Argos at BMO Field

[Invader]

So you don't find the lack of ANY announcement of an extension of a critical deadline by either party, of such an important decision for both the football club and the stadium the least bit strange? Well then obviously the city wasn't very serious with their deadline, and that this deal will just happen when it happens and anything we hear from anyone is meaningless, unless its a confirmed "deal is done" or "deal is off".

We should remember that Leiweke is the one who spearheaded the BMO renovation deal. Perhaps this $100 million expenditure hasn't gone over well amongst the MLSE partners, like Rogers for instance? Leiweke reportedly had to fight tooth 'n nail for with the MLSE board to spend the $100 million to secure a couple of "name" players for TFC, "to make a splash like Beckham in L.A." .

I guess that investment hasn't gone over so well with TFC drawing only 35,000 TV viewers for their recent game and with only 10,000 fans in attendance for the last home game. While the TFC game was supposedly a "complete sellout", those TFC numbers must be troubling for MLSE who are facing another $100 million expenditure to accommodate the Argos at BMO. It could be that Leiweke might have his wings clipped a bit?

The city's conditions for approving BMO's expansion were that the provincial and federal governments must provide $10 million each and the Argos sign a 20-year lease at BMO by May 15th (perhaps they meant 2015?) So far the fed's have said no, the province is wavering and MLSE's been unable to negotiate a lease with the Argos. Other than that all is well!

[doubleblue]

The Feds and Province already put the money into BMO field, but Miller and MLSE pulled a fast one and had the stadium made for Soccer only. So I believe the thinking is from the Gov't is this, we already gave you the funds once and were not going to do it again. So it appears its up to the City and MLSE to fix what they created.

[T-Bone]

We should remember that Leiweke is the one who spearheaded the BMO renovation deal. Perhaps this $100 million expenditure hasn't gone over well amongst the MLSE partners, like Rogers for instance?

Are you claiming that Leiweke went and made a $90 million dollar proposal to the City of Toronto with out the MLSE boards approval?

Miller and MLSE pulled a fast one and had the stadium made for Soccer only.

Great, here we go again with the conspiracy theories.

[paulwoods13]

The sky is falling! Again!

[Neely2005]

I sent an Email to Councillor Layton and Councillor Grimes asking for an update. If I hear anything back I'll post it.

[Neely2005]

I sent an Email to Councillor Layton and Councillor Grimes asking for an update. If I hear anything back I'll post it.

From: councillor_grimes@toronto.ca
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2014 3:20 PM
To:
Subject: Re: BMO Field Expansion


*
At this point we have not yet received an answer.
*
Best Regards,

*
Councillor Mark Grimes' Office
Ward 6, Etobicoke Lakeshore
City Hall
100 Queen Street West, Suite C48
Toronto, ON M5H 2N2
Tel: 416-397-9273 Fax: 416-397-9279
www.markgrimes.ca

[T-Bone]

*
At this point we have not yet received an answer.
*

From whom have they not received an answer?

[paulwoods13]

And what was the question?

[AngeloV]

Leiweke reportedly had to fight tooth 'n nail for with the MLSE board to spend the $100 million to secure a couple of "name" players for TFC, "to make a splash like Beckham in L.A." .

Reportedly? Who has reported this? Nobody follows TFC news more than T-Bone. I don't recall him mentioning this.

[Neely2005]

And what was the question?

I'm looking to get an update on the BMO Field expansion project. One of the conditions of the expansion was that the Toronto Argonauts had to sign a long term lease by May 15, 2014. That was yesterday. Has the lease been signed? Is the project still on?

Regards

From whom have they not received an answer?

I asked that, waiting to hear back.

[ArgoGabe22]

Neely I think Paul might be refering to the question that tha MP is waiting for an answer for.

[Invader]

Are you claiming that Leiweke went and made a $90 million dollar proposal to the City of Toronto with out the MLSE boards approval?

No, he had the Board's approval. That was before the feds and province backed out, and before MLSE failed to negotiate a lease with the Argo by the deadline, and before the wheels fell off the "bend it like Beckham" TFC hyperbole. TFC looked like world-beaters after their first game but were unable to maintain that momentum. National TV ratings like 57,000 and 35,000 for recent TFC games show they haven't exactly ignited the populace. When 10,000 TFC fans don't show up for a home game because 1 MM of rain is forecast..."Houston, we have problem!"

It could be that MLSE is getting cold-feet about dumping another $100 million into the Toronto Football Club experiment and to help out the Toronto Argonaut Football Club, a team which a majority-partner of MLSE despises.

MLSE can still back out of the BMO renovation and blame it on somebody else. The field is perfectly adequate for what TFC requires.

[T-Bone]

Reportedly? Who has reported this? Nobody follows TFC news more than T-Bone. I don't recall him mentioning this.

I don't remember that being reported.

No, he had the Board's approval. That was before the feds and province backed out, and before MLSE failed to negotiate a lease with the Argo by the deadline

It could be that MLSE is getting cold-feet about dumping another $100 million into the Toronto Football Club experiment and to help out the Toronto Argonaut Football Club, a team which a majority-partner of MLSE despises.

MLSE can still back out of the BMO renovation and blame it on somebody else. The field is perfectly adequate for what TFC requires.

Pure speculation on your behalf. The feds and the province never committed so they couldn't back out. At the town hall meeting before the TFC home opener it was said that the final renovation plans wouldn't be ready until June/July. Also, the fact that there is spray paint all around BMO Field marking out things for a renovation makes me think this deal might not be dead just yet. Only time will tell.

The sky is falling! Again!

Indeed.

[argos1873]

Maybe MLSE will go it alone without government money. But as we know only the city requested that the Argos be included if they were to give cash to this venture. So far as we know, the deadline for this has come and gone. This doesn't mean it won't happen, but it also doesn't mean that the stadium will be expanded in a way that will include Canadian football. Maybe it will though. I'm not sure why some people are so confident it will when the stadium was originally supposed to support Canadian football and didn't. And no that's not a conspiracy theory, and no I don't think the sky is falling. I'm just slightly concerned nothing happened on the landlord's imposed deadline. Maybe MLSE says to hell with your 10 million, we'll do it the way we want, and the city says OK, expand our asset on your dime. Where does that leave the Argos?

[D-Gap-Willie]

At this point, it becomes a waiting and guessing game. Will it go ahead or won't it ? Why no lease contract yet ? There are not many possibilities:
1) No lease has been offered to the Argos as yet;
2) MLSE is backing out of the deal;
3) The lease which is offered is entirely in favour of MLSE financially or otherwise, and the Argos refuse to sign or are trying to negotiate alterations. If a favourable lease had been offered, presumably Argos would have signed. If as I predicted earlier the lease removes all hope of the Argos being profitable, and would be a 'poison pill ' to any other buyer than MLSE, I can see the Argos reluctance to sign without having a signed purchase agreement also.

[Rich]

Maybe MLSE says to hell with your 10 million, we'll do it the way we want, and the city says OK, expand our asset on your dime. Where does that leave the Argos?

You're missing the other half of the equation.

If MLSE is gonna spend all that money on the stadium, won't they desperately need another tenant, and right away? They've got to start recouping costs, especially since they're spending so much on TFC. If not 9 Argonauts dates plus a Grey Cup, what else would they put in there, field lacrosse?

I think the delay is because Lieweke is revising the plans so that he can expand the size of the stands to around 30K. He has been talking about that recently. Surely there'd be a delay to revise all the paperwork.

[Ron]

Also, the fact that there is spray paint all around BMO Field marking out things for a renovation makes me think this deal might not be dead just yet. Only time will tell.

No deal in sight. You're just seeing the tags by the notorious local surveyor gang.

Found this deal for some Argo fans. Seems they really need one.

http://www.amazon.com/Silver-Celtic-.../dp/B007D3OY1I

[1argoholic]

How many times have long time Argonaut fans had to go through this Dog and Pony show? People yap on and on about Rider fans being the best. I call BS to that. Die Hard Argo fans have had to deal with up and down BS of this organization not only from day to day but year to year, forever. No respect given to the oldest professional sports franchise in North America by anyone but a few owners and the die hard fans. How can anyone expect fringe fans to support a team that never has more than one or two years of somewhat stability? I'm sick of this stadium talk and no news reported. This as every other team is getting new stadiums or major upgrades. The Argos keep getting crapped on. The only interest in the team seems to be from a massive corporation that I have zero use for. If they even have interest at this point. Who knows, I'd like to know what the hell is going on.

[T-Bone]

I'm not sure why some people are so confident it will when the stadium was originally supposed to support Canadian football and didn't. And no that's not a conspiracy theory

No that's not, but saying it like this sure sounds like one:

Miller and MLSE pulled a fast one and had the stadium made for Soccer only.

It's simply not true. The reason for why that happened is right here.

You're missing the other half of the equation.

If MLSE is gonna spend all that money on the stadium, won't they desperately need another tenant, and right away? They've got to start recouping costs, especially since they're spending so much on TFC. If not 9 Argonauts dates plus a Grey Cup, what else would they put in there, field lacrosse?

Winter Classic.

I think the delay is because Lieweke is revising the plans so that he can expand the size of the stands to around 30K. He has been talking about that recently. Surely there'd be a delay to revise all the paperwork.

30K stands has been part of this expansion plan since day one.

[Invader]

At this point, it becomes a waiting and guessing game. Will it go ahead or won't it ? Why no lease contract yet ? There are not many possibilities:
1) No lease has been offered to the Argos as yet;
2) MLSE is backing out of the deal;
3) The lease which is offered is entirely in favour of MLSE financially or otherwise, and the Argos refuse to sign or are trying to negotiate alterations. If a favourable lease had been offered, presumably Argos would have signed. If as I predicted earlier the lease removes all hope of the Argos being profitable, and would be a 'poison pill ' to any other buyer than MLSE, I can see the Argos reluctance to sign without having a signed purchase agreement also.

You've made some good points, D-G-W. I believe it comes down to ownership. Wouldn't MLSE want a favourable lease for the Argos if they intended to buy the team?

The Argos problem is ownership or lack thereof. Somebody needs to step forward and take control of the situation. That should be MLSE but they are negotiating at arms-length at this point.

MLSE would seem like a perfect owner for Toronto's only football team. MLSE's 37.5%-owner operates Skydome, the Argos home for over 25 years. The other 37.5%-owner controls the Argos and CFL TV rights for the next 5 years. The remaining 25% MLSE-owner said he's wanted to buy the Argos on more than one occasion in the past, according to reports. MLSE controls the only other football stadium in the city. Seems like a match made in heaven. So what's the problem?

Leiweke said MLSE is not interested in the Argos as a "stand-alone" enterprise...meaning as long as they play at Rogers Centre, then MLSE isn't interested. Doesn't Rogers own MLSE? That makes little sense to me.

We all assume it's Rogers whose been the roadblock on the Argos deal. But an even more stark scenario could be that Bell is the problem. There is little doubt Bell/CTV is 100% committed to expanding the NFL in Canada. For all we know, the CFL could be standing in their way of maximizing their NFL revenue. You only had to watch the recent Olympics with the repeated showing of Bell/CTV/TSN's dynamic "The NFL Lives Here" commercials on multi-channel media platforms. But not one mention about the CFL to these huge Olympic audiences. "The CFL used to Live here?"