Bill Manning Named New Argos President

[rdavies]

I personally would prefer this as it would leave the field CFL ready but TFC fans would go ape shit.

Just a few of the zealot morons would go ape poop. Most of the reasonable, knowledgeable folk know that GrassMaster is installed in many of the big name soccer stadiums around the world.

Those who know of this option had assumed this is what would have happened when the stadium sharing was first announced. I'll try and find the reason why it didn't happen originally and post it.

Edit: Sorry I think you meant something different than my response.

[rdavies]

Some history and some of the money that has been spent:

BMO Field's grass whisperer silences skeptics
Home of Grey Cup and Toronto FC faces huge test with big games three days apart.
Laura Armstrong thestar.com Nov. 26, 2016

When Toronto FC kicked off its season back in March, there was as much talk about BMO Field’s grass as there was about the team that would play on it.

With the Toronto Argonauts moving in from the Rogers Centre — a move heavily criticized by Reds fans — all eyes were on head groundskeeper Robert Heggie, who vowed the new football tenants wouldn’t muck up the field for soccer.

Nine months later, the pitch is pristine and many of the doubters have been silenced. But the work is far from done.

After Sunday night’s Grey Cup game between the Ottawa Redblacks and Calgary Stampeders at BMO, Heggie’s crew has just three days to repair and convert the field for Wednesday night’s deciding leg of the MLS Eastern Conference final between Toronto FC and the Montreal Impact.

“I think if we can pull this off . . . that might shut up the rest of the naysayers,” he told the Star.

To pull off the speedy conversion ― in one of the most demanding time frames of the season ― they plan to dig in around the clock, doing roughly six days worth of work in half the time.

That includes scrubbing away the Supaturf, an Australian brand of removable paint used to draw the gridiron, as well as adding green sand as top dressing and green pigment with sprayers.

Luckily, the field has not been played on since TFC’s last home game on Oct. 30. Three games in that week took a toll on the pitch, but the lengthy break means the grass is as full and healthy as it’s been all season, even with cooler temperatures.

“It’s next to perfect. It’s as good as it’s been since before the first Argos game, I’d say right now,” Heggie said Wednesday.

Heggie had a backup plan in place this season, using turf that grows in the Hamilton area, but has never needed it.

“If there was CFL playoffs here and other things happening and the timeline was a little tighter, something might have happened,” he said.

The grass will need to be replaced before next season, though, after the NHL descends for the outdoor Centennial Classic between the Maple Leafs and Red Wings on Jan. 1.

How do you plant a new field in Toronto in February? Stadium general manager Peter Church said Heggie and his team have been working on solving that problem for about a year.

Their solution: a $500,000 cover, bought in Europe, that will be placed over the field like a heated bubble. Heggie’s crew can then re-sod and grow the grass no matter how bad the weather gets.

Church estimates Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment has spent more than $7 million in total on grow lights, Supaturf, the cover and tools for maintaining the pitch. That’s money well spent, he adds.

“It really turned BMO Field into a world-class facility when it comes to ground technology.”

Heggie has said in the past that he asks star players Michael Bradley and Sebastian Giovinco for input about the field’s condition and there have been no complaints.

Unlike in Montreal on Tuesday, where the first leg of the series was delayed by more than 40 minutes because Olympic Stadium’s 18-yard boxes were painted too narrow, Heggie doesn’t expect any hiccups in the finale. He plans to follow a simple motto to make sure: “Measure twice, paint once is the rule of thumb.”

[rdavies]

Why GrassMaster was not originally installed:

Groundskeeper confident Toronto FC, Argos can share BMO Field
Neil Davidson The Canadian Press/TSN.ca April 6/2016

TORONTO - Toronto FC head groundskeeper Robert Heggie has a message to any TFC fans gritting their teeth over sharing BMO Field with the CFL Argonauts.

"I've always said there's one person in Toronto that should be worried about this and it's me. And I'm not overly worried about it," Heggie said.

"So if I'm not worried, everyone can just simmer down a little bit and let's see what happens in June," he added.

Toronto FC opens at home May 7 while the Argos kick off their regular-season schedule June 23.

Like Snoop Dogg, Heggie knows his grass.

In 2015, he was Sports Turf Canada's turf manager of the year. Heggie, who studied horticulture and turf grass management at the University of Guelph, has been TFC's head groundskeeper for seven seasons and has spent two years preparing for the advent of the Argonauts. He's talked to peers around the world to pick their brains, from officials at Wembley Stadium to those at MLS and NFL venues.

He acknowledges there will be growing pains, especially in a season with a compressed soccer schedule due to the stadium renovations. Weather, particularly rain around Argo games, will also complicate matters.

But Maple Leaf Sports & Entertainment, which owns TFC and operates BMO Field, has seemingly spared no option to ensure the ground-sharing works.

"We knew from Day 1 this was going to be a very sensitive subject," said Bob Hunter, MLSE's chief project development officer. "Two of the three (MLSE) owners own the Argos, they're very sensitive to it and Larry (MLSE chairman Larry Tanenbaum) in particular has been very focused on ensuring we have a very very high-quality TFC pitch."

A new turf field — the third to grace BMO Field since artificial turf was removed in 2010 — is set to be installed this week, weather permitting. It has a much thicker base and should settle in much quicker and tighter.

It comes in rolls 60 feet by four feet (18 by 1.2 metres) and is laid on 12 inches (30 centimetres) of sand, which covers the heating and aeration system underneath.

"For all argument's sake, it's a two-acre golf green," said Heggie.

The surface starts as Kentucky bluegrass. Heggie's crew will add in perennial rye grass, which grows better in cooler temperatures as the season wears on.

A backup field is ready and waiting in the Hamilton area if any portions of the BMO surface need replacing. It could be installed within 36 hours — and played on 24 hours later.

A third option is a hybrid field, with natural grass growing around artificial roots to strengthen the turf. That was touted by former MLSE boss Tim Leiweke as the answer to grass problems. But it is less flexible because it is hard to replace, in part or in total.

A hybrid field can also harden.

"We've had this (TFC) team for about two years now so I know what they like," Heggie said, "And I know they don't like it hard."

More than $1 million has been invested in grow-lights to help keep the grass healthy. BMO Field finally got an exemption to use pesticides, which golf courses, lawn bowling clubs and cricket grounds already had. Heggie says he tries to avoid using them but they are another part of his arsenal.

Heggie has turned to Supaturf, an Australian company that specializes in line-marking systems, for the paint need to lay down the lines for football and the ability to remove them. It's not cheap but it is effective, says Heggie.

"They won't tell you the Caramilk secret, obviously on how it actually works," he said.

But the paint solution contains water and malt, among other ingredients. A remover product that reacts to the paint will be sprayed immediately after the game.

There may be some slight ghosting the next day but it will disappear after that, he says.

In Heggie's office at the Kia Training Ground, a calendar above his computer shows both the MLS and CFL games. There is plenty of white between the two — enough time to prepare the pitch, MLSE believes.

Repairing damage caused by the Argos is "basic agronomy," Heggie said. Seeding, watering and fertilization.

The grass will be kept a little higher for CFL games than MLS contests, if timing permits. That grass cut will help remove vestiges of the paint and Heggie says football players like a little more cushion in the grass.

Heggie also has some cosmetic cheats up his sleeve, like a green pigment and green sand that groundskeepers commonly use to touch up the colour as needed.

As part of the ongoing renovations to the stadium, two positions for the football goalposts have been installed. While just a yard or so apart, it means the football lines won't be laid down the same place every game.

All this work and new grass will likely still have to be installed in advance of next season. Heggie says the grass will suffer after being covered for weeks in the leadup to the planned Winter Classic.

[rdavies]

Ok, the turf lesson is over, just pointing out what might happen down the road.

Back to our regularly scheduled thread.

[rdavies]

Sorry, found the one article I really wanted about not installing hybrid turf.

BMO Field's grass guys feeling the pressure
Larson talks with the guys in charge of keeping the grass green
Kurtis Larson, Toronto Sun, February 05, 2016

TORONTO - “Like watching grass grow” is an idiom Robert Heggie doesn't subscribe to.

As BMO Field's head groundskeeper, Heggie does it every day. In his own words, it's his baby, an obsession.

And with Toronto FC's home stadium set to become a shared venue later this year, he's feeling the pressure to deliver a pristine surface for both CFL and MLS games.

“I'm feeling the pressure, but I'm pretty confident,” Heggie told the Toronto Sun. “I'm up for the challenge.

“All I've done for my life is grow grass. We take it personally.”

The challenge, of course, is attempting to maintain a world class soccer pitch despite watching 300-pound linemen stamp all over it a few times per month.

For TFC fans, the grass is a concern. The paint is a concern. The aesthetics remain top of mind.

“MLSE has gone all out,” Heggie said of the resources he has been provided, adding his groundskeeper buddies are all jealous.

All out to the tune of $2 million, actually, according to MLSE executive Bob Hunter, who the Sun reached by phone on Thursday.

A point of contention has been the decision to not install a hybrid grass system – a surface that reinforces a natural surface with artificial fibers.

Instead, MLSE has invested $400,000 in a pair of natural grass pitches currently growing in Mount Hope, Ont. They're identical to the pitch currently growing at BMO Field.

“Once you go with hybrid, you're stuck with it,” Hunter explained the decision. “You can't do patching or replacement.”

As Heggie affirmed, the decision provides something of an insurance plan, an immediate back up.

“If you have a hybrid field you're relying on growing grass from seed,” Heggie added. “There's no quick fix. When you have natural grass you have the ability to rip it out and put fresh grass in – thick cut grass that will stay down. You always have that in case of emergency.”

Heggie's reserve pitches are growing in identical soils a short drive away. They'll be trucked in whenever needed.

After being laid, the new sod is considered playable after three days. Toronto FC won't play before five days following a CFL game, with most games arriving a week after the Argos play.

“It's a matter of scheduling more than anything else,” said Dan Almand, a grass consultant with Millennium Sports Technologies Ltd.

“It's about giving the field enough time to recover between events.”

Almand agrees with MLSE's decision to suspend the installation of an originally planned hybrid system.

It might not make sense – especially when you consider all the cash MLSE is pouring into the project.

“It's very significant,” Almand said of MLSE's investment.

“We try to provide as many tools as we can. BMO Field has some of the best technology available in our business right now.”

For starters, in addition to existing sub-pitch technologies, Toronto FC's ownership group invested $1.5 million in nine grass maintenance lighting systems to ensure all portions of the pitch receive proper lighting – a move Almand said will have “amazing” benefits.

“We believe that having the two fields is a better solution,” Hunter said.

“If it doesn't work, we've got to go back. We haven't eliminated the potential down the road that we might need to do hybrid.”

They've done as much as they can to deal with the factors they can control – including doing everything to eliminate distracting football lines.

Nothing enrages North American soccer fans more than seeing bright white gridiron lines littering a soccer pitch.

It happens occasionally in other shared venues in Seattle and New England. It's unacceptable by TFC fans' standards.

Knowing that, Heggie phoned up Wembley Stadium last year to find best practices before eventually deciding on the same paint product used in London. The paint, which is produced in Australia, is mixed with malt extract.

Heggie and his crew have been testing it at the Kia Training Ground for months now.

“There's some reaction between the remover and the malt,” Heggie explained. “The paint falls off with agitation from the water.”



MLSE groundsman going with Australian-based paint for lines (fourth from right).

The process of removing football lines this year will begin at the conclusion of every CFL game and could extend overnight.

“The life of a groundsman,” Heggie added.

They'll also shift the CFL field game-to-game to ensure lines aren't constantly being repainted in the same areas of the field.

Oh, and there won't be any Double Blue paint used anywhere on the natural surface.

“There's no coloured logos on the field during (CFL) games,” Hunter reaffirmed.

In summary, MLSE is attempting to control what it can control, to reduce the number of variables.

“The kicker is going to be the weather,” Heggie admitted. “If it drops two inches (of rain) during a game it's going to be a different story.

“We have a great setup under the field. It's one of the top in North America. We can pull a lot of water out.”

There are also identical pitches waiting in reserve.

“The players will tell us what they think at the end of the day,” Hunter finished.

They've been their ownership group's biggest critics in the past.

To footballers – and groundsmen, apparently – grass isn't just grass.

[gilthethrill]

Canadian Tire has lawn seed on sale for 35% off this week. I will personally throw a bag on the turf at BMO if it will help.

[Argo57]

Canadian Tire has lawn seed on sale for 35% off this week. I will personally throw a bag on the turf at BMO if it will help.

Fast germinating?

[BATKINSON001]

this thread was supposed to be about Bill Manning, and the related complaining as he doesn't seem to be doing anything to help the Argos yet.

How come the grass articles were posted here and not in another thread?

[rdavies]

this thread was supposed to be about Bill Manning, and the related complaining as he doesn't seem to be doing anything to help the Argos yet.

How come the grass articles were posted here and not in another thread?

It was about something he said that might become a big deal and I was giving the background on it so people will be prepared if/when the poop hits the fan. I posted all I wanted to post so you can go back to complaining about Manning if you want.

[BATKINSON001]

It was about something he said that might become a big deal and I was giving the background on it so people will be prepared if/when the poop hits the fan. I posted all I wanted to post so you can go back to complaining about Manning if you want.

ok. The articles were informative though, thanks.

As for Manning, I am taking a wait and see approach...

[RB957]

I didn't know where else to post this, but this thread seemed appropriate with the connection to TFC through Bill Manning.

Anyway, not sure who else saw it, but the Toronto Star published a small article on MLS wages in Friday's sports section. Apparently TFC has the top two earners in the league. Sebastian Giovinco is #1 at $7.1 million, and Michael Bradley is second at $6.5 million. Jozy Altidor sits at 7th place making $5 million. So that's almost $20 million ( I assume in U.S. dollars) for just three players. Each one earning more than the entire Argos payroll put together. That blew me away. Although the stadium is basically full for every game, those revenues are all in Canadian dollars. When you add that the TV ratings are not great..... how much are TFC losing? And with better TV ratings that the CFL enjoys, how much more of a return would MLSE get if they invest more in the Argos?

[ArgoRavi]

I didn't know where else to post this, but this thread seemed appropriate with the connection to TFC through Bill Manning.

Anyway, not sure who else saw it, but the Toronto Star published a small article on MLS wages in Friday's sports section. Apparently TFC has the top two earners in the league. Sebastian Giovinco is #1 at $7.1 million, and Michael Bradley is second at $6.5 million. Jozy Altidor sits at 7th place making $5 million. So that's almost $20 million ( I assume in U.S. dollars) for just three players. Each one earning more than the entire Argos payroll put together. That blew me away. Although the stadium is basically full for every game, those revenues are all in Canadian dollars. When you add that the TV ratings are not great..... how much are TFC losing? And with better TV ratings that the CFL enjoys, how much more of a return would MLSE get if they invest more in the Argos?

Steve Simmons wrote today that Toronto FC pays out $26 million in salaries while the team they are playing Saturday night, the New England Revolution, have a total payroll of $6 million. I don't understand how the MLS has such a payroll discrepancy as that. I can't imagine that the league would be able to stay alive if every team spent like Toronto FC does. Further, I can't see how TFC makes any money but I guess that MLSE is okay with that.

[Will]

Steve Simmons wrote today that Toronto FC pays out $26 million in salaries while the team they are playing Saturday night, the New England Revolution, have a total payroll of $6 million. I don't understand how the MLS has such a payroll discrepancy as that. I can't imagine that the league would be able to stay alive if every team spent like Toronto FC does. Further, I can't see how TFC makes any money but I guess that MLSE is okay with that.

Well the $6,000,000 payroll beat the $26,000,000 payroll

[Invader]

Steve Simmons wrote today that Toronto FC pays out $26 million in salaries while the team they are playing Saturday night, the New England Revolution, have a total payroll of $6 million. I don't understand how the MLS has such a payroll discrepancy as that. I can't imagine that the league would be able to stay alive if every team spent like Toronto FC does. Further, I can't see how TFC makes any money but I guess that MLSE is okay with that.

TFC doesn't make money. Forbes projected the MLS team lost US$12M in 2016 with player salaries increasing since then...while the media sets its hair on fire if the 144-yr-old Argos supposedly loses C$2M or $5M?

MLS teams have relied on huge franchise expansion fees to bolster their bottom lines but that ship will soon have sailed. TFC will have to massively cut expenses if they ever hope to break even. The Blue Jays lose about US$40M per season, on average, but nobody likes to talk about that. Ted Rogers admitted in a MacLeans article said he'd lost US$300M in the first 8-years of BJ's owernship.

[Treblecharger1]

The difference between the Argos and TFC is that Toronto FC if put on the market today would be worth well over $200 Million USD. TFC has gate revenue over $1 million a game and the Corporate Sponsorship and Merchandise sales is way more then what we would see with the Argonauts. This is where the biggest impact for the Argos being involved with MLSE will come from. You are going to start seeing ( most likely after this season) all Corporate Partner deals being packaged together. You want to sponsor TFC well guess what you are also taking a package with the Argonauts. I know we have been asked to be patient for about 30 years. But give the dude a chance to put his business plans together. The communication has been lacking I agree but it can only get better. The one email I sent to Bill was replied within 24 hours and he was extremely professional and a pleasure to speak with.

Soccer is only going to get bigger in Canada for multiple reasons. I do like how the CFL is getting involved in Soccer with Scott Mitchell in Hamilton running the new Canadian Soccer Business marketing division which will control things such as the Canadian Championship and Canada Soccer. The Argos are going to be fine but we need to be patient. Let's see how the business operations are over the course of the season and go from that point.

[rdavies]

Soccer is only going to get bigger in Canada for multiple reasons. I do like how the CFL is getting involved in Soccer with Scott Mitchell in Hamilton running the new Canadian Soccer Business marketing division which will control things such as the Canadian Championship and Canada Soccer. The Argos are going to be fine but we need to be patient. Let's see how the business operations are over the course of the season and go from that point.

Soccer won't be getting any bigger unless the CPL is a success. Toronto has room for growth because of the unreal size of their market but that hasn't translated beyond the success they've had filling the stadium, Unlike the NHL, where early allegiances were built across Canada this hasn't translated to MLS. No one cares outside the three markets. Depending on what they can land for television, and no one has yet to show me how you can monetize social media into a team's coffers, unless the CPL can get some decent TV exposure, they are doomed to fail. The CSL had as optimum a setup as could be expected and they failed. I just don't see those smaller markets having a critical mass of fans to make them successful long term.

[rdavies]

The difference between the Argos and TFC is that Toronto FC if put on the market today would be worth well over $200 Million USD.

You expect that someone would purchase them for that?

[Shatto]

TFC has three major things going for it. 1) The league itself which FIFA is desperate to see succeed 2) A deep pocketed owner(MLSE) willing to finance the team even at a relatively large annual loss 3) A relatively small but fervent group of local supporters who will fill the stadium
TFC has four majors threats to its success. 1) An annual financial loss that does not appear to be lessening from the 2016 reported loss of about $15+ million (CDN) and if MLSE decides not to cover that loss, there could be a downturn in the team's future 2) A potential lack of competitive balance because there is no salary cap. Every successful North American sports league has realized the importance of a salary cap to provide a competitive balance 3) Financial plan relying on new teams paying $300 million plus. Some have described this a akin to a Ponzi scheme. That might be an overstatement but once this money dries up as it must, the league could be in financial trouble 4) Poor Canadian TV ratings during the regular season, indicating the interest is minimal across the country

The CFL may have its problems but it is now on a sound financial footing and the next TV deal promises to be even more rewarding.

[paulwoods13]

IMO soccer is only going to grow in popularity in North America. The English Premier League is becoming a mainstay on TV here, the World Cup is the only true worldwide best-on-best competition in team sports, and MLS continues on a growth trajectory. Yes, there are issues with its financial underpinnings, but there are also huge success stories in MLS. Its investors seem prepared to play the long game. And soccer is becoming the summer sport of choice for kids across much of the continent. MLS does not IMO pose a serious threat to the nice niche that the CFL has in Canada, but it seems pretty clear to me that MLS is not going away and will continue to grow.

[AngeloV]

2) A potential lack of competitive balance because there is no salary cap. Every successful North American sports league has realized the importance of a salary cap to provide a competitive balance .

Not MLB. Maybe it's just the North American leagues that have the actual words Major League in them?