So do we grab Jarious Jackson now that he's been dumped?

[1argoholic]

I say he could be a great backup. Better than we have in Bell.

[ArgoGabe22]

Great backup but if I was a GM I would go younger. I think that Ray & Mass would be a good mentors and should mentor someone young instead of a career backup mentoring the face of the franchise.

[Will]

I guess I'd feel better knowing that he would be the #2 behind Ricky Ray rather than competing for the #1 job. I still wouldn't mind seeing if there is a younger option.

[bluto]

it would be nice to have him holding the clipboard for us... but i have a suspicion that Jarious Jackson might be a bit of a luxury at backup for us when our #1 makes the sort of coin that he does. i was hoping that we would be able to pry a slightly less experienced guy like Alex Brink away from Winterpeg... but it may be that we have an open competition in training camp for our backup spots and Coach Milanovich can have his pick of whomever Barks finds.

[backer@oldclarke]

I feel Alex Brink could be a fit thru FA, but then he may end up in Regina too.

[DanTheFan]

I want to see some youth backing up Ray, but my knowledge of who's out there is lacking.

[KCargosfan]

I'd be down with Brink or Jackson. I'm assuming we could sign Jackson for a little over $100K based on the fact he made (I think) $140-ish in BC last year.

[Oarsman]

Is Dalton Bell still a consideration for a backup? He is closer to what RR is in style than is currently out there. I know Dalton Bell is a FA, and not even sure if they will even re-sign him.

[1argoholic]

Perhaps a coach in the know like Milanovich could see how our O was run last year and feel that Bell isn't as bad as he looked. Or perhaps Bell just doesn't have it but i'd like to see some movement towards having our qb situation from top to botton fixed. Obviously Ray is number one but right now we need a very strong backup.

[Invader]

I'm a big backer of J. Jackson, but he might have been a better fit last year...helping Lemon and Bell become better QB's. But that is ancient history now.

Ricky Ray has proven to be a very durable QB, but what happens if he does go down? I can't believe the Argos would go into next season with D. Bell as the primary backup? You could kiss GC100 goodbye in that scenario.

So perhaps there is a place with the Argos for a veteran QB as insurance. J. Jackson just might fit the bill as a "Jason Maas-type" player, assuming he would sign for $100k or less.

Ray will likely play another 3 or 4 years, at least. So I'm not sure the Argos would want Bell at No. 3, that should be a green-grass prospect who is a several years away from playing. The No. 2 should have some experience, who could go in and execute the offence if called upon...and won't complain about riding the pine for 18 games. Who are the suitable candidates? J. Jackson; Q. Porter (not sure about the not complaining part or if Ham. would release him); R. Dinwittie (kidding); Ben Sankey; J. Maas becomes a player/coach? The ranks are looking a little thin...

[OV Argo]

Argos could draft Mac QB Quinlan, or UBC QB Greene (Hec winner last year) - IF they want some youth at QB; BUT - Barker may be leery of that route after Brannagan didn't pan out; not sure Millanovich has ever heard of either of those 2 guys - Quinlan will be at the CFL Combine coming up.

The Argos may want some vet QB insurance behind Ray - so i guess Jackson could be a possibilty; never overly impressed by him, but i guess he at least has CFL experience, plus a strong arm. Bell coming back? (gawd i hope not after that horrid showing last year); and after that Hall - proven zip basically - as the only other QBs now ??? Not interested at all in Brink - big-time over-rated by some CFL fans IMO; i guess he did flash a bit of form for the Bombers last year, but has also looked brutal in some of his CFL playing time; Jyles flashed some decent QB form in all of his CFL time too - to go along with lots of mediocre to pi$$-poor QB play.

I'd rather see Maas as the emergency / could dress experienced guy option; rather than mediocre stiffs like Jackson or Brink - who would command at least decent CFL $M$ bucks; and then go with 2 (or 3 including the PR) young guys with some upside to develop/learn from Ray & Maas and Millanovich. CFL teams have been desperate enough to float in / recycle all sorts of older QBs before - see Bishop or Ricky Foggie, etc. etc. given stints in the past - i doubt Maas would be any worse - unless him arm is totally shot or he's woefully out of shape.

[Area 51]

If Brink ends up leaving Winnipeg, it would make much more sense for him to go to Edmonton instead of Toronto. Would you rather compete against Ricky Ray or Steve Jyles for the #1 job?

At this point in his career Jackson would be a nice fit at the #2 in Toronto. Great in the dressing room, you wouldn't have a Damon Allen/Mike Bishop situation where the QBs are at each other's throats. There's no possible way Toronto - - or any other CFL team - - could draft a CIS guy and realistically expect him to be the back up. So unless they want a Canadian QB on the practice roster of as the #3 instead of BJ Hall, let's forget about that happening.

[argotom]

Definitely bring in JJ and based on last year he would make a good backup.

[AngeloV]

No interest at all in JJ for me. I would much rather go after Brink. As for the CIS QB's I would be interested in Quinlan as a development guy, but no interest in Greene out of UBC.

[ArgoRavi]

There is a part of me that still thinks that Bell could be a good QB with the right coaching. He did move the ball well at times last year but the INTs are what killed him. He also had that absolutely dreadful game against B.C. which is the game more than any other that sticks in everyone's minds. I could really go either way on the decision to bring him back but I am almost of the mind that we should as we have already invested two years in him. Just let him battle it out with a couple of other QBs for the backup spot behind Ray.

[Midnight Blue]

Whoever ends up as the #2 QB, should be a proven starter, ideally. Granted, that's always a luxury to have in this League, or in any League, but hey, if we're goin' to go after the 100th Grey Cup, we should try to have that kind of insurance. And the #3 QB should be more than just a project (again, in a "go-for-it" year, as opposed to a re-building year), since the #3 is one play/injury away from being #2. I say go with the most experienced QBs we can get this year. After we win the Grey Cup this year, we can go with younger guys again (if we need to). Also, not meaning to go off topic, but whatever happened to the talked about proposal of having a space on the roster specifically to develop young Canadian QBs? As a #4 or #5 developing QB? Pay them enough to cover their rent, Kraft Dinner, spaghetti, meatloaf and lasagna through the week, with pizza and beer on weekends. Shouldn't break the bank. Outside the salary cap. It would be great to have Canadian QBs developing/learning on the sidelines, on every team.

[argolio]

I imagine there won't be a lot of cap space available for our backup QBs, so I say go young unless an experienced vet will come here for little money.

[1argoholic]

I think we better hope Barker finds some young Lulay or Tate kind of guy that picks the game up fast with no BS attitude. You can't go into the season with some second stringer that's a huge work in progress type of guy. If Ray gets killed then the season is done.

[Invader]

There is a part of me that still thinks that Bell could be a good QB with the right coaching. He did move the ball well at times last year but the INTs are what killed him. He also had that absolutely dreadful game against B.C. which is the game more than any other that sticks in everyone's minds. I could really go either way on the decision to bring him back but I am almost of the mind that we should as we have already invested two years in him. Just let him battle it out with a couple of other QBs for the backup spot behind Ray.

I agree that Bell should be given the opportunity to compete for a job in training camp. That disastrous B.C. game with 4 Int's and him admitting he wasn't prepared to play was a real low point. (Though in all fairness the B.C. defence made every QB look bad in the last half of 2011). It would have been easy to write him off then...but if he can rebound and show he has the potential to be a starter, then the Argos could have a valuable player.

Much like Brink in Wpg, who had such a terrible performance in his first game as a rookie in 2010. He bounced back his next game and really took charge. I would consider Brink one of the top QB prospects in the league. Bell can do the same, but he'll be given a short leash.

Brink...89 of 140 (64%); 1023 yds; 5 Td (3.6%) 4 Int (2.9%) 85.5 QR
Bell.....52 of 101 (52%); 612 yds; 3 Td (3.0%) 10 Int (9.9%) 38.9 QR


<tbody>


</tbody>

[Area 51]

That disastrous B.C. game with 4 Int's and him admitting he wasn't prepared to play was a real low point.



Just when I was starting to leave last year's disaster in the rear view mirror, this brings me right back to the lack of accountability.

Bell gave the "I wasn't prepared" explanation on more than one occassion last year. Seriously? How many organizations, in any sport, would keep a guy around after acknowledging to everyone that he wasn't ready to play on game day? And it wasn't like Bell just struggled a bit and was off on a couple of throws - - he completely sh!t the bed. Then explains it away by saying he "wasn't prepared". Didn't bother studying film? Figured the playbook wasn't all that important?

Hopefully the Argos are as "unprepared" to resign Bell as he was to play football.

Speaking of useless Argo QBs named "Bell" - - anybody else remember this all time classic? Somehow Kerwin manages to bag himself AND get flagged for objectionable conduct at the same time.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hohrGa1DKJI

[ArgoRavi]

Just when I was starting to leave last year's disaster in the rear view mirror, this brings me right back to the lack of accountability.

Bell gave the "I wasn't prepared" explanation on more than one occassion last year. Seriously? How many organizations, in any sport, would keep a guy around after acknowledging to everyone that he wasn't ready to play on game day? And it wasn't like Bell just struggled a bit and was off on a couple of throws - - he completely sh!t the bed. Then explains it away by saying he "wasn't prepared". Didn't bother studying film? Figured the playbook wasn't all that important?

Hopefully the Argos are as "unprepared" to resign Bell as he was to play football.

Frank Zicarelli said in today's Sun that Bell will not be re-signed: http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Football/CFL/News/2012/02/02/19331311.html

[1argoholic]

Nice Area 51 as if it wasn't bad enough talking about Dalton you had to bring up Kermet as well. haha.

NO MORE QB'S NAMED BELL IN TORONTO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Was there ever a bigger DORK playing qb than Kermet Bell? Who'll ever forget that spike? He was where it hit him, a knob.

[Oarsman]

Dare I bring these names up as a backup...

Michael Bishop
Casey Printers
Jared Zabransky
... Chris Leak????

:p

[Area 51]

Dare I bring these names up as a backup...

Michael Bishop
Casey Printers
Jared Zabransky
... Chris Leak????

:p



With names like that you might as well add Cleo Lemon and Dolton Bell to the list. Hell, why not include Kerwin Bell as a "candidate" for the #2 QB...

[argolio]

All things considered, Kerwin Bell did a decent job for us as QB in '98, and as QB and offensive co-ordinator in the second half of 2000 when he was re-acquired after John Huard was fired. I wouldn't be surprised to see Bell get a CFL head coaching job in the near future.

[jerrym]

I see either Brink or Jackson as an improvement on virtually immobile Bell. However, I'd prefer Brink because Jackson would be a one or at most two stop-gap because of his age.

[Will]

All things considered, Kerwin Bell did a decent job for us as QB in '98, and as QB and offensive co-ordinator in the second half of 2000 when he was re-acquired after John Huard was fired. I wouldn't be surprised to see Bell get a CFL head coaching job in the near future.

Kerwin Bell almost threw for 5,000 yards in 1998 for the Argos. I'd say that's not bad at all.

I'm not really interested in anybody on Oarsman list particularly Bishop or Printers. Zabransky is no better than Bell IMO.

Has Leak played much during his CFL stint?

[OV Argo]

Kerwin Bell almost threw for 5,000 yards in 1998 for the Argos. I'd say that's not bad at all.

I'm not really interested in anybody on Oarsman list particularly Bishop or Printers. Zabransky is no better than Bell IMO.

Has Leak played much during his CFL stint?

Leak was just plain brutal, IMO, when he got some signifigant playing time for the Als. How some of these stiffs get recycled in the CFL and with some fans wanting their team to show interest in mediocre, no clue QBs just because they made another CFL roster before, is beyond me. I guess it's just near impossible to recruit/find some new or young QB talent that could learn & develop behind Ray and with Millanovich and Maas around as teachers too?

[ArgoRavi]

Milanovich would be quite familiar with Leak as they worked together in Montreal for three seasons. If he thinks that Leak has any potential, I am sure that he would give him a chance but I wouldn't hold my breath on that one as Leak has shown nothing in his limited opportunities.

I agree with argofan87 that there is nobody on the list a few posts up that piques my interest. I have been a Printers fan but he is radioactive while Bishop should be retired and Zabransky and Leak do not inspire any confidence whatsoever based on what little they have shown in the CFL when they have had their chances (Zabransky is another one who reportedly is a dressing room problem).

[argotom]

Leak, Zabransky or Jackson should be all in the mix for a backup.
I agree how Dalton should not be back as he has done zip here and like some have said, the man has more excuses for not performing since Brian Burke of the Laffers.

[ArgoRavi]

Leak, Zabransky or Jackson should be all in the mix for a backup.
I agree how Dalton should not be back as he has done zip here and like some have said, the man has more excuses for not performing since Brian Burke of the Laffers.

I don't get why you are so high on Leak and Zabransky, AT. Zabransky's stats in 2010 were as bad as Bell's were in 2011 and he was reportedly an unpopular guy in the dressing room. As for Leak, again what has he shown to lead you to think that he can be an effective CFL QB? He didn't show much of anything in Saskatchewan's camp last year. Yes, both had great college stats but that means nothing at this level. If it did, we might as well bring Timmy Chang in too.

[argolio]

How some of these stiffs get recycled in the CFL and with some fans wanting their team to show interest in mediocre, no clue QBs just because they made another CFL roster before, is beyond me.Seriously? Players (QBs or otherwise) getting recycled has been a part of pro ball on both sides of the border forever. A few of them even develop into something better with another team.


Leak, Zabransky or Jackson should be all in the mix for a backup.
Are you saying we should sign them all?

[argotom]

No bring therm all in to compete for the 2nd and 3rd string position.


I don't get why you are so high on Leak and Zabransky, AT. Zabransky's stats in 2010 were as bad as Bell's were in 2011 and he was reportedly an unpopular guy in the dressing room. As for Leak, again what has he shown to lead you to think that he can be an effective CFL QB? He didn't show much of anything in Saskatchewan's camp last year. Yes, both had great college stats but that means nothing at this level. If it did, we might as well bring Timmy Chang in too.


In what little playing time I saw of the two, Leak has an accurate arm while Z reminded me a bit of a Matt Dunigan, great legs and the willingness to mix it up.
Either of these two or both could be great development material for the future while an understudy of Ricky.
And as we all know this is the one major failure for this team.

[OV Argo]

Seriously? Players (QBs or otherwise) getting recycled has been a part of pro ball on both sides of the border forever. A few of them even develop into something better with another team.


Are you saying we should sign them all?


Sure - all sorts of players end up being good after being recyled after not showing much for another team; but also - pro teams can recruit all sorts of good new talent on their own - look far & wide at all possibilities; as far as current CFL back-ups who might become available to the Argos - the only guy i'd be interested in is Porter from the Ticats - big guy, good arm, can run and has at least put up a few very impressive CFL QB performances in some of his (fairly limited) playing time. Sorry - not at all interested in Brink, Leak or older recycle projects like Jarious Jackson or Casey Printers - and a lot of these QBs who have been on CFL rosters before would probably want decent CFL $M$ bucks - not worth it IMO.

Rather see the Argos find some new QBs on their own; if Hall is coming back but Bell is not = room for at least 3 more if not 4 or 5 more new QBs to look at in smart TC evaluation. There are plenty of ex-NFL QBs - guys who get cut down there every year; the Argo brought in Lemon, Hamden and Dorsey a couple of years back - none panned out but that doesn't mean you don't try there again - maybe you find an Austin or McManus; and try to maybe sign a young NCAA good quality QB - a guy who is going to be over-looked by the cookie cutter NFL super-experts, but maybe quite suited for the CFL game; the Ottawa Rough Riders once brought in Tom Clements and Condredge Holloway as rookies in the same season - not an easy thing or common occurence - but you can at least try; and finally - maybe a long-shot, but IMO it's plain stupid or ignorant to discount - look at a top CIS QB - guys who grew up playing the Canadian game and i'd guess would be super keen/honored to get a shot to play in the pro league in their own country; this year there are, IMO, a couple of very good CIS QBs - Quinlan and Greene (Hec winner) - both big QBs with great passing stats and both are mobile / can run; Quinlan's superb play in the CIS play-offs and Vanier should have surely drawn some notice if any CFL decision makers were actually watching those games - don't see why one or both of those QBs could not be brought in for a look by the Argos = a team with serious need behind Ray.

Again - look far & wide for some new QB talent - and don't be hung up on having to bring in some guy just because he was on a CFL roster before but has shown next to nothing or looked bad when they did get some CFL playing time. And again too - maybe Maas could be an emergency / could dress guy if Ray went down and the team has little faith in any of the young back-ups and was desperate for "experience"- i doubt he would do worse than a Printers, Bishop, Jackson type.

[R.J]

I still say try to go after Chase Clement (yes I am aware he retired from football in order to leave the TiCats), the way I see it with the UFL all but over, maybe he will finally realise that the CFL is a good option for him. I'm actually not opposed to bringing in Jarious as a back-up and mentor/coach, for the right price I realll don't see a negative in having him in the Argos fold. The Argos need to bring in some fresh meat in at QB though, and hopefully Barker puts a real focus on bringing in solid receivers for TC.

[AngeloV]

Kerwin Bell almost threw for 5,000 yards in 1998 for the Argos. I'd say that's not bad at all.



Truth be told, it would have likely been over 6,000 if he didn't miss the first 4 games because of injury. Argos started 1-3 in the games that he missed and finished 9-5 the rest of the way. He was really in a no win situation that year coming in and replacing Flutie. He was a great passer, no doubt.

[ArgoRavi]

Truth be told, it would have likely been over 6,000 if he didn't miss the first 4 games because of injury. Argos started 1-3 in the games that he missed and finished 9-5 the rest of the way. He was really in a no win situation that year coming in and replacing Flutie. He was a great passer, no doubt.

On top of that, we had no running game that season. Everyone knew that we would be throwing the ball every down and Bell still put up those monster numbers. He really was not a bad QB at all.

[KCargosfan]

Whatever we do let's not bring in Brody Croyle or Tyler Thigpen. Those guys suck.

[argolio]

No bring therm all in to compete for the 2nd and 3rd string position.Even if, for the sake of argument, the Argos were interested in all three, there is zero chance all three would come here.

[argotom]

Even if, for the sake of argument, the Argos were interested in all three, there is zero chance all three would come here.


How do you know?

[R.J]

How do you know?Zabransky is done in this league IMO, the fact that no other team even tried to bring him in as TC fodder says a lot (also a horrible QB in my opinion). Leak's only chance of being brought in would be his familarity with Milanovich and his systems. Jackson could be brought in as another mentor/insurance in the unlikely hood of Ray being injured, and again I wouldn't be opposed to bringing in Jackson as a backup/mentor/coach, but all three will not be here either for TC or at any point during the season.

[gilthethrill]

Truth be told, it would have likely been over 6,000 if he didn't miss the first 4 games because of injury. Argos started 1-3 in the games that he missed and finished 9-5 the rest of the way. He was really in a no win situation that year coming in and replacing Flutie. He was a great passer, no doubt.

Was that not the same year Mookie had 160 receptions? Bell used him over & over again with Mookie piling up YAC yards. A very good combo that never gets mentioned as one of the best in Argo history.

[ArgoRavi]

Was that not the same year Mookie had 160 receptions? Bell used him over & over again with Mookie piling up YAC yards. A very good combo that never gets mentioned as one of the best in Argo history.

Yes, that was the same year. IIRC, Canadian Nigel Williams also had a 1000 yard season but, after trying the NFL the following year, he was never came close to that level of performance again.

[AngeloV]

On top of that, we had no running game that season. Everyone knew that we would be throwing the ball every down and Bell still put up those monster numbers. He really was not a bad QB at all.

Former Atlanta Falcon Tony Smith was signed to replace Robert Drummond IIRC. When he wasn't injured that year, he was horrible. I think Ryan Terry did ok when he was there, though.

[R.J]

Ryan Dinwiddie maybe ? :D

[ArgoRavi]

Former Atlanta Falcon Tony Smith was signed to replace Robert Drummond IIRC. When he wasn't injured that year, he was horrible. I think Ryan Terry did ok when he was there, though.

Was Terry there in '98? If he was, he must have been injured for a good bit of that season as Smith was because I remember Duane Dmytryshyn of all people being the feature back for at least a game or two later that season.