October 10, 2014: Hamilton Tiger-Cats vs. Toronto Argonauts

[T-Bone]

http://cfl.assets.mrx.ca/shared/sked_blocks_logos/2012_2/2012_schedule_default2/ham.png vs. http://cfl.assets.mrx.ca/shared/sked_blocks_logos/2012_2/2012_schedule_default2/tor.png

Week 16
Friday, October 10, 2014 at 7:00pm EDT.
Rogers Centre. Toronto, ON.

TV: TSN (http://www.tsn.ca/cfl-on-tsn-broadcast-schedule-1.78723)
Video Webcast: TSN Go (http://www.tsn.ca/tv#/) - ESPN3 (http://espn.go.com/watchespn/index/_/type/upcoming/sport/football/search/CFL/)
Radio: HAM: CHML 900 (http://www.900chml.com/ticatsnation/)/Y108 ROCKS (http://www.y108.ca/) - TOR: TSN 1050 (http://www.tsn.ca/argos-on-tsn-1050-broadcast-schedule-1.84907)
Audio Webcast: HAM: Here (http://player.900chml.com/) - TOR: Here (http://www.tsn.ca/radio/tsn-1050-live-stream-1.52945?ot=example.AjaxPageLayout.ot)
Satellite Radio: SiriusXM (http://www.cfl.ca/article/siriusxm-canada-and-cfl-renew-multi-year-broadcast-agreement)

Depth Charts: HAM: Here (http://www.ticats.ca/page/2014-depth-charts-game-notes-stats) - TOR: Here (http://www.argonauts.ca/depthchart/list/team/7/year/2014)

Pre-Game Preview: Here (http://www.argonauts.ca/video/index/id/104091)

Post-Game: Shoeless Joe's (http://www.shoelessjoes.ca/) at 276 King St W (https://maps.google.ca/maps?q=276+King+St.+W.&hnear=276+King+St+W,+Toronto,+Toronto+Division,+On tario+M5V+3C6&gl=ca&t=m&z=16)

515

Tickets Available: Here (http://www.argonauts.ca/page/toronto-argonauts-tickets) or at Rogers Centre Gate 9 Box Office (http://www.rogerscentre.com/events/tickets.jsp)

516

Post-Game Update: Argos Come Back From 17 Point Deficit to Shock Ti-Cats (http://argonauts.ca/article/recap-argos-vs-ticats-2014)

Final Score: 33-34

[Will]

Obviously the most important game of the season to date as the Argos can tie the Tiger-Cats for first place with a victory. Hamilton's defense has been playing very, very, very well since Labour Day and that is the part of their team that worries me the most. They have a very tough front four and great team speed on defense so the offensive line is going to have to be on it's best because I don't know if the traditional YAC heavy offense for the Argos will work against the Tiger-Cats.

[gilthethrill]

Hamilton's defence has been a mirage of late. Big game against Tito Sunseri, & close wins over a Winnipeg team that is floundering & an injury riddled BC team led by AV's favourite qb, Kevin Glenn. Lets see what they can do against an offence that has some teeth. If Tim Burke can solve Hamilton's bread & butter play, that being the screen pass, the Argos should beat those clowns.

[ArgoZ]

Obviously the most important game of the season to date as the Argos can tie the Tiger-Cats for first place with a victory. Hamilton's defense has been playing very, very, very well since Labour Day and that is the part of their team that worries me the most. They have a very tough front four and great team speed on defense so the offensive line is going to have to be on it's best because I don't know if the traditional YAC heavy offense for the Argos will work against the Tiger-Cats.

Huge game. I can see Montreal winning this week, resulting in a three way tie for first, if the Argos win. I like the Argos chances to make the playoffs with the remaining games against the Als and RB's, but to finish first, they really need this one.

[jerrym]

Milanovich reports that Carter has an injured elbow tendon and is doubtful for Hamilton. He also discusses what has made the Hamilton defence so successful recently below.

http://www.argonauts.ca/video/index/id/104045

[ArgoRavi]

IMO, first place in the East will ultimately come down to these two games between Toronto and Hamilton (with all due respect to Montreal). The Ticats need only to win one of these games while the Argos can't finish first without winning both of these games. Here are the remaining games for the top three teams in the East:

Toronto: vs. Hamilton (2), vs. Montreal, at Montreal, vs. Ottawa
Hamilton: at Toronto (2), vs. Ottawa, at Ottawa, vs. Montreal
Montreal: vs. Saskatchewan, at Ottawa, at Toronto, vs. Toronto, at Hamilton

I see Montreal beating both Saskatchewan and Ottawa which would give them at least 7 wins. I see Hamilton beating Ottawa twice which would give them at least 8 wins. I see Toronto beating Ottawa and Montreal at least once which would give them at least 7 wins. I suspect that Hamilton will also beat the Als at home which would give them 9 wins which is why the Argos have to beat Hamilton twice to finish in first. This is the biggest game of the season so far coming up this Friday night.

[Ticats85]

This should be a good one, both teams are catching fire right now.I believe that they will split the last two games against each other. Cant wait for Friday, Oskee Wee Wee!

[paulwoods13]

IMO, first place in the East will ultimately come down to these two games between Toronto and Hamilton (with all due respect to Montreal). The Ticats need only to win one of these games while the Argos can't finish first without winning both of these games. Here are the remaining games for the top three teams in the East:

Toronto: vs. Hamilton (2), vs. Montreal, at Montreal, vs. Ottawa
Hamilton: at Toronto (2), vs. Ottawa, at Ottawa, vs. Montreal
Montreal: vs. Saskatchewan, at Ottawa, at Toronto, vs. Toronto, at Hamilton

I see Montreal beating both Saskatchewan and Ottawa which would give them at least 7 wins. I see Hamilton beating Ottawa twice which would give them at least 8 wins. I see Toronto beating Ottawa and Montreal at least once which would give them at least 7 wins. I suspect that Hamilton will also beat the Als at home which would give them 9 wins which is why the Argos have to beat Hamilton twice to finish in first. This is the biggest game of the season so far coming up this Friday night.

I agree with your analysis, Ravi. If we lose Friday, first place is almost certainly out of our grasp -- it would take some surprising results elsewhere for us to leap over Hamilton's two-game and tie-breaker advantage. I have to admit I wouldn't mind finishing second, winning at home in the semifinal and being the underdog on the road in the EF. We did OK in that scenario in 2004 and 2012. But first place would be OK, too. ;-)

[Will]

Argonauts know offence at a premium against Ticats. (http://www.torontosun.com/2014/10/06/argonauts-know-offence-at-a-premium-against-ticats)

[Stouffvillain]

Looking for positive omens for this one?

Ti-cats have only won one time on the road this season (two weeks ago against the sliding Bluebombers).
Argos are 3-2 in the Dome this season against the "tougher" Western Division.

Ti-cats are averaging 19.5 ppg on the road this season while allowing opponents to score 25.7 ppg.
Argos are averaging 30.2 ppg at home this season while allowing opponents to score 27 ppg.


If anyone knows Collaros and how to mess with him it's the coaches that decided to let him go just one year ago. No one knows Collaros' strengths and weaknesses better than Milanovich.

Sure Hamilton have been on a run since Labour Day. A game that they barely squeaked out at home opening their stadium against an Argos team that was asking just about everyone on the street if they could play WR. Let's see how they deal with the Ray/Owens combo in Skydome.

AAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!

[Neely2005]

I agree with your analysis, Ravi. If we lose Friday, first place is almost certainly out of our grasp -- it would take some surprising results elsewhere for us to leap over Hamilton's two-game and tie-breaker advantage. I have to admit I wouldn't mind finishing second, winning at home in the semifinal and being the underdog on the road in the EF. We did OK in that scenario in 2004 and 2012. But first place would be OK, too. ;-)

I'd prefer to play in the Semi Final just because my son has an away hockey tournament the weekend of the 23rd. :-)

[jerrym]

IMO, first place in the East will ultimately come down to these two games between Toronto and Hamilton (with all due respect to Montreal). The Ticats need only to win one of these games while the Argos can't finish first without winning both of these games.

Without a win in this game, the Argos will be struggling simply to make the playoffs. However, the good news is that the Argo offence seems to be clicking even in the absence of Durie.

[ArgoRavi]

Without a win in this game, the Argos will be struggling simply to make the playoffs. However, the good news is that the Argo offence seems to be clicking even in the absence of Durie.

If the Argos don't win on Friday night then they will have to focus on beating out Montreal for second place and likely the final playoff spot in the East. That would then come down to the two head-to-head meetings with the Als and the Als might need to win both of those games because the Argos have already won the first game in the season series.

[jerrym]

If the Argos don't win on Friday night then they will have to focus on beating out Montreal for second place and likely the final playoff spot in the East. That would then come down to the two head-to-head meetings with the Als and the Als might need to win both of those games because the Argos have already won the first game in the season series.

That is still going to amount to a struggle.

[Argocister]

I believe it's good to have the struggle, it will spurn the players onto passionate play.
The team is on the upswing, and should peak at the playoffs .... I think we will make it.... But it will be tense!

[gilthethrill]

I believe it's good to have the struggle, it will spurn the players onto passionate play.
The team is on the upswing, and should peak at the playoffs .... I think we will make it.... But it will be tense!

The way B.C. & Winnipeg are playing, the Crossover is far from being a lock.

[AngeloV]

The way B.C. & Winnipeg are playing, the Crossover is far from being a lock.

Except for the fact that they still play each other once. If B.C wins, that's 8 wins for them. I think it's a stretch to think all of Argos, Hamilton and Montreal get to 8 wins considering how often they still play each other.

[Argo]

IMO, first place in the East will ultimately come down to these two games between Toronto and Hamilton (with all due respect to Montreal). The Ticats need only to win one of these games while the Argos can't finish first without winning both of these games. Here are the remaining games for the top three teams in the East:

Toronto: vs. Hamilton (2), vs. Montreal, at Montreal, vs. Ottawa
Hamilton: at Toronto (2), vs. Ottawa, at Ottawa, vs. Montreal
Montreal: vs. Saskatchewan, at Ottawa, at Toronto, vs. Toronto, at Hamilton

I see Montreal beating both Saskatchewan and Ottawa which would give them at least 7 wins. I see Hamilton beating Ottawa twice which would give them at least 8 wins. I see Toronto beating Ottawa and Montreal at least once which would give them at least 7 wins. I suspect that Hamilton will also beat the Als at home which would give them 9 wins which is why the Argos have to beat Hamilton twice to finish in first. This is the biggest game of the season so far coming up this Friday night.

Als vs. Riders is tough to call. I believe the Riders will eke out the win.

[Argo57]

Argos should be nervous, Hamilton has Ottawa twice, Montreal has Saskatchewan and Ottawa who they are more than capable of beating. Basically as Ravi pointed out the Argos have no margin of error at all, points squandered in Ottawa and the Calgary collapse could turn out to be their undoing this season.

[AngeloV]

Argos should be nervous, Hamilton has Ottawa twice, Montreal has Saskatchewan and Ottawa who they are more than capable of beating. Basically as Ravi pointed out the Argos have no margin of error at all, points squandered in Ottawa and the Calgary collapse could turn out to be their undoing this season.

Montreal doesn't scare me at all. If the Argos can't beat them, they don't deserve to be in the playoffs. Next to Ottawa, they have the worst O in the league.

[argotom]

We are on a roll and need to win this game badly, even though the Cats have a better streak.
It could come down to a battle of the two best punter and kickers in the league.

[Argocister]

We are on a roll and need to win this game badly, even though the Cats have a better streak.
It could come down to a battle of the two best punter and kickers in the league.

Then I know Swayze will pull the Boatmen through!

[Stevoman]

Didn't think we'd win last week but was happy to see them pull through. Should be a good one of Friday!

[Will]

Depth Chart (http://argonauts.ca/depthchart/game/depthid/10229)

Unfortunately, Jalil Carter has been put on the 6-game. He was playing fairly well this season. Donald Washington, who I thought looked good in the one pre-season game, takes over for him. Chiles also seems to be on the depth chart.

[T-Bone]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Bring a food item Friday night &amp; get a picture with the <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/GreyCup?src=hash">#GreyCup</a>! Tweet the photo using <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/TackleHunger?src=hash">#TackleHunger</a> to @PurolatorTH 2 win <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Argos?src=hash">#Argos</a> tix!</p>&mdash; Toronto Argonauts (@TorontoArgos) <a href="https://twitter.com/TorontoArgos/status/520243086405156864">October 9, 2014</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[Wobbler]

We're fielding a much better team than we did on September 1. I'm expecting a solid win.

Hamilton is using former Argo Terrell Sinkfield at slot in place of injured Greg Ellingson. It's always fun to go up against a recent cut.

[gilthethrill]

I hope the Argo passing game does not become too dependent on Owens. Edmonton seemed to figure that out in the 2nd half last game.

[mchesher03]

Depth Chart (http://argonauts.ca/depthchart/game/depthid/10229)

Unfortunately, Jalil Carter has been put on the 6-game. He was playing fairly well this season. Donald Washington, who I thought looked good in the one pre-season game, takes over for him. Chiles also seems to be on the depth chart.

Washington was playing on Labour Day IIRC. I remember because Zach went after him a fair bit - with mixed success. Within th Dome and with an improved receiving corps we should be in decent shape Friday. D was fine on labour day it was the offence that was sad.

[ArgofanIan]

Hey Guys and Gals.... and even Ticat fans ( ugh ) ... try to bring a food item to tonights game to help out the GTA food bank.... I think this reflects good on our fan base if we can do get behind this......


Lets Go ARRRRRRRRRRRRGOOOOOOOOSSSSSSSS !!!!

[DoubleBlue1873]

Really looking forward to tonight's game! Came down from Ottawa last night with my wife, we have great seats right behind the Argos' bench. Hope to see a better crowd out tonight given importance of game, lots of Ticats fans in attendance and interesting storylines (e.g. Ray vs. his former understudy Collaros). Should be a great game!

The kickers may ultimately decide the outcome (my money's on Swayze in that case), but there should be plenty of offence in the meantime. If our D can hold Hamilton to FGs, we stand a good chance as we have a better record of scoring majors once in the red zone.

[ArgoRavi]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p><a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Argos?src=hash">#Argos</a> inactives tonight are WR LaVon Brazill &amp; OL Jarriel King. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFL?src=hash">#CFL</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/BeatTheTicats?src=hash">#BeatTheTicats</a></p>&mdash; Toronto Argonauts (@TorontoArgos) <a href="https://twitter.com/TorontoArgos/status/520703813641322496">October 10, 2014</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Looks like John Chiles will be back in the starting lineup.

[jerrym]

Three totally unnecessary penalties after the play in the first few minutes of the game. Argos are back to their old selves.

[Stevoman]

Keep giving away field position like this and it's going to be a long night!

[jerrym]

In what is likely the most important of the game, the Argos look like they haven't even arrived to play the game yet, allowing the Ticats to jump to a 13-0 lead.

[jerrym]

Even on a 15 yard penalty against the Ticats the Argos have to go and get an objectionable conduct call, thereby minimizing the gain.

[jerrym]

Watt TD! Considering how chippy the game is, it may be the team who gets the last penalty that loses the game.

[Stevoman]

Nice drive at the end of the half but Collaros has looked fantastic! Now the Argos need to get much more production in the second half than they have been getting in order to win. I hate seeing Steinauer and Simmons on the Ticat coaching staff. Man I wish they were still here. They can keep Austin (his temper tantrums have always irked me). Sinkfield is doing well but is selfish attitude on that return makes me glad the Argos cut him.

[ArgoRavi]

Sinkfield made a fool of himself on his long return when he showboated and got caught from behind. Hopefully the four points that the Ticats gave up there will turn out to be the difference in the game.

[jerrym]

The Argos, the team giving up the most points per game and who have given up another 20 at halftime, have to tighten up their defence if they are going to make the playoffs. Time and again they've failed to contain the other teams on returns, qb runs and sweeps.

[argonaut11xx]

halftime....

I think if the Argo defense can step up, the game is a win for the Argo's....

Oh, by the way, Zac is from Steubenville, OH, yes home of the ULTIMATE lounge lizard, Dean Martin, however, Jimmy "The Greek" Synder grew up next door to Dean.

Sinkfield???...really???...we are making this PLUG look like gizmo williams

[jerrym]

Argos take another unnecessary 15 yard penalty. Brandon Smith blows an interception for a TD and Hamilton scores on the next play. Sums up much of the Argo season.

[Stevoman]

Smith needs to make that play. That was a gifted 6 points! We don't deserve this one.

[gilthethrill]

I think we all knew Hamilton would score the next player after Smith miffed that easy pic 6...

[gilthethrill]

Hamilton now has no RB in the game but yet the D continues to give 2nd and long conversions out like candy....

[gilthethrill]

Why did we not use Sinkfield as a returner?

[jerrym]

Crazy man, crazy! Ricky brings them back from the dead. After Sinkfield puts them near the 50 Argos defence not only holds but sacks Collaros twice.

[gilthethrill]

Look what happens when Hamilton's D faces a team with a QB.....

[gilthethrill]

When it's total points as a tiebreaker, why not kick a FG to end the game????

[Stevoman]

Wow! Fun to see them pull that one out. No risk on the field goal in case of mistake. Now, clear up the penalties and shore up the field position on special teams and we might be able to beat them again later in the month!

[larz-7]

i was prepared to right this game off 6 minutes ago. omg they did it

[argosrule2415]

This has to be up there with the last Argos/Ti-Cats game of 2012 back when we had Collaros and ended the Ti-Cats playoffs in the last game of the season as one of the sweetest regular season wins ever! Incredible! Glad the Argos changed there mind back when there was over 3 minutes left in the game to go for it on third down in our own end with Barnes converting with a clutch catch.

[ArgoRavi]

When it's total points as a tiebreaker, why not kick a FG to end the game????

The Argos and Ticats only play three times so total points is not going to matter unless the final game ended in a tie. The risk is that the FG is blocked and the Ticats return it for the winning points.

[argosrule2415]

When it's total points as a tiebreaker, why not kick a FG to end the game????

Now now, let's not dampen the mood haha.

[ArgoRavi]

This has to be up there with the last Argos/Ti-Cats game of 2012 back when we had Collaros and ended the Ti-Cats playoffs in the last game of the season as one of the sweetest regular season wins ever! Incredible! Glad the Argos changed there mind back when there was over 3 minutes left in the game to go for it on third down in our own end with Barnes converting with a clutch catch.

Don't forget the great Marvin Graves-engineered comeback in 1994 when the Argos were down by over three TDs in the fourth quarter and came back to win. This is definitely up there though and probably a bit bigger given the gravity of the game and the fact that both teams are much better than the '94 Argos and Ticats were.

[argosrule2415]

Don't forget the great Marvin Graves-engineered comeback in 1994 when the Argos were down by over three TDs in the fourth quarter and came back to win. This is definitely up there though and probably a bit bigger given the gravity of the game and the fact that both teams are much better than the '94 Argos and Ticats were.

I'll have to google that and try to find Youtube vids of it later as I was only 3 years old at the time. :D

#Argos is trending on Twitter in Toronto! Success.

[gilthethrill]

I'll have to google that and try to find Youtube vids of it later as I was only 3 years old at the time. :D

#Argos is trending on Twitter in Toronto! Success.

I have that 94 Game Ravi mentioned on something called VHS.....I am freaking out....freaking out.....

[gilthethrill]

The Argos and Ticats only play three times so total points is not going to matter unless the final game ended in a tie. The risk is that the FG is blocked and the Ticats return it for the winning points.

Of course....I am embarrassed that I posted that....feel like an amateur.....sorry Ravi......:)

[ArgoRavi]

I have that 94 Game Ravi mentioned on something called VHS.....I am freaking out....freaking out.....

Paul Woods has uploaded clips of that '94 game on YouTube. Tonight's game will be one that will be talked about for a long time too I suspect.

A lot went wrong tonight but a lot went right late in the game. It was certainly an emotional roller-coaster tonight. The game in two weeks will be another battle and if these two teams meet again in the East Final, you have to believe that it will be yet another nail-biter. Just listening to Milanovich's post-game comments now on TSN Radio. He says that they need to be much better than they were tonight which I won't disagree with.

[argosrule2415]

Would have been hilarious had Ray thrown the ball right into the corner stands on that last throw, just to stick it to the Ti-Cats who always seemed to be chucking it into the stands everytime they got a TD.

[ArgoRavi]

Would have been hilarious had Ray thrown the ball right into the corner stands on that last throw, just to stick it to the Ti-Cats who always seemed to be chucking it into the stands everytime they got a TD.

Would have been hilarious to see that ball land in the hands of some Ticats fans.

[gilthethrill]

Paul Woods has uploaded clips of that '94 game on YouTube. Tonight's game will be one that will be talked about for a long time too I suspect.

A lot went wrong tonight but a lot went right late in the game. It was certainly an emotional roller-coaster tonight. The game in two weeks will be another battle and if these two teams meet again in the East Final, you have to believe that it will be yet another nail-biter. Just listening to Milanovich's post-game comments now on TSN Radio. He says that they need to be much better than they were tonight which I won't disagree with.

I am listening in too....Mike Hogan is a very solid football guy that the Toronto Football market is fortunate to have...still enjoy listening to Jim Tatti after all these years.....

[doubleblue]

Don't forget the great Marvin Graves-engineered comeback in 1994 when the Argos were down by over three TDs in the fourth quarter and came back to win. This is definitely up there though and probably a bit bigger given the gravity of the game and the fact that both teams are much better than the '94 Argos and Ticats were.

I had to reread that. Thought at first you said Marvin Graves was great. lol But he did come in with a lot of promise and then fizzled out.

[argotom]

We looked dead and cooled out after three.
The teams changed moe in the fourth and the rest is history, wow!

[Argocister]

It was a very entertaining game.... It was hard to look at the stats at the end of the third, see the similarities, and then see how we were so far behind. Then came the fourth quarter.
It took all parts of the team to make that last quarter work. Defense and Specials got us great field position and the offense capitalized. Even the fans came through in the last minute to do their part in getting Zach off the field!
Totally satisfied .... Too bad more fans didn't show up .... Maybe next time in 2 weeks.

For those that sit on the " visitors" side in the dome, were the Argos fans loud from your perspective?
I sit behind the Argos bench, and it sounded loud but when one heard the Ticats fans, they sounded loud as well ..... But more echoed as they are on the other side.

[argofan81]

It was a very entertaining game.... It was hard to look at the stats at the end of the third, see the similarities, and then see how we were so far behind. Then came the fourth quarter.
It took all parts of the team to make that last quarter work. Defense and Specials got us great field position and the offense capitalized. Even the fans came through in the last minute to do their part in getting Zach off the field!
Totally satisfied .... Too bad more fans didn't show up .... Maybe next time in 2 weeks.

For those that sit on the " visitors" side in the dome, were the Argos fans loud from your perspective?
I sit behind the Argos bench, and it sounded loud but when one heard the Ticats fans, they sounded loud as well ..... But more echoed as they are on the other side.

I was on the visitors side -- both sets of fans were loud. From my perspective the biggest difference between the fans was that Hamilton fans used more horns/noise makers for noise whereas it seems that Argo fans relied on clapping & cheering (oh and I guess you could sort of hear the thunder sticks).

[argofan81]

Whiny-Cat fans are complaining that Owens was offside (claims being anywhere from 2-4 yards offside) on the last touchdown. I didn't see it at the time and still don't see it on the highlight replays but what are others' thoughts on the matter?

[Will]

The return of John Chiles was crucial tonight.

[Stevoman]

Whiny-Cat fans are complaining that Owens was offside (claims being anywhere from 2-4 yards offside) on the last touchdown. I didn't see it at the time and still don't see it on the highlight replays but what are others' thoughts on the matter?
When the play happened I thought he was too but this happens to every team, every game. This is the norm. Receivers have to be WAY offside for them to throw the flag. If we re-watched this game, I'm sure there are several examples of Ticat receivers doing the exact same thing.

[ArgoRavi]

When the play happened I thought he was too but this happens to every team, every game. This is the norm. Receivers have to be WAY offside for them to throw the flag. If we re-watched this game, I'm sure there are several examples of Ticat receivers doing the exact same thing.

I have found that there are times when a receiver appears to be offside while watching live but when you slow it down on the PVR he isn't. Dressler, on Labour Day, appeared to be offside for sure on the winning TD. However, when you slowed that play down he actually wasn't which I suspect happened on the Owens play too.

EDIT: I just watched the play on TSN's website and it looks like Owens was NOT offside. Pause the video when the ball is snapped and look at where Owens is: http://www.tsn.ca/video/cfl-in-game-tor-34-33-touchdown-1.104314

[flafson]

Owens was a little bit offside but they also had a touchdown that their receiver was WAY more offside and they didn't throw a flag.

EDIT: I guess it seemed worse than it really was.

[Qman]

When the play happened I thought he was too but this happens to every team, every game. This is the norm. Receivers have to be WAY offside for them to throw the flag. If we re-watched this game, I'm sure there are several examples of Ticat receivers doing the exact same thing.

its when the ball its snapped ... not when the QB pulls out from centre or you see the ball go back in shotgun. Its a optical illusion, thats why sometimes you think its offside.

Their are linesmen right on on the LOS watching the snap. They can tell right away if a receiver crosses before the ball moves. if their leg blocks the ball they are offside (obviously the ball hasn't been snapped yet)

[jerrym]

Emry has really stepped up his game the last couple of weeks, leading the team in tackles last week and coming second this week and almost getting in position for an interception.

[argofan81]

I have found that there are times when a receiver appears to be offside while watching live but when you slow it down on the PVR he isn't. Dressler, on Labour Day, appeared to be offside for sure on the winning TD. However, when you slowed that play down he actually wasn't which I suspect happened on the Owens play too.

EDIT: I just watched the play on TSN's website and it looks like Owens was NOT offside. Pause the video when the ball is snapped and look at where Owens is: http://www.tsn.ca/video/cfl-in-game-tor-34-33-touchdown-1.104314

I did the same -- watching the highlights online & pausing them right on the snap. I agree, Owens is onside but we'll never convince the pussycats of that, lol. A great comeback for the Argos but I hope in the future that they wake up prior to 3/4 through the fourth -- I feel a little cheap getting the win lol. Based on the first 3.75 quarters, we certainly did not deserve to win that game.

[QBall]

I love the smell of burnt Cat in the morning. It smells like victory. Anyone else feel like it's 2012 with the Argos' late season push all the way to the Cup?

[Neely2005]

It was a very entertaining game.... It was hard to look at the stats at the end of the third, see the similarities, and then see how we were so far behind. Then came the fourth quarter.
It took all parts of the team to make that last quarter work. Defense and Specials got us great field position and the offense capitalized. Even the fans came through in the last minute to do their part in getting Zach off the field!
Totally satisfied .... Too bad more fans didn't show up .... Maybe next time in 2 weeks.

For those that sit on the " visitors" side in the dome, were the Argos fans loud from your perspective?
I sit behind the Argos bench, and it sounded loud but when one heard the Ticats fans, they sounded loud as well ..... But more echoed as they are on the other side.
I sit on the Visitors Side and the Argonauts fans really only sounded loud for the last half of the 4th Quarter. Which is strange because a lot of Argonauts fans left early when we were down.

[Will]

I'd like to see a breakdown of the Owens TD because it was a LB who ended up covering him. What did the Argos specifically do or perhaps what did the Ticats not do in order for Owens to get an advantageous match-up.

[paulwoods13]

I was on the visitors side -- both sets of fans were loud. From my perspective the biggest difference between the fans was that Hamilton fans used more horns/noise makers for noise whereas it seems that Argo fans relied on clapping & cheering (oh and I guess you could sort of hear the thunder sticks).

I agree. Hamilton fans use noisemakers, we don't. But both were very loud at times.


Emry has really stepped up his game the last couple of weeks, leading the team in tackles last week and coming second this week and almost getting in position for an interception.

He's playing way better the past five or six games, but he also took a very stupid penalty last night and got immediately benched for the rest of that series. About time Milo started making guys pay for stupidity. (And having said that, Rosamanda -- who took stupid penalties on both of the first two kickoffs -- got not one but two game balls last night).


I'd like to see a breakdown of the Owens TD because it was a LB who ended up covering him. What did the Argos specifically do or perhaps what did the Ticats not do in order for Owens to get an advantageous match-up.

He ran a post-corner and somehow the main DBs on that side moved over towards Chiles. Steinauer's scheme really got caught out on that play. Having a LB cover the most dangerous player in the league without safety help was a huge mistake.

Spencer Watt did not play in the second half and I could not see him on the sideline. If he is hurt our NAT depth will really be tested. With Durie and Laing out we are incredibly thin. I guess we could use both Bradwell and Woodson at receiver, but Bradwell is not nearly as valuable as Watt because he lacks speed. Watt may not get thrown to much but teams have to cover him deep -- they don't have to do that to Bradwell.

[Skinny G]

For those of you who missed the comeback...TSN is actually replaying last nights game right now

[Argo57]

I agree. Hamilton fans use noisemakers, we don't. But both were very loud at times.

Paul, those aren't noisemakers, they are exhaling through the gaps in their teeth.

[ArgoRedneck]

Good game, penalities were killing me though. Owens was as close as it gets but was onside. Does anyone know that on a scoring play if offside is looked at when reviewing? I have on many times used my PVR on plays and have found that when I thought the in motion man was offside he was in fact right on the line when the ball was snapped. As soon as the ball moves play is on.

Still have not had 20,000 at a home game this year. WOW, Sask and Hamilton games I would have expected that.

[ArgoRavi]

Good game, penalities were killing me though. Owens was as close as it gets but was onside. Does anyone know that on a scoring play if offside is looked at when reviewing? I have on many times used my PVR on plays and have found that when I thought the in motion man was offside he was in fact right on the line when the ball was snapped. As soon as the ball moves play is on.

I am pretty sure that offside is not reviewable on a scoring play. With a scoring play, all they are concerned with is if the player crossed the goalline with the ball.

[jerrym]

Still have not had 20,000 at a home game this year. WOW, Sask and Hamilton games I would have expected that.

With an attendance of 17,811 to what could well be the most important game of the season and against a team with many of their fans coming from just down the road, the extent of the Argo off-field crisis was emphatically restated.

[paulwoods13]

With an attendance of 17,811 to what could well be the most important game of the season and against a team with many of their fans coming from just down the road, the extent of the Argo off-field crisis was emphatically restated.

I'm not denying that the franchise is in a terrible state, but I think a couple of factors mitigated against a big turnout from Hamilton:

7 o'clock start (instead of 7:30)
Gardiner Expressway construction -- why would anyone subject themselves to that?
The fact that these teams meet again two weeks from now, this time on a Saturday -- given a choice of one or the other, many Ticats fans would opt for that one, I bet.

[gilthethrill]

Not dressing a reserve RB for the 2nd time this season really caught up with Austin. Really limited what Collaros could do late in the game. Surprised Anthony Woodson only had one play, albeit it was a huge catch to set up Rays TD plunge. Hope we came out healthy after such a hard hitting contest.

[ArgoRavi]

Not dressing a reserve RB for the 2nd time this season really caught up with Austin. Really limited what Collaros could do late in the game. Surprised Anthony Woodson only had one play, albeit it was a huge catch to set up Rays TD plunge. Hope we came out healthy after such a hard hitting contest.

With the larger rosters today, it is unfathomable not to dress a backup tailback, especially when Austin experienced the same issue just a few short weeks ago. It is odd that Woodson wasn't as much of a factor last night but the one play that he made was a very good one. I really liked the move that he made on the Hamilton defender to get down to the 1 yard-line. I suspect that Woodson will play more of a role yet before this season is over. I don't know where OV has gone but he is a big fan of Woodson's so he must be quite happy about Woodson seeing more time on offence these days.

According to the CFL, last night's comeback was the second greatest one in Argo history after that memorable '94 game against Hamilton: http://www.thestar.com/sports/argos/2014/10/11/argonauts_comeback_against_tigercats_one_for_the_b ook.html

[paulwoods13]

Here are links to the 1994 comeback:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pnyai4LU4aY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WajRzIbQ9x0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xt2dNOkyddo

Full playlist: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pnyai4LU4aY&list=PLBA3EF32579F3F56B&spfreload=10%20Message%3A%20Syntax%20error%20(url% 3A%20https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DP nyai4LU4aY%26list%3DPLBA3EF32579F3F56B)

[argosrule2415]

One of the very first memorable games between the Ti-Cats that I ever watched was the 2010 ECSF back when we had Cleo Lemon at the helm at QB lol. Also it was the year Owens broke out as a star, some major highlights of the game in the link below.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pBEffDz1XQQ&index=58&list=FLGI_Z3MwErVbIGJI5_bV4Og

I remember our special teams were consistent that year, one of the Cinderella Argos team that I remember, granted I only started following them in 2009. We got pummeled by the Als in the Eastern Final but eh we got far enough for my satisfaction that year.

[AngeloV]

It was an unbelievable mood swing from the first 57 minutes to the last 3. I have to say though, coaching really cost the Ti-Cats this game. As mentioned, bad decision not to dress a true 2nd RB. But I believe the biggest coaching blunder of the game was calling for a reverse, in which the ball was handled by 3 different players with a 30-13 lead. That fumble was the main reason the Argos had the opportunity to come back. Full credit to the Argos for taking advantage of it.

Having said that, the Argos did a good job of, get this for those who questioned it when half the roster was injured, making better half time adjustments. After completing 14 of 15 in the first half, the Argos held Collaros to about 50% passing in the 2nd half.

[ArgoRavi]

It was an unbelievable mood swing from the first 57 minutes to the last 3. I have to say though, coaching really cost the Ti-Cats this game. As mentioned, bad decision not to dress a true 2nd RB. But I believe the biggest coaching blunder of the game was calling for a reverse, in which the ball was handled by 3 different players with a 30-13 lead. That fumble was the main reason the Argos had the opportunity to come back. Full credit to the Argos for taking advantage of it.

Having said that, the Argos did a good job of, get this for those who questioned it when half the roster was injured, making better half time adjustments. After completing 14 of 15 in the first half, the Argos held Collaros to about 50% passing in the 2nd half.

I find that when the Argos win we don't hear much about the coaching staff on this forum. When they lose it is an entirely different story.

[paulwoods13]

It was an unbelievable mood swing from the first 57 minutes to the last 3. I have to say though, coaching really cost the Ti-Cats this game. As mentioned, bad decision not to dress a true 2nd RB. But I believe the biggest coaching blunder of the game was calling for a reverse, in which the ball was handled by 3 different players with a 30-13 lead. That fumble was the main reason the Argos had the opportunity to come back. Full credit to the Argos for taking advantage of it.

Having said that, the Argos did a good job of, get this for those who questioned it when half the roster was injured, making better half time adjustments. After completing 14 of 15 in the first half, the Argos held Collaros to about 50% passing in the 2nd half.

I agree on all counts. I had given up when it got to 30-13 -- I don't usually tweet during games but I was so fed up I complained about how "Of all the games we have given away this season because of stupid mistakes, this is by far the worst." Then Austin decided to try that incredibly stupid double reverse play, and everything changed. It's funny how he claimed afterwards that if the exchange had been clean, Ticats would have scored a TD on the play. It was at the Hamilton 35 or so -- he could tell watching it live that Sinkfield would have been able to run 75 yards untouched!? That's hubris at its finest.

[Argo57]

I agree on all counts. I had given up when it got to 30-13 -- I don't usually tweet during games but I was so fed up I complained about how "Of all the games we have given away this season because of stupid mistakes, this is by far the worst." Then Austin decided to try that incredibly stupid double reverse play, and everything changed. It's funny how he claimed afterwards that if the exchange had been clean, Ticats would have scored a TD on the play. It was at the Hamilton 35 or so -- he could tell watching it live that Sinkfield would have been able to run 75 yards untouched!? That's hubris at its finest.

Austin comes across as an arrogant ass both on the sidelines and during his press conferences, good on the Argonauts for hanging tough and capitalizing on their opportunities BUT they will have to be significantly better for 60 minutes next time these teams play.
Old cliches apply, "one game at a time" etc, we may have to run the table in the last games to finish first.

[Argo57]

Check out Simoni Lawrence's post game comments on Ticats.ca
" that's not a team that can compete with us if we don't give them anything".......interesting!

[gilthethrill]

One of the very first memorable games between the Ti-Cats that I ever watched was the 2010 ECSF back when we had Cleo Lemon at the helm at QB lol. Also it was the year Owens broke out as a star, some major highlights of the game in the link below.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pBEffDz1XQQ&index=58&list=FLGI_Z3MwErVbIGJI5_bV4Og

I remember our special teams were consistent that year, one of the Cinderella Argos team that I remember, granted I only started following them in 2009. We got pummeled by the Als in the Eastern Final but eh we got far enough for my satisfaction that year.

That 2010 team was a team & staff that newly hired HC Jim Barker put together (after the Bart Andrus debacle) with little time to do so. How they managed to win 9 games still amazes me. Each win it seemed it was done in a different fashion, such as special teams as you mentioned, INT returns for TD's as the offence struggled. Yes, that 2010 ESF victory under the guidance of Cleo Lemon was without a doubt, one of the sweetest wins I have seen in my long (sometimes frustrating) tenure as a diehard Argo fan.


Check out Simoni Lawrence's post game comments on Ticats.ca
" that's not a team that can compete with us if we don't give them anything".......interesting!

As I pointed out in a much earlier thread, Hamilton's D was fortunate to face teams with either backup QB's or teams that were just struggling. They were not able to handle competition in the form of an elite QB with his weapons finally at his disposal. It would be benefical to win the East & potentially have Hamilton return as they are unable to win away from THF.

[Argo57]

As I pointed out in a much earlier thread, Hamilton's D was fortunate to face teams with either backup QB's or teams that were just struggling. They were not able to handle competition in the form of an elite QB with his weapons finally at his disposal. It would be benefical to win the East & potentially have Hamilton return as they are unable to win away from THF.

Although some people question the benefit of having a bye week I think winning first place in the east would be very beneficial, let Hamilton battle it out with Montreal or the crossover team while we rest.
Hopefully the Argonauts can build on this and gain momentum in the homestretch.

[ArgoRavi]

Although some people question the benefit of having a bye week I think winning first place in the east would be very beneficial, let Hamilton battle it out with Montreal or the crossover team while we rest.
Hopefully the Argonauts can build on this and gain momentum in the homestretch.

I know that it hasn't worked out well for the Argos the last three times that they have hosted the East Final but I would still rather them do so anyway. I think that it has been notable this year that the team coming off the bye week has won quite a bit more than they have lost. At a minimum, the team coming off the bye week this year has played much better, even if they have lost (see the Argos in Calgary).

[LLB997]

One of the very first memorable games between the Ti-Cats that I ever watched was the 2010 ECSF back when we had Cleo Lemon at the helm at QB lol. Also it was the year Owens broke out as a star, some major highlights of the game in the link below.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pBEffDz1XQQ&index=58&list=FLGI_Z3MwErVbIGJI5_bV4Og

I remember our special teams were consistent that year, one of the Cinderella Argos team that I remember, granted I only started following them in 2009. We got pummeled by the Als in the Eastern Final but eh we got far enough for my satisfaction that year.

we were lovingly referred to as the smoke and mirror Argos

[Stouffvillain]

I know I'm a little late to the party on this one but this was an absolutely thrilling game. Glad to see both sides of the ball step up. Really hope the Argos can hold on and get a home date with the Ti-cats in the playoffs. Think we could take them again at home.

[Double Dare]

I find that when the Argos win we don't hear much about the coaching staff on this forum. When they lose it is an entirely different story. Coaching??? Hamilton crapped out in the last 3 minutes, and Argos won big in the last 3 minutes ... 'tis all. We all know this outcome was on the players in the game.

[AngeloV]

Coaching??? Hamilton crapped out in the last 3 minutes, and Argos won big in the last 3 minutes ... 'tis all. We all know this outcome was on the players in the game.

So you don't think coaching had anything to do with the completion percentage difference from the first half to the 2nd half for Collaros?

[Argocister]

I find that when the Argos win we don't hear much about the coaching staff on this forum. When they lose it is an entirely different story.

interesting you mentioned that .... I was thinking during the game that Milanovich seemed a tad more aggressive in this game, than earlier in the season.

[Will]

interesting you mentioned that .... I was thinking during the game that Milanovich seemed a tad more aggressive in this game, than earlier in the season.

He had to be. The implications of an Argo loss were too great not to be. For whatever reason, prior to the 5:00 minute mark of the 4th quarter, Orlondo Steinauer had figured out a scheme that had neutralized the Argo offense for multiple games. I was waiting for Milanovich to make adjustments against the Ticats and he finally did.