Chad Kelly 2023 CFL MOP

**Argo57** · 11-16-2023, 08:04 PM

Congrats to Chad Kelly all in all a great season!!

https://3downnation.com/2023/11/16/t...anding-player/

**Stevoman** · 11-16-2023, 09:43 PM

Of course we all want the Grey Cup more but I'm proud of how many Argo's were represented tonight! It's never easy to follow a championship season and they did so incredibly well!

**AngeloV** · 11-17-2023, 08:25 AM

Well deserved. This was a fantastic season, even if it had a disappointing ending. Looking forward to seeing him get even better next season.

**Argo57** · 11-17-2023, 09:32 AM

Originally Posted by AngeloV

Well deserved. This was a fantastic season, even if it had a disappointing ending. Looking forward to seeing him get even better next season.

Most times adversity makes you stronger and more resilient, hopefully this drives Kelly to get even better.

**paulwoods13** · 11-17-2023, 10:16 AM

Originally Posted by Argo57

Most times adversity makes you stronger and more resilient, hopefully this drives Kelly to get even better.

Sadly, in retrospect, this team faced absolutely no adversity all season. It was going to hit eventually, and unfortunately they were not ready for it (defence excepted).

**Argo57** · 11-17-2023, 03:09 PM

Originally Posted by paulwoods13

Sadly, in retrospect, this team faced absolutely no adversity all season. It was going to hit eventually, and unfortunately they were not ready for it (defence excepted).

The Argos basically cruised along all season including the last 6 games, Montreal on the other hand came into the EF battle tested and it certainly showed.
Toronto (specifically Chad Kelly) got smacked in the mouth on the first possession and unraveled from there, hopefully a learning experience for him.

**ArgoRavi** · 11-17-2023, 04:46 PM

Originally Posted by paulwoods13

Sadly, in retrospect, this team faced absolutely no adversity all season. It was going to hit eventually, and unfortunately they were not ready for it (defence excepted).

Not that I buy into the narrative coming from some in the west that the Argos only beat up on weak eastern teams this year - the same eastern teams that had a collective winning record against the west - but I do welcome the return of the balanced schedule next year including two games each against Winnipeg and BC. I think that won't hurt in testing the Argos even more before playoff time.

**Antwon** · 11-18-2023, 09:01 AM

Originally Posted by ArgoRavi

Not that I buy into the narrative coming from some in the west that the Argos only beat up on weak eastern teams this year - the same eastern teams that had a collective winning record against the west - but I do welcome the return of the balanced schedule next year including two games each against Winnipeg and BC. I think that won't hurt in testing the Argos even more before playoff time.

Who ever has that narrative in the west is just making excuses. I guess they forget that Wpg and BC feasted on Edm, Sask, and Cgy!!!
The Mtl vs Tor games were competitive. It's not the Argos fault that Ham and Ott were pathetic.
It may have helped Tor if they played Mtl later in the season.
And this Argo team went toe to toe with Wpg with our backup QB. I thought that loss was suppose to make a point with the team that they still had to work for the wins. But maybe it backfired and they thought they would have one with Kelly.
I too am happy to see the balanced schedule back.

**AngeloV** · 11-18-2023, 04:50 PM

Originally Posted by Antwon

I guess they forget that Wpg and BC feasted on Edm, Sask, and Cgy!!!

And both lost to Hamilton, who the Argos were 4-0 against. Hell, Winnipeg even lost to Ottawa, and BC should have without some late dumbass coaching decisions.

**kellynjk** · 11-18-2023, 07:13 PM

This is a well-deserved award for Chad Kelly and I thought his acceptance speech was nice, the way he credited his team-mates for making him a better player. Congrats!!

**TICATS SUCK !** · 11-20-2023, 10:26 PM

Let me preface my response with the following: I have nothing against Chad Kelly. He had a very successful season, especially as a first year starter in the CFL, which is quite rare.

Chad Kelly shouldn't have won the award for MOP. To me, this is one of the weakest selections ever. I feel that he wasn't even the best player at his position, whereas Brady Oliveira was. As Paul Woods and Argo Ravi noted, Kelly regressed over the last half/third of the season. I would describe his performance during this time as "pedestrian."

Historically speaking , Kelly's 23 TD passes is the lowest amongst all MOP winning QB'S (in a full season) since the advent of the 18 game schedule in 1986. His passing yardage total (4,123) is the 2nd lowest ever. Here are some of Kelly's ranks this past season:

Passing Yards: 4th
Completion %: 4th
Yards Per Attempt: 1st
TD Passes: 3rd
QB Rating: 2nd
300 Yard Games: 4th

I realize that stats aren't everything. That being said, these numbers don't scream MOP to me. Kelly's selection will make good fodder for those who feel that the CFL shows favourtism towards the Argos.

On an unrelated note, I feel that Montreal's improbable Grey Cup title is reminiscent of the Argos winning in 2017. Personally, it takes a little bit of the sting out the disastrous Eastern Final.

**Stevoman** · 11-21-2023, 01:03 AM

Originally Posted by TICATS SUCK !

On an unrelated note, I feel that Montreal's improbable Grey Cup title is reminiscent of the Argos winning in 2017. Personally, it takes a little bit of the sting out the disastrous Eastern Final.

I feel the same way!

**AngeloV** · 11-21-2023, 11:24 AM

Originally Posted by TICATS SUCK !

Let me preface my response with the following: I have nothing against Chad Kelly. He had a very successful season, especially as a first year starter in the CFL, which is quite rare.

Chad Kelly shouldn't have won the award for MOP. To me, this is one of the weakest selections ever. I feel that he wasn't even the best player at his position, whereas Brady Oliveira was. As Paul Woods and Argo Ravi noted, Kelly regressed over the last half/third of the season. I would describe his performance during this time as "pedestrian."

Historically speaking , Kelly's 23 TD passes is the lowest amongst all MOP winning QB'S (in a full season) since the advent of the 18 game schedule in 1986. His passing yardage total (4,123) is the 2nd lowest ever. Here are some of Kelly's ranks this past season:

Passing Yards: 4th
Completion %: 4th
Yards Per Attempt: 1st
TD Passes: 3rd
QB Rating: 2nd
300 Yard Games: 4th

I realize that stats aren't everything. That being said, these numbers don't scream MOP to me. Kelly's selection will make good fodder for those who feel that the CFL shows favourtism towards the Argos.

On an unrelated note, I feel that Montreal's improbable Grey Cup title is reminiscent of the Argos winning in 2017. Personally, it takes a little bit of the sting out the disastrous Eastern Final.

I disagree, but I guess it’s fashionable to jump off Kelly’s bandwagon. The only reason he regressed in the 2nd half is because they had nothing to play for and had big 2nd half leads. TD passes are such an overrated stat, especially when your passing gets you close to the goal line which lead to a league high 30 rushing TD’s and no other team was close to that. I don’t recall a lot of those rushing TD’s being long runs. Kelly was absolutely the right choice for the award.

**RB957** · 11-21-2023, 04:08 PM

Originally Posted by AngeloV

I disagree, but I guess it’s fashionable to jump off Kelly’s bandwagon. The only reason he regressed in the 2nd half is because they had nothing to play for and had big 2nd half leads. TD passes are such an overrated stat, especially when your passing gets you close to the goal line which lead to a league high 30 rushing TD’s and no other team was close to that. I don’t recall a lot of those rushing TD’s being long runs. Kelly was absolutely the right choice for the award.

Originally Posted by TICATS SUCK !

Let me preface my response with the following: I have nothing against Chad Kelly. He had a very successful season, especially as a first year starter in the CFL, which is quite rare.

Chad Kelly shouldn't have won the award for MOP. To me, this is one of the weakest selections ever. I feel that he wasn't even the best player at his position, whereas Brady Oliveira was. As Paul Woods and Argo Ravi noted, Kelly regressed over the last half/third of the season. I would describe his performance during this time as "pedestrian."

Historically speaking , Kelly's 23 TD passes is the lowest amongst all MOP winning QB'S (in a full season) since the advent of the 18 game schedule in 1986. His passing yardage total (4,123) is the 2nd lowest ever. Here are some of Kelly's ranks this past season:

Passing Yards: 4th
Completion %: 4th
Yards Per Attempt: 1st
TD Passes: 3rd
QB Rating: 2nd
300 Yard Games: 4th

I realize that stats aren't everything. That being said, these numbers don't scream MOP to me. Kelly's selection will make good fodder for those who feel that the CFL shows favourtism towards the Argos.

On an unrelated note, I feel that Montreal's improbable Grey Cup title is reminiscent of the Argos winning in 2017. Personally, it takes a little bit of the sting out the disastrous Eastern Final.

Honestly, I can see both sides and could argue either of your positions. Perhaps from a strictly statistical perspective, TICAT's argument has merit. But for me, and I think this is where I lean toward Angelo's comment, the crux is how you define "outstanding". Does it mean you have to be the top in all or most statistical categories? I don't think so, and I don't think that the evaluators saw it that way. If you look at it from the perspective of most "valuable", then Kelly wins hands down. And I agree that some of the stats can be misleading.

To the comment that the Alouettes remind you of the 2017 Argonauts, I would say they also remind me so much of the 2012 Argonauts. As I recall, that team was mediocre, but then had a big win on the road in Saskatchewan, after which they caught fire. They were a .500 team, and had to win two games to make it to the Grey Cup. It just reinforces for me how important the mental aspect and team culture is. The Als had that MOJO going for them and they caught fire at the right time.

**bluto** · 11-22-2023, 08:18 AM

Originally Posted by RB957

If you look at it from the perspective of most "valuable", then Kelly wins hands down. And I agree that some of the stats can be misleading.

That's how I regard it. He won the MOP award due to being the MVP.

**paulwoods13** · 11-22-2023, 09:20 AM

Of the top three QBs in the league, only Kelly never had a bad (regular-season) game, only Kelly sat out two full games because he wasn't needed, and only Kelly regularly played ultra-conservatively in second halves due to sizeable leads. His statistics are not as impressive as Collaros's and Adams's because the Argos didn't need him to rack up impressive statistics. I have previously noted that he was somewhat less impressive in the second half of the season, but it's worth noting that only three of those nine games actually mattered. IMO he deserves to be all-star QB and he deserves to be MOP because he excelled at a position that is much more critical to a team's success is than RB. Not to take anything away from Oliveira, who had a superb year, but IMO the 39-22 MOP vote in Kelly's favour is about right.

As for the CFL showing favouritism to the Argos, tell that to Argo fans who have seen their team screwed by the schedule-maker year after year (tho not in 2023, to be fair). And the awards are not determined by the league but by a panel of voters from all nine cities, with Toronto reps likely outnumbered something in the range of eight to one.

**RB957** · 11-22-2023, 02:13 PM

Originally Posted by paulwoods13

As for the CFL showing favouritism to the Argos, tell that to Argo fans who have seen their team screwed by the schedule-maker year after year (tho not in 2023, to be fair). And the awards are not determined by the league but by a panel of voters from all nine cities, with Toronto reps likely outnumbered something in the range of eight to one.

I would add to this... what possible motivation would there be for showing favouritism to the Argos with the awards. Let's face it, they are so far down the pecking order in terms of sports coverage and interest in this city, what difference would this make?

**ArgoRavi** · 11-22-2023, 02:50 PM

Originally Posted by paulwoods13

Of the top three QBs in the league, only Kelly never had a bad (regular-season) game, only Kelly sat out two full games because he wasn't needed, and only Kelly regularly played ultra-conservatively in second halves due to sizeable leads. His statistics are not as impressive as Collaros's and Adams's because the Argos didn't need him to rack up impressive statistics. I have previously noted that he was somewhat less impressive in the second half of the season, but it's worth noting that only three of those nine games actually mattered. IMO he deserves to be all-star QB and he deserves to be MOP because he excelled at a position that is much more critical to a team's success is than RB. Not to take anything away from Oliveira, who had a superb year, but IMO the 39-22 MOP vote in Kelly's favour is about right.

As for the CFL showing favouritism to the Argos, tell that to Argo fans who have seen their team screwed by the schedule-maker year after year (tho not in 2023, to be fair). And the awards are not determined by the league but by a panel of voters from all nine cities, with Toronto reps likely outnumbered something in the range of eight to one.

In the same vein, I find that, in recent years in the CFL, when a QB throws for 400+ yards, they usually lose because they have to throw the ball so much because they're well behind. Situationally, Kelly didn't need to put up huge numbers - he just needed to do what he had to for the Argos to consistently win games. He is certainly capable of throwing for 400 yards if he has to but he never had to.

I have seen the Argos screwed over time and again on the awards front. Terry Greer should have won the MOP award in 1983 but they went with Warren Moon instead who was the first passer to throw for more than 5000 yards but his team was only 8-8. It felt like that MOP award for Moon was more of a make-up award for previous years but has any receiver had a more dominant season than Greer did in 1983?

Also, Jon Volpe beat out Rocket Ismail for top rookie in 1991 and Chris Isaac somehow won top rookie in 1982 over Bob Bronk (not to mention Mervyn Fernandez as well). Isaac played some good football for Ottawa but they were 5-11 in 1982.