Maritime Expansion

[matthew]

Based on this article sounds like maritime expansion may be folly

http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/how-the-maritimes-became-canadas-incredible-shrinking-region/article23554298/?service=mobile

Thoughts anyone know the status out there on the ground

[Argo57]

Based on this article sounds like maritime expansion may be folly

http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/how-the-maritimes-became-canadas-incredible-shrinking-region/article23554298/?service=mobile

Thoughts anyone know the status out there on the ground

Slap a coat of paint on the abandoned restaurant and our asshole owner may think about moving the Argonauts there.
Quebec City would be an area of consideration for expansion, Quebec folk love football and what a great rivalry you would create with Montreal.
10 team league would be ideal for a balanced schedule.

[rdavies]

As a Maritimer, sorry, I'm just not buying that story. A team would be well supported if it was, in actuality, seen as a Maritime (not Halifax) team.

[doubleblue]

Based on this article sounds like maritime expansion may be folly

http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/how-the-maritimes-became-canadas-incredible-shrinking-region/article23554298/?service=mobile

Thoughts anyone know the status out there on the ground

New Brunswick has quite a bit of Natural Gas reserves which they could turn into jobs and income for the Province. But they elected a Government that ran on a platform against fracking. So some of their poverty is seemingly self inflicted IMO.

[Mookie Fan]

As a Maritimer, sorry, I'm just not buying that story. A team would be well supported if it was, in actuality, seen as a Maritime (not Halifax) team.

I think this is an interesting and important point. Obviously the BC Lions and Saskatchewan Roughriders are named after provinces, not cities. I'm not sure how much the name matters in establishing a following outside the city a team is located in. That said, what could a team in the Maritimes be called, if not named after one city? There is more than one province in eastern Canada, and none of them have very big populations. Could the word Maritime be in the name? Maybe that wouldn't work, I have no idea.

Also, I think it is important that a new stadium built in the Martimes be a pretty good size. I know some people talk about building a stadium with between 25 000 - 28 000 seats. I think that is too small. I would build one with at least 33 000 seats. My reason is I think it would be more effective to try and draw people from other cities, and sell more tickets at very affordable prices than fewer tickets at much higher prices. Some people say a team in eastern Canada could not work because of a lack of a corporate base and too little wealth in that part of the country. I think the solution is to sell more tickets at lower prices, rather than fewer tickets at higher prices. I think a team could more than break even if it did this effectively. It would also lead to big crowds and a great atmosphere at games.

[rdavies]

what could a team in the Maritimes be called, if not named after one city?
Also, I think it is important that a new stadium built in the Martimes be a pretty good size. I know some people talk about building a stadium with between 25 000 - 28 000 seats. I think that is too small. I would build one with at least 33 000 seats. Atlantic Schooners, (has a history, 30+ years without actually being the name of the franchise) with little objection.

http://i57.tinypic.com/14wreh0.png

The stadium has to follow the model of the new east stadiums (24k) 33K is way to big. The games have to be sold as individual events.

As a Maritimer, who has lived in all three provinces I know Maritimers are spoiled, we like our lifestyle, we don't like to commute. I've met people from the GTA who commute an hour and a half to work, most Maritimers see that as insane. Anyone who takes over 15 minutes to get to work has a long commute unless it's something like Halifax traffic.

I see people everyday flying out to Fort Mac but have heard few success stories. Most go out there make good money and then waste it, few are those who saved their money and came back and settled into a better lifestyle at home.

We don't have a history of large crowds for regular events, 24k is more than enough.

[Fumblitis]

I think this is an interesting and important point. Obviously the BC Lions and Saskatchewan Roughriders are named after provinces, not cities. I'm not sure how much the name matters in establishing a following outside the city a team is located in. That said, what could a team in the Maritimes be called, if not named after one city? There is more than one province in eastern Canada, and none of them have very big populations. Could the word Maritime be in the name? Maybe that wouldn't work, I have no idea.

Also, I think it is important that a new stadium built in the Martimes be a pretty good size. I know some people talk about building a stadium with between 25 000 - 28 000 seats. I think that is too small. I would build one with at least 33 000 seats. My reason is I think it would be more effective to try and draw people from other cities, and sell more tickets at very affordable prices than fewer tickets at much higher prices. Some people say a team in eastern Canada could not work because of a lack of a corporate base and too little wealth in that part of the country. I think the solution is to sell more tickets at lower prices, rather than fewer tickets at higher prices. I think a team could more than break even if it did this effectively. It would also lead to big crowds and a great atmosphere at games.The name is huge. At least half the Riders following is from outside Regina. Without that, the Riders would have folded long ago. As a matter of fact when they became the Saskatchewan Roughriders in 1947 it was because Saskatoon and Moose Jaw's team had folded and the only way to save the Regina Roughriders was to have the team belong to the entire province.

[1argoholic]

I like the PEI Spuds. Now that PEI has a bridge it can no longer be called an island. What do you think Double Dare? Plus why would you drive an hour back and forth for work. You must be from away and love snow shoveling?

Atlantic Schooners is the only name.

[R.J]

Atlantic Krakens.

The Argos already have boats covered.

[rdavies]

Atlantic Krakens.And that has what to do with the Maritimes? Is Canadian history covered in Ontario schools?

[R.J]

And that has what to do with the Maritimes? Is Canadian history covered in Ontario schools?
Nothing, it's just a name, sorry but I'm not a fan of the Schooners name.
There wasn't a need to be a douchebag about it.

[Double Dare]

I like the PEI Spuds. Now that PEI has a bridge it can no longer be called an island. What do you think Double Dare? Plus why would you drive an hour back and forth for work. You must be from away and love snow shoveling?

Atlantic Schooners is the only name. Someone in Hamilton was sold a 50 million winning ticket to Lotto Max. I think the winner, maybe a Ti Cat fan, should buy the Argos and relocate the team to the Maritimes! Screw Toronto ... the fans aren't worthy! Ha, ha, ha.

[ArgofanIan]

There should be lots of east coast people across Canada that would support the team for road games.... Would be nice in my life time if I could see a grey cup in Halifax.... Think that would be a fun party.... hope this happens some day....

[matthew]

Atlantic Schooners, (has a history, 30+ years without actually being the name of the franchise) with little objection.

http://i57.tinypic.com/14wreh0.png

The stadium has to follow the model of the new east stadiums (24k) 33K is way to big. The games have to be sold as individual events.

As a Maritimer, who has lived in all three provinces I know Maritimers are spoiled, we like our lifestyle, we don't like to commute. I've met people from the GTA who commute an hour and a half to work, most Maritimers see that as insane. Anyone who takes over 15 minutes to get to work has a long commute unless it's something like Halifax traffic.

I see people everyday flying out to Fort Mac but have heard few success stories. Most go out there make good money and then waste it, few are those who saved their money and came back and settled into a better lifestyle at home.

We don't have a history of large crowds for regular events, 24k is more than enough.

I have always like the name the Maritime Tide with 4 cresting waves on the helmet to represent the provinces.

Sort of like this Tulane concept or the Boston Breakers

[rdavies]

I have always like the name the Maritime Tide with 4 cresting waves on the helmet to represent the provinces. That's interesting, but if it was Maritime it would be three waves. I was thinking what word would go with Maritime and it's a hard one to match. Maritime Tide almost sounds repetitive with the last syllable of Maritime. I'm not sure whether it slips well off the tongue or not. I don't mind Atlantic Tide and it does tie in well with the provinces.

[matthew]

That's interesting, but if it was Maritime it would be three waves. I was thinking what word would go with Maritime and it's a hard one to match. Maritime Tide almost sounds repetitive with the last syllable of Maritime. I'm not sure whether it slips well off the tongue or not. I don't mind Atlantic Tide and it does tie in well with the provinces.

I could get behind that the Atlantic Tide has a nice ring to it.

I was thinking four pei, New Brunswick, Nova Scotia and Newfoundland.

And we don't have a singular team name yet!

["Issues"Mcgee]

Atlantic Corsairs.

[LLB997]

Someone in Hamilton was sold a 50 million winning ticket to Lotto Max. I think the winner, maybe a Ti Cat fan, should buy the Argos and relocate the team to the Maritimes! Screw Toronto ... the fans aren't worthy! Ha, ha, ha.


or we can fold the argos and watch the ticats fold a mere 3 minutes later. book it!

[Wobbler]

I was thinking four pei, New Brunswick, Nova Scotia and Newfoundland.
Little known fact: Newfoundland isn't a "Maritime province". I assume that's because the name was established well before Newfoundland became a province.

[rdavies]

Uhh, it's a very well known fact, that's why Matthew later corrected the previous post.

[rdavies]

Atlantic Corsairs.Not really a word Maritimers associate with, now Corvettes might be different. IIRC, it was one of the more popular names mentioned when a team name was being looked at.

http://i57.tinypic.com/fuvrky.jpg
HMCS Regina

[Double Dare]

or we can fold the argos and watch the ticats fold a mere 3 minutes later. book it! Ha, ha ... doubt it. Ti Cats have a good owner, new stadium, and a vibrant fan base and forum(s). It's like saying the Roughriders will fold.

[Wobbler]

Uhh, it's a very well known fact, that's why Matthew later corrected the previous post.
My, you're on a roll this week rdavies.

Please try to be nice.

[rdavies]

The problem I have is when people on the Internet present information as fact that is clearly wrong and people who aren't in the know tend to believe it, and I was correcting it

I would expect to be called out on something I said that wasn't factual.

[Double Dare]

The problem I have is when people on the Internet present information as fact that is clearly wrong and people who aren't in the know tend to believe it, and I was correcting it

I would expect to be called out on something I said that wasn't factual. That, and a lot of Canadians as a whole, don't know too much about their own country, especially it's east coast.

[rdavies]

That, and a lot of Canadians as a whole, don't know too much about their own country, especially it's east coast.Unfortunately true

[matthew]

The problem I have is when people on the Internet present information as fact that is clearly wrong and people who aren't in the know tend to believe it, and I was correcting it

I would expect to be called out on something I said that wasn't factual.

I wasn't taking it that seriously actually but seems I have offended so sorry about that. It was a pleasant post that's all. I wasn't trying to pass myself off as an expert hence the wording and mere sharing of the link at the start if this thread as just an FYI. I thought I let the article speak for itself not me speaking to it.

And where is it clear that it's not? I would wager when most people think of the maritimes they include Newfoundland. Anyhow if they name the team the Tide I will claim the idea and get my free seats!

[rdavies]

There's no offense, just straightening something out. Getting back to the subject it is likely that if it ever comes to fruition Schooners will be the name. Maritimers are traditional people and even this name goes back over 30 years.

http://i57.tinypic.com/2i7w9c5.jpg

[paulwoods13]

Yes it does. I went to an Atlantic Schooners hospitality suite a night or two before the 1982 Grey Cup in Toronto. J.I. Albrecht might have been there but my memories are fuzzy as there was a little too much liquid refreshment involved.

[rdavies]

Yes it does. I went to an Atlantic Schooners hospitality suite a night or two before the 1982 Grey Cup in Toronto. J.I. Albrecht might have been there but my memories are fuzzy as there was a little too much liquid refreshment involved.That ol' con man probably boozed people up on purpose.

The name works on many levels, first the famous Bluenose of Lunenburg was a schooner and although we tie that in with Nova Scotia, all three Maritime provinces had large shipbuilding industries because of the abundance of wood and shipping ports.

And speaking of liquid refreshment we have the famous 60 year old beer (at least in the Maritimes) http://i61.tinypic.com/bgzr6f.jpg

Notice the sentimentality and tradition portrayed in the spot below, that sentiment still plays today


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0SMZz9tZag

[Wobbler]

The problem I have is when people on the Internet present information as fact that is clearly wrong and people who aren't in the know tend to believe it, and I was correcting it.
Huh. I really thought you were going to say "I'm quite sensitive regarding the appreciation of Eastern Canada, and tend to lash out at those who fail to meet my standard". Silly me.

[LLB997]

Ha, ha ... doubt it. Ti Cats have a good owner, new stadium, and a vibrant fan base and forum(s). It's like saying the Roughriders will fold.

you sir are no roughriders. legendary Ivor Wynne sold out exactly zero games in its farewell season aside from LD classic. Its laughable to even compare yourselves to the riders. I remember CHCH running a couple of stories on Hamiltonian sports bars playing NFL games foremost during Cats playoff runs. Nice stadium, good owner but lets be serious here.

[rdavies]

Huh. I really thought you were going to say "I'm quite sensitive regarding the appreciation of Eastern Canada, and tend to lash out at those who fail to meet my standard". Silly me.Well I'm not as sensitive as some here appear to be. Pauvre de petit moi!

[Double Dare]

you sir are no roughriders. legendary Ivor Wynne sold out exactly zero games in its farewell season aside from LD classic. Its laughable to even compare yourselves to the riders. I remember CHCH running a couple of stories on Hamiltonian sports bars playing NFL games foremost during Cats playoff runs. Nice stadium, good owner but lets be serious here. I'm not a Ti Cat fan ... sorry, but Toronto's franchise is in grave trouble (I don't know if you know that yet), and to say that if T.O. craps out they'll take Hamilton with them is ridiculous. I know Toronto is the center of the universe, but ...

[Fumblitis]

If T.O craps out the whole league will eventually go with it.

[rdavies]

If T.O craps out the whole league will eventually go with it.Don't think so. Toronto could easily go, (as Montreal did and LA in the NFL did) where the problem lies is its place as the home of national sponsors. I'm not worried about it as the home of the national media because that's been basically hostile or irrelevant (save TSN) and new media as we know it is taking over from traditional sources of information.

Players and teams can get their story out through new channels, things like the Player's Tribune, Twitter, and sites such as Argofans. Traditional sources of information are being replaced.

But if sponsors are lost because they don't have access to the largest market in the country, that ain't good. The league would survive but be much weaker for it. Also contrary to popular belief that TV contract didn't come about because nobody in the GTA is watching, which people would like you to believe.

[LLB997]

exactly, Toronto is in grave trouble and last time I looked, Hamilton wasn't enclosed in any sort of plastic bubble. A mere 40 minute stretch on the QEW does not change the feeling of indifference towards the CFL in Southern Ontario. Bob Young has lost hand over fist during his tenure which is why it's laughable for a ticat fan to throw around the "Argos , who needs em" talk . Ticats are no model franchise, not by a long shot. Lets see how long the THF honeymoon lasts.

[R.J]

http://www.tsn.ca/the-cfl-must-do-more-to-protect-quarterbacks-1.386814

They’re attempting to entrench themselves in a football market which has twice lost its CFL franchise. And if Ottawa works, with its real estate/retail/entertainment strategy, there are groups eyeing an expansion opportunity in Halifax. It’s never as simple as just one play on the field. There’s more at stake.

Not the first time I've heard someone bring this up, so hopefully Ottawa works this time as I would love to see a team in Halifax. Shannon Park and the Dartmouth Crossing are continually brought up as potential locations for a stadium and entertainment district. There's one potential ownership group that I've heard of so I'm glad to hear that there's potential interest from other parties.

[paulwoods13]

exactly, Toronto is in grave trouble and last time I looked, Hamilton wasn't enclosed in any sort of plastic bubble. A mere 40 minute stretch on the QEW does not change the feeling of indifference towards the CFL in Southern Ontario. Bob Young has lost hand over fist during his tenure which is why it's laughable for a ticat fan to throw around the "Argos , who needs em" talk . Ticats are no model franchise, not by a long shot. Lets see how long the THF honeymoon lasts.

Since this thread has been bumped, we can now say that the honeymoon is still going strong. THF has been sold out for every game the Ticats played this season. Can't do any better than that.

[R.J]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/seat-stadium-on-halifax-council-agenda-1.3308597

At least they're still looking into it.

[shayman]

Since this thread has been bumped, we can now say that the honeymoon is still going strong. THF has been sold out for every game the Ticats played this season. Can't do any better than that.

Well, yeah, it helps that they built a stadium with 5,000 fewer seats than the previous one :-)

[R.J]

City Council votes no for stadium at Shannon Park.
http://www.metronews.ca/news/halifax/2015/11/10/halifax-council-votes--no--to-stadium-dreams-at-shannon-park.html

[OV Argo]

City Council votes no for stadium at Shannon Park.


http://www.metronews.ca/news/halifax/2015/11/10/halifax-council-votes--no--to-stadium-dreams-at-shannon-park.html


Frickin' @rse-holes.

Don\t really know much about Halifax (only visited once, and have a cousin who is a long-time resident); but seems to me, in my bit of reading on that Shannon Park site, that maybe it is kind of their version of Lansdowne Park in Ottawa? - even if only in that it is a prime piece of real estate in the heart of a city, that is sitting unused and that could be developed into something really special & nice - a multi use facility that could benefit many citizens? Maybe those city councillors don\t get that football is a CANADIAN game and that this stadium/facility could serve all of Atlantic Canada as a host for not only a CFL team (and become the only big league team in Atlantic Canada sports) but also other leagues and sports (say the Uteck Bowl in CIS ball, or big soccer tournaments) and for concerts. I wonder what the vote would have been if it had been about building a nice hockey arena there for a potential future NHL franchise?

[argolio]

I wonder what the vote would have been if it had been about building a nice hockey arena there for a potential future NHL franchise?Probably a bigger NO vote since there is far less chance of Halifax ever getting an NHL team.

[paulwoods13]

There is no one with the $150-200M needed to build a stadium in Atlantic Canada. I'd love a team in Halifax, but until there is a major multi-sport international games that will trigger big govt funding, the idea of a CFL team out there is a pipe dream.

[R.J]

There is no one with the $150-200M needed to build a stadium in Atlantic Canada. I'd love a team in Halifax, but until there is a major multi-sport international games that will trigger big govt funding, the idea of a CFL team out there is a pipe dream.
The idea thrown out there has been to replicate Lansdowne Live, but I agree until Governments are willing to spend, it ain't going to happen.

[1argoholic]

Living close to Peterborough you can understand how some cities politics are SCREWED. Last year a developer came forward after buying a sweet chunk of Peterborough property and was going to put 90 to 100 million of his own money towards a new arena and development and the Petes would play there. The Memorial Centre is old and the Petes need a new home. The local government squashed the plans saying it didn't fit their needs, wants or location. UnFingreal. Everything in Peterborough takes a mere few minutes to get to. Not like building a new stadium in Newmarket to serve downtown TO.

[R.J]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Jeffrey Orridge just told me, <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Halifax?src=hash">#Halifax</a> needs a good owner, stadium, and corporate sponsors for expansion to happen. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFL?src=hash">#CFL</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/GreyCup103?src=hash">#GreyCup103</a></p>&mdash; Steve Morley (@SteveMorley62) <a href="https://twitter.com/SteveMorley62/status/669560534866329601">November 25, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[AngeloV]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Jeffrey Orridge just told me, <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Halifax?src=hash">#Halifax</a> needs a good owner, stadium, and corporate sponsors for expansion to happen. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFL?src=hash">#CFL</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/GreyCup103?src=hash">#GreyCup103</a></p>— Steve Morley (@SteveMorley62) <a href="https://twitter.com/SteveMorley62/status/669560534866329601">November 25, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


I think the stadium is the biggest hurdle. If they can clear that, I think the others will fall into place.

[R.J]

I think the stadium is the biggest hurdle. If they can clear that, I think the others will fall into place.
I'm aware that there are interested parties, one of which is the Oland family, who are also looking into getting a new arena for the Mooseheads as well. It's continually brought up how "they're" keeping on eye on Ottawa and Lansdowne Live, so if it ever gets done, we could see a similar stadium and arena complex with an entertainment district. From my understanding, while Shannon Park is a no go right now, the business leaders actually want it to happen at the Dartmouth Crossing, which already is an entertainment district.

[Scooter McCray]

What about the Irving family? They own New Brunswick and are one of the wealthiest families in Canada. They would need to be involved. On a par with Thompson family who was a huge Argo fan while alive.

[Argocister]

Somewhere, in the last couple of weeks, I read that Halifax turned down a proposal for a stadium/arena complex for the city just recently. So I'm thinking the possibility of a Maritime expansion will be put on hold for another 5-10 years .

[Argo57]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Jeffrey Orridge just told me, <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Halifax?src=hash">#Halifax</a> needs a good owner, stadium, and corporate sponsors for expansion to happen. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFL?src=hash">#CFL</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/GreyCup103?src=hash">#GreyCup103</a></p>&mdash; Steve Morley (@SteveMorley62) <a href="https://twitter.com/SteveMorley62/status/669560534866329601">November 25, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

The new commish has it all figured out, you need a good owner, stadium and corporate sponsors for expansion to happen, Thanks Captain Obvious.

[Argocister]

The new commish has it all figured out, you need a good owner, stadium and corporate sponsors for expansion to happen, Thanks Captain Obvious.

where's that damn LIKE Button! < LIKE >

[R.J]

The new commish has it all figured out, you need a good owner, stadium and corporate sponsors for expansion to happen, Thanks Captain Obvious.
A lot of hate for the new commish, did he kick everybody's dog or something ?
Wait is that offensive to say that ?

[OV Argo]

[QUOTE=Argo57;74416]The new commish has it all figured out, you need a good owner, stadium and corporate sponsors for expansion to happen, Thanks Captain Obvious.[/QUOTE

Stadiums - particularly relatively modest ones that only seat 25 K or so, that the CFL now sees as their model - can get built ... yes they can, with fund$ coming from lots of places - federal (the new Liberal govt. just got a massive majority in Atlantic Canada - IF some big-wig within cared about Canadian football and the multi-faceted boost a stadium/entertainment facility could give to Atlantic Canada - this project would EASILY happen) provincial and municipal governments, local investors who have LOTS of money and care about the sport & community (see Ottawa's group now), AND, gasp, the CFL - ALL teams and led by a Commissioner who has some guts & vision - have some dollars they could set aside to contribute there - that's if they're not cheapskates. Combine all the above resources with a concerted effort led by the CFL that would believe expansion could help their sport/business a LOT (IMO - easily the single biggest thing the CFL could do to increase their brand & profile & prestige - expand to a 10 team coast to coast league in Canada - with 5 games on TV per week instead of 4, and 2 seperate Conference play-off semis = no one play-off game win to get to the GC) = the money could be put together. Sorry, financial experts who say no way.

But yes - this would take some vision instead of CFL myopia and cheap$kate greed. This" we kicked the tires a bit in the Atlantic but nobody home" routine by the CFL is total gutless hogwash IMO; they should have somebody full-time on the case - for years now - lobbying all 3 levels of govt., seeking out local business help and a CFL fund in place and growing for this cause. Orridge is not the guy there - I doubt. Could happen / shoulda happened by now - just IMO and sorry bout that to all the excuse makers coming up with reasons why it can't happen.

[ArgoRavi]

How much money do you want the league to kick in, OV?

[OV Argo]

How much money do you want the league to kick in, OV?

How bout starting with a 3 or 2 or even 1 million a year account (that could have been started years ago)? Too much you say and can't be done? Braley, Wet-and-all and Bob-O Young or the Saskatchewan Rough Riders have no money ? CFL teams and the league itself make no profits now? Can you show me the CFL's books that show ALL revenues including merchandise sales, corporate sponsors, TV revenues, etc. ?

[R.J]

It's easy when it isn't your money.

[OV Argo]

It's easy when it isn't your money.


Sure; just like it's easy to be a cheap$kate and myopic and claim there is no money.

[Wobbler]

Yeah, if I was an owner this would be a pretty tough sell. The only apparent reward for my generosity would be substantially increased annual travel expenses.

[OV Argo]

Yeah, if I was an owner this would be a pretty tough sell. The only apparent reward for my generosity would be substantially increased annual travel expenses.


umm, no, and see, that is the type of cheapskate & myopic thinking I'm talking about.

Try instead - the profile, prestige and exposure of the entire CFL goes up, wayyyyyyy up, in adding a 10th team to make it a coast to coast league with now 5 games a week and better competition, variety, more media interest and a more interesting play-offs. And with this increase in exposure, prestige and interest - ALL teams make more money, wayyyyy more money: better TV contract, more sponsors & advertising, more merchandise, etc. Could some bottom-line only thinkers get this?

[paulwoods13]

Sure; just like it's easy to be a cheap$kate and myopic and claim there is no money.

Until someone steps forward to offer money, there is no money. I do not believe any level of govt is going to kick anything significant towards a facility that would bring in serious revenue 10 times a year. And I don't believe the private sector in that market sees any possibility of making it work financially. Maybe that's myopic; IMO it is realistic.

[paulwoods13]

umm, no, and see, that is the type of cheapskate & myopic thinking I'm talking about.

Try instead - the profile, prestige and exposure of the entire CFL goes up, wayyyyyyy up, in adding a 10th team to make it a coast to coast league with now 5 games a week and better competition, variety, more media interest and a more interesting play-offs. And with this increase in exposure, prestige and interest - ALL teams make more money, wayyyyy more money: better TV contract, more sponsors & advertising, more merchandise, etc. Could some bottom-line only thinkers get this?

I agree the league would benefit financially from a 10th team, in Halifax. What I don't agree with is the idea that a Halifax team could make enough money to justify a sizeable investment in a stadium. The market is too small, in terms of both population and corporate money.

[KCargosfan]

I think a 10th team would be great, but until there is a 25K seat stadium and a person with a net worth north of $200 million willing to start a team, it's not going to happen.

[argolio]

expand to a 10 team coast to coast league in Canada - with 5 games on TV per week instead of 4, and 2 seperate Conference play-off semis = no one play-off game win to get to the GC) So you'd want 8 out of 10 teams to make the playoffs?

[R.J]

So you'd want 8 out of 10 teams to make the playoffs?
This would be one issue I would have if the CFL ever gets to 10 teams, I think it's best to stick with 6 teams making the playoffs, but conventional wisdom has taught me that the League would go with whatever makes them more money.

[OV Argo]

So you'd want 8 out of 10 teams to make the playoffs?


Sure; you like it better when 2 teams in a league need to play only one play-off game to get to the league Championship ? - is what it is for a small league, but that's laughable in terms of competition and doesn\t exis in most other sports; the old days at least had East 2 game total point series to qualify for the GC. 1st plays 4th and 2nd plays 3rd in both conference semis; 2 teams miss the play-offs; only 3 miss the play-offs now, so what's the big deal with the change?

Again - one more game a week in the sched. and on TV with 10 teams = BIG improvement for the league - always Thursday Night thru the year; always Friday Night (with some double headers) and a mix of some weekend games; and extra play-off game would be big too.

[OV Argo]

Until someone steps forward to offer money, there is no money. I do not believe any level of govt is going to kick anything significant towards a facility that would bring in serious revenue 10 times a year. And I don't believe the private sector in that market sees any possibility of making it work financially. Maybe that's myopic; IMO it is realistic.


Not sure if you are that familiar with the new Lansdowne facility, but it hardly used only 10x a year - people in Ottawa visit there every day; besides CFL football, the Park has stores & shops, restaurant/ bars, green / recreation space, and there is a good sized hockey arena on site as well; and a nice stadium can host lots of other events too - besides just CFL regular season - football - eg. the Vanier Cup and other football championship games; major soccer or perhaps rugby tournaments and matches; big name band concerts, conventions. Lots of uses for lots of different people and the project creates jobs - some temporary and some permanent.

But i guess there is no need for that kind of stuff or a major construction project and modern development in Atlantic Canada. And the CFL and its BOGoofs should continue to hide in their little shell and pinch their pennies.

And the federal govt never drops 100 million dollars or so on basically anything do they? - not interested in a major urban development or community infrastructure projects that could benefit many people and businesses and create jobs too? - nah, and provincial or municipal govts. should have no such interest either; yep - just NO money out there.

[AngeloV]

10 teams with 6 making the playoffs would be ideal. I really don't want any undeserving 4, 5, or 6 win teams making the playoffs.

[paulwoods13]

Ottawa is more than twice as big as Halifax, population-wise, so much more able to use the various parts of Lansdowne that aren't the stadium. Halifax already has a modern, downtown hockey arena so that's not a selling point for a development project.

I believe there is no chance even this govt would commit $100M to a football stadium project there without some sort of multi-sport games attached. And even if they did, a decent stadium would cost at least another $50M, money that would have to come from somewhere. I just don't see it happening although it's nice to dream of a team in Halifax.

[R.J]

Modern Arena ? The Metro Centre was built in 1978.

[timlb01]

Not sure if you are that familiar with the new Lansdowne facility, but it hardly used only 10x a year - people in Ottawa visit there every day; besides CFL football, the Park has stores & shops, restaurant/ bars, green / recreation space, and there is a good sized hockey arena on site as well; and a nice stadium can host lots of other events too - besides just CFL regular season - football - eg. the Vanier Cup and other football championship games; major soccer or perhaps rugby tournaments and matches; big name band concerts, conventions. Lots of uses for lots of different people and the project creates jobs - some temporary and some permanent.


But i guess there is no need for that kind of stuff or a major construction project and modern development in Atlantic Canada. And the CFL and its BOGoofs should continue to hide in their little shell and pinch their pennies.

And the federal govt never drops 100 million dollars or so on basically anything do they? - not interested in a major urban development or community infrastructure projects that could benefit many people and businesses and create jobs too? - nah, and provincial or municipal govts. should have no such interest either; yep - just NO money out there.

The federal government is spending a lot on Syrians. The government spends money on what is politically acceptable and spending it on professional sports is a no-no. I don't like it but it is the way it is.

[paulwoods13]

Modern Arena ? The Metro Centre was built in 1978.

OK, not so modern. But it's definitely not being replaced as part of a stadium/arena/entertainment project a la Lansdowne in the foreseeable future. It would be difficult to scrape up enough money in Halifax for a modern arena; two sports venues there (one to be used only sporadically) is a bridge way too far.

[OV Argo]

OK, not so modern. But it's definitely not being replaced as part of a stadium/arena/entertainment project a la Lansdowne in the foreseeable future. It would be difficult to scrape up enough money in Halifax for a modern arena; two sports venues there (one to be used only sporadically) is a bridge way too far.

I didn't say an arena had to be part of the package in Halifax, and it would obviously add cost. The Civic Centre Arena at Lansdowne was in existence for years before they did the re-do of the park and they were able to save/maintain it - and it is still used for hockey, concerts and other gatherings and I noticed Ottawa football fans watching the GC on big screen there yesterday

For Halifax: A modernish 25K stadium, plus/ with some green space/park recreation area for all the public to use, maybe a movie theatre, a coffee shop, a couple of bar/restaurants, a couple of stores, maybe a small museum of some sort (Maratimes history & wildlife museum say) = a multi-use facility for all the citizens, plus a tourist attraction.

[OV Argo]

The federal government is spending a lot on Syrians. The government spends money on what is politically acceptable and spending it on professional sports is a no-no. I don't like it but it is the way it is.


Governments can be lobbied, persuaded, swayed. And influential people within a govt. can provide the impetus & buck$ for big projects they take a shine to.

IF a big-wig in the new Liberal Fed govt had a big interest in such a project, you rest assured they could make such a thing happen: they had over-whelming support in Atlantic Canada and pay-back for such support can take the form of $pending in that area; the project could be justified with reasons like job creation. it's good for business or tourism, the facility was needed in the area, etc.

[R.J]

I didn't say an arena had to be part of the package in Halifax, and it would obviously add cost. The Civic Centre Arena at Lansdowne was in existence for years before they did the re-do of the park and they were able to save/maintain it - and it is still used for hockey, concerts and other gatherings and I noticed Ottawa football fans watching the GC on big screen there yesterday

For Halifax: A modernish 25K stadium, plus/ with some green space/park recreation area for all the public to use, maybe a movie theatre, a coffee shop, a couple of bar/restaurants, a couple of stores, maybe a small museum of some sort (Maratimes history & wildlife museum say) = a multi-use facility for all the citizens, plus a tourist attraction.
A new 15,000 seat arena has been talked about in Halifax and as I've mentioned before, there are "groups" (only one that I know of) looking at the Ottawa model and Darthmouth Crossing is where a stadium, arena, hotel and entertainment district would most likely go.

[paulwoods13]

I didn't say an arena had to be part of the package in Halifax, and it would obviously add cost. The Civic Centre Arena at Lansdowne was in existence for years before they did the re-do of the park and they were able to save/maintain it - and it is still used for hockey, concerts and other gatherings and I noticed Ottawa football fans watching the GC on big screen there yesterday

For Halifax: A modernish 25K stadium, plus/ with some green space/park recreation area for all the public to use, maybe a movie theatre, a coffee shop, a couple of bar/restaurants, a couple of stores, maybe a small museum of some sort (Maratimes history & wildlife museum say) = a multi-use facility for all the citizens, plus a tourist attraction.


At a cost of, what, $250 million? Nice dream tho.

[OV Argo]

At a cost of, what, $250 million? Nice dream tho.

I don't know - probably in that range I guess. Nice dream ? - sure you could look at it that way; or how bout - nice project that fits and benefits many people in Atlantic Canada. I guess Ottawa shoulda just let a prime piece of real estate and historic site just go to waste - tear down the stadium and turn the area into a parking lot? Stupid bunch of dreamers at work there in Ottawa, including the OSEG and the City of Ottawa.

[argolio]

Sure; you like it better when 2 teams in a league need to play only one play-off game to get to the league Championship ? - is what it is for a small league, but that's laughable in terms of competition and doesn\t exis in most other sports; the old days at least had East 2 game total point series to qualify for the GC. 1st plays 4th and 2nd plays 3rd in both conference semis; 2 teams miss the play-offs; only 3 miss the play-offs now, so what's the big deal with the change?

Again - one more game a week in the sched. and on TV with 10 teams = BIG improvement for the league - always Thursday Night thru the year; always Friday Night (with some double headers) and a mix of some weekend games; and extra play-off game would be big too.The extra 1st vs 4th games are a recipe for mismatches at a time when you've got the most eyeballs watching the league, and would tax teams trying to sell two home playoff games in consecutive weeks. The OUA showed what a huge mistake it was to have 8 playoff teams in a 10/11 team league, and they sensibly cut back to 6. Eliminating only two teams from a ten team league is fine for a kids league, but it's embarrassing for a pro league to give out what essentially would be participation medals for having mediocre or even terrible seasons. The CFL already gets enough unwarranted criticism. No need to give people a valid excuse to attack the league.

[1argoholic]

You need big money east coast to step up like McCain's or Irving Oil. Perhaps Moncton is more willing then Dare could get seasons and make the trip over from Spud Island. Actually it's more mainland now that there's a bridge. haha

[OV Argo]

The extra 1st vs 4th games are a recipe for mismatches at a time when you've got the most eyeballs watching the league, and would tax teams trying to sell two home playoff games in consecutive weeks. The OUA showed what a huge mistake it was to have 8 playoff teams in a 10/11 team league, and they sensibly cut back to 6. Eliminating only two teams from a ten team league is fine for a kids league, but it's embarrassing for a pro league to give out what essentially would be participation medals for having mediocre or even terrible seasons. The CFL already gets enough unwarranted criticism. No need to give people a valid excuse to attack the league.


Disagree - it's way more "embarassing" and non-competitive to have 2 teams needing to play only one play-off game to get to the league championship - name another sport/league that has a long regular season with that kind of finish? Mismatches happen all the time in the play-offs BTW and CFL history the way you like it has seen teams with terrible records make the play-offs (see 81 East); and there could still be a cross-over rule if the 5th place team in one Division has a better record than the 4th in the other. 2 extra play-off games in the semis would be huge, IMO, for league exposure and provide for more interesting football - the bye set-up now with win one play-off game and you are in the GC is Mickey Mouse if there could be an alternative to make a team better earn it's way to the GC.

[AngeloV]

Disagree - it's way more "embarassing" and non-competitive to have 2 teams needing to play only one play-off game to get to the league championship - name another sport/league that has a long regular season with that kind of finish?

Baseball used to, and it was arguably better then because you were guaranteed of a team earning their way in. The NHL used to have 16 of 21 teams make it, and it was considered a joke at that time, as the Leafs would regularly make the playoffs with 63 or so points. In '81 when the Als made the playoffs with a 3-13 record, just beating out the 2-14 Argos, it was very embarrassing.

IMO, the season has to matter, otherwise people are paying good money for glorified exhibition games. If a .300 winning percentage makes the playoffs, then it really doesn't matter all that much.

[OV Argo]

Baseball used to, and it was arguably better then because you were guaranteed of a team earning their way in. The NHL used to have 16 of 21 teams make it, and it was considered a joke at that time, as the Leafs would regularly make the playoffs with 63 or so points. In '81 when the Als made the playoffs with a 3-13 record, just beating out the 2-14 Argos, it was very embarrassing.

IMO, the season has to matter, otherwise people are paying good money for glorified exhibition games. If a .300 winning percentage makes the playoffs, then it really doesn't matter all that much.


In baseball, you would have to win 4 games, minimum, even if you got a bye to the league Championship, to win the title. I didn't have a big problem with a lot of NHL teams making the play-offs, and at least nobody got to go to the Stanley Cup by winning one play-off game anyways - more than one series and 4 wins to take a series. The CFL has an 18 game sched compared to the 16 regular season NFL and that is more competitive, but at least no NFL team gets to go to the Super Bowl by winning just one play-off game.

CFL GC contestants have often, for a long-time now, only needed to win one play-off game to get a shot at the league Championship. Sorry, but IMO, this is wrong / not competitive enough. A first place finish in the division would give you home field for a one game semi if it was 1st vs. 4th with a 10 team league - that is a nice advantage (ALL home teams won the play-off games this year). The good old days of great CFL football (into the mid 70s) saw 2 game total point East & West finals = you had to win the equivalent of 2 play-off games to get to the GC even if you won first place in the division - I'd be in favor of those play-off days again.

[AngeloV]

In baseball, you would have to win 4 games, minimum, even if you got a bye to the league Championship, to win the title. I didn't have a big problem with a lot of NHL teams making the play-offs, and at least nobody got to go to the Stanley Cup by winning one play-off game anyways - more than one series and 4 wins to take a series. The CFL has an 18 game sched compared to the 16 regular season NFL and that is more competitive, but at least no NFL team gets to go to the Super Bowl by winning just one play-off game.

CFL GC contestants have often, for a long-time now, only needed to win one play-off game to get a shot at the league Championship. Sorry, but IMO, this is wrong / not competitive enough. A first place finish in the division would give you home field for a one game semi if it was 1st vs. 4th with a 10 team league - that is a nice advantage (ALL home teams won the play-off games this year). The good old days of great CFL football (into the mid 70s) saw 2 game total point East & West finals = you had to win the equivalent of 2 play-off games to get to the GC even if you won first place in the division - I'd be in favor of those play-off days again.

Well I don't have a problem with it. It is something that is earned over the long season, making the long season meaningful.

[R.J]

That's why the season is more meaningful, you have to earn the first round bye, but yeah let's ruin the point of the regular season by having 8 teams make the playoffs. Heck, we should start it for 2016, only 1 team missing the playoffs sounds great.

[argotom]

You need big money east coast to step up like McCain's or Irving Oil. Perhaps Moncton is more willing then Dare could get seasons and make the trip over from Spud Island. Actually it's more mainland now that there's a bridge. haha


I went to Moncton during the Argo game a few years ago and was pleasantly surprised.
Apparently there is money in the city and surrounding area, excluding the cheap McCain and Irving Oil.
They need a new stadium or a substantially renovated current one.

[R.J]

I went to Moncton during the Argo game a few years ago and was pleasantly surprised.
Apparently there is money in the city and surrounding area, excluding the cheap McCain and Irving Oil.
They need a new stadium or a substantially renovated current one.
The Elder McCain was one of the big backers of the Touchdown Atlantic series, so there was at least some interest in the beginning. However, when the last two games didn't sell out, IIRC McCain was quoted saying something along the lines of, "I guess this market isn't interested in the CFL" or it might have been "ready for the CFL", something along those lines.

[ArgoRavi]

I don't care for the idea of 8 of 10 teams making the playoffs either. I would prefer to see no team with a losing record make the playoffs but we usually get at least one of those currently with 6 of 9 making it. It would get ridiculous with 8 of 10 making it and I really don't want to see a 4-14 team make it like Ottawa did back in '93 and '94. To please OV, I am all for going back to the 1986 playoff format where the 4th place team in the West had a better record than the 3rd place team in the East. The result was that the West featured two semi-final games while the East had that memorable 2 game total point series to decide the division between the Argos and Ticats.

[JBarnsley]

After seeing Ottawa and their reception in the city, does Atlantic Canada not seem more likely than ever? Honestly the recipe for success is clear and on the table, Just need the right owner and a suitable stadium of 24,000.

[paulwoods13]

Just need the right owner and a suitable stadium of 24,000.

And enough ticket buyers and corporate support. Not too much to ask.

Ottawa is twice as big as Halifax and has some head offices. And a stadium.

As I have asked before, where will Halifax get $150M-200M for a stadium? Much less whether or not it has a big enough population and enough corporations to support a team. I'd love it but I don't expect to see it happen in my lifetime.

[shayman]

Ottawa is twice as big as Halifax and has some head offices. And a stadium.

Also - Ottawa was extremely lucky that there was already a stadium - albeit one needing repairs, and with NIMBY neighbours, etc - in an incredible location. Can you imagine trying to find a piece of property like that for a new team? It'd cost a hundred million just for the land. I'm sure they wouldn't be doing nearly as well if they'd had to build a new stadium out in the burbs.

(BMO will be great but oh man, if only Varsity had worked out ...)

[OV Argo]

And enough ticket buyers and corporate support. Not too much to ask.

Ottawa is twice as big as Halifax and has some head offices. And a stadium.

As I have asked before, where will Halifax get $150M-200M for a stadium? Much less whether or not it has a big enough population and enough corporations to support a team. I'd love it but I don't expect to see it happen in my lifetime.


I already suggested where the money could possibly come from - federal, provincial and municipal govts. + some rich local investors and businessmen (see Ottawa & OSEG) + the myopic cheapskate flints who run the CFL put together 10 million or so as a sign they are willing to contribute and get the ball rolling. But no - that is just impossible is it? - nice dream though.

Ever heard of the Saskatchewan Rough Riders ? - you know - the team that makes the most money, has SRO crowds and outdraws the biggest demographic in the league team and it's feeble fan base by miles, and, has the most widespread fan base and sells the most mechandise in the entire CFL ? Yep - that demographic in Regina couldn't possibly support a CFL team. People travel from all over the province to support the Green Riders. I'd bet there is a chance people could come from all over Atlantic Canada - Moncton, Saint John & other parts of New Brunswick, PEI, even some from football mad Quebec City area - to join with Nova Scotians to support a CFL team that might mean a lot to an entire region.

I'd love it to happen too, but am not as supportive of the excuses for it not to happen.

[R.J]

Also - Ottawa was extremely lucky that there was already a stadium - albeit one needing repairs, and with NIMBY neighbours, etc - in an incredible location. Can you imagine trying to find a piece of property like that for a new team? It'd cost a hundred million just for the land. I'm sure they wouldn't be doing nearly as well if they'd had to build a new stadium out in the burbs.

(BMO will be great but oh man, if only Varsity had worked out ...)
City of Halifax already owns a large chunk of the Shannon Park area and a huge piece of land in Dartmouth Crossing.

[paulwoods13]

I already suggested where the money could possibly come from - federal, provincial and municipal govts. + some rich local investors and businessmen (see Ottawa & OSEG) + the myopic cheapskate flints who run the CFL put together 10 million or so as a sign they are willing to contribute and get the ball rolling. But no - that is just impossible is it? - nice dream though.

Ever heard of the Saskatchewan Rough Riders ? - you know - the team that makes the most money, has SRO crowds and outdraws the biggest demographic in the league team and it's feeble fan base by miles, and, has the most widespread fan base and sells the most mechandise in the entire CFL ? Yep - that demographic in Regina couldn't possibly support a CFL team. People travel from all over the province to support the Green Riders. I'd bet there is a chance people could come from all over Atlantic Canada - Moncton, Saint John & other parts of New Brunswick, PEI, even some from football mad Quebec City area - to join with Nova Scotians to support a CFL team that might mean a lot to an entire region.

I'd love it to happen too, but am not as supportive of the excuses for it not to happen.

Yes, IMO it is impossible. I don't see any chance feds and Nova Scotia would cough up $140-190M to top up the imagined $10M from CFL (which, I'm just guessing, does not have that kind of cash on hand). And as I have said, I don't see any corporation investing significant dollars on a venture with 10 revenue events per year (plus a slice of TV money) in a market that small. Yes, there would be some travel within the region and maybe one or two big concerts, but someone has to invest enough to make this happen, and I just don't see the kind of investment generating enough return to warrant doing it. I would LOVE to be proven wrong.

[OV Argo]

Yes, IMO it is impossible. I don't see any chance feds and Nova Scotia would cough up $140-190M to top up the imagined $10M from CFL (which, I'm just guessing, does not have that kind of cash on hand). And as I have said, I don't see any corporation investing significant dollars on a venture with 10 revenue events per year (plus a slice of TV money) in a market that small. Yes, there would be some travel within the region and maybe one or two big concerts, but someone has to invest enough to make this happen, and I just don't see the kind of investment generating enough return to warrant doing it. I would LOVE to be proven wrong.

Yep -getting all 3 levels of govt. on board to make this project happen would be difficult and a big hurdle; you think the Federal govt ever throws huge wads of cash at a project they take a shine to and in an area where they have big support? - 100 million is basically pocket change there; but OK - "impossible"


FYI - OSEG = several rich, local and community minded businessmen formed a group and put up LOTS of money. along with the City putting up fund$, towards making Lansdowne park a huge project for Ottawa including a new (mostly) stadium and several other buildings & projects/businesses on site; the Halifax project does not need to be as extensive - stadium first and foremost but also some other development (that i suggested earlier in this thread) that appeals to a wide group of people/consumers = wayyyyy more use than your imagined 10 events a year. Did you think it was "impossible" for tons of money to be invested at Lansdowne and a new stadium to get done there?

[paulwoods13]

Yep -getting all 3 levels of govt. on board to make this project happen would be difficult and a big hurdle; you think the Federal govt ever throws huge wads of cash at a project they take a shine to and in an area where they have big support? - 100 million is basically pocket change there; but OK - "impossible"



There are many gigantic govt-funded projects to build needed infrastructure under way: bridge repairs, highways, public transit. Would a football stadium open 10-20 times a year be considered worthy of $100M? I think not.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/rob-commentary/no-end-in-sight-to-canadas-infrastructure-spending-binge/article26721520/


Here's what the current govt said about infrastructure funding in its campaign material. Not seeing any references to playgrounds for pro athletes.

Nearly double federal infrastructure investment to almost $125 billion – from the current $65 billion – over the next decade, reaching an additional $9.5 billion by year ten;
Make an immediate down payment to kick-start job creation and economic growth by doubling the current federal infrastructure investment in each of the next two fiscal years;
Provide new, dedicated funding to provinces, territories, and municipalities for:
Public transit infrastructure,
Social infrastructure – including affordable housing and seniors facilities, early learning and child care, and cultural and recreational infrastructure,
Green infrastructure – including local and wastewater facilities, climate resilient infrastructure, and clean energy;
Increase the transparency of the New Building Canada Fund by providing clearer project criteria and faster approval processes that will now prioritize investments in roads, bridges, transportation, ports, and border gateways; . . .


https://www.liberal.ca/trudeau-commits-to-largest-infrastructure-investment-in-canadian-history/

[R.J]

It can be done, if there was interest. Federal government funding would most likely be extremely hard, but Provincial and Municipal funding isn't "impossible". The Provincial government in BC paid $514 million for the BC Place renos, Edmonton received over $100 million from the City for the Commonwealth renos, not to mention the ridiculous amount of money given for Rogers place. The Riders new $278 million stadium is largely government funded ($25 million has to come from the Riders up front), even moreso in Winnipeg (tally around $245 million and counting) and Ottawa's stadium and arena were renovated with government money, private money went to building the stores, restaurants, movie theatre, hotel and condos. If a Lansdowne Live were to be built in Halifax, which it should be noted that's the model they're looking at. Whether or not Nova Scotia and Halifax want to spend the money is the question at this time, but I think if someone came up with a good enough plan in can and will be done, not "impossible" IMO. "Unlikely" is the word I'd use.

[OV Argo]

It can be done, if there was interest. Federal government funding would most likely be extremely hard, but Provincial and Municipal funding isn't "impossible". The Provincial government in BC paid $514 million for the BC Place renos, Edmonton received over $100 million from the City for the Commonwealth renos, not to mention the ridiculous amount of money given for Rogers place. The Riders new $278 million stadium is largely government funded ($25 million has to come from the Riders up front), even moreso in Winnipeg (tally around $245 million and counting) and Ottawa's stadium and arena were renovated with government money, private money went to building the stores, restaurants, movie theatre, hotel and condos. If a Lansdowne Live were to be built in Halifax, which it should be noted that's the model they're looking at. Whether or not Nova Scotia and Halifax want to spend the money is the question at this time, but I think if someone came up with a good enough plan in can and will be done, not "impossible" IMO. "Unlikely" is the word I'd use.


??? !!!

Ay caramba - the BC Provincial govt paid $514 million to reno BC place ??? - so how was that "possible", but it's "impossible" for a combined effort group of federal, provincial, municipal govts. + some private investors/rich local business-people + the CFL to put together 200 million for a stadium/recreation/consumer project in Halifax ??? "Social infrastructure" including cultural & recreational - the new Liberal federal govt. says they will spend money there - how does a 25K stadium (that the area lacks) plus some other smart development that could potentially serve/help all of Atlantic Canada - not qualify ???

[paulwoods13]

Wake me up when this happens. I'm in dreamland in the meantime.

[KCargosfan]

Regular season needs to have meaning. No playoff expansion.

[R.J]

Wake me up when this happens. I'm in dreamland in the meantime.
I'm not holding my breath either, but I disagree with the notion of it being impossible. A lot of stadiums have been built or renovated these last few years, all with public money.

[JBarnsley]

I'm not holding my breath either, but I disagree with the notion of it being impossible. A lot of stadiums have been built or renovated these last few years, all with public money. yeah.. wasnt the return of Ottawa impossible since the team folded twice already? I am aware of the brutal ownership similar to Braley, but still.

[argotom]

The risk reward for Halifax or Moncton would be enormous.
Just taking into consideration the dollars coming into a city and province during the Grey Cup.
Not to mention the advertising country wide.
To me it seems like a no brain er, all levels of government coughing up.
How many billions of dollars do we hear regularly are wasted with scandal and or political corruption.

[argolio]

The risk reward for Halifax or Moncton would be enormous.Reading your sentence literally, if the risk and the reward are both enormous, then the risk is typically avoided.

[argotom]

Reading your sentence literally, if the risk and the reward are both enormous, then the risk is typically avoided.

In my opinion the reward is well worth the risk.

[Gill The Thrill]

The new commish has it all figured out, you need a good owner, stadium and corporate sponsors for expansion to happen, Thanks Captain Obvious.

ROFL...No wonder the owners are paying him the big bucks...the guy's proving to be a friggin genius with these comments. Would be nice if he added passionate fans.

I find it funny that Halifax has no money or interest to invest in a stadium to attract concerts and a CFL team, but there is talk about a new arena for the Mooseheads...isn't their arena barely 20 years old, if even. That doesn't sound like an arena that needs to be replaced.

[AngeloV]

I sure hope that getting a team one the east coast isn't what it will take for people to consider Orridge successful. If that is the case, then the league has never had a successful commissioner.

[argolio]

For the record, the arena the Mooseheads play in opened n 1978.

[R.J]

but there is talk about a new arena for the Mooseheads...isn't their arena barely 20 years old, if even. That doesn't sound like an arena that needs to be replaced.
There was talk about building a new arena, but that went to the waist side when Scotiabank bought the naming rights of which the majority of the money is going to upgrade the old Metro Centre, which was built in 1978 as previously mentioned. The new renovations just bought at least 10 more years before talk of a new arena starts up again.

[JBarnsley]

I think if the CFL doesn't have 10 teams within the next 6-10 years its a failure. You cannot convince me that there isn't enough cities in Canada to support over 10 franchises.
The CFL could honestly have 12 with room to expand if the ridiculous territorial rights were ignored.

[R.J]

I think if the CFL doesn't have 10 teams within the next 6-10 years its a failure. You cannot convince me that there isn't enough cities in Canada to support over 10 franchises.
The CFL could honestly have 12 with room to expand if the ridiculous territorial rights were ignored.
The only reason the CFL doesn't have ten or more teams is because there are only 9 (11 if you still include the dome and big owe) CFL ready stadiums in Canada. If Halifax built a stadium in the 80's they would have had their team already. If Quebec had a CFL size stadium they'd probably also get a team etc.

[Gill The Thrill]

There was talk about building a new arena, but that went to the waist side when Scotiabank bought the naming rights of which the majority of the money is going to upgrade the old Metro Centre, which was built in 1978 as previously mentioned. The new renovations just bought at least 10 more years before talk of a new arena starts up again.That's right, it was built in the 70's. I was thinking it may have been built for the Mooseheads, but being a huge hockey fan, I should've remembered that Halifax was the home to the Montreal Canadiens AHL farm team at the time, the Halifax Voyageurs. Quite the farm team too when you think of all the talent the Habs reared in those days. Pretty sure they were the first team to use the Metro Centre.


I think if the CFL doesn't have 10 teams within the next 6-10 years its a failure. You cannot convince me that there isn't enough cities in Canada to support over 10 franchises.
The CFL could honestly have 12 with room to expand if the ridiculous territorial rights were ignored.Let's get to 10 before growing by a third and getting to 12. We also have to consider the standard of play if you consider 12 teams. I think one of the least competitive seasons in CFL history was the 1995 season with 13 teams, including 5 teams made up of solely Americans and many games were dreadful and one-sided. Some of the American teams were awful despite the large talent pool they were allowed to choose players from in the USA, and every Ontario team as well as Winnipeg and Saskatchewan were also terrible in Canada.

You've got to crawl before you can walk, let alone run, and when it comes to the CFL expanding to that 10th team, they've taken the word "crawl" to a whole new level. Getting to 12 teams based in Canada would be something that would most likely happen when most or all on this board are pushing up daisies on a permanent basis. 10 teams in 2 balanced divisions with 3 teams making the playoffs in each division would be very ideal.

[AngeloV]

I think 10 is where the league should stop, should they ever get there. IMO, it's really important to have an even number of teams in the league, and though their are 2 markets (Atlantic and QC) than have been mentioned, I don't see a possibility of a 3rd addition anywhere. Go to 10, and stop right there.

[Scooter McCray]

I think 10 is where the league should stop, should they ever get there. IMO, it's really important to have an even number of teams in the league, and though their are 2 markets (Atlantic and QC) than have been mentioned, I don't see a possibility of a 3rd addition anywhere. Go to 10, and stop right there.

I agree. 10 should be some type of priority for divisional and scheduling balance as well as maxing out TV deal next time around. Grow responsibly.

[paulwoods13]

Twelve would be ideal, but there is no community in Western Canada capable of supporting a team. Okanagan region maybe, but doubtful. And of course it's difficult enough to get one stadium built -- three would be beyond impossible. But yes, an odd number of teams sucks because of how it creates scheduling problems, byes, etc.

[R.J]

THE ATLANTIC SCHOONERS IS LONG OVERDUE FOR CFL EXPANSION
http://lastwordonsports.com/2016/06/07/atlantic-schooners-cfl-expansion/

[KCargosfan]

THE ATLANTIC SCHOONERS IS LONG OVERDUE FOR CFL EXPANSION
http://lastwordonsports.com/2016/06/07/atlantic-schooners-cfl-expansion/

All that is needed is $120 million for a stadium and an owner with deep pockets!

[R.J]

All that is needed is $120 million for a stadium and an owner with deep pockets!
The City is already talking about building a 20,000 seater and the Oland family is rumoured to be heavily interested in owning a CFL team (in Halifax).

[AngeloV]

The City is already talking about building a 20,000 seater and the Oland family is rumoured to be heavily interested in owning a CFL team (in Halifax).

I really hope they can make a go of it. Make the stadium 23-25k and we are talking business.

[ArgoRavi]

All that is needed is $120 million for a stadium and an owner with deep pockets!

That is all that has been needed for 40 years. I will believe that they will have a CFL franchise only when I see it.

[Will]

That is all that has been needed for 40 years. I will believe that they will have a CFL franchise only when I see it.

Winner winner, chicken dinner.

[KCargosfan]

That is all that has been needed for 40 years. I will believe that they will have a CFL franchise only when I see it.

Yes, I had tongue planted in cheek with that post.

That being said, how rich is this Olad family someone mentioned?

[Double Dare]

That being said, how rich is this Oland family someone mentioned? Forget about them (only worth about 30 million). Google the Irvings on the east coast (New Brunswick) (7.8 billion) ... 3rd. richest family in Canada.

[R.J]

Forget about them (only worth about 30 million). Google the Irvings on the east coast (New Brunswick) (7.8 billion) ... 3rd. richest family in Canada.
Irvings don't get involved with sports; at least not at an Ownership level. K.C had an arena named after him, but that's about it.

[Argoknot]

Irvings don't get involved with sports; at least not at an Ownership level. K.C had an arena named after him, but that's about it.Robert Irving owns the QMJHL's Moncton Wildcats, so the Irvings do have some pro sports involvement/experience. The Oland's are having a little family issue right now with one of their kids being found guilty of bludgeoning his father to death so I don't think they'll be in the bidding process.

That leaves the Irvings (8B), McCains (Harrison 3B) (Wallace's estate 3B), Sobeys (3B), Jodreys (500-700 mil family split). And with that, aside from the Sobeys most of those family fortunes are split amongst family members are are not likely available to fund a football team.

[R.J]

Robert Irving owns the QMJHL's Moncton Wildcats, so the Irvings do have some pro sports involvement/experience. The Oland's are having a little family issue right now with one of their kids being found guilty of bludgeoning his father to death so I don't think they'll be in the bidding process.

That leaves the Irvings (8B), McCains (Harrison 3B) (Wallace's estate 3B), Sobeys (3B), Jodreys (500-700 mil family split). And with that, aside from the Sobeys most of those family fortunes are split amongst family members are are not likely available to fund a football team.
Didn't know that about the Irvings, so thanks.
IIRC the McCains were heavily involved with the Touchdown Atlantic series and were thought to be interested in getting involved with a team based in Moncton. If one of (or all of for that matter) the MCains, Irvings and Sobey's family were to get involved with the CFL and a team based in Halifax; it would be a massive win for everyone. They clearly have the money to get 'er done, but not sure if the will is there. IMO building a Landsdowne Live type of development in the Dartmouth Crossing area would be the way to go.

[Argoknot]

I can't recall about McCain involvement but Commish Cohon had an advisory board of Maritime businessmen and no one was interested, unfortunately.

[Argoknot]

Irvings don't get involved with sports; at least not at an Ownership level. K.C had an arena named after him, but that's about it.I think I read somewhere where the Irvings are the largest private landowner in Maine and fifth largest in the US (http://www.cnbc.com/id/100325780).