Game Thread: Winnipeg at BC

[jerrym]

The Bombers did not look like the back-to-back Grey Cup champions they used to be playing against a backup Argo QB and BC is playing at home where they have historically far better record, including this year, so I'm picking BC.

[jerrym]

Injury reports are at the url below. Both teams are fairly healthy

https://www.cfl.ca/2023/10/02/lions-...cipant-on-mon/

[AngeloV]

I'm all in on BC tonight. Other than a couple of games this year (2nd home game vs the Lions and the murder of the Riders in the Banjo Bowl), the Bombers just haven't looked the same this year. Especially on the road.

[ArgoRavi]

I'm all in on BC tonight. Other than a couple of games this year (2nd home game vs the Lions and the murder of the Riders in the Banjo Bowl), the Bombers just haven't looked the same this year. Especially on the road.

I am going with BC in this one as well. The Bombers are a little more vulnerable this season.

[AngeloV]

I am going with BC in this one as well. The Bombers are a little more vulnerable this season.

Their O-line just isn't what it was (at least in pass protection). ZC has been hit more this season, than he was the previous 3 combined it seems. Probably the reason he has thrown more picks than normal.

[Will]

The Lions blew a 10-point lead late yesterday, as they got stuffed on 3rd and inches allowing Winnipeg to kick the game tying field goal and eventually win the game in OT.

Winnipeg need only win next week to secure #1 seed in the West I believe.

[paulwoods13]

Looks like the Peg have all but wrapped up first place again. I wasn't able to stay awake until the end but watched the highlights this morning. Crazy that the Lions blew such a glorious chance to win on the final play of regulation. I still thin they can give Bombers a good run in the Western Final, but having to win in IG Field will be a tall order.

[Will]

Looks like the Peg have all but wrapped up first place again. I wasn't able to stay awake until the end but watched the highlights this morning. Crazy that the Lions blew such a glorious chance to win on the final play of regulation. I still thin they can give Bombers a good run in the Western Final, but having to win in IG Field will be a tall order.

It was imperative, IMO, that BC get that home-field advantage, but (as evidence yesterday) they aren't as invincible at BC Place as they were earlier in the year.

[OV Argo]

BC's passing game was working well early, but they have no clue about a ground game; Bombers took over in the 2nd half - they do have a ground game and the coaching adjustments showed - a far better coached team IMO. Collaros still got strip sacked twice in the 2nd half for turn-overs, but the Lions did nothing with that.

Last few seconds of regulation; BC receiver (Rhymes ?) catches the ball and all of a sudden has lots of room; he lost a race to the end-zone but could have easily have gone down with a few seconds left so they could kick a FG, or, he could have easily punted the ball deep into the end zone for a game winning rouge. IF you have American players who don't understand Canadian rules, that's on the coaches, who need to prepare them for situations; or deploy Canadian players who do understand. Like Chris Jones putting a rookie American back to field a kick late in a game. A lot of real dumb coaching in the CFL now, IMO.

And IMO, this year's Argos are a way better team than either of these 2 West top teams; more talent on D; and far better offensive coaching and play-calling.

[ArgoRavi]

BC's passing game was working well early, but they have no clue about a ground game; Bombers took over in the 2nd half - they do have a ground game and the coaching adjustments showed - a far better coached team IMO. Collaros still got strip sacked twice in the 2nd half for turn-overs, but the Lions did nothing with that.

Last few seconds of regulation; BC receiver (Rhymes ?) catches the ball and all of a sudden has lots of room; he lost a race to the end-zone but could have easily have gone down with a few seconds left so they could kick a FG, or, he could have easily punted the ball deep into the end zone for a game winning rouge. IF you have American players who don't understand Canadian rules, that's on the coaches, who need to prepare them for situations; or deploy Canadian players who do understand. Like Chris Jones putting a rookie American back to field a kick late in a game. A lot of real dumb coaching in the CFL now, IMO.

And IMO, this year's Argos are a way better team than either of these 2 West top teams; more talent on D; and far better offensive coaching and play-calling.

I agree with most of what you are saying here, OV, except I am not sure that a Canadian player would have necessarily gone down any faster than an American player and there are likely many American players who would have done the right thing in this situation. Paul Lapolice said after the game that the coaches need to remind all players in a situation like that of what they need to do. Rhymes could have gone down with anywhere from 2 to 4 seconds left after he made that catch and the Lions would likely be hosting the West Final in November. It's a shame that he didn't.

The lack of a running game for the Lions was certainly evident last night and will make it more difficult for them to get to the Grey Cup.

[ArgoRavi]

It was imperative, IMO, that BC get that home-field advantage, but (as evidence yesterday) they aren't as invincible at BC Place as they were earlier in the year.

We have to be honest here - the Lions lost to the freaking Tiger-Cats at home and should have lost to the Redblacks. They aren't playing their best football right now for sure.

[OV Argo]

I agree with most of what you are saying here, OV, except I am not sure that a Canadian player would have necessarily gone down any faster than an American player and there are likely many American players who would have done the right thing in this situation. Paul Lapolice said after the game that the coaches need to remind all players in a situation like that of what they need to do. Rhymes could have gone down with anywhere from 2 to 4 seconds left after he made that catch and the Lions would likely be hosting the West Final in November. It's a shame that he didn't.

The lack of a running game for the Lions was certainly evident last night and will make it more difficult for them to get to the Grey Cup.

Point is Ravi - the coaching staff needs to prepare any player for the situation; and a Canadian player is far more likely to have his grasp on Canadian rules kick-in at a crucial time. My guess is they made no mention to any of their receivers going into that play - to either get down to kill the clock for a FG attempt, OR to punt the ball for a rouge.

BC has IMO the best receiving corps in the league; and when Vernon Adams is hot and on his A game, they are very dangerous to score lots; but Adams is not always there; their O-Line is iffy, and they have no clue about a ground game. Good luck in a poor weather or field conditions play-off game with that.

And their D - outside of Betts as a premier pass rusher, just is not that good; front 7 weak against the run often, and holes in the secondary (Peters & Lee are 2 very good vet DBs though). Why they were not playing vet play-making LB Lokombo in such a big game is bizzarre-o IMO.

Much rather see another Argo/Lions GC match-up but I'll bet on the Bombers being able to take-out BC , especially if at home.

[paulwoods13]

I agree with most of what you are saying here, OV, except I am not sure that a Canadian player would have necessarily gone down any faster than an American player and there are likely many American players who would have done the right thing in this situation.

I think we have seen Argo receivers deliberately fall to the ground at least a couple of times in the past year to leave a few seconds for a FG. Daniels did it at least once that I can recall.

[ArgoRavi]

I think we have seen Argo receivers deliberately fall to the ground at least a couple of times in the past year to leave a few seconds for a FG. Daniels did it at least once that I can recall.

We have. And that is all the more reason to have expected Rhymes to do the right thing on that play with the game and 1st place on the line.

[argolio]

The best play there was to go down and set up a FG attempt, but I get that most players instinctively think they can take it to the house once they break free from initial contact. Kicking the ball was a very low percentage play. Rhymes could have just as easily shanked or missed the ball entirely, and that's with a huge assumption that a kick was possible with DBs in hot pursuit. As a non-kicker, he would have had to slow down a bit in order to attempt a kick.

[OV Argo]

The best play there was to go down and set up a FG attempt, but I get that most players instinctively think they can take it to the house once they break free from initial contact. Kicking the ball was a very low percentage play. Rhymes could have just as easily shanked or missed the ball entirely, and that's with a huge assumption that a kick was possible with DBs in hot pursuit. As a non-kicker, he would have had to slow down a bit in order to attempt a kick.

IF Rhymes (or another receiver) had practiced the play/situation, and has even modest punting skills, there was lots of time/room for him to slow down and drill a low punt into the end-zone from about 25 yards out, with a good chance the ball goes out of the back-line, or, other receivers, knowing what's coming, would have been able to trap a defender trying to field the punt and tackle him (or block the chance at a return punt): single point rouge there = game over. A FG attempt would have been a nice option too with a reliable kicker like Whyte, but FG attempts can be missed or blocked (see both teams in last year's GC)

[TrueBlueGuy]

all of you posters have raised excellent points, but as I was able to get back from the Argo game in time to see only the last Quarter of the Lions-Bombers, I just have to say what a great CFL football game between two well-coached top-notch teams, just the way it should be. VERY entertaining football. Collaros is one tough cookie, and Brady O may be the league MOP for 2023. Hoping for similar quality of football, NFL-style, when the Cowboys and the 49ers play.

[jerrym]

BC's passing game was working well early, but they have no clue about a ground game;

When your RBs gain just 23 yards, the chances of winning, even in the pass happy CFL, are slim to none.

[ArgoRavi]

The best play there was to go down and set up a FG attempt, but I get that most players instinctively think they can take it to the house once they break free from initial contact. Kicking the ball was a very low percentage play. Rhymes could have just as easily shanked or missed the ball entirely, and that's with a huge assumption that a kick was possible with DBs in hot pursuit. As a non-kicker, he would have had to slow down a bit in order to attempt a kick.

Agreed on all points. I have re-watched the play several times. Rhymes caught the ball between the 40 and 45 (making it a 52 yard FG attempt at the most) with 4 seconds left and got down to the 32, where he broke a tackle, with 2 seconds left. It's unfortunate that he didn't just go down somewhere between catching the ball and breaking that tackle but I also understand that once he broke that tackle, he felt like there was nobody between him and the endzone.