan experience ever and has nothing to do with the loss. This is just a game. I don't need to pay to be treated this way.

[Will]

Will never go back to Tim Horton' Field to watch Argos vs TiCats. worst fan experience ever and has nothing to do with the loss. This is just a game. I don't need to pay to be treated this way.

Could you be a little more specific?

Chants like "Argos suck" are to be expected at THF, but I suspect with you it was something more?

[PullTogether73]

Will never go back to Tim Horton' Field to watch Argos vs TiCats. worst fan experience ever and has nothing to do with the loss. This is just a game. I don't need to pay to be treated this way.

I have to laugh at this REAL.
I completely agree and came to the exact same conclusion over the last two years.
The Tiger-Cats will get no money out of me for tickets again.

I've posted my experiences/reasons before on this forum.
What did it for you?

[Antwon]

"If you have the game recorded take a look at the coaches handshake tells you what Milanovich thinks of Austin.
Noticed it last year as well. "

Missed it, what happened??

[Argo]

I have to laugh at this REAL.
I completely agree and came to the exact same conclusion over the last two years.
The Tiger-Cats will get no money out of me for tickets again.

I've posted my experiences/reasons before on this forum.
What did it for you?

I was at THF for the latest playoff loss. Obviously cheering for the Argos. Not one problem with Ti-Cat fans. Not even a bad vibration.

[Reggiemac]

Maybe hire a retired ref to watch the game and assist. Bet there would be some refs wouldnlike thevwork.

[ArgoGabe22]

Maybe hire a retired ref to watch the game and assist. Bet there would be some refs wouldnlike thevwork.

Like the one who runs the command centre? LOL

[Argo]

I watched the game last night, up to the unchallenged pass interference call (against Jefferson, IIRC) that turned the game completely around in the Ti-Cats favour.

I have to wonder about Milanovich... however I find it difficult to understand how Jefferson or the couple of other Argos near the play did not instantly give Milanovich the scream / signal / sign to challenge the play.

Secondary point: couldn't the so-called "Command Centre" overrule a completely botched call such as this example? If this is indeed the case, then what exactly is the "Command Centre" doing instead of its job?

[1971GreyCup]

I watched the game last night, up to the unchallenged pass interference call (against Jefferson, IIRC) that turned the game completely around in the Ti-Cats favour.

I have to wonder about Milanovich... however I find it difficult to understand how Jefferson or the couple of other Argos near the play did not instantly give Milanovich the scream / signal / sign to challenge the play.

Secondary point: couldn't the so-called "Command Centre" overrule a completely botched call such as this example? If this is indeed the case, then what exactly is the "Command Centre" doing instead of its job?

Interestingly, my son and I attended the Italy vs Canada rugby match. An infraction was missed by the officials. At a break, they looked up at the replay, saw their error and immediately reversed their call. How novel!

[argolio]

Interestingly, my son and I attended the Italy vs Canada rugby match. An infraction was missed by the officials. At a break, they looked up at the replay, saw their error and immediately reversed their call. How novel!

They video review basically everything in rugby. Just not part of pro football culture right now, but I can see it getting there one day.

[1971GreyCup]

They video review basically everything in rugby. Just not part of pro football culture right now, but I can see it getting there one day.

I for one, would like to see it. Given all the natural breaks in football and the scoreboard replays, it's a simple solution. The official would have to have the power to change their mind, too.

Home teams still might delay the replay like last week in Hamilton.