Yearly Schedule Thread - 2015 Version of Toronto Argonauts getting screwed

[Mulder]

Preseason

June - Friday 12th -> Sunday 14th

Or we will be playing at at Varsity Stadium

July.

With the Opening @ closing ceremonies at Rogers Centre, Argos could be screwed for any July home dates.
Opening ceremony is the 10th, Closing is the 26th, So depending on setup for these ceremonies, it could be tight.

Saturday July 4th -> Sunday 5th.
This could be home opener weekend depending on Rogers Center setup up for opening

Tuesday 14th or Wednesday July 15th.
Same day as the all star game. There is a possibility of a game on Wednesday. The Jays play a 3 games series at home Friday->Sunday

August

Assuming a 48 hour Rogers Centre setup time.

Saturday August 8th is a possibility (Only)

Next available opening is the week of August 18th to the 23rd. I wouldn't be surprised if the Argos play twice at home this week. Once on Tuesday, then again on Sunday.

September.
Prepare yourself Argo Fans! If the Blue Jays host "Tournament 12" again. We could be without any home games in September.
Only available week is September 10th to the 13th.


At most between the months of July -> September we will have 6 home games. That's making some very risky assumptions between how long Pan-Am games needs to setup in the Skydome & if Rogers wants to make available a 4 day window between times they play at home early August and if a annual tournament doesn't happen at the Skydome. It's very possible that the Argos will play 3 home games in the first 3 months of the 2015 CFL Season.

[Neely2005]

Wow that's crazy. Especially when you consider this year's schedule:

http://www.argofans.com/showthread.php?2864-We-have-the-worst-schedule-in-CFL-history-(with-proof)

[argonaut11xx]

Does Braley still have access to "Empire Field"?...maybe set it up at the farm where they do the annual argo corn roast...

[BATKINSON001]

I wouldn't be surprised if Rogers told the argos to F-off for the season... between the jays and panam games... they are being screwed.

[Neely2005]

I wouldn't be surprised if Rogers told the argos to F-off for the season... between the jays and panam games... they are being screwed.

I'm assuming that you're being sarcastic but if not that wouldn't be possible because the Argonauts have a lease for the Rogers Centre until the End of 2017.

[paulwoods13]

Wow that's crazy. Especially when you consider this year's schedule:

Actually it is completely in keeping with this year's schedule. Not crazy at all -- just our lot in life until we get a new home with a more favourable lease arrangement.

[BATKINSON001]

Actually it is completely in keeping with this year's schedule. Not crazy at all -- just our lot in life until we get a new home with a more favourable lease arrangement. which probably wont happen until TFC folds and we get BMO to ourselves.

[Argo57]

which probably wont happen until TFC folds and we get BMO to ourselves.

Depends on ownership, either way can't be any worse than what we have now.

[AngeloV]

Depends on ownership, either way can't be any worse than what we have now.

Exactly. TFC has 20 or so home dates per year, compared to 81 for the Blue Jays. There is no way in hell a move there wouldn't create a more favourable schedule.

[1argoholic]

Karma Rogers...Karma you bags of CRAP!!!!!!

[Mulder]

Actually it is completely in keeping with this year's schedule. Not crazy at all -- just our lot in life until we get a new home with a more favourable lease arrangement.

Looking at last seasons predictions, I nailed the first 2 weeks (CFL Weeks 2-3) and predicted week 8 at home as well, I didn't except it to be 2 games at home for the week however.

Last season I originally gave the Argos 7 potential home dates between July and September, before revising it with later bookings to 4 maybe 5.

Because of unknowns such as setup time for Pan-Am games, if Rogers would make available Saturday August 8th and Tournament 12 in September (This is likely happening, lets face it). It's currently a maximum of 6, with the very real possibility that during the first 3 months of the CFL season the Argonauts will be playing 3 games at home.

http://www.argofans.com/showthread.php?2245-2014-Vacation-Planning-Thread-(Rogers-Centre-Schedule)

[ArgofanIan]

Not much we can do about Pan Am games.. Ticats are in same boat... maybe they could start the season a week early....if Rogers could give us 6 good dates... I could tolerate being at Sky dome...now that the Bills posters are down for good. I live on the subway line so easy for me to stagger home.... on a positive note... our remaining home games this year are all critical and could all be playoff previews...even our Ottawa game could be a must win.... Lets go ARRGOS !!!!

[Nob]

So is it safe to bet that he Argos will be the home team in TD Atlantic 2015?

Wouldn't surprise me to see the league bring that game back.

[Mulder]

Not much we can do about Pan Am games.. Ticats are in same boat... maybe they could start the season a week early....if Rogers could give us 6 good dates... I could tolerate being at Sky dome...now that the Bills posters are down for good. I live on the subway line so easy for me to stagger home.... on a positive note... our remaining home games this year are all critical and could all be playoff previews...even our Ottawa game could be a must win.... Lets go ARRGOS !!!!

Yeah, I'm not sure if there is any rules that prevent Ticats from hosting a game before the Pan Am's

They could potentially host a home games July 3rd weekend, and then go on a 2 games road trip with a bye poked in there. Not that bad.

The Woman's World cup brings in another dynamic. Edmonton is already hosting their pre-season game June 13, 2015 in Fort McMurray. Preseason will be 3 weeks again starting the first week of June.
Vancouver, Winnipeg, Edmonton and Ottawa are all hosting the event (stadium wise).
Edmonton has already already made plans, Winnipeg doesn't host any games after June 16th. So look for Winnipeg to host their pre-season game week 'C' of the preseason.

That leaves Ottawa and Vancouver.

Ottawa won't beable to host a home game until week 2 of the regular season.
Vancouver won't beable to host a home game until week 3 of the regular season.

This assumes FIFA doesn't want other teams to use the field, they could convert the field in Ottawa and Vancouver during mid week breaks.


So is it safe to bet that he Argos will be the home team in TD Atlantic 2015?

Wouldn't surprise me to see the league bring that game back.

Possible with Moncton stadium hosting Fifa too. Leave the temporary seats in place for another month or two

[argonaut11xx]

So is it safe to bet that he Argos will be the home team in TD Atlantic 2015?

Wouldn't surprise me to see the league bring that game back.

I think this a smart idea, maybe 2 regular season off-site games, the Ticats hosting TD Atlantic, and the Argo's hosting a game in Quebec City.

[Mulder]

U2 is set to announce a world tour in 2015. Once it's announce I'll check the date and venue. They've always liked playing at Rogers Centre.

[AngeloV]

U2 is set to announce a world tour in 2015. Once it's announce I'll check the date and venue. They've always liked playing at Rogers Centre.

That's because they are a bunch of self centred SOB's that just want to make as much money as possible...even if it means playing in a venue where the sound is crap.

[ArgoRavi]

Zicarelli has mentioned in his latest article that the Argo home opener next year may not happen until August:

"Argos fans, at least those who still care, should be prepared to see a stretch next season that features six weeks of no home games with talk of the team’s home opener not being played until August.
Six weeks of non-home games and people wonder why the Argos need to get out of the cavernous venue and into a more intimate setting that caters to the Argos’ needs."

http://www.torontosun.com/2014/11/07/argonauts-keep-playoff-hopes-alive-with-win-over-redblacks

[Ron]

Argos are not being screwed by Rogers. Thanks to Rogers the Argos have a place to play. Something nobody else has provided.

[1argoholic]

That's one way to look at Rogers Ron. It's really NO thanks to Rogers it just morphed into the situation we're in. Rogers cares about Rogers and the Argos are just a pain in the ass to them. Hopefully one day Rogers can have their empty cave of yellowing sod as the Jays continue to crap out and we have a new suitable home. Rogers are a bunch of money grubbing scum suckers.

[Neely2005]

Rogers is no different than Bell. Bell just happens to have the rights to the CFL.

[argotom]

Zicarelli has mentioned in his latest article that the Argo home opener next year may not happen until August:

"Argos fans, at least those who still care, should be prepared to see a stretch next season that features six weeks of no home games with talk of the team’s home opener not being played until August.
Six weeks of non-home games and people wonder why the Argos need to get out of the cavernous venue and into a more intimate setting that caters to the Argos’ needs."

http://www.torontosun.com/2014/11/07/argonauts-keep-playoff-hopes-alive-with-win-over-redblacks



This year was horrid, but next year would be totally unacceptable.
Don't know what the answer is as long we are at the crap dome.
Maybe going TD Atlantic where at least the people appreciate watching the CFL for a few weeks?

[ArgoRavi]

Rogers is no different than Bell. Bell just happens to have the rights to the CFL.

Bell doesn't ignore the Blue Jays though as Rogers pretty much does with the CFL. The Jays will still be the lead story on Bell whereas the CFL is almost never the lead story on Rogers.

[argotom]

Bell doesn't ignore the Blue Jays though as Rogers pretty much does with the CFL. The Jays will still be the lead story on Bell whereas the CFL is almost never the lead story on Rogers.


Absolutely this is the life in Southern Ontario where the producers dictate the agenda.

[T-Bone]

Eskimos president Len Rhodes spearheads effort to start CFL season earlier to avoid frigid playoffs (http://www.edmontonsun.com/2014/11/18/eskimos-president-len-rhodes-spearheads-effort-to-start-cfl-season-earlier-to-avoid-frigid-playoffs)

[AngeloV]

2 weeks sounds ok to me. Just don't try and make it a spring and summer league.

[paulwoods13]

Eskimos president Len Rhodes spearheads effort to start CFL season earlier to avoid frigid playoffs (http://www.edmontonsun.com/2014/11/18/eskimos-president-len-rhodes-spearheads-effort-to-start-cfl-season-earlier-to-avoid-frigid-playoffs)

Yeah, that's a great idea -- make the Argos' season overlap even more than it does with the Blue Jays'. Might be doable starting in 2018, but any move to an earlier season start in the meantime will just make it even harder to get Argo home dates.

[Double Dare]

2 weeks sounds ok to me. Just don't try and make it a spring and summer league. Exactly. It isn't Canadian football if some nice, cold weather doesn't enter into the outcome and play of the game.

[Stouffvillain]

I like the idea of moving it up a few weeks. No one wants to sit outside in -20 degree weather for 3+ hours. I find people that often say they like the effect the elements have on the game are often those that watch from the comfort of their soft, comfy couch.

I'm ok with the possiblity of players/coaches having to deal with the possiblity of cold and snow I just don't like that it's pretty much gaurenteed with the last week of November in Canada.

[1argoholic]

Windy, cold and very winter like today but I could easily dress for this at say a BMO and actually sweat. Ice fishing gear. I hate the 2 to 4 degree and pissing rain days.

Does anyone really think that stepping backwards into a BMO situation would have fans filling the stands. That will wear pretty thin with the World Class City types. There is no winning in a SHITE sports city like Toronto.

[ArgoRavi]

Yeah, that's a great idea -- make the Argos' season overlap even more than it does with the Blue Jays'. Might be doable starting in 2018, but any move to an earlier season start in the meantime will just make it even harder to get Argo home dates.

Let's not forget that the Stanley Cup Finals now clash with the first few CFL preseason games. If you move the regular season up two weeks, you will be going head-to-head with the Stanley Cup Finals and we all know who will get the lion's share of the media coverage in that case.

[doubleblue]

Let's not forget that the Stanley Cup Finals now clash with the first few CFL preseason games. If you move the regular season up two weeks, you will be going head-to-head with the Stanley Cup Finals and we all know who will get the lion's share of the media coverage in that case.

I think that would depend on who was in the Stanley Cup finals. No Canadian teams and the interest isn't as great. Now if the Leafs were to get into the Finals that could be a problem. Fortunately that doesn't look like it will be a problem in the forseeable future. But I don't see a problem starting the middle of June.

[paulwoods13]

But I don't see a problem starting the middle of June.

Unless you count stadium availability for the Argos as a problem. As a reminder, five of our nine home games this season were scheduled after baseball season ended. If we lose two of those weeks, what dates are we left with?

[Stouffvillain]

Windy, cold and very winter like today but I could easily dress for this at say a BMO and actually sweat. Ice fishing gear. I hate the 2 to 4 degree and pissing rain days.

Does anyone really think that stepping backwards into a BMO situation would have fans filling the stands. That will wear pretty thin with the World Class City types. There is no winning in a SHITE sports city like Toronto.


I agree with you that slightly above freezing and rain would be worse than just cold temperatures. It's the casuals that the owners are trying to capture by moving up the schedule. People that follow the team but aren't willing to endure hours in the freezing cold to watch. If cities like Edmonton, who don't have the competing sports like we do in Toronto, are feeling it than it is safe to say this is a nationwide issue.

At the same time this is Canada and you are never going to get a outdoor game in November with tropic conditions, people are going to have to live with that.

On your BMO Field point, moving there alone would do only one thing, make the stands look more full. Smaller stadium, less empty seats, that is all.

[paulwoods13]

Has something changed recently to make this a pressing issue? Are Cdns wimpier than we used to be? The Grey Cup has been played in late November (even December at times) for at least 50 years. Climate change data suggests that the weather is warmer now than it used to be, on average. So why the sudden "it's too cold for football" bleating from out west?

[shayman]

Has something changed recently to make this a pressing issue? Are Cdns wimpier than we used to be? The Grey Cup has been played in late November (even December at times) for at least 50 years. Climate change data suggests that the weather is warmer now than it used to be, on average. So why the sudden "it's too cold for football" bleating from out west?

Well - people have other options now that they didn't have 50 years ago. Another 5 NHL teams, the arrival of the NBA and MLB in Canada, the Internet, the rise of the NFL hype machine to stratospheric levels, and inexpensive, big, quality TV sets with great game broadcasts you can view in the comfort of your own home without lining up to get in, lining up to use the restroom, or lining up to get a drink.

I don't think we're wimpier. We just have more attractive choices now, and a gate-driven league needs to do everything it can to get people to come to the stadium.

[primetime1]

Well - people have other options now that they didn't have 50 years ago. Another 5 NHL teams, the arrival of the NBA and MLB in Canada, the Internet, the rise of the NFL hype machine to stratospheric levels, and inexpensive, big, quality TV sets with great game broadcasts you can view in the comfort of your own home without lining up to get in, lining up to use the restroom, or lining up to get a drink.

I don't think we're wimpier. We just have more attractive choices now, and a gate-driven league needs to do everything it can to get people to come to the stadium. Well said.

[1argoholic]

Been there done that CNE, mistake by the lake BS and now we seem to be heading back down that road. Outdoor stadium on the shores of Lake Ontario. We're not exactly having nice fall weather the last while and sitting at BMO right now would suck anyway you cut it. I for one like the location and don't mind the dome other than it's owners.
Not afraid of the cold as I never would have moved here. Been to old Cleveland Stadium in Dec to watch my Vikes lose way back when. That was one cold day along the Lake Erie shores.

Been to the coldest outdoor Grey Cup in 91 in Winnipeg and the warmest in 98 in Winnipeg. I enjoyed 98 much more.

[AngeloV]

I think that we need to forget talking about the dome. Fact is, we are out in max 3 years. We should all embrace any other option at this point, and if a smaller stadium such as BMO means a demand for tickets, then let's all agree to be happy with that. The bottom line is that we all want to see the Argos survive for a long time, and it won't be in the dome.

[ArgoRavi]

I think that we need to forget talking about the dome. Fact is, we are out in max 3 years. We should all embrace any other option at this point, and if a smaller stadium such as BMO means a demand for tickets, then let's all agree to be happy with that. The bottom line is that we all want to see the Argos survive for a long time, and it won't be in the dome.

Agreed. The reality is that the Argos are dying a slow death in SkyDome and nothing is going to change that. The only viable option for survival is a move to BMO Field.

[paulwoods13]

. . . a gate-driven league needs to do everything it can to get people to come to the stadium.

I agree with that, but I do not think it logically follows that we must start the season in mid-June and end it in mid-November. And again, if this is done before 2018 I believe the Argos will be even more screwed than they already are on stadium availability. Moving the season up to get slightly bigger semifinal crowds out west could translate to another blow to the already battered Argonauts franchise. The league better think this idea through very, very carefully.

[Neely2005]

I like the idea of moving it up a few weeks. No one wants to sit outside in -20 degree weather for 3+ hours. I find people that often say they like the effect the elements have on the game are often those that watch from the comfort of their soft, comfy couch.

I'm ok with the possiblity of players/coaches having to deal with the possiblity of cold and snow I just don't like that it's pretty much gaurenteed with the last week of November in Canada.

Agreed! Almost every football fan that I know who says they like frigid, snowy games says that from the comfort of their couch, no way they would ever attend one of those games in person. And like I said previously my wife has already told me that she'll no longer be going to Argonauts games in October & November if/when we move to BMO Field so I'm all for this idea.


Windy, cold and very winter like today but I could easily dress for this at say a BMO and actually sweat. Ice fishing gear. I hate the 2 to 4 degree and pissing rain days.

Does anyone really think that stepping backwards into a BMO situation would have fans filling the stands. That will wear pretty thin with the World Class City types. There is no winning in a SHITE sports city like Toronto.

Sad but true.

[paulwoods13]

I'm somewhat to blame for this thread going sideways, so I'll do my bit to get it back on track by refraining from any further discussion about global climate. I'm far more interested in promoting the idea that, weather be damned, going to an earlier season start would almost certainly damage the Argos' already terrible schedule situation.

[T-Bone]

I'm somewhat to blame for this thread going sideways, so I'll do my bit to get it back on track by refraining from any further discussion about global climate.
That content has been moved here (http://www.argofans.com/showthread.php?3028-Global-Climate-Change) so this thread can get back on topic.

[Neely2005]

As suspected it's not looking good:

http://www.ottawasun.com/2015/01/22/upcoming-cfl-schedule-will-be-tough-on-argonauts-again

"Last year's schedule was revealed on Feb. 12, and CFL president and COO Michael Copeland is hoping fans will see it even earlier this year. There could be some hurdles that prevent that from happening, though.

“The schedule is an incredibly difficult one at the best of times,” Copeland said Thursday in Winnipeg, where the CFL's annual winter meetings are being conducted. “This year it's made more difficult with the 2015 Women's World Cup and the Pan Am Games in southern Ontario."

[Neely2005]

As suspected it's not looking good:

http://www.ottawasun.com/2015/01/22/upcoming-cfl-schedule-will-be-tough-on-argonauts-again

"Last year's schedule was revealed on Feb. 12, and CFL president and COO Michael Copeland is hoping fans will see it even earlier this year. There could be some hurdles that prevent that from happening, though.

“The schedule is an incredibly difficult one at the best of times,” Copeland said Thursday in Winnipeg, where the CFL's annual winter meetings are being conducted. “This year it's made more difficult with the 2015 Women's World Cup and the Pan Am Games in southern Ontario."

So much for getting the schedule much earlier this season.

[ArgoRavi]

So much for getting the schedule much earlier this season.

As long as the Argos continue to play at SkyDome, we won't see the schedule out any earlier than it has been. I read an old article from the mid 1970s recently and they would have the schedule out a year in advance back then. Of course, there were no Blue Jays back then.

[T-Bone]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>The 2015 <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFLSchedule?src=hash">#CFLSchedule</a> is ready! We need YOU to unlock it by making your pick for the <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/GreyCup?src=hash">#GreyCup</a>! <a href="http://t.co/f87kQkfqpb">http://t.co/f87kQkfqpb</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFL?src=hash">#CFL</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/IsItJuneYet?src=hash">#IsItJuneYet</a>?</p>&mdash; CFL Official Feed (@CFL) <a href="https://twitter.com/CFL/status/566250823228080128">February 13, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[AngeloV]

I was just going to post that Kirk Penton mentioned in his CFL blitz column that the schedule is going to be out today.

http://www.winnipegsun.com/2015/02/12/cfl-blitz-early-winners-losers-of-free-agency


PLAN YOUR SUMMER

The CFL schedule will be released on Friday, likely around noon EST, and it could very well be a wild and wacky affair.

Thanks to the Women's World Cup taking place in stadiums across the country in June and July, and the Pan Am Games in southern Ontario this summer, there are likely to be some oddities in this year's 81-game slate.

The Argos never have a friendly schedule thanks to the Blue Jays having control over Rogers Centre, and the Pan Am Games are going to make it even worse for the Boatmen.

[Neely2005]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>The 2015 <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFLSchedule?src=hash">#CFLSchedule</a> is ready! We need YOU to unlock it by making your pick for the <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/GreyCup?src=hash">#GreyCup</a>! <a href="http://t.co/f87kQkfqpb">http://t.co/f87kQkfqpb</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFL?src=hash">#CFL</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/IsItJuneYet?src=hash">#IsItJuneYet</a>?</p>&mdash; CFL Official Feed (@CFL) <a href="https://twitter.com/CFL/status/566250823228080128">February 13, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Clever idea, I wonder how long it will take to get to 10,000?

[Neely2005]

Clever idea, I wonder how long it will take to get to 10,000?

More than half way there now:

http://www.cfl.ca/2015releasert

[T-Bone]

Clever idea, I wonder how long it will take to get to 10,000?
Personally, I don't think forcing a trend on Twitter is a clever idea. Glad the schedule will be out soon though.

[Neely2005]

Personally, I don't think forcing a trend on Twitter is a clever idea. Glad the schedule will be out soon though.

Why not? Everyone does it and it gives the league a little buzz and free publicity.

80% of the way there now.

[T-Bone]

Why not? Everyone does it and it gives the league a little buzz and free publicity.
Everyone forces it? Most put it out there and it trends. It's the forced part of this I'm not a fan of. Like I said before, I'm glad the schedule will be out soon though.

[Neely2005]

Lol the Redblacks are leading for the East:

http://cfl.ca/2015releasert

[T-Bone]

And here it is:

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Goal Reached! Follow this link to see the 2015 <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFLSchedule?src=hash">#CFLSchedule</a>! <a href="http://t.co/3IloEFAhU8">http://t.co/3IloEFAhU8</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFL?src=hash">#CFL</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/IsItJuneYet?src=hash">#IsItJuneYet</a>? <a href="http://t.co/ICQRR1PxqK">pic.twitter.com/ICQRR1PxqK</a></p>&mdash; CFL Official Feed (@CFL) <a href="https://twitter.com/CFL/status/566288709038141440">February 13, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Argos Home Schedule (http://argonauts.ca/article/toronto-argonauts-announce-2015-game-schedule)

[Neely2005]

And here it is:

<iframe style="width: 1px; height: 0px; border: medium none; position: absolute; visibility: hidden;" allowfullscreen="" class="twitter-tweet twitter-tweet-rendered" allowtransparency="true" scrolling="no" id="twitter-widget-0" frameborder="0"></iframe>
Goal Reached! Follow this link to see the 2015 #CFLSchedule (https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFLSchedule?src=hash)! http://t.co/3IloEFAhU8 #CFL (https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFL?src=hash) #IsItJuneYet (https://twitter.com/hashtag/IsItJuneYet?src=hash)? pic.twitter.com/ICQRR1PxqK (http://t.co/ICQRR1PxqK)
— CFL Official Feed (@CFL) February 13, 2015 (https://twitter.com/CFL/status/566288709038141440)
<script async="" src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Argos Home Schedule (http://argonauts.ca/article/toronto-argonauts-announce-2015-game-schedule)


Here's the Tweet with the Argonauts Home Schedule:

https://twitter.com/TorontoArgos/status/566289602588467202

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>BREAKING: The <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Argos?src=hash">#Argos</a> 2015 <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFLSchedule?src=hash">#CFLSchedule</a> has been released! <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFL?src=hash">#CFL</a> <a href="http://t.co/K31kXVyead">pic.twitter.com/K31kXVyead</a></p>&mdash; Toronto Argonauts (@TorontoArgos) <a href="https://twitter.com/TorontoArgos/status/566289602588467202">February 13, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


<iframe style="display: none;" allowtransparency="true" scrolling="no" id="rufous-sandbox" frameborder="0"></iframe>

[AngeloV]

Really? A home game in Fort McMurray, Alta? Have we sunk that low? I would rather play it in Moncton or Hamilton. What an F'N joke. Get us the hell out of the dome.

Need to call my rep now. Will this decrease the price of my ST's by 10%

[Neely2005]

Here's the Tweet with the Argonauts Home Schedule:

https://twitter.com/TorontoArgos/status/566289602588467202

<iframe style="width: 1px; height: 0px; border: medium none; position: absolute; visibility: hidden;" allowfullscreen="" class="twitter-tweet twitter-tweet-rendered" allowtransparency="true" scrolling="no" id="twitter-widget-0" frameborder="0"></iframe>
BREAKING: The #Argos (https://twitter.com/hashtag/Argos?src=hash) 2015 #CFLSchedule (https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFLSchedule?src=hash) has been released! #CFL (https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFL?src=hash) pic.twitter.com/K31kXVyead (http://t.co/K31kXVyead)
— Toronto Argonauts (@TorontoArgos) February 13, 2015 (https://twitter.com/TorontoArgos/status/566289602588467202)
<script async="" src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


<iframe style="display: none;" allowtransparency="true" scrolling="no" id="rufous-sandbox" frameborder="0"></iframe>


No July home games and 4 October home games. Only 3 weekend home games.
<iframe style="display: none;" allowtransparency="true" scrolling="no" id="rufous-sandbox" frameborder="0"></iframe>

[ArgoRavi]

Really? A home game in Fort McMurray, Alta? Have we sunk that low? I would rather play it in Moncton or Hamilton. What an F'N joke. Get us the hell out of the dome.

Need to call my rep now. Will this decrease the price of my ST's by 10%

Yeah, that is what you call a "competitive disadvantage" as the Argos essentially have to play the Esks on their home turf twice. That is hard to take. No regular season home game until August 8th which has to be latest home opener that the Argos have had since the late 1960s or early 1970s.

[argofan81]

Really? A home game in Fort McMurray, Alta? Have we sunk that low? I would rather play it in Moncton or Hamilton. What an F'N joke. Get us the hell out of the dome.

Need to call my rep now. Will this decrease the price of my ST's by 10%

I fail to see how they can even call this a "home game" when it is not even played in the same province that the team is located in. Are they going to pay for our flights and accommodation to attend the game?

[Downtownfan]

Just brutal. What happens if the Jays make the playoffs? I know its not likely, but you never know. We need to get out of the Dome ASAP.

[Neely2005]

Really? A home game in Fort McMurray, Alta? Have we sunk that low? I would rather play it in Moncton or Hamilton. What an F'N joke. Get us the hell out of the dome.

Need to call my rep now. Will this decrease the price of my ST's by 10%

I already sent an Email asking about this. Not impressed!

[Downtownfan]

Here's the explanation:

With the release of the 2015 CFL schedule today the new season is soon upon us – just a little more than four months from now! Our 2015 home schedule has a number of highlights. We welcome the return of the Labour Day re-match on September 11 against Hamilton, we will see Ottawa play twice at Rogers Centre this year as we begin to re-establish the long-time football rivalry between the two cities, and 7 of 8 regular season home games will be played on either Friday night, Saturday or Sunday.
It is important to note that we are kicking off our regular season in Fort McMurray, Alberta at scenic SMS Equipment Stadium at Shell Place. While we are excited to participate in Northern Kickoff and help grow the CFL in other Canadian markets, we would like to provide you with an explanation as to why we have made the unusual decision to move a home game. There were limited available dates at Rogers Centre this summer due in part to the highly anticipated 2015 PAN/Parapan Am Games, as well as the Blue Jays schedule, concerts and other Rogers Centre events. In addition to those challenges, Canada welcomes the 2015 FIFA Women’s World Cup which has directly impacted available dates in most CFL markets in June and part of July. In lieu of these limitations, we began exploring our options and Fort McMurray and the Wood Buffalo Region in Alberta stepped forward and offered a location with a stadium that is both ready for CFL football and available. For this game, we have created a limited number of hotel and ticket packages for Argos fans from around Canada who wish to join us for the first regular season CFL game in northern Alberta. We encourage you to call your ticket representative for specific details, including pricing.
We are also pleased to announce that all season ticket holders, who are paid in full as of June 1, 2015, will be entered into a draw to win one of five trips for two to see your Argos play live in the Northern Kickoff! Each trip will include transportation to and from Fort McMurray, Alberta on the team charter, two tickets to the game, two nights hotel stay and $200 spending money.
Thank you for committing early as an Argonauts season ticket holder. Your package will now include:

<tbody>

<tbody>

<tbody style="WIDTH: 100%">

>
A ticket to the Argos’ home pre-season game at Varsity Stadium in Toronto




>
Tickets to eight regular season Argos home games at Rogers Centre




>
A ticket to a potential Argos home playoff game in 2015*




>
Two bonus tickets to the 2015 Home Opener on August 8 vs. Saskatchewan




>
Exciting benefits and quality service from your personal sales representative


</tbody>



</tbody>


</tbody>
*A credit will be applied to your account for future Argos ticket purchases in the event the Argonauts do not host a home playoff game in 2015.
Finally, Rogers Centre has informed us that they will remodel most of the seats in the 200 Level of the stadium this spring. The new seats will remain larger than the seats in the 100 Level, and those that had a cup holder last season will still have one included, but not all seats will be padded as they have been in the past. Seats in the Club VIP 200 Level Lounge in the South Endzone will remain padded.
The CFL schedule maker did a very good job of preparing this year’s schedule considering the number of major events being hosted in Canada this summer. As we considered available dates, we worked hard to ensure that the needs of our fans and our football team were put at the forefront.
Thank you for your continued support and we look forward to seeing you in the stands.

[Neely2005]

No July home games and 4 October home games. Only 3 weekend home games.
<iframe style="display: none;" allowtransparency="true" scrolling="no" id="rufous-sandbox" frameborder="0"></iframe>

Which means that our Home Opener isn't until August 8th!!!

WTF???


Here's the explanation:

With the release of the 2015 CFL schedule today the new season is soon upon us – just a little more than four months from now! Our 2015 home schedule has a number of highlights. We welcome the return of the Labour Day re-match on September 11 against Hamilton, we will see Ottawa play twice at Rogers Centre this year as we begin to re-establish the long-time football rivalry between the two cities, and 7 of 8 regular season home games will be played on either Friday night, Saturday or Sunday.
It is important to note that we are kicking off our regular season in Fort McMurray, Alberta at scenic SMS Equipment Stadium at Shell Place. While we are excited to participate in Northern Kickoff and help grow the CFL in other Canadian markets, we would like to provide you with an explanation as to why we have made the unusual decision to move a home game. There were limited available dates at Rogers Centre this summer due in part to the highly anticipated 2015 PAN/Parapan Am Games, as well as the Blue Jays schedule, concerts and other Rogers Centre events. In addition to those challenges, Canada welcomes the 2015 FIFA Women’s World Cup which has directly impacted available dates in most CFL markets in June and part of July. In lieu of these limitations, we began exploring our options and Fort McMurray and the Wood Buffalo Region in Alberta stepped forward and offered a location with a stadium that is both ready for CFL football and available. For this game, we have created a limited number of hotel and ticket packages for Argos fans from around Canada who wish to join us for the first regular season CFL game in northern Alberta. We encourage you to call your ticket representative for specific details, including pricing.
We are also pleased to announce that all season ticket holders, who are paid in full as of June 1, 2015, will be entered into a draw to win one of five trips for two to see your Argos play live in the Northern Kickoff! Each trip will include transportation to and from Fort McMurray, Alberta on the team charter, two tickets to the game, two nights hotel stay and $200 spending money.
Thank you for committing early as an Argonauts season ticket holder. Your package will now include:

<tbody>

<tbody>

<tbody>

>

A ticket to the Argos’ home pre-season game at Varsity Stadium in Toronto



>

Tickets to eight regular season Argos home games at Rogers Centre



>

A ticket to a potential Argos home playoff game in 2015*



>

Two bonus tickets to the 2015 Home Opener on August 8 vs. Saskatchewan




>

Exciting benefits and quality service from your personal sales representative

</tbody>



</tbody>


</tbody>

*A credit will be applied to your account for future Argos ticket purchases in the event the Argonauts do not host a home playoff game in 2015.
Finally, Rogers Centre has informed us that they will remodel most of the seats in the 200 Level of the stadium this spring. The new seats will remain larger than the seats in the 100 Level, and those that had a cup holder last season will still have one included, but not all seats will be padded as they have been in the past. Seats in the Club VIP 200 Level Lounge in the South Endzone will remain padded.
The CFL schedule maker did a very good job of preparing this year’s schedule considering the number of major events being hosted in Canada this summer. As we considered available dates, we worked hard to ensure that the needs of our fans and our football team were put at the forefront.
Thank you for your continued support and we look forward to seeing you in the stands.

So since I have 2 Season Tickets does that mean that I get 4 "Bonus Tickets" to the 2015 Home Opener?


Just brutal. What happens if the Jays make the playoffs? I know its not likely, but you never know. We need to get out of the Dome ASAP.

Then we can bump This Thread:

http://www.argofans.com/showthread.php?2848-Thanks-Rogers!-quot-Argos-could-be-without-home-in-October-if-Blue-Jays-make-playoffs

[Rich]

So since I have 2 Season Tickets does that mean that I get 4 "Bonus Tickets" to the 2015 Home Opener?

Not likely.

The good news is that our playoff tickets are now already paid for. And i love all the Friday Night games, they are always more fun.

[AngeloV]

>

Two bonus tickets to the 2015 Home Opener on August 8 vs. Saskatchewan

That should bump up the attendance to around 4,500 that night.

:ohno:

[1argoholic]

Well so called Argo Hero from a few years back has totally turned out to be one very large TOOL! David Braley that is. He has screwed around for over a year now while the Argos sink. The last nail will surely be hammered in the Argo coffin very soon.

I had to just say WTFF when I heard the news about the Argos playing in that HUGE North American DEADZONE called Fort Mac. I wouldn't go there if my life depended on it. I'm surprised that Sh!tpit has a stadium. That in itself is a slap in the face to the Argonauts and it's fans. F this whole scene.

Braley you are one ....... .... ... ......

SAD SHITE indeed.


Oh and this will get people to fill the stadium on Augs 8th. hahaha. Grey Cup 100 seems like 20 years ago at this point.

[Rich]

That should bump up the attendance to around 4,500 that night.



On the other hand, if the Argos come into that game at 5-1, what with Sasky being the top draw, there could be 30,000 people there. The marketers call it pent-up demand.

[mchesher03]

this schedule is one big competitive disadvantage. Playing our arch-rivals on the road twice, giving away a home game and who knows what else I've missed in terms of turnaround time between games. Not happy and the odds of me renewing my seasons has dropped to about 0% now (in fairness it was about 10-20% before). Hard for the Argos to be competitive on the football side of things when their own front office gives it away like this - pathetic.

EDIT - i see we have hamilton at home Sept. 11 so one complaint down - several more to go....

[1argoholic]

Braley's running The Good Ship Argonaut to the bottom of Lake Ontario. He is the problem.

[AngeloV]

Braley's running The Good Ship Argonaut to the bottom of Lake Ontario. He is the problem.

Agreed. At the very least in stead of pretending to ponder about perhaps building his own stadium, he should have worked out a lease at BMO, as soon as the news was out that the Dome would not be their home in the future. They likely would have been playing out of BMO this year be it under his ownership or MLSE's.

[Neely2005]

So since I have 2 Season Tickets does that mean that I get 4 "Bonus Tickets" to the 2015 Home Opener?


Not likely.

The good news is that our playoff tickets are now already paid for. And i love all the Friday Night games, they are always more fun.

Confirmed with my Account Representative that it's Per Season Ticket so since I have 2 Season Tickets I get:


<tbody>

>

2 tickets to the Argos’ home pre-season game at Varsity Stadium in Toronto




>

2 tickets to eight regular season Argos home games at Rogers Centre




>

2 tickets to a potential Argos home playoff game in 2015*




>

4 bonus tickets to the 2015 Home Opener on August 8 vs. Saskatchewan




>

Exciting benefits and quality service from your personal sales representative


</tbody>

[T-Bone]

No conflicts for me, just one back to back on October 17. Fort McMurray being a home game is unfortunate but it has happened in the past with Moncton.

[argofan81]

As bad as it is, I'm glad that we are not the only team in the CFL without a home game in July....Hamilton's home opener isn't until Aug. 3 (vs. Toronto). So it looks like this year we really can't blame our owner or Rogers Centre for giving us a crap schedule in the first month of the season; it's the Pan Am games that are screwing us over!

[argonaut11xx]

ok....just curious....

im actually excited about the fort mac game, im wondering how to grab single game tickets for it? (not a package/hotel deal) . I'd drive my RV.

[hugoagogo]

I know it's always a tough schedule for Argo fans, but every team has something to complain about. Esks have their byes in the second week and last week of the season. 17 straight games without a bye.

Having said that - Rogers sucks - you need to get out of that stadium.

[argonaut11xx]

SOOOOO......

The Eskies are playing Sask in the same Fort Mac Stadium on June 13th....so 2 weeks in a row for the Eskies in Oil country.

Looks better than Varsity, or BMO
http://www.macdonaldisland.ca/shell-place/about

[AaronInToronto]

I love how they are trying to call the Friday, Sept 11th game a "Labour Day Classic" game.!!!!

[ArgoGabe22]

Good excuse for me to go back to Alberta. I actually prefer home games in the fall, since that is a boring time for me. Summer is too hectic.

[Fumblitis]

The silver lining with the "home" game in Ft Mac is that the Argos should get a nice cut of ticket sales/concessions/etc. Not a bad cash infusion for them until they get bought up by MLSE.

[Neely2005]

I love how they are trying to call the Friday, Sept 11th game a "Labour Day Classic" game.!!!!

They're not:

"We welcome the return of the Labour Day re-match on September 11 against Hamilton"

[1argoholic]

Just googled Fort Mac Stadium and everything lists Edmonton and Sask still. This will be the official opening of Shell Stadium. Funny how the oil industry is tanking and soon will sit a small empty new nice little stadium in Fort Mac. Nice to not only send the Argonauts west to the deadzone but to rub yet another new stadium in their faces. How many new stadiums do the Argos get to open. Nice home date against Edmonton in Eskimo territory. I just can't get over this mess.

[ArgoFan1]

I don't know why everyone is complaining so much. I'll go whenever the Argos play. Don't like losing one home game, but if they get a home playoff game, that works out well. The spread of home games is much better than last year when we didn't see the team for 7 weeks at one stage. Just circle the dates on your calendars and you have months to arrange your life to fit it in. How are we going to get new fans to come out when even the supposed die-hards complain about the schedule. It is what it is, so let's get pumped for the season. My only complaint is that the Argos only play in Montreal on Thanksgiving. I always went to Montreal for the Argo game, but it might be tough getting away for this one, getting out of the family get together. Oh well. I'll check to see about a trip to Ottawa. Cannot wait for the season.

[Invader]

ok....just curious....

im actually excited about the fort mac game, im wondering how to grab single game tickets for it? (not a package/hotel deal) . I'd drive my RV.
Hopefully the Argos will organize a "party train" to Fort Mac, that would be a gas! (albeit hitched to the back of a slow-moving bitumin hauler.) Despite the devaluation of oil, the frontier city is still awash in cash, so tickets will very likely be re-selling at a huge premium over face value. Being an Argo "home" game, they will likely be alloted a block of tickets. I love the look of Shell Centre at Fort Mac, kinda reminds me of Venice with the beautiful canals (or are those tailing ponds?) ;)

[Antwon]

Just googled Fort Mac Stadium and everything lists Edmonton and Sask still. This will be the official opening of Shell Stadium. Funny how the oil industry is tanking and soon will sit a small empty new nice little stadium in Fort Mac. Nice to not only send the Argonauts west to the deadzone but to rub yet another new stadium in their faces. How many new stadiums do the Argos get to open. Nice home date against Edmonton in Eskimo territory. I just can't get over this mess.

It was a known fact that this year's CFL schedule was going to be a challenge!
1.The annual attempt to get dates from Rogers and the Blue Jays
2.Pan Am games are impacting Hamilton and Toronto FC for that matter.
3.Womens FIFA soccer tournament at many other CFL venues.


Hopefully the Argos will organize a "party train" to Fort Mac, that would be a gas! (especially hitched to the back of a slow-moving bitumin hauler.) Despite the devaluation of oil, the frontier city is still awash in cash, so tickets will very likely be re-selling at a huge premium over face value. Being an Argo "home" game, they will likely be alloted a block of tickets. I love the look of Shell Centre at Fort Mac, kinda reminds me of Venice with the beautiful canals (or are those tailing ponds?) ;)

There's the attitude! The place looks great. Anyone here price or who a paid?

[Bleeds Double Blue]

Commented Argonauts Executive Chairman & CEO, Chris Rudge, “This year’s home schedule delivers the excitement and tradition of Argos football that our fans count on, and adds renewed rivalries, striking venues, and more suitable Friday, Saturday and Sunday kickoffs. As always, those who join us at Rogers Centre, Varsity Stadium, or SMS Equipment Stadium at Shell Place in Fort McMurray, can expect an entertaining and engaging in-game experience. <P> Say WHAT?

[R.J]

Hopefully the expanded seating is added to SMS Stadium, it would be pretty sad to see only 5,000 people at a regular season home game, last season with Hamilton's fiasco was bad enough.

The schedule is mediocre at best, while it's great that 7 out of 8 games are on the weekend, the spacing of these games is craptacular. 5 homes games in 5 weeks (an away game sprinkled in there), no home opener until August. The Argos really do need to get out of the dome, I really hope the League steps in soon.

Hamilton's schedule doesn't look amazing either.

[gilthethrill]

First home game in Toronto is week 7. Lots of games in the dome in the fall, but that again could easily change if the Jays ever get into the post season. I will get tickets for the Labour Day Game in Hamilton since I am not working that day.

[1argoholic]

Why Fort Mac for TO? Sure have Edmonton and Sask but hell let the Argos play in Moncton or somewhere east at least. Not a pit like Fort Mac.

I understand the BS with scheduling but it goes way deeper then that. This mess is getting worse and Braley is just watching the ship sink slowly. This is becoming very bush.

[Mightygoose]

Fort McMurray - the San Juan of the CFL

[argonaut11xx]

Why Fort Mac for TO? Sure have Edmonton and Sask but hell let the Argos play in Moncton or somewhere east at least. Not a pit like Fort Mac.

I understand the BS with scheduling but it goes way deeper then that. This mess is getting worse and Braley is just watching the ship sink slowly. This is becoming very bush.

Me thinks..... an early season game in Quebec City v the Al's would have made more sense,

however, being selfish i can swing a Calgary/Fort Mac trip in the RV, then return by the 24th of July for the Argo game at BC place...

and 1argoholic is right...the LEFT coast sucks compared to Ontario...

[T-Bone]

Why not? Everyone does it and it gives the league a little buzz and free publicity.
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>According to analytics site Topsy, <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFLSchedule?src=hash">#CFLSchedule</a> has been Tweeted or RT 6,387 so far. I'm not good at math but I don't think that's 10K. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFL?src=hash">#CFL</a></p>&mdash; Drew Edwards (@scratchingpost) <a href="https://twitter.com/scratchingpost/status/566349740896681985">February 13, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>In other words, it would appear that the <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFL?src=hash">#CFL</a> experiment in forced social media wasn't just annoying, it was also a sham.</p>&mdash; Drew Edwards (@scratchingpost) <a href="https://twitter.com/scratchingpost/status/566350435712516097">February 13, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[argonaut11xx]

<iframe id="twitter-widget-0" scrolling="no" frameborder="0" allowtransparency="true" class="twitter-tweet twitter-tweet-rendered" allowfullscreen="" style="display: block; max-width: 99%; min-width: 220px; padding: 0px; border-radius: 5px; margin: 10px 0px; border-color: rgb(238, 238, 238) rgb(221, 221, 221) rgb(187, 187, 187); border-width: 1px; border-style: solid; box-shadow: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.14902) 0px 1px 3px; position: static; visibility: visible; width: 500px;" title="Embedded Tweet" height="210"></iframe>
<script async="" src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
<iframe id="twitter-widget-1" scrolling="no" frameborder="0" allowtransparency="true" class="twitter-tweet twitter-tweet-rendered" allowfullscreen="" style="display: block; max-width: 99%; min-width: 220px; padding: 0px; border-radius: 5px; margin: 10px 0px; border-color: rgb(238, 238, 238) rgb(221, 221, 221) rgb(187, 187, 187); border-width: 1px; border-style: solid; box-shadow: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.14902) 0px 1px 3px; position: static; visibility: visible; width: 500px;" title="Embedded Tweet" height="210"></iframe>
<script async="" src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Tbone....alot of us older folks (born in the '60's, or earlier) think twitter is for "TWITS", and facespace is stupid....that said, i'd have actually phoned an 800 number to get the schedule....but what do i know, i STILL put film in my camera<iframe id="rufous-sandbox" scrolling="no" frameborder="0" allowtransparency="true" style="display: none;"></iframe>

[R.J]

http://www.tsn.ca/argonauts-to-play-opener-in-fort-mcmurray-1.206918

[argolio]

kicking off our regular season in Fort McMurray, Alberta at scenic SMS Equipment Stadium at Shell PlaceI guess the Siberia deal fell through.

[Neely2005]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>According to analytics site Topsy, <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFLSchedule?src=hash">#CFLSchedule</a> has been Tweeted or RT 6,387 so far. I'm not good at math but I don't think that's 10K. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFL?src=hash">#CFL</a></p>&mdash; Drew Edwards (@scratchingpost) <a href="https://twitter.com/scratchingpost/status/566349740896681985">February 13, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>In other words, it would appear that the <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFL?src=hash">#CFL</a> experiment in forced social media wasn't just annoying, it was also a sham.</p>&mdash; Drew Edwards (@scratchingpost) <a href="https://twitter.com/scratchingpost/status/566350435712516097">February 13, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I thought that you just had to Tweet who you thought is going to win the 2015 Grey Cup? I don't remember it saying that you had to use #CFLschedule

[paulwoods13]

There is one highly offensive aspect of all this. If we don't get a home playoff game, which we are paying for in advance without being asked, the money will be credited to the purchase of tickets in future years. There's no mention of a refund. So I guess anyone who buys tix this year but not next will have donated the cost of two game tickets to the team. Completely unacceptable.

[argotom]

Really? A home game in Fort McMurray, Alta? Have we sunk that low? I would rather play it in Moncton or Hamilton. What an F'N joke. Get us the hell out of the dome.

Need to call my rep now. Will this decrease the price of my ST's by 10%


Agreed, this has to be the worst ever.

Going back to Moncton, QC or anywhere in between would have been more acceptable then FM.
What a joke.

[hugoagogo]

The only theory might be actual costs versus profits. I believe the Ft Mac stadium is being expanded to 20k and prepped for TSN crews for the Esks/Riders game. The city is going all out to make this a success. As a result, it is CFL approved and ready to go. The BC Lions may actually move their home pre-season game against the Esks to the same stadium as they don't have access to BC Place due to FIFA. They are considering using Thunderbird Stadium, but it only has 3500 seats. So what is more profitable? Ft.Mac with 20k and concessions/souvenirs with some travel expenses (and a stadium that is ready to go)...or...3500 in gate and no travel expenses (although they will need to spend some money to get the field CFL ready and have facilities suitable for TSN). Even if they went with another non-CFL stadium that is closer to home, there are expenses to get everything ready.

[Invader]

Going back to Moncton, QC or anywhere in between would have been more acceptable then FM.
What a joke.
Why is Moncton better than Fort Mac? I doubt many Argo fans would be making trip in either case. It costs $1 million or more to convert Moncton for CFL games, are the Argos going to pay that? At least in Fort Mac the 20,000-seat CFL conversion is already in place. I'm sure Fort Mac made an outstanding bid for the game which the Argos couldn't turn down. Now the Lions are contemplating playing an exhibition game in Fort Mac too. Could this be laying the groundwork for a new CFL franchise in Alberta?

[Fumblitis]

Why is Moncton better than Fort Mac? I doubt many Argo fans would be making trip in either case. It costs $1 million or more to convert Moncton for CFL games, are the Argos going to pay that? At least in Fort Mac the 20,000-seat CFL conversion is already in place. I'm sure Fort Mac made an outstanding bid for the game which the Argos couldn't turn down. Now the Lions are contemplating playing an exhibition game in Fort Mac too. Could this be laying the groundwork for a new CFL franchise in Alberta?i think the point of the Ft Mac series is for the Eskimos to expand their fan base. The problem is that a lot of oil field employees are in fact Saskatchewan expats who went to Ft Mac for work and many are likely Rider fans.

[shayman]

i think the point of the Ft Mac series is for the Eskimos to expand their fan base. The problem is that a lot of oil field employees are in fact Saskatchewan expats who went to Ft Mac for work and many are likely Rider fans.

And now the Lions are considering a game in Fort McMurray too. Three games? CFL Expansion has happened while we weren't looking!


http://www.vancouversun.com/sports/football/lions/Lions+seeking+place+play+preseason+contest/10813015/story.html

[AngeloV]

Why is Moncton better than Fort Mac? I doubt many Argo fans would be making trip in either case. It costs $1 million or more to convert Moncton for CFL games, are the Argos going to pay that? At least in Fort Mac the 20,000-seat CFL conversion is already in place. I'm sure Fort Mac made an outstanding bid for the game which the Argos couldn't turn down. Now the Lions are contemplating playing an exhibition game in Fort Mac too. Could this be laying the groundwork for a new CFL franchise in Alberta?

It's not rocket science. If a team is giving up a home game, from a competitive balance point of view a netral site would be preferred compared to what essentially will now be an Edmonton home game. We all were embarrassed when the Las Vegas Posse had to move a home game vs the Esks to Edmonton. I'm of the opinion that this is not that much less embarrassing.


There is one highly offensive aspect of all this. If we don't get a home playoff game, which we are paying for in advance without being asked, the money will be credited to the purchase of tickets in future years. There's no mention of a refund. So I guess anyone who buys tix this year but not next will have donated the cost of two game tickets to the team. Completely unacceptable.

No kidding Paul. I was exchanging emails with my ticket rep all afternoon, and although I expressed to him multiple times that my frustration was not with him or the employees on King St, but rather Braley, he was so defensive, and seemed to take it personally. Almost as if Invader had intercepted my emails.

:)

[Stevoman]

While I like the home stand near the end of the season, this is all pretty ridiculous. I mean, try explaining this to the rookie American player who is coming up to play in one of North America's largest cities and then finds out the first "home" game is somewhere way out North West??? Sadly, it is bush league and I love my CFL but it is the truth.

[Argocister]

My 2 cents .....

Having the Pan Am games and the FIFA Womens cup in the same year has created major havoc for the CFL (and probably others as well)
Both the Argos and Ticats don't start their home games until August. Even if we had access to BMO, we still wouldn't start till August. We have to be hosts to the Pan Am games and to the FIFA soccor.

The only difference .... Argos fans are use to this and complain .... Ticats go ... one more year and the stadium revolves around us!
Last year the Ticats season ticket holders had a choice of more tickets to games or money back at the end of the season , so I am sure the Argos will do the same at the end of the year.

Fort Mac .... it was building its stadium for the purpose to hold CFL games.... much like Moncton did. It is the obvious choice to hold extra game s there instead of bringing back Moncton. I wonder if they will have similar pre game festivities like Moncton had, to try and promote the "home" team.

I hate to say it but I hope the Jays tank ..... I will have to review the schedule, maybe THF will be the alternate. I'd hate to go to Fort Mac for playoff games in Nov :ohno:

Sorry guys... even if this was a community owned team, the Argos were going to be stiffed this year. The Ticats schedule is similar... except for the Fort Mac venue. Who knows, maybe another east team will have to play there next year. .... similar to Moncton.

[ArgofanIan]

ARGos are my team... I will be there supporting them... looking forward the Ticat , MTL and SASK game's specifically ...... hopefully I can do a road trip to Hamilton or MTL this year as well ....schedule is not the best but as long as we continue to win the Ballard cup.... I am happy.... cause the only thing that really matters .... is us beating the Cats.....

[ArgoRavi]

No conflicts for me, just one back to back on October 17. Fort McMurray being a home game is unfortunate but it has happened in the past with Moncton.

At least half of the crowd in Moncton would be cheering for the Argos. How many fans in oil sands country are going to be cheering for the Argos over the Esks. Edmonton got themselves one more home game and the Argos one less.

[AngeloV]

At least half of the crowd in Moncton would be cheering for the Argos. How many fans in oil sands country are going to be cheering for the Argos over the Esks. Edmonton got themselves one more home game and the Argos one less.

Argos would have been better off playing the game in Calgary or Regina. At least their fans wouldn't be cheering for the Esks.

[paulwoods13]

No kidding Paul. I was exchanging emails with my ticket rep all afternoon, and although I expressed to him multiple times that my frustration was not with him or the employees on King St, but rather Braley, he was so defensive, and seemed to take it personally. Almost as if Invader had intercepted my emails.

:)

I've addressed this concern to the team as well, and I will report back on what response I get. The more I think about this the more outraged I become. You can't sell something to someone (in this case nine games), then take away part of it (in this case one game), then make them buy something else to get what they originally paid for.

[Neely2005]

I've addressed this concern to the team as well, and I will report back on what response I get. The more I think about this the more outraged I become. You can't sell something to someone (in this case nine games), then take away part of it (in this case one game), then make them buy something else to get what they originally paid for.

I agree that we should be given an option but I think that the 2 extra free tickets to the home opener and the 1 free ticket to the playoff game (if we qualify) is a fair replacement of the 1 missing regular season home game.

[T-Bone]

At least half of the crowd in Moncton would be cheering for the Argos. How many fans in oil sands country are going to be cheering for the Argos over the Esks. Edmonton got themselves one more home game and the Argos one less.
I didn't consider that, thank you for pointing it out. Outside of that though personally I don't see much of an issue with the schedule. We all knew we would have the late start and that's not solely linked to Rogers Centre.

[Argo57]

I've addressed this concern to the team as well, and I will report back on what response I get. The more I think about this the more outraged I become. You can't sell something to someone (in this case nine games), then take away part of it (in this case one game), then make them buy something else to get what they originally paid for.

It does make the Argos look really bad (once again), how many more marketing gaffes can this team make before they permanently damage the brand (if they haven't done so already).

[Will]

The possibility of a neutral site game was unfortunately a reality because of the Pan-Am Games and Rogers' attitude towards the Argos. However, to give the Argos a "home game" in Fort McMurray, AB against the CFL team that is geographically the closest to Fort McMurray is a slap in the face.

[Neely2005]

The possibility of a neutral site game was unfortunately a reality because of the Pan-Am Games and Rogers' attitude towards the Argos. However, to give the Argos a "home game" in Fort McMurray, AB against the CFL team that is geographically the closest to Fort McMurray is a slap in the face.

Just another example of the owners (including our own) showing their disdain for the Argonauts.

[Bleeds Double Blue]

Just about every team has had their schedule impacted by FIFA. The Lions for example do not have a location for their home preseason game yet to accommodate Switzerland vs Ecuador and Japan vs Cameroon. They could solve a lot of problems nation wide if they played the soccer in Fort Mac. Women's soccer.... gimme a break.

[Argocister]

I've addressed this concern to the team as well, and I will report back on what response I get. The more I think about this the more outraged I become. You can't sell something to someone (in this case nine games), then take away part of it (in this case one game), then make them buy something else to get what they originally paid for.


I agree that we should be given an option but I think that the 2 extra free tickets to the home opener and the 1 free ticket to the playoff game (if we qualify) is a fair replacement of the 1 missing regular season home game.

The Ticats had that last year, where the STH had purchased the 9 games and then 3-4 of them were in other venues or the construction wasn't complete and couldn't hold all the STH . They had the same issue, replace the tickets or get extras or get your monies back . I am sure for those that insist they can get a refund on a game. My husband just got his money back .... Although it was towards the end of the season ..... Probably in case you change your mind.
There is no way they would know how the season schedule would turn out. It would have been much more dangerous to not sell season tickets til after the schedule was out.

[argonaut11xx]

I've addressed this concern to the team as well, and I will report back on what response I get. The more I think about this the more outraged I become. You can't sell something to someone (in this case nine games), then take away part of it (in this case one game), then make them buy something else to get what they originally paid for.

Reminds me a lot of "Negative option billing", which rogers once attempted.(and it was a massive failure)

[VANRIDERFAN]

This really sucks for you guys and I hope your situation is rectified soon. In contrast the Riders play on Fri/Sat or Sun.

I really wish we had a Canadian Bill Gates who loved football and would swoop in and buy the Argos and build a nice 35,000 seat stadium with all the bells and whistles and tell Rogers and MLSE to go and have carnal relationships with animals!

[AngeloV]

I agree that we should be given an option but I think that the 2 extra free tickets to the home opener and the 1 free ticket to the playoff game (if we qualify) is a fair replacement of the 1 missing regular season home game.

This is where I disagree with you. There are thousands of unsold tickets every game. By giving away 2 to each of their 2.500 or so season ticket holders is no loss whatsoever to them, but they have gained by selling a 9 game package as 10 games. Even if they host a playoff game, that's over $100,000 (based on about a $50 average ticket) they are receiving 6 months or so ahead of the time they would usually be receiving that money. They are making our money work for them.

[Neely2005]

This is where I disagree with you. There are thousands of unsold tickets every game. By giving away 2 to each of their 2.500 or so season ticket holders is no loss whatsoever to them, but they have gained by selling a 9 game package as 10 games. Even if they host a playoff game, that's over $100,000 (based on about a $50 average ticket) they are receiving 6 months or so ahead of the time they would usually be receiving that money. They are making our money work for them.

Which is why I said that they should give the option. Personally I would take the 3 free tickets per season ticket.

[1argoholic]

There's a good reason why every Argo fan should be pissed. The Argos gain squat from TO hosting the Pan Am games. Hamilton has a nice sweet new stadium and the Argos organization has one foot in the friggin grave. Then we find out that our first home game is in The Deadzone, Fort Mac. Whoever came up this this plan should be tossed into a tailings pond with cement shoes on.

Why not play at Centennial Stadium? Fans could bring lawn chairs.

I'm so sick of hockey being played up so big that if you don't follow the NHL you're not Canadian. So much time, money and effort is wasted on the Maple Laughs while the oldest pro sports franchise in North America continues to get washed in septic sludge year in and year out.

The older I get and see just how this world of ours is evolving makes me more and more bitter and longing for the mom and pop days. Everything is big business and tradition mean jack shite.

[Rich]

This is where I disagree with you. There are thousands of unsold tickets every game. By giving away 2 to each of their 2.500 or so season ticket holders is no loss whatsoever to them, but they have gained by selling a 9 game package as 10 games. Even if they host a playoff game, that's over $100,000 (based on about a $50 average ticket) they are receiving 6 months or so ahead of the time they would usually be receiving that money. They are making our money work for them.

Don't be such a crybaby. The Argos are having difficulties and they need a little help and understanding from their fans. Do you turn you back on your friends when they're in trouble?

[gilthethrill]

This really sucks for you guys and I hope your situation is rectified soon. In contrast the Riders play on Fri/Sat or Sun.

I really wish we had a Canadian Bill Gates who loved football and would swoop in and buy the Argos and build a nice 35,000 seat stadium with all the bells and whistles and tell Rogers and MLSE to go and have carnal relationships with animals!

Thanks for your support Van.....and LOL on that suggestion.

[paulwoods13]

Don't be such a crybaby. The Argos are having difficulties and they need a little help and understanding from their fans. Do you turn you back on your friends when they're in trouble?

Yeah, we should all just donate whatever they need to keep them afloat. Who cares that they sold nine games and only guaranteed eight?

[Argo57]

Don't be such a crybaby. The Argos are having difficulties and they need a little help and understanding from their fans. Do you turn you back on your friends when they're in trouble?

The people that are complaining are season ticket holders who despite this franchises bumbling ways continue to show up and in fact do not turn their back on this team.

[Argocister]

I'm with Rich and. Neely ...... I don't have a problem with the substitution.
During the season I often buy extra tickets for friends and family, so having extras already paid for .and at a 2for 1 price ... That's good for me.
Last year we were provided with vouchers for free tickets. I used all of mine. I am sure the Argo management looked at their stats and said ... Well this way we can guarantee more bodies in the seats.I don't mind helping out with the marketing and putting more bums in seats ..... I'll just charge top price ;)

[AngeloV]

Don't be such a crybaby. The Argos are having difficulties and they need a little help and understanding from their fans. Do you turn you back on your friends when they're in trouble?

34 years and counting as a season ticket holder. I don't plan on giving it up, but that doesn't mean I have to be happy and just give them everything they want. Furthermore, if my friends are ever in trouble and need a little support from me, they would not try and give me a load of BS so that I give them more than they need.


I'm with Rich and. Neely ...... I don't have a problem with the substitution.
During the season I often buy extra tickets for friends and family, so having extras already paid for .and at a 2for 1 price ... That's good for me.
Last year we were provided with vouchers for free tickets. I used all of mine. I am sure the Argo management looked at their stats and said ... Well this way we can guarantee more bodies in the seats.I don't mind helping out with the marketing and putting more bums in seats ..... I'll just charge top price ;)

Do you really think that providing us with vouchers for tickets that would otherwise go unsold really is an act of good faith on their part? We used to get cool gifts with our season tickets. We used to get locker room sales at season's end where we can get good stuff at awesome clearance prices. They used to sell 2 for 1 merchandise at the final home game at the kiosks. Now we pay more and get less.

Sorry, I will never stop going to the games, but I refuse to bite my tongue. This owner is a cheap jackass that has no ties to the team or city. I'm of the opinion that he only took over the team because he was guaranteed multiple Grey Cups over a short period of time which would more than offset any losses he took on the Argos, and now is looking for a huge winfall to unload them. The team and their fans is paying the price for this.

[Rich]

Who cares that they sold nine games and only guaranteed eight?

They didn't deliberately mislead anybody. It was probably only in the last two weeks that they realized they couldn't deliver a 9th home date. The front office is already in chaos because of the ownership situation. Cash flow is obviously a problem. Covering the payment for playoff tickets seems like a fair solution to many of us subscribers.

Why would you think they would run off with your money if we don't make the playoffs? They would never get away with it. You think the media coverage of the Argos is bad now, just imagine when everyone finds out they ripped off their subscribers. They'd never sell another season's ticket.

You love this team, don't you? So cut them some slack. They aren't gonna rip you off. Things are tough enough at head office these days without subscribers boo-hooing that they've been scammed somehow.


At least half of the crowd in Moncton would be cheering for the Argos. How many fans in oil sands country are going to be cheering for the Argos over the Esks. Edmonton got themselves one more home game and the Argos one less.

Wikipedia says that less than half the population of Fort MacMurray comes from Alberta. 17% comes from Newfoundland, maybe they'd cheer for the Argos. And there's lots of people from Ontario too.

[paulwoods13]

The team has sent me this in response to my complaint about the "no-refund" policy announced previously:

In the event we do not host a playoff game the amount for that game will be placed on a credit in your account. When the season is completed and if you would rather have that amount placed back on a credit card rather than on account credit simply contact us and we will be more than happy to do so.

So they have stood down. Would they have done so had there been no public complaining?

Either they didn't realize they were in effect ripping their own subscribers off or they chose to do so in hopes we would all roll over. Either way, yet another reason to lack confidence in the front office.


They didn't deliberately mislead anybody. It was probably only in the last two weeks that they realized they couldn't deliver a 9th home date. The front office is already in chaos because of the ownership situation. Cash flow is obviously a problem. Covering the payment for playoff tickets seems like a fair solution to many of us subscribers.

Why would you think they would run off with your money if we don't make the playoffs? They would never get away with it. You think the media coverage of the Argos is bad now, just imagine when everyone finds out they ripped off their subscribers. They'd never sell another season's ticket.

You love this team, don't you? So cut them some slack. They aren't gonna rip you off. Things are tough enough at head office these days without subscribers boo-hooing that they've been scammed somehow.

I agree they likely realized only recently that they could not deliver nine home games. But that does not even remotely excuse announcing a "make-good" policy that amounts to "make-another-purchase-if-you-want-to-get-what-you-already-paid-for." As soon as it became apparent there was no ninth home game, they should have announced three options:

1. Credit the ninth game towards a playoff game if there is one.
2. Credit the ninth game towards a future purchase.
3. Refund the unplayed ninth game.

Instead they forced 1 and 2, without offering any options at all. Stupid management, stupid PR.

Yes, I love the team. But that doesn't mean I'm going to roll over and accept everything they do. The idea that we should not be "crybabies" because "things are tough enough at head office these days" is both offensive and a joke. Things are tough in large part because the marketing department -- in particular two extremely effective senior managers -- was eliminated . . . by head office. So boo-hoo.

[D-Gap-Willie]

The team has sent me this in response to my complaint about the "no-refund" policy announced previously:

In the event we do not host a playoff game the amount for that game will be placed on a credit in your account. When the season is completed and if you would rather have that amount placed back on a credit card rather than on account credit simply contact us and we will be more than happy to do so.

So they have stood down. Would they have done so had there been no public complaining?

Either they didn't realize they were in effect ripping their own subscribers off or they chose to do so in hopes we would all roll over. Either way, yet another reason to lack confidence in the front office.

Perhaps I missed something here Paul. You state that the Argo HO has responded to your "complaint about the "no refund" policy announced previously " and that they have now "stood down". Can you please direct me to this "previously announced " ""no refund" policy". I am only aware of the announcement by footnote, " *A credit will be applied to your account for future Argos ticket purchases in the event the Argonauts do not host a home playoff game in 2015."

I merely want to get this issue straight in my mind , as to the original position of the Argos. In my time as an Argo STH, I have several times had a credit on my account and a refund was always available.

[paulwoods13]

Perhaps I missed something here Paul. You state that the Argo HO has responded to your "complaint about the "no refund" policy announced previously " and that they have now "stood down". Can you please direct me to this "previously announced " ""no refund" policy". I am only aware of the announcement by footnote, " *A credit will be applied to your account for future Argos ticket purchases in the event the Argonauts do not host a home playoff game in 2015."

I merely want to get this issue straight in my mind , as to the original position of the Argos. In my time as an Argo STH, I have several times had a credit on my account and a refund was always available.

"A credit will be applied to your account for future Argos ticket purchases in the event the Argonauts do not host a home playoff game in 2015" seems pretty clear to me -- if there is no ninth game, your future Argos ticket purchases will be reduced by the value of that game you already paid for. If they were offering refunds as well, it should have been explicitly stated from the outset. Instead the clear impression was left that if you don't get a game this year, you can get it next year -- but you will have to buy more tickets to qualify. A competent communications professional would have advised against what looks like a move to force future purchases. There used to be one of those (a competent communications professional) in the organization.

[Argocister]

I think you're getting your tail tied in knots.
the Ticats did exactly the same thing last year. If you wanted your money back and didn't use it for anything else then they will give it to you.

Put yourself in their position ... you need to provide some type of compensation to the STH. Providing extra tickets and putting the cost towards your account is the normal thing. Even if its not sports, it would be the same. Take the dark glasses off.

[paulwoods13]

I think you're getting your tail tied in knots.
the Ticats did exactly the same thing last year. If you wanted your money back and didn't use it for anything else then they will give it to you.

Put yourself in their position ... you need to provide some type of compensation to the STH. Providing extra tickets and putting the cost towards your account is the normal thing. Even if its not sports, it would be the same. Take the dark glasses off.

Yeah, I am renowned for my dark glasses when it comes to the Argos. Just ask OV.

The team botched what should have been an incredibly simple, understood and supportable announcement about a potential inconvenience to its most important paying customers. I guess we should all just forgive and forget. Especially since they have been so good to us fans in so many other ways in recent years -- no price increases, lots of STH benefits, a string of exciting announcements about the future in a new venue, etc. It's all cherries and roses for Argo fans these days, that's for sure.

[Argocister]

Yeah, I am renowned for my dark glasses when it comes to the Argos. Just ask OV.

The team botched what should have been an incredibly simple, understood and supportable announcement about a potential inconvenience to its most important paying customers. I guess we should all just forgive and forget. Especially since they have been so good to us fans in so many other ways in recent years -- no price increases, lots of STH benefits, a string of exciting announcements about the future in a new venue, etc. It's all cherries and roses for Argo fans these days, that's for sure.

No its called ..... been there done that in other situations. ..... this is not that much different .....

[paulwoods13]

No its called ..... been there done that in other situations. ..... this is not that much different .....

To each his own. The fact that any Argo fan was left unhappy by the team's announcement would suggest to me it should not have happened. There are increasingly small numbers of us, and the team can't afford to alienate a single STH. They risked that with the way this was handled. Shrug it off if you like; I'm holding the org to account for its actions because all of those actions affect the future of this sadly troubled franchise.

[AngeloV]

No its called ..... been there done that in other situations. ..... this is not that much different .....

With dwindling season ticket numbers (down to a reported 1,500 now)..Maybe something different is what is needed.

You really can't compare the situation in Hamilton to that in Toronto. At least the Cats don't have an absentee owner. One that has tried everything there is to try in order to make the game experience better for their fans. That can't be said about the Argos.



The sad thing is, it would likely be cheaper to buy a ticket for the pre-season game for $10 of a scalper, and then purchase your season ticket package. That way you save on the pre-season game, and will not have to up front for a playoff game that may not happen.

[paulwoods13]

Since I have been critical of the organization over how it handled the issue of the ninth game, it's only fair to say I got a call from Chris Rudge about this last night, in response to my email of a few days ago. I won't get into everything he said, but his frustration over the scheduling options available to the team from Rogers Centre was palpable. Whomever agreed to a contract entitling the Argos to the bare minimum number of dates -- I'm guessing this was done by the oft-heralded C&S regime, but that's speculation -- bears a great deal of responsibility for the team's current woeful state. (So, for that matter, does whomever agreed to surrender first priority. I've been told that when SkyDome opened in 1989, the Argos had first choice of dates. Surrendering that right, probably in exchange for cash, was the genesis of what we have now. Probably Harry Ornest's doing -- don't know that for sure, but I intend to find out some day.) This year the team was offered one date in June but opted to play the ex game at Varsity rather than pay the much higher fee at RC. That left them with no choice but to play a regular-season game somewhere else.

I still say the team should have made clear up front that the unplayed game could be refunded as well as credited, and I told Rudge I disagreed with the approach they took. But I give the man credit for at least reaching out to me in response to my complaint.

Unfortunately he had no news to impart about any potential sale or BMO lease. That's not surprising since any such activity needs to be done quietly, behind closed doors.

[Neely2005]

^ Thanks for the update, glad to see that he reached out to you.

However at any point did the Argonauts actually say that they wouldn't refund the game if they didn't make the playoffs or was everyone just assuming that?

[argonaut11xx]

Since I have been critical of the organization over how it handled the issue of the ninth game, it's only fair to say I got a call from Chris Rudge about this last night, in response to my email of a few days ago. I won't get into everything he said, but his frustration over the scheduling options available to the team from Rogers Centre was palpable. Whomever agreed to a contract entitling the Argos to the bare minimum number of dates -- I'm guessing this was done by the oft-heralded C&S regime, but that's speculation -- bears a great deal of responsibility for the team's current woeful state. (So, for that matter, does whomever agreed to surrender first priority. I've been told that when SkyDome opened in 1989, the Argos had first choice of dates. Surrendering that right, probably in exchange for cash, was the genesis of what we have now. Probably Harry Ornest's doing -- don't know that for sure, but I intend to find out some day.) This year the team was offered one date in June but opted to play the ex game at Varsity rather than pay the much higher fee at RC. That left them with no choice but to play a regular-season game somewhere else.

I still say the team should have made clear up front that the unplayed game could be refunded as well as credited, and I told Rudge I disagreed with the approach they took. But I give the man credit for at least reaching out to me in response to my complaint.

Unfortunately he had no news to impart about any potential sale or BMO lease. That's not surprising since any such activity needs to be done quietly, behind closed doors.


Im sorry, but the BITCHING with regards to this topic is really SAD.

Paul even if your a Platinum level season ticket holder, your complaining about 91 dollars(per seat)?
Far less if you hold a season ticket in a cheaper section.

Im not saying that this was handled perfectly by the Argonauts, Im just saying the actual dollar amounts are so MINIMAL, that its seems petty to make this such a big deal.

[Argocister]

Im sorry, but the BITCHING with regards to this topic is really SAD.

Paul even if your a Platinum level season ticket holder, your complaining about 91 dollars(per seat)?
Far less if you hold a season ticket in a cheaper section.

Im not saying that this was handled perfectly by the Argonauts, Im just saying the actual dollar amounts are so MINIMAL, that its seems petty to make this such a big deal.

Like button .... Checked

As a season ticket holder, I would assume you have a higher commitment to the team than just one that can buy their tickets at each game. You give your monies earlier in the off season in order to commit to the team. ..... Mind you the complaining obviously portrays a mistrust of the organization ..... Perhaps due to previous owners .... But may also be reflective as to why the the Argos don't have more STH .... Pity

[paulwoods13]

^ Thanks for the update, glad to see that he reached out to you.

However at any point did the Argonauts actually say that they wouldn't refund the game if they didn't make the playoffs or was everyone just assuming that?

No, they did not say they would not refund. They also did not say they would. IMO there is a strong need to treat their most valued customers as well as they possibly can, which in this case would mean both providing multiple options and announcing all of those options -- not staying silent on what should have been the most basic option in a case where something already purchased was no longer available.


Im sorry, but the BITCHING with regards to this topic is really SAD.

Paul even if your a Platinum level season ticket holder, your complaining about 91 dollars(per seat)?
Far less if you hold a season ticket in a cheaper section.

Im not saying that this was handled perfectly by the Argonauts, Im just saying the actual dollar amounts are so MINIMAL, that its seems petty to make this such a big deal.

OK, so we should have just donated the money to the team, since it's a minimal amount? Have we evolved so much as a society that the principle of "get what you pay for" no longer applies? If I ordered a jersey from the team website, and when it arrived it was something other than what I ordered, should I just say nothing because the dollar value is low?

[argonaut11xx]

OK, so we should have just donated the money to the team, since it's a minimal amount? Have we evolved so much as a society that the principle of "get what you pay for" no longer applies? If I ordered a jersey from the team website, and when it arrived it was something other than what I ordered, should I just say nothing because the dollar value is low?

Donated?....geesh....

You are getting what you PAID for, and your actually getting a BONUS if the Argo's make the playoff's.

Your being a cheapskate/skinflint, and beyond frugal. You as a season ticket holder get a BONUS, or a full credit (cash if you so badly need it, or a credit on your account)

What is VERY scary is that IF Chris Rudge is calling all "whiny season ticket holders" personally, that says to me there are probably very few actual PAID season ticket holders.

Paul, your not getting ripped off in ANY of the scenario's provided by the Toronto Argonauts

(all this for 90 bucks or probably less...wow)

[Al&Kat]

here's an optimistic thought, fellow STH...
In 2014 the Ticats were hugely screwed, schedule-wise, all year, until very late in the season, while the Argos were mildly screwed, with their 7-weeks between home dates 2014 schedule. To their credit, the Ticats persevered through all the crap and, along with getting a spiffy new venue, advanced to the Cup game.

Now it seems clear that in 2015, it is the Argos being royally-screwed, schedule-wise, certainly more than any other CFL team is, and the Ticats get mildly screwed with such a late THF home opener. Sooo let's see our Argos turn the tables, the way the Ticats did, and go to the 2015 Cup! Cheer hard people!

Oh crap, one thing missing...no spiffy new Argos venue by year's end. Damn!

[paulwoods13]

Donated?....geesh....

You are getting what you PAID for, and your actually getting a BONUS if the Argo's make the playoff's.

Your being a cheapskate/skinflint, and beyond frugal. You as a season ticket holder get a BONUS, or a full credit (cash if you so badly need it, or a credit on your account)

What is VERY scary is that IF Chris Rudge is calling all "whiny season ticket holders" personally, that says to me there are probably very few actual PAID season ticket holders.

Paul, your not getting ripped off in ANY of the scenario's provided by the Toronto Argonauts

(all this for 90 bucks or probably less...wow)

Umm, we paid for tickets to nine regular-season games, did we not? We are getting eight regular-season games, are we not? How is it that we are getting what we paid for?

If you want to call me names, go ahead, but please do answer my questions.


here's an optimistic thought, fellow STH...
In 2014 the Ticats were hugely screwed, schedule-wise, all year, until very late in the season, while the Argos were mildly screwed, with their 7-weeks between home dates 2014 schedule. To their credit, the Ticats persevered through all the crap and, along with getting a spiffy new venue, advanced to the Cup game.

Now it seems clear that in 2015, it is the Argos being royally-screwed, schedule-wise, certainly more than any other CFL team is, and the Ticats get mildly screwed with such a late THF home opener. Sooo let's see our Argos turn the tables, the way the Ticats did, and go to the 2015 Cup! Cheer hard people!

Oh crap, one thing missing...no spiffy new Argos venue by year's end. Damn!

I love the optimism, but I can't accept the premise that the Ticats got screwed worse than us, schedule-wise, last year. We had one home game in nine weeks, which has likely never happened in the history of pro football. Plus two home games five days apart, one of them on a Tuesday in summer. Ticats' schedule was nothing to write home about, but ours was worse IMO. This year's is also bad, of course, especially one true home game in the first seven games, but there's not a damn thing the team can do about the schedule until we are out of RC.

One annoying thing is that one of our two bye weeks is quite short -- 11 days between July 13 and 24. I haven't looked at other teams' schedules but I'd be surprised if anyone else has such a short bye. Our second bye is a true break -- 15 days between Sept. 11 and 26.

[argonaut11xx]

So...if i purchased a BOOK, and AFTER it was delivered the author added another chapter, should i feel ROBBED, and done wrong?

hmmmmm......

You will get tickets for 9 games, if the Argo's make the playoffs, you actually get MORE than you paid for(as a playoff ticket is at a higher cost).

If the Argo's dont make the playoff's, you get FULL credit,or your money back.

I just think that for 90 bucks (or less), some are making a MOUNTAIN out of a molehill.

[paulwoods13]

So...if i purchased a BOOK, and AFTER it was delivered the author added another chapter, should i feel ROBBED, and done wrong?

hmmmmm......

You will get tickets for 9 games, if the Argo's make the playoffs, you actually get MORE than you paid for(as a playoff ticket is at a higher cost).

If the Argo's dont make the playoff's, you get FULL credit,or your money back.

I just think that for 90 bucks (or less), some are making a MOUNTAIN out of a molehill.

A more accurate analogy would be: I ordered a book online. When it arrived one of the nine chapters was missing, and I was told by the publisher that I might get a better chapter nine months later. And if that doesn't happen, I can still get another chapter, but only if I buy another book. If you can't see the problem with this, good for you.

As I have said (repeatedly), it's not about 90 (or whatever) bucks. It's about the principle of giving people -- in particular your most loyal and important paying customers -- what they paid for, or giving them appropriate options if you can't deliver on the contractual agreement. The team has now promised to offer refunds if it can't offer a playoff game instead of the missing home game. It should have done that in the first place.

[1argoholic]

Sorry but at this point the money we'll be getting screwed for is a big deal for me and my wife. I'm not exactly raking in the cash since moving back to Ontario and attempting to start my company over. It's not cheap for us to just get to games. With gas and GO Train it's easily $60 just getting back and forth not including tickets or a bite to eat. At one point that would have been a drop in the bucket for me but not at this point.

[Argo57]

Donated?....geesh....

You are getting what you PAID for, and your actually getting a BONUS if the Argo's make the playoff's.

Your being a cheapskate/skinflint, and beyond frugal. You as a season ticket holder get a BONUS, or a full credit (cash if you so badly need it, or a credit on your account)

What is VERY scary is that IF Chris Rudge is calling all "whiny season ticket holders" personally, that says to me there are probably very few actual PAID season ticket holders.

Paul, your not getting ripped off in ANY of the scenario's provided by the Toronto Argonauts

(all this for 90 bucks or probably less...wow)

The last thing I would call any season ticket holder is a "cheapskate/skinflint".
I had no doubt that the Argonauts would do the "right thing" by there fans but lack of communication has plagued this organization for years, all options should have been clearly laid out including the option to get a refund immediately for the missing home game.

[argolio]

I've been told that when SkyDome opened in 1989, the Argos had first choice of dates. Surrendering that right, probably in exchange for cash, was the genesis of what we have now. Probably Harry Ornest's doing -- don't know that for sure, but I intend to find out some day.
It was definitely Ornest, probably in 1990. The Jays were desperate to get scheduling priority, and I imagine Ornest made some decent coin from this.

[AngeloV]

Umm, we paid for tickets to nine regular-season games, did we not? We are getting eight regular-season games, are we not? How is it that we are getting what we paid for?

If you want to call me names, go ahead, but please do answer my questions.

I'll throw in another what if scenario, Paul.

What if the Argos don't host a home playoff game this season? Therefore 10% of or payments go as a credit in our accounts. Now...what if, much like this year(last year for me), the Argos (Braley) decide another ticket increase is in the cards. Essentially, we lose our so called credit at that point.

[Ron]

I still say the team should have made clear up front that the unplayed game could be refunded as well as credited, and I told Rudge I disagreed with the approach they took. But I give the man credit for at least reaching out to me in response to my complaint.


What was his actual response to you telling him you disagreed with their approach.

[paulwoods13]

What was his actual response to you telling him you disagreed with their approach.

I wasn't taking notes but he basically kept talking about the difficult scheduling challenges they face. Didn't respond directly and I did not press the point.

[T-Bone]

The last thing I would call any season ticket holder is a "cheapskate/skinflint".
I had no doubt that the Argonauts would do the "right thing" by there fans but lack of communication has plagued this organization for years, all options should have been clearly laid out including the option to get a refund immediately for the missing home game.
I agree, I wouldn't call Argos season ticket holders cheapskates either. A lot of times we are not getting the best deal on tickets. I know of a few season ticket holders that have given up their season tickets as a result. A lot of times with discounts here and there you can go to all the games for a cheaper price than the cost of a season ticket.

With that said, I have no issue with paying for a possible playoff ticket in advance but in this case that was not the season ticket package they were selling up to this point. They changed the deal so I can understand peoples frustration. Like you said the team has had problems with communicating with its season ticket holders and the refund option of the playoff ticket should have been clear. They really should also be offering a full refund on season tickets sold before this announcement as this is not the ticket package people paid for.


I'll throw in another what if scenario, Paul.

What if the Argos don't host a home playoff game this season? Therefore 10% of or payments go as a credit in our accounts. Now...what if, much like this year(last year for me), the Argos (Braley) decide another ticket increase is in the cards. Essentially, we lose our so called credit at that point.
That would be a really stupid move but after raising the prices this year I wouldn't be surprised if it happened.

[Will]

It was definitely Ornest, probably in 1990. The Jays were desperate to get scheduling priority, and I imagine Ornest made some decent coin from this.

That's always been the consensus I think. The scheduling issues really didn't start till 2010 I think so it was something that C&S did to really screw it up.

[ArgoRavi]

That's always been the consensus I think. The scheduling issues really didn't start till 2010 I think so it was something that C&S did to really screw it up.

IIRC, C & S merely had to renew the lease with Rogers at the already-existing terms - which were much better - but did not do this for some reason and Braley had to negotiate a new lease which was far worse.

[Will]

IIRC, C & S merely had to renew the lease with Rogers at the already-existing terms - which were much better - but did not do this for some reason and Braley had to negotiate a new lease which was far worse.

I forgot about that part.

[doubleblue]

I have been trying to figure Braley's end game in all this fiascle. The problem isn't the employees. I think we are fortunate to have people like Rudge, Barker and Milanovich running the football part of the team. I shudder to think who we might have ended up with this year if Barker and Milanovich had decided they had had enough and moved on. When good people like long time front office people like Beth Waldman leave you know there has to be a problem with ownership spending.
IMO David Braley had two choices when he took over the Argos (his cost of purchase was paying the bills) 1) put more money into the promotion and the advertizing side hoping to attract some buyers or 2) cut things down to the bare bones as doing #1 would have been throwing good money after bad. He has obviously taken the second route apparently thinking he won't get anymore for the team from MLSE if he spends money or not.
I believe he has given the football side of the operation the money to compete. The GM and Coaches wouldn't stay if they were being short changed IMO. When the "deal" with MLSE is finally completed (there doesn't appear to be anyone else in the picture), I hope Ricky Ray isn't transfered to the BC Lions.

[paulwoods13]

I forgot about that part.

Yeah, there were reports that the Argos missed a deadline to renew, which cost them all of their leverage. Never seen that confirmed by anyone in the know but I suspect it happened.

[Neely2005]

"Remote Alberta wasn’t the Argos’ first choice. Options such as Moncton, Guelph and London, Ont., were considered but dismissed for different reasons. Fort McMurray stepped up, offering revenue guarantees and covering all of the team’s expenses."

http://www.thestar.com/sports/argos/2015/02/13/toronto-argonauts-home-opener-in-fort-mcmurray-vs-eskimos.html

[Neely2005]

So with the Jays seemingly going all in and us having 4 home games in October I guess that there is again a possibility that we get kicked out of the Rogers Centre if the Jays are in the playoffs.

[AngeloV]

So with the Jays seemingly going all in and us having 4 home games in October I guess that there is again a possibility that we get kicked out of the Rogers Centre if the Jays are in the playoffs.

After this year, I don't care what the Jays do going forward. But this year, I will definitely be chearing for their opponents every game. All this BS about needing 36 hours to change the field over, I don't buy that for a minute. It would be funny if all of the sudden the "find" a way to do it faster now that their tennants are leaving.

[ArgoRavi]

So with the Jays seemingly going all in and us having 4 home games in October I guess that there is again a possibility that we get kicked out of the Rogers Centre if the Jays are in the playoffs.

The Jays are a .500 team and I don't see that changing for the rest of the season which means no playoffs, even in a mediocre AL this year. However, if they do manage to sneak into the playoffs, they may only last one game anyway (the game between the two wild-card teams).

[Will]

The Jays are a .500 team and I don't see that changing for the rest of the season which means no playoffs, even in a mediocre AL this year. However, if they do manage to sneak into the playoffs, they may only last one game anyway (the game between the two wild-card teams).

We'll have a much better indication of whether that statement will be accurate in a few days.

[AngeloV]

if they do manage to sneak into the playoffs, they may only last one game anyway (the game between the two wild-card teams).

Let's just hope it doesn't happen Ravi. In a 1 game playoff, the better overall team doesn't necessarily have an advantage based on who's turn it is in the pitching rotation.

[PullTogether73]

So with the Jays seemingly going all in and us having 4 home games in October I guess that there is again a possibility that we get kicked out of the Rogers Centre if the Jays are in the playoffs.

I'm not sure that they can bump the Argos.
I know that for NBA and NHL playoffs, those leagues schedule around existing arena obligations.
I would think the same applies here.

Of course, Rogers probably has some "our games supersede your games" clause in the lease agreement.:mad:

[Neely2005]

I'm not sure that they can bump the Argos.
I know that for NBA and NHL playoffs, those leagues schedule around existing arena obligations.
I would think the same applies here.

Of course, Rogers probably has some "our games supersede your games" clause in the lease agreement.:mad:

From last year:

http://www.thestar.com/sports/argos/2014/08/13/argos_could_be_without_home_in_october_if_blue_jay s_make_playoffs.html

[ArgoRavi]

I'm not sure that they can bump the Argos.
I know that for NBA and NHL playoffs, those leagues schedule around existing arena obligations.
I would think the same applies here.

Of course, Rogers probably has some "our games supersede your games" clause in the lease agreement.:mad:

I recall the Argos having to move home games back in 1985 and again in 1989 because of the Jays being in the playoffs. Jays' playoff games will absolutely take precedence over any Argos game at SkyDome.

[AngeloV]

I'm not sure that they can bump the Argos.
I know that for NBA and NHL playoffs, those leagues schedule around existing arena obligations.
I would think the same applies here.

Of course, Rogers probably has some "our games supersede your games" clause in the lease agreement.

Lets not forget the Argos had to change a home playoff date in 2004 from Sunday afternoon to Friday evening because of Wiggles concert. If they can't bump the Wiggles, there is no way MLB and the Blue Jays will allow the Argos to bump them.

I recall the Argos having to move home games back in 1985 and again in 1989 because of the Jays being in the playoffs. Jays' playoff games will absolutely take precedence over any Argos game at SkyDome.

Yes, and it wasn't such a big deal back then, because since the Jays didn't own either stadium at the time, there was no BS 36 hours to convert nonsense.

[Will]

Let's just hope it doesn't happen Ravi. In a 1 game playoff, the better overall team doesn't necessarily have an advantage based on who's turn it is in the pitching rotation.

Well then you don't have to worry since none of the Jays 5 starting pitchers (bar perhaps Mark Buehrle) have an advantage in that department.

[AngeloV]

Well then you don't have to worry since none of the Jays 5 starting pitchers (bar perhaps Mark Buehrle) have an advantage in that department.

Yes, but I was thinking more along the lines of the opposing pitcher. If a team needed a win the last game to get in, and used their ace, he wouldn't be available for a 1 game playoff. Blue Jays pitching sucks, but they sure can hit...especially against average pitchers.

[argotom]

On topic, why is the Rogers Blue Jays even mentioned here?
Who gives a rats rectum about that anal operation.

[Neely2005]

On topic, why is the Rogers Blue Jays even mentioned here?
Who gives a rats rectum about that anal operation.

Because they might kick us out of the Rogers Centre in October:


From last year:

http://www.thestar.com/sports/argos/2014/08/13/argos_could_be_without_home_in_october_if_blue_jay s_make_playoffs.html

[Ballstothewall]

So with the pitcher the jays picked up today and being what 2 games out of a playoff spot, I'm afriad the Argos are screwed again. If the Jays make the playoffs, we should just play all the games on the road. Of course no one in the media is taking about the Argos getting pushed out of the dome in OCT. Image if you may. A T.O NFL team and the Jays shared the dome, do you not think that the Jays making a playoff run and pushing out the NFL team would be a story today, but then again the NFL would tell the Jays to go pound salt, no matter what the lease said

Also I went to place this under the yearly Argos get screwed form, but it is close

[1argoholic]

Rogers is the Evil Empire with bad karma on their side so the Argos will be fine. Price will most likely crap the bed as a Jay getting bombed or injured. The new shortstop is injury prone so the turf won't help him either. I don't wish for the players to get injured I just feel that the Jays will fold. One pitcher doesn't make a playoff team.

Basically SCREW ROGERS!!!!

[argotom]

The media here is nuts all anti CFL/Argos except The Sun.
It's been all Crap Jays here leading not only the sports, BUT the news portion of the newscast.
All are drinking the Rogers kool aid, heck I thought it was once reserved for the Rogers media empire.
How frigging sad.

[jerrym]

After this year, I don't care what the Jays do going forward. But this year, I will definitely be chearing for their opponents every game. All this BS about needing 36 hours to change the field over, I don't buy that for a minute. It would be funny if all of the sudden the "find" a way to do it faster now that their tennants are leaving.

Although the Blue Jays are first in Runs Scored they are 23rd in Runs Against. While David Price is a top notch pitcher, he only pitches every fifth day. There is still a question mark about whether they make the playoffs, as exemplified by today's 7-6 loss - they score lots of runs but still lose.

[paulwoods13]

If it happens -- and it's a big if -- the solution seems fairly simple. Make arrangements between Braley, the new owners and MLSE to play conflicted dates in BMO. TFC has home games Oct. 3, 14 and 17. We have home games oct. 6, 17, 23 and 30. If it came to it we could play the 6th in BMO and move the 17th to the 18th. Not ideal to play two games in five days but we've done it before. Distributing tickets might be a headache but it would be far better than the alternative of playing home games on the road. The other potential snag is if TFC gets into the playoffs but no sense worrying about that just yet.

[1argoholic]

If BMO isn't ready for football we'd be on the road.

[ArgoRavi]

If it happens -- and it's a big if -- the solution seems fairly simple. Make arrangements between Braley, the new owners and MLSE to play conflicted dates in BMO. TFC has home games Oct. 3, 14 and 17. We have home games oct. 6, 17, 23 and 30. If it came to it we could play the 6th in BMO and move the 17th to the 18th. Not ideal to play two games in five days but we've done it before. Distributing tickets might be a headache but it would be far better than the alternative of playing home games on the road. The other potential snag is if TFC gets into the playoffs but no sense worrying about that just yet.

Would BMO be Canadian-football ready by October, Paul? It sounds like you are aware that it can or will be by then.

[argonaut11xx]

I'm hoping the Jays choke, and this wont be an issue.

BMO isnt Football ready, IF the Argo's get kicked out of the dome, i'd bet the Argo's play at THF in the hammer

[paulwoods13]

If "being ready for Canadian football" means regulation end zones, then no it won't be ready this season. But I would rather play a few games with short end zones in our own market and future home than play our home games in some other city that either has no interest in supporting us (Hamilton) or would love an extra home game at our expense (whoever we play when we are displaced). The CFL has a long tradition of elasticity when it comes to end zone length. A few games with short end zones in our own market would be better for competitive balance and credibility than playing home games in Hamilton or calgary or Ottawa.

[AngeloV]

Play at Varsity.

[ArgoZ]

Play at Varsity.

This should be an option. The pre-season games were great there. I see no reason, besides money, that temporary stands couldn't be installed around the track.

[argotom]

Relax people the Crappers are not going to get in.
Even by chance as a Wild card it's one game on the road.
One and done.

[Neely2005]

Play at Varsity.

Varsity only seats 5000 or so and the amenities are non existent, there's no food, no drinks and no alcohol. It's not a realistic option.


This should be an option. The pre-season games were great there. I see no reason, besides money, that temporary stands couldn't be installed around the track.

20,000 temporary seats? You can't place them on the same side as the current seats and there's not much space on the opposite side.

[argonaut11xx]

Sadly, i dont see the league letting the Argo's play on a NFL sized field(or smaller).

Varsity, if seating could be expanded to at least 15K, would be an option, but can it happen?

So, if an "on the road home game", must happen, sadly hamilton does make the most sense.

[paulwoods13]

Sadly, i dont see the league letting the Argo's play on a NFL sized field(or smaller).

Varsity, if seating could be expanded to at least 15K, would be an option, but can it happen?

So, if an "on the road home game", must happen, sadly hamilton does make the most sense.

BMO does not have an NFL-size field. The only difference from CFL is that the end zones would have to be shorter that regulation. And regulation end zones have morphed over the years from 25 to 20 to 20 with rounded off corners to substantially shorter in one or two of the U.S. stadiums. It would be far from the end of the world if we had to play a couple of games with short end zones on an otherwise regulation (and real grass!) field. It would be impossible to put 15k temp seats into Varsity. I doubt they could even put 5,000 in there, and imagine the cost. In my view BMO is miles better than playing before 5,000 fans at Varsity or even fewer in Tim Hortons Field.

[AngeloV]

BMO does not have an NFL-size field. The only difference from CFL is that the end zones would have to be shorter that regulation. And regulation end zones have morphed over the years from 25 to 20 to 20 with rounded off corners to substantially shorter in one or two of the U.S. stadiums. It would be far from the end of the world if we had to play a couple of games with short end zones on an otherwise regulation (and real grass!) field. It would be impossible to put 15k temp seats into Varsity. I doubt they could even put 5,000 in there, and imagine the cost. In my view BMO is miles better than playing before 5,000 fans at Varsity or even fewer in Tim Hortons Field.

All depends Paul. How much room will there be for endzones at this time. To the best of my knowledge the movable end zone seats that will be going in to BMO after this season will not be in place for October. So does that mean, 8 yard end zones? 10? Sorry, I would prefer to play in Varsity, and let as many people as possible stand on the opposite side of the bleachers. If it means fitting in 7,000 (5k in the grandstand and 2k on the open side), than IMO that is a better option than playing with half endzones, or a 100 yard field. At least the integrity of the game would still be there.

[Ron]

Go Jays Go! I hope they get in and do well ... and prove how silly you are all being. ;)

[paulwoods13]

All depends Paul. How much room will there be for endzones at this time. To the best of my knowledge the movable end zone seats that will be going in to BMO after this season will not be in place for October. So does that mean, 8 yard end zones? 10? Sorry, I would prefer to play in Varsity, and let as many people as possible stand on the opposite side of the bleachers. If it means fitting in 7,000 (5k in the grandstand and 2k on the open side), than IMO that is a better option than playing with half endzones, or a 100 yard field. At least the integrity of the game would still be there.

OK, but as long as we're talking about integrity of the game, it would be absolutely decimated if the Argos had to play a "home" game in their opponent's stadium, and only marginally better if they had to play a "home" game in Hamilton. I could live with 10-yard end zones for a couple of games, given all the other ways BMO would be substantially better than Varsity (actual seats, actual food and drink for sale, enough room for a crowd above 5,000, real grass).

[Mookie Fan]

Tim Hortons Field in Hamilton might be the best option on the road to host Argo games late in the season if necessary. The Argos could arrange buses for fans who want that option. Even if they charged fans with tickets a fee for the bus, that might be okay as a short term solution - though I realize it's not an ideal situation. People could also drive if possible, if parking were available somewhere. The Go Train or bus is an option too, although Tim Hortons Field is a bit of a distance from any Go Transit location.

[PullTogether73]

Tim Hortons Field in Hamilton might be the best option on the road to host Argo games late in the season if necessary. The Argos could arrange buses for fans who want that option. Even if they charged fans with tickets a fee for the bus, that might be okay as a short term solution - though I realize it's not an ideal situation. People could also drive if possible, if parking were available somewhere. The Go Train or bus is an option too, although Tim Hortons Field is a bit of a distance from any Go Transit location.

Google maps says THF is 4km from Hamilton GO centre. Not far at all.
I'm going to find out how easy or difficult it is to get there by GO transit at tomorrow night's game.
It should be one train along the Lakeshore line followed by a 15 minute bus ride, and then the last 4km, which I may cover by taxi.

But I hope the Argos don't have to play any "home" games there, and certainly none against the Tiger-cats!
I would drive to Ottawa to watch such a game rather than give Hamilton home field advantage in that scenario.

[Mookie Fan]

This should be an option. The pre-season games were great there. I see no reason, besides money, that temporary stands couldn't be installed around the track.

The problem with this idea is cost. Temporary stands cost a lot to rent and install/uninstall. They cost so much that the team would lose money on those seats and likely the game as a whole. Even at Grey Cup Games (with much higher ticket prices) teams have lost money or come close to it on temporarily installed seats.

[Rich]

At least the integrity of the game would still be there.

Yes, having 10-yard endzones would kill the integrity of the game, such an abomination, could you even call it football?

But this is gonna be fascinating to watch. Rogers isn't just pushing around a rogue auto-parts magnate from Hamilton. They are pushing around a property belonging to Bell and the Kilmer Group, and those guys don't get pushed around.

We have to believe conversations are taking place right now about this. Maybe an early move to BMO might be very advantageous in certain ways to TanenBell. Maybe they can change the construction sked between now and October and make BMO work better. Surely they don't want to inherit a laughing-stock team that played its last 4 home games in Hamilton. They gotta do something to help protect their property.

[Mookie Fan]

Google maps says THF is 4km from Hamilton GO centre. Not far at all.
I'm going to find out how easy or difficult it is to get there by GO transit at tomorrow night's game.
It should be one train along the Lakeshore line followed by a 15 minute bus ride, and then the last 4km, which I may cover by taxi.

But I hope the Argos don't have to play any "home" games there, and certainly none against the Tiger-cats!
I would drive to Ottawa to watch such a game rather than give Hamilton home field advantage in that scenario.

Regarding the distance of THF from the Hamilton GO Centre, the distance is deceptive. The route is not a direct route or a straight line, there are many turns and could be a lot of stopping and starting. It isn't as easy to get to or as quick as one might think. THF is really a bit out of the way, unless you are driving and can take more of a direct route off the highway to the stadium. That said, there is little parking near the stadium--many rent out people's driveways for the night as it is a primarily residential area with little parking, rather than a U.S.-style set-up of a stadium surrounded by huge parking lots.

Many Go Trains only go as far west as Aldershot. That means a bus ride (partially along highway 403) to the Hamilton Go Centre. It isn't a short ride. 15 minutes on the road for this ride is the best case scenario probably. Remember, buses won't be as frequent probably as they were during the Pan Am Games when all Go Service (and TTC service) was free to-and-from Pan Am events. Some trains go as far as the new West Harbour Go Train Station that opened in time for the Pan Am Games. Some trains may also go to the Hamilton Go Centre, I'm not sure, but many only go as far as Aldershot.

Some trains are express trains to the end of the line, some are not. During the Pan Am Games (with soccer games at THF--dubbed the Pan Am Soccer Stadium) some Go Trains were express trains from Union Station all the way to West Harbour Go Train Stadium, which is one stop past Aldershot. During the Pan Am Games, there were free buses from Hamilton Go Centre and West Harbour GO Station to THF. You won't have that luxury. I have no idea how good taxi service is in Hamilton.

Trains from east of Toronto often go as far as Aldershot, but often stop at every stop. On your way home, you may get a train that goes all the way (from west-to-east), or you may have to switch trains at Union Station if you need to travel farther east than downtown Toronto.

As for how long your trip might take, I would plan to leave very early. The worst thing that might happen if you do this is you will have to wait a bit for the game to start, but that's preferable to missing some of the game. Parts of THF have a beautiful view of the vast area, and it's nice to be early--though admittedly Toronto fans of the Argos (and many other teams in Toronto IMO) tend to arrive at the last minute--as noted by Pinball (if I recall correctly) about Argo Fans in his book All Heart back in the 1990s.

Your travel time will depend a lot on where you are getting on the go train. If you are getting on the Lakeshore line at Union Station or especiallly west of it, your trip will obviously likely be considerably shorter. If you are coming from the eastern part of the Lakeshore Line, it could be much longer. Travel times often vary widely on the GO Train versus the TTC. Trains can slow to a halt, be delayed 15-30+ minutes, and can be easily 30 minutes+ to switch to another train on your way somewhere. I would expect a trip from the eastern portion of the Lakeshore Line to THF to take 3 hours or longer easily if train(s) taken are not express trains and the bus ride from Aldershot to the Hamilton Go Centre is necessary. This is even if you make good connections.

During the Pan Am Games, there were people that took 2-3+ hours to get to THF from eastern Toronto or east of Toronto. Going home some people took 2.5 hours to get from THF to their homes east of Union Station, but some took well over 4 hours to do the same. You never really know completely how long it will take, even if you follow the schedules closely. That may be stating the obvious, but don't expect a short trip. It won't be.

Enjoy the game!!!

[Neely2005]

All depends Paul. How much room will there be for endzones at this time. To the best of my knowledge the movable end zone seats that will be going in to BMO after this season will not be in place for October. So does that mean, 8 yard end zones? 10? Sorry, I would prefer to play in Varsity, and let as many people as possible stand on the opposite side of the bleachers. If it means fitting in 7,000 (5k in the grandstand and 2k on the open side), than IMO that is a better option than playing with half endzones, or a 100 yard field. At least the integrity of the game would still be there.

No way that they get a permit for that without more washrooms.


Go Jays Go! I hope they get in and do well ... and prove how silly you are all being. ;)

How are we being silly? Did you not read this?


From last year:

http://www.thestar.com/sports/argos/2014/08/13/argos_could_be_without_home_in_october_if_blue_jay s_make_playoffs.html


Yes, having 10-yard endzones would kill the integrity of the game, such an abomination, could you even call it football?

But this is gonna be fascinating to watch. Rogers isn't just pushing around a rogue auto-parts magnate from Hamilton. They are pushing around a property belonging to Bell and the Kilmer Group, and those guys don't get pushed around.

We have to believe conversations are taking place right now about this. Maybe an early move to BMO might be very advantageous in certain ways to TanenBell. Maybe they can change the construction sked between now and October and make BMO work better. Surely they don't want to inherit a laughing-stock team that played its last 4 home games in Hamilton. They gotta do something to help protect their property.

Let's see Rogers owns the Rogers Centre and Bell and the Kilmer Group don't own the Argonauts yet.

If the Jays make the playoffs this doesn't end well for the Argonauts.

How can they change the construction schedule if TFC is still playing? What if TFC makes the playoffs?

[Rich]

Let's see Rogers owns the Rogers Centre and Bell and the Kilmer Group don't own the Argonauts yet.

If the Jays make the playoffs this doesn't end well for the Argonauts.

How can they change the construction schedule if TFC is still playing? What if TFC makes the playoffs?

I'm just saying TanenBell should give the Argos more leverage. TanenBell makes a big announcement the Argos are moving to BMO for the last 4 games, breaking the Argos lease at Rogers. They'll squeeze onto the BMO field as is. The same press conference they announce the 2016 Grey Cup is coming to BMO, stealing some of Rogers thunder.

Whether TanenBell gets involved or not, they are impacted by what happens to the Argos in October. Only they could expedite the early move to BMO.

[ArgoZ]

All depends Paul. How much room will there be for endzones at this time. To the best of my knowledge the movable end zone seats that will be going in to BMO after this season will not be in place for October. So does that mean, 8 yard end zones? 10? Sorry, I would prefer to play in Varsity, and let as many people as possible stand on the opposite side of the bleachers. If it means fitting in 7,000 (5k in the grandstand and 2k on the open side), than IMO that is a better option than playing with half endzones, or a 100 yard field. At least the integrity of the game would still be there.

The endzones would be about 3 yards as it stands currently, or 8 if they played on a 100 yd field. A company that I frequently deal with was the low tender on the demolition of the stands and they are scheduled to be in there right after TFC finishes in October. I do not see any scenario that involves the Argos playing at BMO this year.

[Tobythor]

Maybe we could play at York University and keep the temp stands up after the Parapan games.

[AngeloV]

The endzones would be about 3 yards as it stands currently, or 8 if they played on a 100 yd field. A company that I frequently deal with was the low tender on the demolition of the stands and they are scheduled to be in there right after TFC finishes in October. I do not see any scenario that involves the Argos playing at BMO this year.

Thanks ArgoZ. That is exactly what I thought. There doesn't seem to be more than 5 yards currently beyond either goal line for soccer. I would seriously doubt the league would allow a game to take place on a 100 yard field or with end zones that small. I'm sure in any event the games would be played at the dome, but it could make for some team (be it the Argos or their opponents) to really get screwed and play a 2 game in 4 days scenario.

I really just can't wait until we are out of the dome.

[ArgoRavi]

Frank Zicarelli is reporting and Steve Milton tweeted that the Argos could be playing home games in Hamilton in October if the Jays make it to the MLB playoffs:

THE HAMILTON ARGOS?
HAMILTON — Tim Hortons Field served up a helping hand of CFL football holiday Monday as the Ticats ushered in their home opener against the Argos.
It was Toronto that helped open the building last Labour Day and it could very well play host to Argos home games in October.
As odd as it may sound, an Argos home game in the Hammer is a real possibility, especially with the red-hot Blue Jays moving into a tie for a wild-card berth.
There’s a lot of euphoria around the baseball team given the many big-time moves the franchise engineered prior to the trade deadline, playoff baseball likely to be in the air with a post-season run back in Toronto since the glory days of the back-to-back World Series titles.
In other words, the Argos need a place to play and there aren’t any CFL-ready venues in the GTA area, which is why Tim Hortons, the home of Ticats football, is very realistic.
In fact, some say negotiations have already begun, which seems logical in the wake of the Jays’ emergence, that will see the Argos play home games in Hamilton.
How many remains unclear, but the Argos have four home games in baseball’s traditional post-season month, beginning with a date against Ottawa on Oct. 4.
The Argos have been down this road before, but this year is different because the Jays are legitimate post-season threats and not some paper contender.
Being sold to new owners with a new place to call home next season has presented the Argos with some unique challenges in 2015, but this latest is almost hard to stomach.
It began with the Argos playing their season opener, a home game, in Alberta against the Eskimos in Fort McMurray, a game that drew flies.
The Argos are a tough sell at home, even in the best of times, but imagine how hard it will be to sell the Argos if they have to move to Hamilton.
There’s simply no place to play.
Toronto returns on Labour Day this season to the Hammer and play host to the Ticats at Rogers Centre on Sept. 11.
Dealing with distractions have been part of the Argos’ way for years and it almost seems fitting, poetic justice in some ways, that more has been piled on the franchise, even with so much to look forward to with engaged owners stepping in and a new playing home where fan-friendly dates and in-game experiences can be created.
But just the thought of the Hamilton Argos is one that’s hard to stomach.
Another alternative is Varsity Stadium, which has played host to the Argos in the past three pre-seasons, but it doesn’t seat many, meaning the Argos risk alienating their subscribers, who were felt betrayed when the Argos went to northern Alberta.



http://www.torontosun.com/2015/08/03/ticats-hammer-the-argos-in-hamilton

[jerrym]

When the Argos leave Rogers viper's nest, I'm going to throw a party.

[1argoholic]

Too bad that the Argonauts couldn't in someway have blocked The Jays from ever being welcome at CNE Stadium.I can't recall any ill will by any Argonaut fan or the team at the time. It was an exciting time in Toronto as was moving to Skydome. Now look at how corporate greed has tarnished things from an Argonaut perspective.

If we have to play in Hamilton I sure hope we can get our money refunded. NO way in hell will I be traveling from here to Hamilton. It's 2.5 hours just to get to Pearson when doing the speed limit. This year could really turn out to be a total shite show.

[AngeloV]

When the Argos leave Rogers viper's nest, I'm going to throw a party.

If there are strippers there, count me in.

:D

[argonaut11xx]

Now look at how corporate greed has tarnished things from an Argonaut perspective.

BULLSEYE.....thats why i dislike Rogers so much...TSN (bellmedia) always covers the Jays in a fair way, and is gushing over them now. Rogers media??..they are worse than Paul Godfrey, and thats almost pure EVIL.

[Neely2005]

Too bad that the Argonauts couldn't in someway have blocked The Jays from ever being welcome at CNE Stadium.I can't recall any ill will by any Argonaut fan or the team at the time. It was an exciting time in Toronto as was moving to Skydome. Now look at how corporate greed has tarnished things from an Argonaut perspective.

If we have to play in Hamilton I sure hope we can get our money refunded. NO way in hell will I be traveling from here to Hamilton. It's 2.5 hours just to get to Pearson when doing the speed limit. This year could really turn out to be a total shite show.

We may be able to make it to a game or two in Hamilton but no way can we make it to all 4.

We will want a refund option too.


BULLSEYE.....thats why i dislike Rogers so much...TSN (bellmedia) always covers the Jays in a fair way, and is gushing over them now. Rogers media??..they are worse than Paul Godfrey, and thats almost pure EVIL.

I was actually quite surprised when Rogers Sportsnet led with the CFL on their highlight show a few days ago.

[Argocister]

I was actually quite surprised when Rogers Sportsnet led with the CFL on their highlight show a few days ago.

Whaaaaaa? was that the Ticats win? like the Globe headlines telling of a Ticat win .... written by the hamilton reporter .... must be that the Hamilton audience is the Globes mainstay ( whats the sarcastic emoji? we need the small devil ! )

[Gill The Thrill]

It's not as if you have long homestands in the MLB playoffs like you do during the season. The Argo home date schedule was only changed once in 1993, and the Blue Jays have made the playoffs since moving into skydome 4 times.

1989 - Lost ALCS in 5 games to Oakland ( Jays had 3 home dates and affected 0 Argo home dates)
1991 - Lost ALCS in 5 games to Minnesota ( Jays had 3 home dates and affected 0 Argo home dates)
1992 - Jays won WS, Played 12 games total, including 6 at home. ( 0 Argo home games in conflict)
1993 - Jays won WS, and played 6 home games. (1 game affected, as a home date vs Calgary was moved because it conflicted with Game 6 of the World Series which was played on Saturday, October 23)

That Argo home date vs Calgary in 1993 was moved to Monday, October 25 @ 7pm. Even remember the ridiculous score...Flutie led Stampeders killed the Argos 55-7, and even remembered 2 faced Bob McCown mocking the Argos back then, and mentioning something about why they even bothered playing the game or why anyone would care?

This just 2 years after "bobcat" hosted a weekly Argo post-game show on 1430 CJCL, before they went to all sports. I wonder whose butt he was kissing in the organization to be willing to host that. I remember he was very low key and a matter of fact in just providing game stats and details. He even had some call-ins. It was not necessarily related to having McNall, Gretzky and Candy owning the team because I believe he hosted the same show in 1990 when Ornest was still the owner, but I could be wrong. I know for certain he hosted a low-key post-game Argo radio show in 1991 so it very well could've been McCown wanting to be in the company of McNall, Gretzky and Candy...maybe he wanted to brush up against some of the celebrities that were coming to Toronto for those games.

Also, IIRC, the Skydome conversion took only 1 day in 1993 as the Blue Jays hosted a World Series victory parade and get together immediately on Sunday, after winning the World Series (after the Joe Carter home run) on Saturday night because many players were itching to get outta town asap. They invited fans to the Skydome to hear victory speeches from players, management and even dignitaries (politicians) and this lasted until 4 pm or later on the Sunday between the last World Series game and the rescheduled Argo game.

If the Jays do have a long playoff run, there's basically a possible Wild Card home game which would be played on the Tuesday, October 6 date when the Argos are scheduled to play Ottawa. I could see this game being moved to Thursday, Oct 8 as TSN does not have a CFL game scheduled that day. The Jays would be starting a best of 5 ALDS on the road if they're playing in the WC game so this would be possible. If the Jays win the division, they may start an ALDS series at home on either the Wednesday or the Thursday. This may present a problem with the original scheduled Argo game on the Tuesday. Not as much with the Argos as they have a bye the previous but more for Ottawa who have a Thursday night home game on Oct 1st. I could see this game moving to Monday, Oct 5. It would reduce a days prep for Ottawa, but teams have played with 3 days rest plenty of times, especially when they do the Labour Day Monday and Friday rematch.

[ArgoRavi]

I recall two Argos home games being moved from Friday night to Sunday afternoon in 1985 (vs. Calgary and Montreal). I also thought that an Argos home game was affected in '89. They ended up playing Ottawa on Thanksgiving Monday afternoon but I believe that game was originally scheduled for another date. The biggest difference between now and the early 1990s is this supposed 3 day turnaround to convert the field from baseball to football. This why the Argos would be potentially greatly affected if the Jays make the playoffs and are in there for any length of time.

[Gill The Thrill]

Don't remember any other game rescheduled, especially in 1985 which saw the Jays host ALCS games 1,2,6 and 7 on consecutive tuesdays and Wednesdays as they played in KC in the weekend.

The 3 day turnaround is complete BS...That's just Rogers Centre not wanting to bring in the manpower. It's just a matter pf pressing a button or lever to move the 100 level seating configuration to the rectangular Football/Soccer shape and then folding or moving those rows of seats in or out of the way. Yah, they may have to roll on a field or re-paint lines but this could easily be done in a day. If moving seats on a track or on wheels is that much of a chore...high school and University gymnasiums would be closed for days just to host a game with their portable bleachers, yet 4 people is sufficient to roll down those stands, some of them as high as 10-15 rows of bleachers. Surely the Rogers Centre has more than 4 people in a conversion team, but who knows the way they run that place?

Remember playoff homestands in the MLB playoffs are either 2 days or 3 days. Teams are either hosting games 1,2, and 5 in the ALDS or hosting Games 3, and 4. In the LCS and World Series, they're either hosting two 2 game homestands; Games 1,2 and then games 6,and 7 or hosting one 3 game homestand hosting games 3,4 and 5. Remember they don't play every day in the baseball playoffs as they have travel days off between cities and venues. Baseball also schedules their playoffs so that no 2 playoff games are scheduled at the same start time for TV broadcasters. This means Weekend homestands are altered to Friday, Saturday and Sunday, or Saturday, Sunday and Monday.

It's not as if Baseball and Football never shared venues. It was common place in the 70's and 80's. I've never remember the Pirates, Phillies or the Big Red Machine and Oakland A's kicking out their NFL teams for 2 weeks because they were winning World Series in Stadiums that were used for Football and Baseball. Is the Argo contract that bad, where they could be kicked out on a whim...mind you I never remember another team having to move a playoff date for the Wiggles.:o

[gilthethrill]

The 3 day turnaround is complete BS...That's just Rogers Centre not wanting to bring in the manpower. It's just a matter pf pressing a button or lever to move the 100 level seating configuration to the rectangular Football/Soccer shape and then folding or moving those rows of seats in or out of the way. Yah, they may have to roll on a field or re-paint lines but this could easily done in a day. If moving seats on a track or on wheels is that much of a chore...high school and University gymnasiums would be closed for days just to host a game with their portable bleachers, yet 4 people is sufficient to roll down those stands, some of them as high as 10-15 rows of bleachers. Surely the Rogers Centre has more that 4 people in a conversion team, but who knows the way they run that place?

I also strongly suspect that Rogers crews don't get started on the field conversion right away either.

[argofandave]

I recall two Argos home games being moved from Friday night to Sunday afternoon in 1985 (vs. Calgary and Montreal). I also thought that an Argos home game was affected in '89. They ended up playing Ottawa on Thanksgiving Monday afternoon but I believe that game was originally scheduled for another date. The biggest difference between now and the early 1990s is this supposed 3 day turnaround to convert the field from baseball to football. This why the Argos would be potentially greatly affected if the Jays make the playoffs and are in there for any length of time.

The Argo game vs. Ottawa in 1989 was originally scheduled for Saturday October 7th but was moved to Monday October 9th. The Argos and Jays shared the same turf back then which made converting the field a lot faster.

[Gill The Thrill]

I recall two Argos home games being moved from Friday night to Sunday afternoon in 1985 (vs. Calgary and Montreal). I also thought that an Argos home game was affected in '89. They ended up playing Ottawa on Thanksgiving Monday afternoon but I believe that game was originally scheduled for another date. You're right about 1989...IIRC that Argo game went a little better than the rescheduled '93 game as they trounced a bad Ottawa Rough Riders team. That was the ill-fated last year of Obie which saw the Argos really end badly at 7-11 and losing to the Lee Saltz led Winnipeg Blue Bombers 30-7 in East Semi-Final...yikes, maybe they should have taken the hint and left Skydome them..lol. Although they've won more Grey Cups playing at the dome than they did at the CNE. That re-scheduled Ottawa game may have been there last good game of that '89 season. I remember them getting trounced in the final week at IvorWynne, 45-14, a day which saw Rocky Di Pietro break what was the all-time receptions record.

That turnaround also took one day as the Jays hosted Games 3-5 of that ALCS on Fri, Sat and Sunday when they were eliminated. Geez...I can still see that Jose Canseco HR in Game 4 on the Saturday land in the 500 level. He was the first to do that.

[paulwoods13]

If the Jays do have a long playoff run, there's basically a possible Wild Card home game which would be played on the Tuesday, October 6 date when the Argos are scheduled to play Ottawa. I could see this game being moved to Thursday, Oct 8 as TSN does not have a CFL game scheduled that day. The Jays would be starting a best of 5 ALDS on the road if they're playing in the WC game so this would be possible. If the Jays win the division, they may start an ALDS series at home on either the Wednesday or the Thursday. This may present a problem with the original scheduled Argo game on the Tuesday. Not as much with the Argos as they have a bye the previous but more for Ottawa who have a Thursday night home game on Oct 1st. I could see this game moving to Monday, Oct 5. It would reduce a days prep for Ottawa, but teams have played with 3 days rest plenty of times, especially when they do the Labour Day Monday and Friday rematch.

Moving to Thursday, Oct. 8, would mean two Argo games in five days as we play the following Monday in Montreal. Not ideal, but potentially doable. But that would require the field to be converted in under 48 hours and I'm not sure that is something Rogers would be prepared to do, if it is in fact still doable. I share your skepticism about how much time it should really take, but I'm not basing it on any knowledge of what's actually involved these days. I am pretty sure the turf doesn't just roll up the way the old hard stuff used to.

[AngeloV]

Moving to Thursday, Oct. 8, would mean two Argo games in five days as we play the following Monday in Montreal. Not ideal, but potentially doable. But that would require the field to be converted in under 48 hours and I'm not sure that is something Rogers would be prepared to do,

Pretty sure Rogers has stated that 36 hours is required. That is why the Argos can only play at home if there is no event the day before or the day after.

[Argo57]

Pretty sure Rogers has stated that 36 hours is required. That is why the Argos can only play at home if there is no event the day before or the day after.

Rogers have no interest in accommodating the Argos, so 36 hours is it, looking forward to Gods team and 16x World Champion Toronto Argonauts leaving the concrete mausoleum and moving to their new digs next season, that thought makes all the BS this season seem quite palatable.

[AngeloV]

On tonight's pre game show, Naylor mentioned the Argos are looking at a possible Varsity stadium schedule should the Blue Jays make the playoffs. It wouldn't be ideal, but I would be 100% fine with it. Better than playing in Hamilton with more fans against them than for them.

[Neely2005]

On tonight's pre game show, Naylor mentioned the Argos are looking at a possible Varsity stadium schedule should the Blue Jays make the playoffs. It wouldn't be ideal, but I would be 100% fine with it. Better than playing in Hamilton with more fans against them than for them.

Both options suck. I'm not sure which one is worse.

[Argocister]

?........ looking forward to Gods team and 16x World Champion Toronto Argonauts leaving the concrete mausoleum and moving ...........

Gods team :D.

Where's that like button!

[Downtownfan]

As they say, it is always darkest before the dawn: This year will be very difficult for the Argos given the lack of marketing, lame-duck ownership, crappy dates/moved dates, and ongoing hatred/ignoring by the local media against the team, not to mention the Jays upswing. But we know that we have a good thing going on the football operations side of things, and the team is doing well, despite all these challenges. We're just going to have to grin and bear it, and count on the fact that next year we will have much, much better dates, a much better venue, an active and engaged ownership, a new president who has a good grasp on what needs to get done, and hopefully a revitalized fan base and a great game day experience.

[paulwoods13]

As they say, it is always darkest before the dawn: This year will be very difficult for the Argos given the lack of marketing, lame-duck ownership, crappy dates/moved dates, and ongoing hatred/ignoring by the local media against the team, not to mention the Jays upswing. But we know that we have a good thing going on the football operations side of things, and the team is doing well, despite all these challenges. We're just going to have to grin and bear it, and count on the fact that next year we will have much, much better dates, a much better venue, an active and engaged ownership, a new president who has a good grasp on what needs to get done, and hopefully a revitalized fan base and a great game day experience.

What he said!

[Argo57]

As they say, it is always darkest before the dawn: This year will be very difficult for the Argos given the lack of marketing, lame-duck ownership, crappy dates/moved dates, and ongoing hatred/ignoring by the local media against the team, not to mention the Jays upswing. But we know that we have a good thing going on the football operations side of things, and the team is doing well, despite all these challenges. We're just going to have to grin and bear it, and count on the fact that next year we will have much, much better dates, a much better venue, an active and engaged ownership, a new president who has a good grasp on what needs to get done, and hopefully a revitalized fan base and a great game day experience.

Two thumbs up.
Better days ahead!!

[ArgoRavi]

As they say, it is always darkest before the dawn: This year will be very difficult for the Argos given the lack of marketing, lame-duck ownership, crappy dates/moved dates, and ongoing hatred/ignoring by the local media against the team, not to mention the Jays upswing. But we know that we have a good thing going on the football operations side of things, and the team is doing well, despite all these challenges. We're just going to have to grin and bear it, and count on the fact that next year we will have much, much better dates, a much better venue, an active and engaged ownership, a new president who has a good grasp on what needs to get done, and hopefully a revitalized fan base and a great game day experience.

Well said! We all knew that this year would be a challenge off the field but there are better times ahead.

[argofan81]

Frank Zicarelli is reporting and Steve Milton tweeted that the Argos could be playing home games in Hamilton in October if the Jays make it to the MLB playoffs:

THE HAMILTON ARGOS?
HAMILTON — Tim Hortons Field served up a helping hand of CFL football holiday Monday as the Ticats ushered in their home opener against the Argos.
It was Toronto that helped open the building last Labour Day and it could very well play host to Argos home games in October.
As odd as it may sound, an Argos home game in the Hammer is a real possibility, especially with the red-hot Blue Jays moving into a tie for a wild-card berth.
There’s a lot of euphoria around the baseball team given the many big-time moves the franchise engineered prior to the trade deadline, playoff baseball likely to be in the air with a post-season run back in Toronto since the glory days of the back-to-back World Series titles.
In other words, the Argos need a place to play and there aren’t any CFL-ready venues in the GTA area, which is why Tim Hortons, the home of Ticats football, is very realistic.
In fact, some say negotiations have already begun, which seems logical in the wake of the Jays’ emergence, that will see the Argos play home games in Hamilton.
How many remains unclear, but the Argos have four home games in baseball’s traditional post-season month, beginning with a date against Ottawa on Oct. 4.
The Argos have been down this road before, but this year is different because the Jays are legitimate post-season threats and not some paper contender.
Being sold to new owners with a new place to call home next season has presented the Argos with some unique challenges in 2015, but this latest is almost hard to stomach.
It began with the Argos playing their season opener, a home game, in Alberta against the Eskimos in Fort McMurray, a game that drew flies.
The Argos are a tough sell at home, even in the best of times, but imagine how hard it will be to sell the Argos if they have to move to Hamilton.
There’s simply no place to play.
Toronto returns on Labour Day this season to the Hammer and play host to the Ticats at Rogers Centre on Sept. 11.
Dealing with distractions have been part of the Argos’ way for years and it almost seems fitting, poetic justice in some ways, that more has been piled on the franchise, even with so much to look forward to with engaged owners stepping in and a new playing home where fan-friendly dates and in-game experiences can be created.
But just the thought of the Hamilton Argos is one that’s hard to stomach.
Another alternative is Varsity Stadium, which has played host to the Argos in the past three pre-seasons, but it doesn’t seat many, meaning the Argos risk alienating their subscribers, who were felt betrayed when the Argos went to northern Alberta.



http://www.torontosun.com/2015/08/03/ticats-hammer-the-argos-in-hamilton

An article in today's Sun is reporting that both Tim Horton's Field and Varsity Stadium have refused to accommodate the Argos in October should the Jays make the playoffs. Alternative suggestions were Oshawa or having to play our home games out west (i.e. Fort McMurray).

[Gill The Thrill]

Centennial Stadium in Etobicoke, Birchmount Stadium in Scarborough, or North York's Esther Shiner Stadium, which for years was known as Civic Stadium would all need temporary bleachers, but it is possible. York Stadium may be another venue.

York would be a great option if the subway station was open, but it isn't. Of the other 3 options, Birchmount Stadium would have the best access. As it would require a short bus ride taking the Birchmount or Warden Bus South from Warden Station from the Bloor-Danforth Subway line. I don't think the bus ride from Kipling Station out to Centennial in Etobicoke is that quick or direct, and Esther Shiner is near Finch and Bathurst which would require a bus ride from Finch Station at Yonge/Finch to Bathurst and Finch. These are all municipally owned venues other than York. Centennial is beside a park, while Birchmount and Esther Shiner are beside high schools.

Believe it or not, I think Birchmount would be the best as the TTC bus drops you off right in front of the Arena/Stadium and Community Centre. There is also tons of open space that may be utilized for parking and temporary bleachers that could hold at least 12,000 spectators around the field...All these places mentioned have field turf with painted football lines. Centennial may also have room around the field for these bleachers, and so would York which would require sharing the facility with the York Lions.

[paulwoods13]

An article in today's Sun is reporting that both Tim Horton's Field and Varsity Stadium have refused to accommodate the Argos in October should the Jays make the playoffs. Alternative suggestions were Oshawa or having to play our home games out west (i.e. Fort McMurray).

Here is link to FZ's latest.

http://www.torontosun.com/2015/08/15/argos-rally-to-victory-against-bombers

Notice no attribution anywhere. Just indefinite words like "it now appears," "that was the word," "there's talk of" and "by all accounts". Actually there have been no on-the-record accounts. If FZ has been told something by someone in position to know, his stories should say so. Otherwise why should we assume he's in the know and not just speculating?

[Gill The Thrill]

Here is link to FZ's latest.

http://www.torontosun.com/2015/08/15/argos-rally-to-victory-against-bombers

Notice no attribution anywhere. Just indefinite words like "it now appears," "that was the word," "there's talk of" and "by all accounts". Actually there have been no on-the-record accounts. If FZ has been told something by someone in position to know, his stories should say so. Otherwise why should we assume he's in the know and not just speculating?

Why would he make it up Paul? Lay off FZ, he's the only guy in the Toronto media that does cover the team on an almost daily, if not daily basis, so that sounds like a legitimate reason to assume that he's in the know. He's around the team and doesn't just throw darts from afar or from a radio station microphone like others do.

I just find it funny that people criticize the coverage that this team gets, but then criticize the coverage from the one guy who's consistently on the Argo beat. FZ's analysis have been quite good this year, and so have his pre-game predictions which would indicate he's watching the games and knows what he's talking about. Remember the article is predominantly on the Argos-Bombers game on Friday. Perhaps his editor may have chopped off the more in-depth info and attribution for possible stadium conflicts because they have to fit in another ad, another Blue Jays article or NFL training camp story.

[paulwoods13]

Why would he make it up Paul? Lay off FZ, he's the only guy in the Toronto media that does cover the team on an almost daily, if not daily basis, so that sounds like a legitimate reason to assume that he's in the know. He's around the team and doesn't just throw darts from afar or from a radio station microphone like others do.

I just find it funny that people criticize the coverage that this team gets, but then criticize the coverage from the one guy who's consistently on the Argo beat. FZ's analysis have been quite good this year, and so have his pre-game predictions which would indicate he's watching the games and knows what he's talking about. Remember the article is predominantly on the Argos-Bombers game on Friday. Perhaps his editor may have chopped off the more in-depth info and attribution for possible stadium conflicts because they have to fit in another ad, another Blue Jays article or NFL training camp story.

For the record there were two stories in the paper, one on the game and a shorter one on the stadium. There were no ads on the page, and no stories about the Blue Jays or the NFL. The two stories were combined into a single posting on the web; that's just a matter of convenience for posting purposes.

The mere fact of being around the team most days does not make someone "in the know," unfortunately. I'm not saying he "made it up" -- I'm saying the lack of attribution and the indefinite, imprecise words he used do not make me inclined to believe that THF and Varsity are out of the question. If he had an actual scoop, why not report it as such. Even an imprecise "sources say" would lend more credence than "it now appears," "that was the word," "there's talk of" and "by all accounts". I'm not assuming THF and Varsity are out until someone connected with the team says so on the record.

[Neely2005]

An article in today's Sun is reporting that both Tim Horton's Field and Varsity Stadium have refused to accommodate the Argos in October should the Jays make the playoffs. Alternative suggestions were Oshawa or having to play our home games out west (i.e. Fort McMurray).

Why would THF refuse the extra revenue?

[ArgoRavi]

Why would THF refuse the extra revenue?

That doesn't make sense to me either, Neely.

[Gill The Thrill]

For the record there were two stories in the paper, one on the game and a shorter one on the stadium. There were no ads on the page, and no stories about the Blue Jays or the NFL. The two stories were combined into a single posting on the web; that's just a matter of convenience for posting purposes.

The mere fact of being around the team most days does not make someone "in the know," unfortunately. I'm not saying he "made it up" -- I'm saying the lack of attribution and the indefinite, imprecise words he used do not make me inclined to believe that THF and Varsity are out of the question. If he had an actual scoop, why not report it as such. Even an imprecise "sources say" would lend more credence than "it now appears," "that was the word," "there's talk of" and "by all accounts". I'm not assuming THF and Varsity are out until someone connected with the team says so on the record.There may have been no story on the Jays or an NFL training camp on that same page, but who limits FZ to that page only, the editor. I highly doubt, although I have not seen a hard copy of yesterday's paper that there was neither a story or 2 or 3 at least on the Blue Jays, (justified in a pennant race) and one on some NFL training camp, maybe even more than one. (a Bills article justified, but a training camp update from AP on a battle for 2nd and 3rd string QB on a team based a 1,000 miles away is not justified over more Argo coverage imo)

Perhaps FZ is using those terminologies because the Argos are still hopeful of coming up with those resolutions and have been met with more resistance than anticipated. Don't like the THF in Hamilton resolution, and if Varsity and Uof T is giving them a hassle, they better deal with with the City of Toronto Parks and Recreation Department and look at the stadiums that I've mentioned previously which could work temporarily should they need the contingency plan and be locked out of the Rogers Centre because of MLB playoffs.

[Gill The Thrill]

Why would THF refuse the extra revenue?

Perhaps it's a neighborhood issue in that the city has agreed that the local residential community where Tim Hortons Field sits cannot have too many events within close proximity interrupting their day to day living. Don't know for sure, but sounds like a reason why they may object to hosting this many extra football games. (Up to 4 potentially)

[1argoholic]

If we need to change stadiums and it's not going to be in Toronto I want a refund for sure. Times and scheduled days are one thing but out west or in Hamilton is screwed for us personally. If so this would be some final season in what has become the Rogers Shit Pit!
To think that Argo fans so were pumped about getting Skydome and now look at things this many years later. Go Yanks Go!!!!!

[Gill The Thrill]

If we need to change stadiums and it's not going to be in Toronto I want a refund for sure. Times and scheduled days are one thing but out west or in Hamilton is screwed for us personally. If so this would be some final season in what has become the Rogers Shit Pit!
To think that Argo fans so were pumped about getting Skydome and now look at things this many years later. Go Yanks Go!!!!!Go Yanks Go...so you're a traditionalist baseball fan...lol

All kidding aside, if you're coming from Douro which I've been too, that would be a ridiculous drive for you to get to Hamilton, especially on a weeknight. The Argo organization would be wise to give you a prorated refund and keep your loyalty. I certainly hope they don't dick around with you or any season ticket subscribers. I even think they should offer refunds if they need to switch stadiums even within Toronto because it could be tricky for Durham subsrcibers to get to Etobicoke or for Peel Region subscribers to get to Scarborough. A lot of Argo fans would tough it out and keep thier tickets, but some would have legitimate concerns.

I'd almost be curious to see the Argos out of the dome and in a smaller environment even with portable bleachers instead of seeing them at their step-landlords at Rogers Centre. I know someone who wasn't an Argo fan who went to Varsity Stadium for the pre-season game and they enjoyed themselves and the atmosphere. I've also meet people who've mentioned that they'd check out an Argo game when they move to BMO, but don't go to watch them at the dome. So this move out of Rogers Centre is being anticipated and is viewed as positive based on my anectodal evidence. Perhaps it may be sooner than expected, but it may give us a preview of the atsmosphere we may expect at BMO.

[paulwoods13]

Centennial Stadium in Etobicoke, Birchmount Stadium in Scarborough, or North York's Esther Shiner Stadium, which for years was known as Civic Stadium would all need temporary bleachers, but it is possible. York Stadium may be another venue.

They would need a lot more than temporary bleachers. Locker rooms, press box, sufficient power and lighting for a broadcast, enough bathrooms, parking, etc. I cannot believe the CFL would subject itself to playing at stadiums that are akin to high school facilities. I think we'll be in Guelph before we are in Centennial or Birchmount.

[Gill The Thrill]

They would need a lot more than temporary bleachers. Locker rooms, press box, sufficient power and lighting for a broadcast, enough bathrooms, parking, etc. I cannot believe the CFL would subject itself to playing at stadiums that are akin to high school facilities. I think we'll be in Guelph before we are in Centennial or Birchmount.

Perhaps, but why would they not look at York University before looking 95 km away at Alumni Stadium in Guelph.
The Argos are really not in a position to demand rebuilt locker room amenities for such a temporary situation.

As for the CFL, this is the same league, albeit 20 years ago now that boasted Hornet Field as a home field for the Sacramento Goldminers that used porta-potties for bathrooms. Not just that they used them, they were visible in the corner of the endzones during the TV broadcast. Who would've known that a fan on their way to the bathroom could be witnessed by a North American TV audience?:o:sick::D I believe Centennial Stadium in Etobicoke was extensively renovated for the Pan-Am Games. I have not seen the improvements and renovations but it was pretty run down prior to being closed last summer for the renovations.

[paulwoods13]

Yeah, what was good for the league in 1993 is clearly good for it now as well.

Maybe they will look at York, certainly they should do so over Birchmount, etc. At least there are locker rooms there, but does it have adequate lighting for TV? Guelph does.

[AngeloV]

I really don't get the love on here for Frank Z. Some people on here seem to think it's his choice to go and write on the Argos. It's just an assignment from his bosses, plain and simple. I don't think it was his first choice of assignment.

I was at practice last Tuesday, and Frank didn't show up to that practice until there was about 5 minutes left, just in time to join in for Milanovich's post practice comments. Other times, I've witnessed him sitting by himself reading while practice is going on. How are we supposed to take a report on practice seriously when he wasn't even there to witness it?

I really think that some of us are so hungry for Argo news, that we tend to overlook quality just because a certain guy has been assigned to cover them.

[Will]

I've said on here before, but you really get the feeling that Drew Edwards has integrated himself with the team he writes for and that he treats it as more than just an assignment. While I don't necessarily dislike the job the Argo beat reporters do, I don't get the sense that, as Angelo says, it is anything more than an assignment.

[Argocister]

So couple thoughts on this thread that is all over the map ......
I like Rushs articles over Franks .... My husband heard Frank the other day and thought it was
Rick Moranis .... Giggle ... For those remembering second city

As to stadiums ..... Guelph may be a good alternative but I'm not sure how fast expanded seating can be placed. A series of buses to Guelph would make it a fun expedition . 1 argoholic, if it's in Guelph I'll make sure you and your wife have a room for the night.
I would think York would be the better alternative. Same problem with the expanded seating but at least the team is used to the surroundings. .... Some type of home field advantage.

I like that term ..... rogers shitpit.....😀

[ArgoRavi]

I've said on here before, but you really get the feeling that Drew Edwards has integrated himself with the team he writes for and that he treats it as more than just an assignment. While I don't necessarily dislike the job the Argo beat reporters do, I don't get the sense that, as Angelo says, it is anything more than an assignment.

I would think that this is a good assignment for Curtis Rush given his football background. Other than him though, you would have to go back to Perry Lefko and Rick Matsumoto for guys who had a much better understanding of the game and who could write quite knowledgeably about it.

As I have mentioned elsewhere, it would be great to see columnists writing again about the Argos someday soon. Bruce Arthur and Steve Simmons even get paycheques from Bell but neither has analyzed an Argos game in eons. I sure miss the days of Proudfoot, Dunnell, Hunt, Frayne, etc., etc.

[Gill The Thrill]

Yeah, what was good for the league in 1993 is clearly good for it now as well.

Maybe they will look at York, certainly they should do so over Birchmount, etc. At least there are locker rooms there, but does it have adequate lighting for TV? Guelph does.I'm sure there is adequate lighting as TSN in its' days when it produced more CIS football programming throughout the years televised games from York Stadium. This was before they were bought out by ESPN. I remember they got pounded by Western on national TV...come to think of it, it's probably as far back as 1990. Sadly, TSN cut down it Canadian University Football coverage even before ESPN bought them and sadly Rogers has the broadcast rights and basically chooses not to produce any decent football coverage for any part of the regular season. CIS football is now in limbo when it comes to broadcast coverage but that's a whole other topic.

Just to reiterate, York does have adequate lighting. We got to wonder if BMO has enough lighting for football, or will they add lighting along the sidelines above the roof of the stands like the grandstand at CNE used to have and what most North American football stadiums have. Presently, BMO has a European soccer stadium style with only 4 light standards located in the corners of the stadium. (one on each corner) Will this be enough lighting for high punts and passes to be seen throughout the stadium up to and including the end zones which have not been built...just wondering.


I really don't get the love on here for Frank Z. Some people on here seem to think it's his choice to go and write on the Argos. It's just an assignment from his bosses, plain and simple. I don't think it was his first choice of assignment.

I was at practice last Tuesday, and Frank didn't show up to that practice until there was about 5 minutes left, just in time to join in for Milanovich's post practice comments. Other times, I've witnessed him sitting by himself reading while practice is going on. How are we supposed to take a report on practice seriously when he wasn't even there to witness it?

I really think that some of us are so hungry for Argo news, that we tend to overlook quality just because a certain guy has been assigned to cover them.Absolutely baseless argument. Do you know FZ? How do you come up with such a conclusion based on one practice and should we even assume that you're an authority based on your criteria. You may be at the practice, but do you actually know what you're watching or even talking about...not saying you don't, but just saying.

FZ has prognosticated every game correctly save for week 1 vs Edmonton in Fort Mac. Everybody predicted the Argos to lose that one because of the travel, no Ricky Ray and so forth. He's correctly predicted both road losses to Calgary and Hamilton and was damn near close in predicting the exact scores. I think that proves that FZ's coverage has some merit. Whether you choose to believe it or accept it is up to you, I don't care, and I'm probably sure that Frank doesn't care about your opinion. The Toronto Sun is the top sports newspaper in Toronto and FZ is the Argos beat reporter, that's fact. I don't have a love on as you say for FZ, but he's the most consistent newspaper reporter from the newspaper which has consistently covered the Toronto Argonauts and the CFL better than any other in this town for a long time.

Now that's being objective, not basing my fact on hearing how a guy sounds and stereotyping them on that...Heck, Perry Lefko used to trip on his words all the time talking to Jim Tatti on Sportsline back in the 90's. It didn't mean that he didn't know what he was saying, it just told me that he was newspaper guy not used to speaking in front of a camera.

Yah, his game summaries may come across as negative to some who think you can't criticize the Argos or the league, but if it's fact in that there were many flags thrown with no flow such as last Saturday's game, then so be it. That's called accurate coverage as that was a shite game until the 4th quarter. He compliments great plays and mentions great performances, but just because he's not necessarily a team shill it doesn't mean he does not like the game and that he's writing that because his boss won't let him cover the Jays. I remember Pat Marsden, who was one of the league's biggest proponents back when CTV televised CFL games was also one of it's harshest critics when he felt a league decision or Argo team decision merited such a critique. Same with Marty York...the league wishes they could buy that kind of attention and care from many in the media nowadays.

[mchesher03]

I really don't get the love on here for Frank Z. Some people on here seem to think it's his choice to go and write on the Argos. It's just an assignment from his bosses, plain and simple. I don't think it was his first choice of assignment.

I was at practice last Tuesday, and Frank didn't show up to that practice until there was about 5 minutes left, just in time to join in for Milanovich's post practice comments. Other times, I've witnessed him sitting by himself reading while practice is going on. How are we supposed to take a report on practice seriously when he wasn't even there to witness it?

I really think that some of us are so hungry for Argo news, that we tend to overlook quality just because a certain guy has been assigned to cover them.

no i'm on the same page angelo - i myself could write the same articles as frank and I don't pretend to be an expert in the least (in fact if i was paid to cover the team, i'd hope I knew a LOT more). Agree with Drew Edwards in Hamilton though - I follow him on twitter and read his articles b/c they are good plain and simple.

[paulwoods13]

I'm sure there is adequate lighting as TSN in its' days when it produced more CIS football programming throughout the years televised games from York Stadium.

York actually has a different stadium than it did when TSN was showing games (and I am suspect TSN never televised a night game from there) so I am not as sure as you are that the lighting is up to broadcast standards. One would think a new stadium would have it, but I just don't know that for a fact.

[AngeloV]

no i'm on the same page angelo - i myself could write the same articles as frank and I don't pretend to be an expert in the least (in fact if i was paid to cover the team, i'd hope I knew a LOT more). Agree with Drew Edwards in Hamilton though - I follow him on twitter and read his articles b/c they are good plain and simple.

Edwards is great. Does Frank even tweet on the Argos? Or would that be considered going above and beyond in his world? At least Rush tweets on them, but sadly the Star doesn't assign him as often as they should on the Argos. He was covering table tennis during the Pan Am games, and not covering the Argos.




FZ has prognosticated every game correctly save for week 1 vs Edmonton in Fort Mac. Everybody predicted the Argos to lose that one because of the travel, no Ricky Ray and so forth. He's correctly predicted both road losses to Calgary and Hamilton and was damn near close in predicting the exact scores. I think that proves that FZ's coverage has some merit.

Surely you can't be serious? Your basing his knowledge on the fact that he is pretty good at picking the winner on a 50/50 chance? OK, more power to you and him, I guess.

I don't know if you've ever played in an office pool, but I can assure you, quite often the winners can't name more than a player or two on any team.

[Gill The Thrill]

York actually has a different stadium than it did when TSN was showing games (and I am suspect TSN never televised a night game from there) so I am not as sure as you are that the lighting is up to broadcast standards. One would think a new stadium would have it, but I just don't know that for a fact.It was the present stadium that they are in now, beside the multiplex arena and their old single pad ice arena, as well as beside some practice fields.(tons of room for temporary bleachers as the stadium is fenced off) It can be seen off Steeles Ave on the north side of the campus and was new at that time.

Prior to that stadium, the York Yeoman, as they were in those days played off campus at North York Civic Stadium on Bathurst St, just north of Finch. It's presently called Esther Shiner Stadium and is another one of the stadiums that I had previously mentioned as it has a Canadian Football Field. A lot of minor football and high school is played in that stadium as well as soccer. It's municipally owned and run with field turf.

Anyway let's hope that they won't be that inconvenianced. I hope the Jays win the division as they end the season on the road...that Oct 6 game Argo game is the next day, so they can have time to changeover the field. I honestly can't see the Jays finishing out of the playoffs or even finishing in the 2nd wild card spot. If they don't clinch the AL East, then that Oct 6 game will definitely be moved.

Lastly, haven't the Argos got any rights as far as the contractual lease goes or can they just be kicked out.


Surely you can't be serious? Your basing his knowledge on the fact that he is pretty good at picking the winner on a 50/50 chance? OK, more power to you and him, I guess.

I don't know if you've ever played in an office pool, but I can assure you, quite often the winners can't name more than a player or two on any team.Did I say I'm basing his knowledge on picking just the winners...I'm basing SOME OF it on the accuracy of the scores, spreads and the teams, not picking some random card at a table at a Super Bowl party. If you find that the person winning your office pool tends to not know much about players on any teams, then that might be an indicator of the rest of the so called experts in your pool. I know it can happen, but it's usually not the case.

His articles are not pulitzer prize articles, but they're not that bad. I just think you're being rather elitist, and I really have to be quite honest...I think you have no reason to be, especially if those office pool wins are based on your anectodal evidence.

If you don't like a guy for whatever reason, just say I don't like a guy, at least you're being honest. Anyways we're entitled to have different opinions on many things and I will defend you're right to have that. I know that FZ is the newspaper reporter following the Argos for the Toronto Sun and it beats having nobody doing it. It's not like he's tearing down the league and telling fans not to watch or care and rip up their tickets as Steve Simmons did back in 1988, let alone on the reporters. I've never heard Bruce Arthur provide wonderful insight about Canadian Football on the reporters, whether he has in the past, maybe, but I don't necessarily remember which might be an indicator as I've followed this league for a long time when I think about it.

to end this on a comedic note... or as Bobby Bitman and Leslie Neilson would say respectively, "As a comedian in all seriousness" ..."don't call me surely."

[ArgoRavi]

Lastly, haven't the Argos got any rights as far as the contractual lease goes or can they just be kicked out.

I don't believe that the Argos have any rights at all, Gill. In other words, I am pretty sure that they can just be kicked out for any game if there is a conflict with the Jays or some other event that the Rogers folks deem to be more important.

[Gill The Thrill]

I don't believe that the Argos have any rights at all, Gill. In other words, I am pretty sure that they can just be kicked out for any game if there is a conflict with the Jays or some other event that the Rogers folks deem to be more important.

That C&S lease agreement is going to haunt this Argo organization until the very last friggin day they stay in that upside down toilet dome. I can't believe it...but then again I can. It's almost as if the Argos should just suspend operations this year and give the East to Hamilton with all this uncertainty. Very frustrating that the organization has put themselves in these marginal situations throughout their tenure at the dome.

Can't wait till they get out of there as I've been advocating that for over a decade since the Wiggles incident. It better not be the same situation with TFC at BMO. Do you know that the MLS stupidly plays games until late October and that their championship and playoffs are in November? Wonderful soccer weather in Toronto, Montreal, New England and Columbus. (Soccer is not meant to be played in frozen weather, unlike gridiron football, games are cancelled if the field is frozen) It's not unusual that their championship game is held on the same Sunday or the Sunday before the Grey Cup game is played. I know a soccer schedule is similar to football and not as daily or monotonous as a baseball schedule, but I don't want to hear about this conflict crap anymore after this year.

[R.J]

I could be completely wrong about this, but for some reason I remember either hearing or reading about how only 1 date would have to be given up by the Argonauts in October.
Weirdest thing about the whole situation was the dome was rarely used during the pan ams, why couldn't the Argonauts get one or two games during that period ?
Would have solved a lot of issues.