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  1. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulwoods13 View Post
    In two games he made one really nice throw -- the long pass to Shaw while rolling out last week. He made a ton of truly terrible throws, forcing his receivers to either try one-handed grabs or missing them altogether. The one that really convinced me was the missed TD pass to an open Elliott in the end zone. That throw had to be made, and wasn't.

    It's amazing to me how some posters' hatred of Barker, Milanovich and Willy is blinding them to the reality that LeFevour is one of the poorest passers we have seen in a long time. His legs don't compensate for being unable to pass if the defence stops him from running.
    I'm sure nobody here "hates" B, M, and W, or even LeFevour for that matter.

    Speaking of LeFevour, I have only watched his first two starts. He made more than "one nice throw" in these two starts alone. Beyond that, my take on LeFevour is just that. He won't be starting again, although Milanovich will be coaching again.

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  2. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulwoods13 View Post
    In two games he made one really nice throw -- the long pass to Shaw while rolling out last week. He made a ton of truly terrible throws, forcing his receivers to either try one-handed grabs or missing them altogether. The one that really convinced me was the missed TD pass to an open Elliott in the end zone. That throw had to be made, and wasn't.

    It's amazing to me how some posters' hatred of Barker, Milanovich and Willy is blinding them to the reality that LeFevour is one of the poorest passers we have seen in a long time. His legs don't compensate for being unable to pass if the defence stops him from running.
    SO - if LeFevour is such a poor passer - as you've likely been sold on in your usual rush to defend everything this Argo braintrust does - then surely there is much actual evidence to support this notion? What is LeFevour's CFL career completion % then? - is it somewhere in 50% range which would indicate one of the poorest passers we've seen in a long time (that notion is totally laughable and demonstrates your obvious pre-disposed notion here) ? Has LeFevour even had a horrible passer rating or completion % in his brief time with the Argo offence, or has he failed to make some big throws or TD passes? Please site all this evidence other than he made a few poor throws - which almost every QB in the CFL manages game in and game out. Your "truly terrible throws" schtick is nothing but a load of bs intended to support your pre-conceived notions and defend this "truly" clueless Argo offence led by a total dullard in Millanovich. That's amazing to me - somebody unable to watch football games on their own, but instead swallow standard team shill bs in the guise of being a "fan".

  3. #143
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    We're here to discuss ideas, not attack other members, OV.

    Paul's message is perfectly clear. If you want to dispute it, find your own evidence.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wobbler View Post
    We're here to discuss ideas, not attack other members, OV.

    Paul's message is perfectly clear. If you want to dispute it, find your own evidence.

    Sure his message is clear - but IMO it's unmitigated bs with next to no real evidence to support it. Why don't you call for him to provide evidence?


    How many incompletions has LeFevour even thrown in his brief Argo playing time so far ?; since he is such a terrible passer - one of the "poorest" we've seen with the Argos in some time - let's see some real evidence of this. Why doesn't Paul put together a hi-lite package of all of LeFevour's poor/terrible throws - I guess he'd have us believe most of his incompletions were either one hop grounders at the feet of open receivers, badly over or under throwing wide open receivers, and the rest a bunch of wobbly, wounded ducks that should have been easily picked off. Let's see all of these - real evidence from the football field; instead of pre-conceived Millanovich & Barker are always right sermons.

  5. #145
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    I have twice suggested posters go back and watch the second half of last week's game and the first half of this week's game. Watch every throw LeFevour makes in those 60 minutes. Then tell us how many were good, easily catchable passes, and how many were woefully bad. It's all there to see, available on TSN on Demand. If someone does that and still doesn't agree with me, well, everyone is entitled to reach their own conclusions about "evidence."

    As for OV's incessant tendency to snarkily insult someone he disagrees with and/or accuse them of being just a shill for management, well, yawn. (Of course I was on record as supporting Milanovich's decision to start LeFevour this week, right? Must have been since I'm his PR agent.)

    "Preconceived sermons" may be the most ironic phrase in an OV post, ever.
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  6. #146
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulwoods13 View Post
    I have twice suggested posters go back and watch the second half of last week's game and the first half of this week's game. Watch every throw LeFevour makes in those 60 minutes. Then tell us how many were good, easily catchable passes, and how many were woefully bad. It's all there to see, available on TSN on Demand. If someone does that and still doesn't agree with me, well, everyone is entitled to reach their own conclusions about "evidence."

    As for OV's incessant tendency to snarkily insult someone he disagrees with and/or accuse them of being just a shill for management, well, yawn. (Of course I was on record as supporting Milanovich's decision to start LeFevour this week, right? Must have been since I'm his PR agent.)

    "Preconceived sermons" may be the most ironic phrase in an OV post, ever.
    Sure they're all there to see - and I've seen them; I guess your definition of terrible, uncatchable footballs is just very different than mine (see my last post to get what I think of evidence of such "poor"passing) - and that's fine by me. Why don't you cite LeFevour's "terrible" CFL career passing completion % as such "evidence" ?

    You getting to constantly object to other poster's opinions that are anything close to negative about this Argo team and your obvious "support" of Barker & Millanovich (yep, we must all just "hate" them if we aren't cheeleaders) is your right - carry on there - boring/predictable as ever.

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    All we armchair qb's, coaches, GMs etc can do is bitch moan complain and or speculate....

    We may not be happy about things but there's nothing we can do about it... Unfortunately.
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  8. #148
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    I am not a LeFevour hater (kind of neutral tbh), but using completion % as a measure of a QB's effectiveness in the Argonauts offence is completely useless.
    Throwing a bunch of high completion rate check down passes could be done by anyone.
    I have said several times here that Ricky Ray's completion % numbers are always high because so many are dinky passes.
    Most of the time the Argos can't get the first down though, so...useless.

  9. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by OV Argo View Post

    You getting to constantly object to other poster's opinions that are anything close to negative about this Argo team and your obvious "support" of Barker & Millanovich (yep, we must all just "hate" them if we aren't cheeleaders) is your right - carry on there - boring/predictable as ever.
    You getting to constantly object to other poster's opinions that are anything close to positive about this Argo team and your obvious "contempt" of Barker & Millanovich is your right - carry on there - boring/predictable as ever.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron View Post
    You getting to constantly object to other poster's opinions that are anything close to positive about this Argo team and your obvious "contempt" of Barker & Millanovich is your right - carry on there - boring/predictable as ever.

    Yep - and you carry on with your usual job of trying to criticize other posters while bringing zero in terms of actual, original observations about the game or team. The site's hall monitor and teacher's snitch.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OV Argo View Post
    Yep - and you carry on with your usual job of trying to criticize other posters while bringing zero in terms of actual, original observations about the game or team. The site's hall monitor and teacher's snitch.
    Salty are you. LOL.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OV Argo View Post
    Yep - and you carry on with your usual job of trying to criticize other posters while bringing zero in terms of actual, original observations about the game or team. The site's hall monitor and teacher's snitch.
    The schoolyard bully at it again.
    SMH.

    And yet, loved by many (apparently) on this site.
    I really don't get it.
    I guess those people like receiving abuse and hostility if they don't tow his line.
    I've seen others banned from this site for less.

    Great environment around here.

  13. #153
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron View Post
    You getting to constantly object to other poster's opinions that are anything close to positive about this Argo team and your obvious "contempt" of Barker & Millanovich is your right - carry on there - boring/predictable as ever.
    "Boring/predictable as ever" -- second-most ironic phrase in an OV post, ever.
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    This thread is getting off topic.
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    Quote Originally Posted by GreyDragon View Post
    I am not a LeFevour hater (kind of neutral tbh), but using completion % as a measure of a QB's effectiveness in the Argonauts offence is completely useless.
    Throwing a bunch of high completion rate check down passes could be done by anyone.
    I have said several times here that Ricky Ray's completion % numbers are always high because so many are dinky passes.
    Most of the time the Argos can't get the first down though, so...useless.
    Check down passes are not useless. They are about field possession and not turning the ball over. I will take a check down on 2nd down that does not result in a first down any day over a sack or forcing a ball into coverage for a pick. But hey, that's me and I'm a shill. 😁
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    Quote Originally Posted by GreyDragon View Post
    I am not a LeFevour hater (kind of neutral tbh), but using completion % as a measure of a QB's effectiveness in the Argonauts offence is completely useless.
    Throwing a bunch of high completion rate check down passes could be done by anyone.
    I have said several times here that Ricky Ray's completion % numbers are always high because so many are dinky passes.
    Most of the time the Argos can't get the first down though, so...useless.

    Precisely, could not agree with you more.
    Ray's completion numbers are horribly skewed because of those so called and mostly useless check down completions, while the total passing yards tell the story with only in the 200+ yard range.
    That number is like warming up on the sidelines, it means basically zilch.

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    Quote Originally Posted by argotom View Post
    Precisely, could not agree with you more.
    Ray's completion numbers are horribly skewed because of those so called and mostly useless check down completions, while the total passing yards tell the story with only in the 200+ yard range.
    That number is like warming up on the sidelines, it means basically zilch.
    But Kilgore's 10 INTs in 3 games is an accurate representation, right?

    A lot of "stats" mean nothing. Trevor Harris used to rack up 300+ with his screen/hitch passes, throws 15 yards laterally and then Williams and Jackson took care of rest. Therefore, removing YAC yards from a QBs total passing yards would be the most accurate figure. QB win/loss record is a pretty bad statistic as well. Everyone talks about BLM's record as if he is the only reason why the Stamps are so good.
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  18. #158
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    Yes it's too bad the total yards that we see calculated and which I agree is not a true indicator, does not come with a further crucial breakdown one for the distance of the actual throw and the second being the receiver YAC yards.
    Now that combination calculated would be the real deal.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AngeloV View Post
    Check down passes are not useless. They are about field possession and not turning the ball over. I will take a check down on 2nd down that does not result in a first down any day over a sack or forcing a ball into coverage for a pick. But hey, that's me and I'm a shill. 😁
    You're crazy, obviously it's much better to force a throw into coverage than to commit the dreaded sin of checking down.

    I mean just look at how well it worked for Kilgore!

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    Quote Originally Posted by AngeloV View Post
    Check down passes are not useless. They are about field possession and not turning the ball over. I will take a check down on 2nd down that does not result in a first down any day over a sack or forcing a ball into coverage for a pick. But hey, that's me and I'm a shill. 
    That maybe true about checkdowns, but the problem seems to be the Argo receivers don't get open past the 1st down markers. I watch other CFL games, other teams receivers are running north/south when the catch a pass. In the Argo scheme, they seem to be either standing still or running east/west. Defenses are able to react much quicker and force the punt more often than not.
    I have read that Milanovich's system does not allow any freelancing. Perhaps it would be more productive if it did.

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