Tim Burke resigns; Creehan now DC

[Will]

Tim Burke has resigned due to "personal reasons." Now we are stuck with Casey Creehan as defensive co-ordinator, which makes me very unsettled given his track record.

[Skinny G]

I would've preferred if they tried to go after Benevides

[ArgoGabe22]

Wasn't too too thrilled with Burke but Creehan scares me. Will JAIME ELIZONDO be getting a promotion soon? Yikes

[paulwoods13]

Creehan has got to be ready for a coordinator role at some point. Maybe this is it. He's coached for many years despite being a young pup and has been a coordinator before, so I'm prepared to see how he does for a quarter or two before jumping off the cliff.

[ArgoRavi]

Yeah, I am not a big Creehan fan as a defensive co-ordinator. He ran, arguably, the worst defence in modern times in Hamilton back in 2012. Hopefully, the third time will be the charm for him as IIRC he had a difficult time as defensive co-ordinator in Winnipeg as well.

[R.J]

I'm very concerned about Creehan taking over as DC, IMO single handedly ran the one of the worst defenses I've ever seen two years in a row. I would have much rather seen Pete Kuharchek named defensive coordinator, even if that meant introducing a new defensive scheme.

[gilthethrill]

I got a bad feeling about this.........

[Neely2005]

Crazy. At least it's before training camp. Hopefully Tim Burke is okay.

[argonaut11xx]

This is TERRIBLE news...

Hopefully all is well with Tim Burke...

(where is Marcello Simmons these days?)

[1argoholic]

The unsettled business in Argoland just keeps coming. I don't like this at all. It's just a game however and hopefully Burke is healthy and ok.

On a side note the news in Sensland keeps becomeing more and more bleak. One coach lost to cancer. GM battling cancer and an owner with a serious health issue.

[R.J]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Scott Milanovich said Burke's resignation wasn't out of the blue. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Argos?src=hash">#Argos</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFL?src=hash">#CFL</a></p>&mdash; Kirk Penton (@PentonKirk) <a href="https://twitter.com/PentonKirk/status/599274539604791296">May 15, 2015</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Milanovich said Burke is in fine health. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Argos?src=hash">#Argos</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFL?src=hash">#CFL</a></p>&mdash; Kirk Penton (@PentonKirk) <a href="https://twitter.com/PentonKirk/status/599274868559872000">May 15, 2015</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Milanovich said Casey Creehan played a big role in turning the <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Argos?src=hash">#Argos</a> defence around last season. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFL?src=hash">#CFL</a></p>&mdash; Kirk Penton (@PentonKirk) <a href="https://twitter.com/PentonKirk/status/599275908990566401">May 15, 2015</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Milanovich said there were no philosophical differences between him and Burke. It sounds like a family issue. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFL?src=hash">#CFL</a></p>&mdash; Kirk Penton (@PentonKirk) <a href="https://twitter.com/PentonKirk/status/599276227258515457">May 15, 2015</a></blockquote>
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[gilthethrill]

Glad to hear Burke is in fine health. As for Creehan getting the promotion, it makes sense. Milanovich was wise to promote from within, especially with a coach who has been there for a while. Will the Argos go & hire a new DL coach to replace Creehan?

[paulwoods13]

Man, the fear on here is both palpable and IMO irrational. How many times have fans of our team (or any team) been sure something good or bad would happen, and then the opposite happened when the season began? Just because Creehan had a bad defence with Hamilton does not mean he will have a bad defence with us, A million factors come into play -- it's not just who the coordinator is. I would bet a lot of money that Milanovich is extremely confident Creehan can do a more-than-adequate job.

[doubleblue]

Bad defenses seem to follow Creehan around though.

[Wobbler]

Maybe I'm wrong, but I think of defense as 90% personnel, 10% coaching. I'm more concerned about whether we'll field an effective secondary than who our DC is.

[Ballstothewall]

Tim did not like the fact he was going to make less then 6 other DC

[R.J]

Man, the fear on here is both palpable and IMO irrational. How many times have fans of our team (or any team) been sure something good or bad would happen, and then the opposite happened when the season began? Just because Creehan had a bad defence with Hamilton does not mean he will have a bad defence with us, A million factors come into play -- it's not just who the coordinator is. I would bet a lot of money that Milanovich is extremely confident Creehan can do a more-than-adequate job.
Tim Burke himself stated that one of Creehan's issues while the Bombers were running Creehan's defense was that he's very conservative, too conservative at times. Which is why he (Burke) was going to become more hands on with the defense. Look back at Hamilton's and Winnipeg's defenses under Creehan and you'll understand the fear.

Tim did not like the fact he was going to make less then 6 other DC
Source ?

[paulwoods13]

Speaking of sources, what is the source for what Burke allegedly said about Creehan? Folks are free to be full of fear. I'm looking forward to seeing what our defence can do this year.

[argotom]

This does not bode well for the season.
Usually when something like this happens so close to training camp or the beginning of the season it is either argument with other staff or HC or the usual philosophical differences.
Like others have mentioned Creehan is not well regarded as a DC and has had a number of failures in similar posts.

[R.J]

Speaking of sources, what is the source for what Burke allegedly said about Creehan? Folks are free to be full of fear. I'm looking forward to seeing what our defence can do this year.
http://www.cfl.ca/article/irving-burke-refusing-to-accept-excuses

- Regarding defensive meltdowns in the last two outings, Burke said: “I’ve spoken to defensive coordinator Casey Creehan and told him I am going to get more involved in the defence. I think we need to play more man to man and we need to blitz more. We were too conservative against rookie Calgary quarterback Bo Levi Mitchell”

There was a whole interview about it on "The Coaches Show" at CJOB, when Bruke was the HC of Winnipeg, however CJOB doesn't carry audio segment for longer than a month it seems.

[AngeloV]

I'm not overly concerned. The Bombers and Ti-Cats that Creehan coached on were very bad teams. If you don't feel you have the personnel to play man coverage, you can't. Time will tell, but I'm not going to complain about him without seeing what happens.

[jerrym]

On TV, I found Burke's body language was self- and team-defeating in communicating to the players in Winnipeg that they were on the road to defeat again and never saw a sense of confidence relayed to the Argo players under his charge. Given that Creehan's Hamilton defence concerns me even more.

[Argo57]

Hopefully Creehan has learned from past experiences, remember Cortez constantly ripping into Creehan on the sidelines in 2012 while with the Ticats, although much of that could be the fact that Cortez looks like a miserable asshole at the best of times.
Hopefully this all works out but my gut tells me this could be another frustrating season in Argoland.

[OV Argo]

I'm not overly concerned. The Bombers and Ti-Cats that Creehan coached on were very bad teams. If you don't feel you have the personnel to play man coverage, you can't. Time will tell, but I'm not going to complain about him without seeing what happens.

I might not be that concerned IF Creehan had tons of vet, proven talent to work with on D - but - outside of Foley & Okpo at DE, maybe Gabriel at S = lots of question marks ... to be molded by a guy who seems like an @$$-hat and who has little to no proven D coaching ability.

Too late to start over and hire a good DC i guess (not really IMO - but that's debatable) = we shall see allright AV.

[paulwoods13]

This does not bode well for the season.
Usually when something like this happens so close to training camp or the beginning of the season it is either argument with other staff or HC or the usual philosophical differences.
Like others have mentioned Creehan is not well regarded as a DC and has had a number of failures in similar posts.

Or the coordinator wants out for personal reasons and the team survives just fine. See 1983 Toronto Argonauts.

[Fumblitis]

On TV, I found Burke's body language was self- and team-defeating in communicating to the players in Winnipeg that they were on the road to defeat again and never saw a sense of confidence relayed to the Argo players under his charge. Given that Creehan's Hamilton defence concerns me even more.Yeah you just got the sense that the team never bought in to what he was trying to do in Winnipeg. Publicly berating his players didn't help either.

[Argocister]

There was an article where Milanovich said Burkes resignation was a possible scenario, so they have had a succession plan in place for awhile. In fact Creehan went to some set of meetings instead of Burke during the off season ..... In case.
Creehan has had a year or two under Burke so probably has learned some.
This may be a better scenario than hiring a new DC altogether. At least the systems will be the same if not similar, and the players have had a year under their belt already. It won't be as disjointed as the move from
Jones to Burke .... And hopefully will be an improvement for the team, the fans and for
Creehan ... who could use a plus year for his resume. The Defense will just have to work hard!

[ArgoRavi]

There was an article where Milanovich said Burkes resignation was a possible scenario, so they have had a succession plan in place for awhile. In fact Creehan went to some set of meetings instead of Burke during the off season ..... In case.
Creehan has had a year or two under Burke so probably has learned some.
This may be a better scenario than hiring a new DC altogether. At least the systems will be the same if not similar, and the players have had a year under their belt already. It won't be as disjointed as the move from
Jones to Burke .... And hopefully will be an improvement for the team, the fans and for
Creehan ... who could use a plus year for his resume. The Defense will just have to work hard!

It is too late to hire a new defensive coordinator and try to install a new system. The advantage with Creehan is that he knows Burke's system and presumably believes in it so it won't be much of an adjustment for any defensive players who remain from last year.

[Argo57]

It is too late to hire a new defensive coordinator and try to install a new system. The advantage with Creehan is that he knows Burke's system and presumably believes in it so it won't be much of an adjustment for any defensive players who remain from last year.

Probably half of this defence will be new (thus learning a new system anyway), just can't get the 2012 Hamilton D fiasco (led by Creehan) out of my head and as OV correctly mentioned much of our D personnel will once again be new.
BTW not buying into the notion that it is too late to hire a new DC but the Argos seem to pay their assistants SFA so the cheap and easy fix is to "promote" Creehan.
My 11 year old son who love his Ticats just about split a gut laughing when he heard Creehan would be running our D as he remembers his frustration watching his teams pitiful D in 2012.

[gilthethrill]

Frank Z mentioned in his article today that the Argos are in need of a DB coach and that Jordan Younger, who I think is a AC at U of T would be a great hire. I agree. However, why is the team in need of a DB coach this late in the offseason??????

[ArgoZ]

Probably half of this defence will be new (thus learning a new system anyway), just can't get the 2012 Hamilton D fiasco (led by Creehan) out of my head and as OV correctly mentioned much of our D personnel will once again be new.
BTW not buying into the notion that it is too late to hire a new DC but the Argos seem to pay their assistants SFA so the cheap and easy fix is to "promote" Creehan.
My 11 year old son who love his Ticats just about split a gut laughing when he heard Creehan would be running our D as he remembers his frustration watching his teams pitiful D in 2012.

Wow, that's some fan. Most 8 year olds would struggle to name a single player, nevermind defensive coaches.

[Argo57]

Wow, that's some fan. Most 8 year olds would struggle to name a single player, nevermind defensive coaches.

I remember going to the Ex with my dad at that age not having a clue what was going on, I'm proud to pass my love of our game on to my son who cant get enough of the CFL and his Ticats.
On a side note the 2012 season actually ended on a high note for him as he was chosen to accompany Grover Covington onto the field when he was named to the All-Time Hamilton Tiger Cats team before the last game at Ivor Wynne.

[Argo57]

Or the coordinator wants out for personal reasons and the team survives just fine. See 1983 Toronto Argonauts.

Anything is possible Paul, except that when Darrel Davis left after 1982 most (if not all) of the players that executed his "Run and Shoot" offence returned in 1983, same can't be said regarding our defence.
Who knows how Creehan can and will be able to mold this D together with a substantial number of new players.

[Wobbler]

Frank Z mentioned in his article today that the Argos are in need of a DB coach and that Jordan Younger, who I think is a AC at U of T would be a great hire. I agree. However, why is the team in need of a DB coach this late in the offseason??????
In the article (http://www.torontosun.com/2015/05/15/argos-promote-casey-creehan-to-defensive-co-ordinator-after-tim-burke-resigns), Zicarelli claims that Younger "is the kind of individual the Argos require" and that "a guy of his magnitude should be pursued". It's all pretty vague and unconvincing. We haven't had a DB coach since Eddie Brown left in 2013.

[Argo57]

If you read the article (http://www.torontosun.com/2015/05/15/argos-promote-casey-creehan-to-defensive-co-ordinator-after-tim-burke-resigns), Zicarelli claims that Younger "is the kind of individual the Argos require" and that "a guy of his magnitude should be pursued". It's all pretty vague and unconvincing. We haven't had a DB coach since Eddie Brown left in 2013.

It also touched on the fact the organization may be harbouring some resentment regarding the timing of Youngers retirement which may be closer to the truth.

[paulwoods13]

Anything is possible Paul, except that when Darrel Davis left after 1982 most (if not all) of the players that executed his "Run and Shoot" offence returned in 1983, same can't be said regarding our defence.
Who knows how Creehan can and will be able to mold this D together with a substantial number of new players.

Yes. But Mouse ran an effective offence in 1982. With all the crying about Creehan, you'd think the 2014 Argo defence was lights out. Guess what -- it wasn't.

[Argo57]

That's true Paul (and my point as well) the Argonaut D has been sub-par since the 2012 World Championship revolving door with both players and coaches, although I loved the Foley trade and look forward to seeing Greenwood, our secondary in particular should be of great concern.

[AngeloV]

That's true Paul (and my point as well) the Argonaut D has been sub-par since the 2012 World Championship revolving door with both players and coaches, although I loved the Foley trade and look forward to seeing Greenwood, our secondary in particular should be of great concern.

Secondary is definitely a concern, but if the new rules are implemented as the league says they will, I think every secondary in the league may have big concerns.

[doubleblue]

Secondary is definitely a concern, but if the new rules are implemented as the league says they will, I think every secondary in the league may have big concerns.

The new rules that don't allow contact after 5 yards might have something to do with nine of the twelve listed DB's being 5'11 and under. Smaller quicker guys who can cover better. The problem is there quite a few tall receivers in the League now.

[Stevoman]

Lots of factors that will determine how the Argos do. Adjustment to new rules, Creehan with a whole new secondary, the health of Ray (#1 thing that determine's this season's success), Durie's health, emergence of new reliable receivers, Oline and LT help...never mind the ownership distractions.

[ArgoRavi]

Secondary is definitely a concern, but if the new rules are implemented as the league says they will, I think every secondary in the league may have big concerns.

I was thinking that same thing this morning, AV. I would not be surprised to see average scores go back up to over 60 points per game this season which would be the highest per game average in over 20 years

Ultimately, the key for the Argos on defence will be what kind of pressure they can get with their front four. If they can get lots of pressure with their front four, it will make Creehan's job much easier.

[johnnyice]

No worries ! It's not like Burke was a STUBLER or Jones......

[ArgoGabe22]

No worries ! It's not like Burke was a STUBLER or Jones......

While Jones had success, he was one of the most frustrating to watch. Always had confidence in Stubler.

[argos1873]

I remember going to the Ex with my dad at that age not having a clue what was going on, I'm proud to pass my love of our game on to my son who cant get enough of the CFL and his Ticats.
On a side note the 2012 season actually ended on a high note for him as he was chosen to accompany Grover Covington onto the field when he was named to the All-Time Hamilton Tiger Cats team before the last game at Ivor Wynne.

That's awesome. Your only failure seems to be passing on your love of the Argos, but hey, we can't be perfect. :)

[Argo57]

That's awesome. Your only failure seems to be passing on your love of the Argos, but hey, we can't be perfect. :)

Cleo Lemon prompted the switch to the Ticats.

[argos1873]

Cleo Lemon prompted the switch to the Ticats.

Hahaha, no words.

[Will]

The significant difference between Mouse Davis' departure in 1983 and Tim Burke's departure in 2015 is that in 1983 you had one of the most talented offenses in the Canadian Football League. The Argos' defense of 2015 will have areas where the starters will lack CFL experience.

[paulwoods13]

That's one significant difference. Another (more significant IMO) is that Mouse Davis's offence was incredibly successful and innovative. Tim Burke's defence was neither. It astounds me that folks here are so upset about his departure. What did the defence do last year to warrant such a response to the DC's resignation?

[Will]

That's one significant difference. Another (more significant IMO) is that Mouse Davis's offence was incredibly successful and innovative. Tim Burke's defence was neither. It astounds me that folks here are so upset about his departure. What did the defence do last year to warrant such a response to the DC's resignation?

His replacement.

[AngeloV]

I'm going to wait and see before I jump all over Creehan. He wouldn't be the first coach that got off to a rocky start in his career to turn things around with more experience. Orlondo Steinauer's D was not great as an Argo coach, and he went back to ST co-ordinator when Milo and Jones came here. He seemed to have learned a thing or 2 since then.

[paulwoods13]

His replacement.

Sorry but that has little to do with the job Burke did as coordinator in 2014. Unless you are laying all of the defence's faults last year on Creehan, which IMO would be way off base. Position coaches can do only so much. And BTW there have been coaches in this league who became successful after being terrible in the early part of their career. Creehan was not the sole cause of his defence's failures when he was a coordinator elsewhere, and there is no reason to believe he is doomed to fail this year.