July 13, 2015: Toronto Argonauts vs. Calgary Stampeders

[T-Bone]

http://cfl.assets.mrx.ca/shared/sked_blocks_logos/2012_2/2012_schedule_default2/tor.png vs. http://cfl.assets.mrx.ca/shared/sked_blocks_logos/2012_2/2012_schedule_default2/cgy.png

Week 3
Monday, July 13, 2015 at 9:00pm EDT.
McMahon Stadium. Calgary, AB.

TV: TSN1/3/4/5 (http://www.tsn.ca/cfl-on-tsn-broadcast-schedule-1.206931)
Video Webcast: TSN Go (http://www.tsn.ca/tv#/) - ESPN3 (http://espn.go.com/watchespn/index/_/type/upcoming/sport/football/search/CFL/)
Radio: TOR: TSN 1050 (http://www.tsn.ca/radio/toronto-1050) - CGY: CHQR 770 (http://www.newstalk770.com/)
Audio Webcast: TOR: Here (http://www.tsn.ca/radio/tsn-1050-live-stream-1.52945?ot=example.AjaxPageLayout.ot) - CGY: Here (http://www.newstalk770.com/stampeders/)
Satellite Radio: SiriusXM (http://www.siriusxm.ca/sports/cfl/)

Depth Charts: TOR: Here (http://www.argonauts.ca/depthchart/list/team/7/year/2015) - CGY: Here (http://www.stampeders.com/mediainfo)

Game Preview: Here (http://argonauts.ca/video/index/id/112627)

Post-Game Update:

Game Highlights (http://www.cfl.ca/video/index/id/112729)

Game Recap (http://argonauts.ca/article/argos-stamps-game-recap)

Final Score: 20-25 (http://www.tsn.ca/cfl/game/toronto-argonauts-calgary-stampeders-20150713/Stats)

[Qman]

i assume this on monday instead of saturday/sunday to avoid the last two days of the stampede.

Interesting to see what the argos do during the the Ex next year

[1argoholic]

We always had to walk through the Ex to get to games at CNE every year. We didn't have to pay because of our tickets. I loved the ex as a kid but hated it starting at about 18. Just dropped my wife off at Pearson heading to Calgary for her uncles funeral. The whole family are huge Stamps fans but she comes home Sunday so she'll miss the game. Her uncle used to drop little jokes about me being an Argos fan.

[AngeloV]

i assume this on monday instead of saturday/sunday to avoid the last two days of the stampede.

Interesting to see what the argos do during the the Ex next year

The "EX" game was always my favourite of the year. Used to love going on he Alpine Way before and after the game yelling AAARRRRGGGGOOOOSSSS to every car we passed. I just hope I have the will power to avoid the CNE casino now.

[T-Bone]

i assume this on monday instead of saturday/sunday to avoid the last two days of the stampede.

Interesting to see what the argos do during the the Ex next year
TFC usually has one or two games during the Ex and like 1argoholic said of Argos games in the past during the Ex, your game ticket includes admission for that day. I assume if the Argos play during the Ex next year it will be no different.

Personally I really enjoy games during the Ex because we always make a day of it. Hit the Food Building, grab a few drinks etc. Always a fun day.

[Will]

The Argos usually had a game against Hamilton during the CNE didn't they? A perfect time to restart that tradition.

As for the game itself, the Stampeders haven't looked like themselves in the first two weeks. Whether they get their intensity level as a result will go a long way to determine who wins this game. For me right now it's a bit unpredictable.

[AngeloV]

The Argos usually had a game against Hamilton during the CNE didn't they? A perfect time to restart that tradition.



Good question. I remember a few against Hamilton, but 1 I remember in particular was during that bad '85 season against Edmonton. Mike Hohensee was the Argos starting QB as Holloway was hurt much of that season, and he had an awsome perfomance in a blowout victory. I remember being so pumped about the possibilities, then the next week in Montreal, reality hit.

[jerrym]

I have a suspicion that Calgary will try to stampede us right out of the gate on Monday as they will Huf will be breathing fire and brimstone after the clobbering by Montreal. However, if Argos can withstand this in the early going, they could have a decent shot at a victory.

[Wobbler]

After some comforting continuity between Week 1 and 2, we're going to see some significant changes this week.

Definitely out: Durie, Underwood, Gabriel
Ready to come back: Keeping
Perhaps ready to return: Hawkins*, King

I had thought that Agnew would take Underwood's spot, but the fact that Milanovich specifically mentioned Hawkins today suggests that they'll take him off the 6-game list and play him at HB. So... perhaps:

Durie -> Coombs (with Bradfield taking Coombs backup spot)
Underwood -> Hawkins
Gabriel -> M Black
Smith -> Keeping (with the appropriate shift of the OL)

King may be healthy after two weeks on the 1w IR, but I suspect that he'll continue to be "hurt". Campbell and van Roten have been very good.

Coombs can't truly replace Durie - at least not yet - but the other changes are either hypothetical upgrades (Hawkins>Underwood), probable upgrades (Keeping>Smith), or tolerable downgrades (M Black<Gabriel). We're in reasonably good shape going into Calgary... but no more injuries, please!


Hmm. Have I found a VB bug? I'm pretty sure that a less than symbol should be displayed as-is, and even my old friend NOPARSE doesn't fix this.

[Wobbler]

After some comforting continuity between Week 1 and 2, we're going to see some significant changes this week.

Definitely out: Durie, Underwood, Gabriel
Ready to come back: Keeping
Perhaps ready to return: Hawkins*, King

I had thought that Agnew would take Underwood's spot, but the fact that Milanovich specifically mentioned Hawkins today suggests that they'll take him off the 6-game list and play him at HB. So... perhaps:

Durie -> Coombs (with Bradfield taking Coombs backup spot)
Underwood -> Hawkins
Gabriel -> M Black
Smith -> Keeping (with the appropriate shift of the OL)

King may be healthy after two weeks on the 1w IR, but I suspect that he'll continue to be "hurt". Campbell and van Roten have been very good.

Coombs can't truly replace Durie - at least not yet - but the other changes are either hypothetical upgrades (Hawkins>Underwood), probable upgrades (Keeping>Smith), or tolerable downgrades (M Black<Gabriel). We're in reasonably good shape going into Calgary... but no more injuries, please!


Hmm. Have I found a VB bug? I'm pretty sure that a less than symbol should be displayed as-is, and even my old friend NOPARSE doesn't fix this.
Testing. Still broken. Weird! Anyway, the jist of the invisible part of my previous message was that even though Matt Black is a tolerable downgrade from Gabriel, our team is in pretty good shape.

[1argoholic]

Hopefully the stamps are out partying to much during Stampede and they'll be a wreck come Monday night. By the way I have no use for rodeo's like the Stampede and their killing of horses every year. In this day and age for humans to want to use animals in so called sports that are very dangerous to those animals pisses me off to no end. I couldn't care if the humans get hurt as they know what they're getting into.

If we can pressure Mitchell at all and cover at all we should have a good chance. Calgary is due for a breakout game but hopefully Monday isn't it.

[argonaut11xx]

Calgary is due for a breakout game but hopefully Monday isn't it.

Agreed, and thats the part that scares the heck out of me. But as someone said above, If the Argo's can withstand the initial stampeders attack, keep it close, I think the Argo's have a real chance.

The key to this game, imo, is to make bo levi THROW the ball. If the stamps settle in and let Cornish run, it will be a much tougher night.

[Wobbler]

Hawkins was indeed taken off the 6 game list yesterday, so I think it's a safe bet that he will take Underwood's spot.

[argotom]

I expect the offense to steamroll again, it's the defense that I am worried about.
The inability to stop the run and the DB's playing too soft resulted in more then 500+ yards by the Riders in regulation time.
The fact that Gabriel is now out won't help.

[AngeloV]

I honestly believe the Argos did a decent job against the run. Yes, Messam had 84 yards, but it took him 19 carries to do so. That is far below CFL standards from a rushing avg point of view. QB pressure was the bigger issue, but I'm hoping it was just a one off.

[argolio]

I honestly believe the Argos did a decent job against the run.I think the best thing we did on defense was force them to settle for four field goals. If one of those had been a TD, we probably would have lost.

[QBall]

I still get chills thinking about last week's game against the Riders. If this one against the Stamps is anything like that one I don't know if my heart can take it. 3-0 here we come!

[mchesher03]

this may come across as loser talk but does anyone else feel the Boatmen are almost playing with house money at this point of their extended road trip? I had nightmares of an 0-5 start and very very realistically we may be able to get out of it with 4 wins at this point. who'd have thought that a month ago.

anyhow I'm thoroughly enjoying being pleasantly surprised with this team on both sides of the ball. I am wary about Monday given Gabriel (think he holds that secondary together better than most of us outsiders realize) and Durie (a guy who can turn checkdowns into first downs and a Canadian to boot) are out for it. We'll see what happens though and like i said I keep thinking we're playing with house money so I'm trying not to worry haha....

[AngeloV]

Thanks to the Monday night scheduling, Argos have a rare Saturday practice this week. For anyone interested, practice starts at 11:30 or so. Should be beautiful weather wise.

[argotom]

this may come across as loser talk but does anyone else feel the Boatmen are almost playing with house money at this point of their extended road trip? I had nightmares of an 0-5 start and very very realistically we may be able to get out of it with 4 wins at this point. who'd have thought that a month ago.

anyhow I'm thoroughly enjoying being pleasantly surprised with this team on both sides of the ball. I am wary about Monday given Gabriel (think he holds that secondary together better than most of us outsiders realize) and Durie (a guy who can turn checkdowns into first downs and a Canadian to boot) are out for it. We'll see what happens though and like i said I keep thinking we're playing with house money so I'm trying not to worry haha....


Agree with you.
I am very worried about our defense as it looked porous against the Riders.
Did anyone notice how Foley appears a non factor so far at rush end?
With Gabriel out it may get worse.

[gilthethrill]

Agree with you.
I am very worried about our defense as it looked porous against the Riders.
Did anyone notice how Foley appears a non factor so far at rush end?
With Gabriel out it may get worse.

I have noticed Foley making a lot of tackles from behind, but the D has yet to register a sack from the DE position.

[paulwoods13]

Agree with you.
I am very worried about our defense as it looked porous against the Riders.
Did anyone notice how Foley appears a non factor so far at rush end?
With Gabriel out it may get worse.

We are 2-0. Our defence made stops when it had to last week, several times. Let's not get carried away with the glass half empty.

[D-Gap-Willie]

Agree with you.
I am very worried about our defense as it looked porous against the Riders.
Did anyone notice how Foley appears a non factor so far at rush end?
With Gabriel out it may get worse.
I agree that our defense in general did not play well against the Riders - I think they are capable of more, and hope that they deliver in Calgreeeeeeeeee ! They are still getting to know each other.

On Foley's play getting worse because Gabriel is out. I really don't understand the thinking behind this.

[AngeloV]

I agree that our defense in general did not play well against the Riders - I think they are capable of more, and hope that they deliver in Calgreeeeeeeeee ! They are still getting to know each other.

On Foley's play getting worse because Gabriel is out. I really don't understand the thinking behind this.

At the risk of spoiling my image and actually defending argotom, I think he meant the Argos d in general could get worse, and not Foley in particular.

That didn't feel right.....So...
The post in general is his typical over-reaction, the sky is falling, I will change my mind next week style.

[Argo57]

At the risk of spoiling my image and actually defending argotom, I think he meant the Argos d in general could get worse, and not Foley in particular.

That didn't feel right.....So...
The post in general is his typical over-reaction, the sky is falling, I will change my mind next week style.

The good part is we are banking wins as our D works out the kinks and becomes a cohesive unit, the same can be said for our O.
Much higher talent level this year compared to 2013 and 14 IMO, credit to the football ops.

[ArgoRavi]

The good part is we are banking wins as our D works out the kinks and becomes a cohesive unit, the same can be said for our O.
Much higher talent level this year compared to 2013 and 14 IMO, credit to the football ops.

And with a team with so much inexperience there are going to be kinks as we saw last week. Perhaps the win over Edmonton set up some unrealistic expectations for some fans. This is a team with a lot of talent but it is going to take time for this team to reach its potential and there will be rough patches in which fans will have to be patient.

[D-Gap-Willie]

Has anyone seen an Argo depth chart yet for this game ? Probably jumping the gun - my brain says Monday game but it's hard to wait .

[Wobbler]

No chart yet, but it is still early. Often the web site is the last to have it; if you're eager (like me), it's best to check the team FB feed (https://www.facebook.com/ArgosFootball) and Twitter when it is <24h before the game.

[Wobbler]

Speaking of charts, Calgary's is up (http://cfl.uploads.mrx.ca/cgy/downloads/downloads/2015/07/150713-RD-vstor2015074153.pdf). I find it surprising that a team considered to have excellent Canadian content is only starting 7 NATs this year.

[AngeloV]

From my observations at practice yesterday:
Starters On Offence:
O-line: Campbell, Holmes, Keeping, Van Roten, Van Zeyl
receivers: Hazelton, Owens, Coombs, Elliott, Gurley (although Elliott had a collision Travis Hawkins late in practice and had a slight limp, I don't think anything to keep him out)
RB:Whitaker
QB: Harris

On Defence:
D-Line: Okpalaugo, Laing, Cummings and Foley and Vega rotating in at end (guessing Waud checks in for Delano Johnson, but maybe both will dress)
LB: no changes Issaac, Jones and Greenwood
Secondary: Owusu-Ansah, Devin Smith, Mat Black, Hawkins and Jefferson

KO returns had Josey and Bradfield deep
Punt return had Owens

[AngeloV]

Speaking of charts, Calgary's is up (http://cfl.uploads.mrx.ca/cgy/downloads/downloads/2015/07/150713-RD-vstor2015074153.pdf). I find it surprising that a team considered to have excellent Canadian content is only starting 7 NATs this year.

I count 8 starting Nationals. 6 on O and 2 on D.

4 o-lineman
2 RB's (or 1 RB and 1 replaced by a receiver)
2 DT's.

Cote is listed as a starter, but when he isn't on the field, either Parker or Charbonneau are.

[Wobbler]

I count 8 starting Nationals. 6 on O and 2 on D.
Whoops. I'm so used to our charts that I forgot to consider the FB as a starter. Eight it is.

[Wobbler]

Did you see King at practice, Angelo? I'm curious about whether he's still hurt or whether we genuinely prefer van Roten at this point.

[AngeloV]

Did you see King at practice, Angelo? I'm curious about whether he's still hurt or whether we genuinely prefer van Roten at this point.

King was there and participating. I think until they are 100% sure on Keeping, you'll see Van Roten dress over King.

[Will]

From my observations at practice yesterday:
Starters On Offence:
O-line: Campbell, Holmes, Keeping, Van Roten, Van Zeyl
receivers: Hazelton, Owens, Coombs, Elliott, Gurley (although Elliott had a collision Travis Hawkins late in practice and had a slight limp, I don't think anything to keep him out)
RB:Whitaker
QB: Harris

On Defence:
D-Line: Okpalaugo, Laing, Cummings and Foley and Vega rotating in at end (guessing Waud checks in for Delano Johnson, but maybe both will dress)
LB: no changes Issaac, Jones and Greenwood
Secondary: Owusu-Ansah, Devin Smith, Mat Black, Hawkins and Jefferson

KO returns had Josey and Bradfield deep
Punt return had Owens

Depth chart (with standard disclaimer of at times inaccurate) still lists Van Roten starting over Keeping at C. Smith remains at RG beside Van Zeyl.
Correct on the receivers.
Hawkins replaces Underwood at HB and Matt Black replaces Gabriel at safety.

[Wobbler]

...but King comes off the IR. They may not make the final decision on the OL until tomorrow.

[paulwoods13]

King was there and participating. I think until they are 100% sure on Keeping, you'll see Van Roten dress over King.

King was not nearly as good last year as he was in 2013, and IMO Van Roten has been excellent. I think he is ahead of King on the depth chart even after Keeping is healthy.

[AngeloV]

King was not nearly as good last year as he was in 2013, and IMO Van Roten has been excellent. I think he is ahead of King on the depth chart even after Keeping is healthy.

You may be right, Paul. But I'd like to see how a healthy King performs under Himebauch as the O-Line coach. They had a very inexperienced coach there last year in Brian Chiu. It's quite possible they had bad schemes last year.

[D-Gap-Willie]

It'll be very interesting to see how Hawkins performs - I've been looking forward to that. Will his performance keep Underwood on the sidelines ? But then, I am not sure of the extent of Underwood's injury - he like everyone else is on the 6 game IR

[jerrym]

The title says it all about the team with the most depth coming of a thumping: "Argos wary of sleeping giant in Stamps" and playing at home.

http://www.torontosun.com/2015/07/12/argos-wary-of-sleeping-giant-in-stamps

[jerrym]

Having 10 days to lick their wounds I expect Calgary to come out of the gate trying to stampede the Argos into a huge hole.



“The important thing is that we take advantage of the rest that we got, take advantage of the extra time to prepare and go out and play a good football game,” said Stampeders coach and general manager John Hufnagel.


http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sports/football/after-slow-start-and-layoff-stampeders-have-plenty-to-prove-against-argos/article25476464/

[Wobbler]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Tonight&#39;s scratches for the <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Argos?src=hash">#Argos</a> will be: OL Jeff Keeping OL Jarriel King <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CFLGameDay?src=hash">#CFLGameDay</a></p>&mdash; Toronto Argonauts (@TorontoArgos) <a href="https://twitter.com/TorontoArgos/status/620745702956748801">July 14, 2015</a></blockquote> <script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[Will]

The Argos are keeping the OL consistent until the dam bursts I suppose.

[jerrym]

Argos Calgary Game Preview



Many touted Calgary as possible repeat Grey Cup champions this year but the team has shown just how difficult dominating the league over an extended period of time can be. After barely topping the Ticats in Week 1, the Stamps dropped last week’s game to the Alouettes in unspectacular fashion. Bo Levi Mitchell has thrown three interceptions to his one touchdown pass this season, an uncharacteristic statistic that will surely even itself out over the course of the year.
Mitchell and the rest of the Stamps aren’t panicking about how the season has begun and are simply focusing on the new task at hand. “We’re facing a team that, yeah, they just let up 40 points in a game but it was an overtime game. It was a game that their offence was putting up a lot of points too so the defence is going to be out on the field a lot longer,” said Mitchell. “We’re not going to give into that and think that they’re a bad defence in any means. They’re a very good defence, they’re physical, they’re fast.” ...
The Stampeders welcome back receiver Jeff Fuller after the wideout missed last week’s game. Despite only playing in a single game, the 25-year-old still leads the team with 148 receiving yards. Mitchell is happy to see Fuller again in his receiving corps based on his stature alone. Even though Fuller only stands six feet tall, Mitchell feeds off the chemistry the pair have together. “Look at the guy, some guys aren’t as big as him. It’s basketball. If you’re out there and I want to throw you a ball down low in basketball, it’s going to be pretty easy to throw it to you when guys are smaller than you,” said Mitchell. “When you have one-on-ones with that guy, it’s easy to take shots with him because he’s a guy that does have great ball skill. He has a great eye for the ball. He has a great knack for catching it at its highest point and that’s a big thing for receivers.” ...
Jon Cornish has not been as heavily relied upon in Calgary’s offence as last year, topping out at just 70 yards through two contests so far. Whether by design or by game flow, the team has opted for a more aerial attack. ...
Should Trever Harris connect with Chad Owens on a pass sometime during the game, Owens will pass Pinball Clemons for third all-time on the most consecutive games with a receptions list with 69. Owens has been Harris’ favourite target thus far in the season.
Opportunity is knocking for another Argo. After news that Andre Durie is likely to miss the rest of the season, Anthony Coombs’ role in the offence is set to take the next step. The second-year man is leading the team in combined return yards and should see his rushing touches go up another notch.



http://www.vancouversun.com/sports/football/lions/After+team+record+field+goal+Lions+Leone+admits/11208777/story.html

[jerrym]

Great punting start by Pfeffer with 63 yard kick.

[jerrym]

Nice stop by Matt Black to prevent Calgary first down.

[ArgoZ]

Nice defensive and tackling. Need a score here to set a tone.

[jerrym]

Great open field tackle by Greenwood on Cornish.

[bluto]

crazy holding on the calgary LG there

[bluto]

ha! another bad hold gets called but we got the ball anyway!

[ArgoZ]

I would love to see Owens get a TD tonight and do his Andre Durie impression/celebration.

[jerrym]

Harris passes look sharp and on target, even on the interception, which was deflected.

[ArgoZ]

Team is playing solid. No and low scoring is making this a game they can steal.

[bluto]

Beautiful timing throw to Hazelton! Hazelton does very, very well to hang on.

[bluto]

I think Elliot gets away with a push-off... but wow did they make that TD look easy

[Fumblitis]

Pitch and catch as though he'd been a starter for years.

[jerrym]

I think Elliot gets away with a push-off... but wow did they make that TD look easy

What! A CFL ref miss an Argo penalty. Impossible!

[Wobbler]

Just started watching in time to see Harris engineer a nice TD drive. What did the rest of the quarter look like?

[argotom]

Offense looking sharp again, meanwhile Greenwood having an awesome game on the defensive side.

[ArgoZ]

Calgary is going to get frustrated with the Cornish shut down. Let's go D!

[argotom]

So far, the Stamps are not the same team as last year.

[jerrym]

Pfeffer saves Argos after Calgary runs through half the team on a return!

[jerrym]

Calgary not showing its usual discipline when it comes to taking needless penalties.

[argotom]

Our DB's having coverage issues.

[jerrym]

Nice tribute to Durie during prep this week with everyone wearing #32.

[jerrym]

I like the new rule that means you have to kick the PAT from the 32. It puts some drama back in the play, such as in the miss on Calgary's TD.

[bluto]

down by contact?

edit... damn... looks a fumble to me

[Will]

Two turnovers, both on Chad Owens. Now the Stampeders have the lead.

[argotom]

Two huge mistakes for Owens have cost us.

[jerrym]

What a turnaround on the turnover by Owen's fumble!

[bluto]

i doubt we'll challenge even though it looks like Owens caught it. we never win those.

[bluto]

shit. they're starting to open us up but good.

we need a few halftime adjustments.

another O-Line injury? geez...

[argotom]

Just like against the Riders, Mitchell is having a passing field day.
Our coverage is bad.

[ArgoZ]

shit. they're starting to open us up but good.

we need a few halftime adjustments.

another O-Line injury? geez...

Argos should win if they slowly injure everyone, no?

[jerrym]

More poor coverage by Argo dbs on deep passes.

[Will]

Argos are getting beaten downfield. The D-Line is losing containment too often.

[jerrym]

Argos need to respond before things get out of hand, although in the CFL things are never completely out of hand.

[Wobbler]

If Foley and Okpalaugo can't get pressure against Calgary's #3 and #4 options at tackle, something's wrong. Hopefully we'll be able to make it tougher for Mitchell going forward.

[Will]

The Stampeders were 2nd and 13 and Bo Levi runs for the 1st down. The Stampeders were 2nd and 16 and Bo Levi throws for a long gain.

What Wobbler said above.

[bluto]

kinda love Trevor Harris right now.

stupid move by Elliot on the celebration. he knows better and we're trailing.

[jerrym]

Tori Gurley wins fight for the ball for TD!

[argotom]

Important TD before the half, equally as important we have to hold the Stamps now.

[jerrym]

Argo history repeats itself again with another dumb totally useless penalty.

[allatevikin]

ello, like to introduce myself

Ud El is te name

[jerrym]

Cory Greenwood is having a strong game.

[argotom]

A third mistake by Owens why did he give up the point?

[jerrym]

ello, like to introduce myself

Ud El is te name
Hi. Welcome to the good ship Argo.

[Will]

Not one of Chad Owens' better quarters of football.

The Argos need to obviously limit turnovers and affording Calgary good field position.

[Neely2005]

What the hell is Owens thinking?

[allatevikin]

Stampeders practiced lit on Saturday fellows. 46 23 must not be contained. Avoid boxing them, eight balling Hughes with crash plays, instead slant Maver.... Peanuts is to penalties as round nut is to ground hoaug

[ArgoZ]

The Argos coverage "issues", seem to be the amazing play of Calgary's receivers. Players are never going to have a perfect game, we have talked about how hard it is to cover now in this league, but Calgary making great plays is not making it any easier.

[argotom]

The Argos coverage "issues", seem to be the amazing play of Calgary's receivers. Players are never going to have a perfect game, we have talked about how hard it is to cover now in this league, but Calgary making great plays is not making it any easier.


Yes but the same thing happened with the DB's in Regina.

[bluto]

another Stamp down... we may win by attrition.

[ArgoZ]

Yes but the same thing happened with the DB's in Regina.

Sure, Riders made some great catches too, but the Argos have not been torched in this game like last week. The blitz doesn't get enough pressure and your DB is left in single coverage. Combined with an amazing catch, your asking too much.

[argotom]

Boy you hate to pile on Chad, another poor decision in letting the punt roll backwards some 10-15 yards.

[allatevikin]

jerrym (http://www.argofans.com/member.php?71-jerrym&) ope you are enjoyin te snackbar at our stadium

beans and corn nuts

[argolio]

That "must stay on the line" rule for punts needs to go.

[allatevikin]

x-bone; im here for te same practical reason your ere i tink

[argolio]

Nice play by Raymond, but Suitor's an idiot. Ball wasn't thrown outside enough.

[jerrym]

Pfeffer shows his strong foot again with 49 yard FG.

[argolio]

Super play by Isaac.

[argotom]

That Laing is one dirty player.
Stupid move.

[jerrym]

Isaac climbs ladder to tip ball into a Smith interception!

[argolio]

That Laing is one dirty player.
Stupid move.That was a stupid play, not dirty.

[Wobbler]

Agreed, argolio. Nothing dirty about that.

[argolio]

Great play by Brandon Smith.

I like our chances if we can win the field position battle.

[Will]

Great play by Brandon Smith.

I like our chances if we can win the field position battle.

Stopping them on 2nd down here will help that.

[argolio]

Super tackle by Greenwood. He's having himself a game.

[jerrym]

Greenwood stops Calgary getting a first down again.

[argolio]

If there's no infraction, DON'T THROW A FLAG!

[Wobbler]

It has been a while since we saw a nice return by Owens. He's still got it!

[ArgoZ]

If there's no infraction, DON'T THROW A FLAG!

Trigger fingers, LOL.

[jerrym]

Owens has made some mistakes tonight but looked like his old self on 39 yard punt return.

[argotom]

It has been a while since we saw a nice return by Owens. He's still got it!


Yes he does, back in the day he would have out maneuvered a punter.

[argolio]

Owens has made some mistakes tonight but looked like his old self on 39 yard punt return.Good sign that he's working through his issues today.

[Will]

A turnover deep in their own territory by Calgary would be what the doctor ordered.

[argolio]

It's good!

Nice job getting in FG range.

[jerrym]

Pfeffer does it again with a 45 yarder!

[allatevikin]

Is Calary o.c. off to ncaa (Pittsburg_. Sure looks like like a stud with all tat valore on beside the boot

[argotom]

Way too many flags in this game it's killing momentum.

[argolio]

Pfeffer does it again with a 45 yarder!if he keeps this up, we'll need to consider getting rid of Ricky Ray.....wait, wrong discussion.

[Will]

Way too many flags in this game it's killing momentum.

Welcome to the new CFL?

[argolio]

GregJones (it's all one word) with the sack!

[jerrym]

Black and Gabriel both gone now. Second year International Vincent Agnew now playing safety.

[ArgoZ]

if he keeps this up, we'll need to consider getting rid of Ricky Ray.....wait, wrong discussion.
LOL, nice one. I was gonna ask ArgoTom if it's time to give Swayze the boot? It is a "what have you done for me lately and for my future" league right?

[Wobbler]

Uh oh. I hope Matt Black can return for our next game.

[Will]

Matt Black is another one who had bad luck with injuries.

[argolio]

I'll take that punt.

If my ears are working okay, the officials appear to be on the receiving end of some choice words from Stamps fans.

[jerrym]

Pfeffer doing a fine job of punting.

[argotom]

LOL, nice one. I was gonna ask ArgoTom if it's time to give Swayze the boot? It is a "what have you done for me lately and for my future" league right?


No way Swayze is the best.
But give the kid credit though.

[argolio]

No, Suitor, it was Argo pressure which led to that pass.

[Will]

Calgary is doing just enough on their drives to sway the field position battle in their favour.

[argolio]

Bo Levi doesn't seem as decisive without his starting tackles.

Don't blame him.

[Will]

bradfield = brain cramp

[argolio]

Owens had half a step on Wall.

Mistake by Bradfield. That point would have been valuable.

[argotom]

A U of T kid, of all.

[Wobbler]

Bradfield, you nincompoop! (had to double-check the spelling of nincompoop)

[argolio]

Should be Cornish the rest of the way.

Gotta hold them to a FG attempt.

[jerrym]

Bradfield made a bone-headed mistake falling on the ball in the end zone, but he showed he has good speed which could help make him a good receiver in the future.

[jerrym]

In the last Calgary drive it has seemed like they are on a mission to score.

[Wobbler]

Damn. That was a great call against our blitz. We need to hide that better.

[argolio]

I really hope that's holding.

Same difference!

[Wobbler]

Dang. Rogers deked out our entire D on that play. We're really lucky about the penalty.

[argolio]

Dang. Rogers deked out our entire D on that play. We're really lucky about the penalty.Extremely lucky.

[argolio]

We held them to three, so we have a shot.

[Will]

No way Calgary lets us march this downfield.

[jerrym]

Only two penalties probably kept Calgary from getting a TD instead of a FG.

[argolio]

Coombs needed to turn that upfield.

[jerrym]

Hazelton saves first down after Owen's dropped pass.

[argolio]

And that's game.

[jerrym]

Generally, the Argo OL gave Harris very good protection - better than I thought they would at the start of the season.

[argotom]

Worst game of the year, 2 out of 3 still more then was expected.

[Neely2005]

One of the worst games that I've ever seen Owens play.

A couple of really stupid brain cramp plays by players that should know better.

[Will]

Calgary did just enough in the second half to hold onto win this game. Their defense remains tough, as usual, and their offense did just enough to keep the Argos out of prime field position. I don't think Chad Owens has played a worse game in an Argo uniform (aside from an early season game vs Hamilton in 2012) and there were simply too many mental mistakes made to beat the defending Grey Cup champions.

It sounds like Bruce Campbell had a good day going up against Charleston Hughes.

Of greater concern is the health of Matt Black because there are ratio implications there.

[ArgofanIan]

I switched back and forth between the radio and TV coverage.... including post game on 1050... I thought both coverage's were excellent...tough loss....tonight .... but it was an other very interesting game to watch.... Go Arrgos!!!

[jerrym]

Our three new international receivers, Hazelton, Gurley, and Elliott in this game continue to impress me and give us a better overall set of receivers than we had last year.

Cory Greenwood was outstanding, stopping Calgary from getting several first downs and ending up with 7 tackles as well as 2 STT.

[Blue90]

Is this really Professional Football?
I am getting real tired of this.
Penalties, bone head mistakes, cheap shots, bad decisions, poor coaching. (and it's not only the players The refs are just as bad.)
The CFL should be embarrassed about the quality of play.
No wonder the Argos can't draw flies to their games.
(BTW. I'm really a big CFL fan, and have watching the games for more than 40 years.)

[bluto]

Sometimes you sneak out an ugly win on the road.

This was not one of those. Just an ugly loss. Shake it off. We were playing the champs at home during Stampede. Before the season started i had us getting tonked in this one.

Greenwood was a high point. As was the development of a receiving corps who look to be able to do the business for us this year. Josey may have crazy speed, but we haven't seen it yet. Running game or our underneath dump and run game wasn't working all night... not sure if credit goes to Stubler for that. Owens looked like he was out of sync. Our ratio is going to take some massaging if both Gabriel and Black are on the trainer's table. Harris continues to show that he is our future.

i still have no clue what does or does not constitute PI these days. i'm of the belief that they make it up as they go (not joking here).

Typically i have us reckoned as a loss in BC for 10pm starts as a dead certainty... kinda feels like we'll bounce back though.

[Fumblitis]

Our three new international receivers, Hazelton, Gurley, and Elliott in this game continue to impress me and give us a better overall set of receivers than we had last year....and to think that some members of this forum were freaking out about mostly rookie receivers this season. This speaks volumes about Barker and Co. and their ability to recruit talent. This trio is having a season similar to Austin Collie and Ryan Smith (before he was six gamed).

[paulwoods13]

It seemed to me that durie's three amigos (Black, Foley and especially Owens) were so bummed out for their friend that they lost concentration. Foley has yet to make an impact. Owens was atrocious in every respect.

On the bright side, the three new receivers are all players. Big, good hands, concentration and willing to fight for the ball. Pfeffer is a solid replacement for Waters. Greenwood is a stud.

The o-line keeps doing a solid job. But the loss of Black will screw up our roster flexibility. We'll have to go down to the minimum seven NAT starters unless we decide to sit either Van Roten or a receiver. Neither of those seems likely.

I sure would like to know what's going on with Robertson's health. Haven't seen anything about an injury. IMO our d-line was way better in week 1 with him and Wilson in there.

[AngeloV]

Tough game to lose last night. But let's be honest, flying back and forth across the country every week has to take it's toll on a team.

Offence definitely left some plays on the field. Harris was a little off on some of those deep balls, but the reads were good, so that is a definite plus.

Whitaker should have been used a little more.

Rough night for both Owens and Coombs.

O-line continues to impress.

Greenwood and Jones were beasts. Best LB'ing game from an Argos standpoint in a very long time.
Defensive ends have been a major no-show so far. They really need to pick it up, because they are getting good play from the tackles.

Personally, I think the secondary is unfairly being blamed for the bad pass defence. There isn't a secondary around that can stop a good passing game when the opposing QB has all day to throw. The fact that our ends had so little impact with both the starting tackles out is definitely a concern.

[argotom]

I agree three games in Foley has been bad, no impact and no idea why they would have traded Emery for him.
Conversely our 3 new receivers are awesome.

[paulwoods13]

I'd trade Emry for Foley 100 times out of 100, despite the fact Foley has not shown much yet this season. Greenwood and Jones are both substantial upgrades over Emry.

What really galled me about the d-ends was the fact they kept letting Mitchell break contain. He was deadly when rolling out of the pocket but we never really adjusted (altho we did give up only 3 pts in second half).

[ArgoGabe22]

Is Vega getting in more reps than Okapalugo? I'm really dissapointed in our pass rush. I had heard in the media that Foley would be loving to play in Creehan's system. Haven't seen much from the DEs yet.

[Will]

Were the 3 points surrendered in the second half genuinely an improvement or did Calgary feel limited in their play calls due to the injuries sustained by their tackles?

[paulwoods13]

Is Vega getting in more reps than Okapalugo? I'm really dissapointed in our pass rush. I had heard in the media that Foley would be loving to play in Creehan's system. Haven't seen much from the DEs yet.

Can't tell from TV but it appears there is a fairly constant rotation among the d-line. I saw Waud in at one point late in the game so I guess he is now healthy.

[AngeloV]

I'd trade Emry for Foley 100 times out of 100, despite the fact Foley has not shown much yet this season. Greenwood and Jones are both substantial upgrades over Emry.

What really galled me about the d-ends was the fact they kept letting Mitchell break contain. He was deadly when rolling out of the pocket but we never really adjusted (altho we did give up only 3 pts in second half).

I agree with all of this, Paul. We are much better at LB this year. Regarding the contain, there was 1 play in particular that really frustrated me. The Stamps had second and long (I think 12 yards), and Foley made an inside spin move. There was nobody lined up outside of him, which tells me he was responsible for contain, and an inside move is the last thing you want in that situation. Mitchell moved to his left and easily ran for the first down. Perhaps a brain cramp, but also perhaps frustration at the fact that he hasn't been able to get to the QB. Personal stats need to take a back seat to proper responsibilities.

[1argoholic]

Greenwood played like a beast. Anytime a Stamps was rocked it was Greenwood getting up beside the guy.
We need some sort of qb pressure as we've been struggling with that for sure.
Teams are learning to just go deep as our db's give up huge plays all game long. This is the issue with so many new guys to the CFL game. Yet on the offensive side our new receivers look solid. I just wish Elliott would keep the yapping and in your face crap down or he won't last in this league.
For Calgary to win with so many penalties says plenty about our team. It will be an up and down year especially with this opening schedule. We have two more tough ones before coming home finally next month. We could be 2-3 coming home. Oh and we missed Durie and Chad had a tough game. Plenty to improve on.

Just read posts on page 8 and Blue90 you're bang on. All game I was driving my wife crazy calling it a horrible game and the worst in the league so far. Flags on every single play.
Her team won so she got cheeky just as we were heading to bed. Not fun staying up late when your team loses. That last series of ours was CRAAAP!! Tons of time and you just step back and bomb the thing downfield. We missed Durie!!

[Wobbler]

Pfeffer had a very good game. He has progressed to the point where I don't even worry about him any more, and that surprises me.

[AngeloV]

Pfeffer had a very good game. He has progressed to the point where I don't even worry about him any more, and that surprises me.

A very pleasant surprise to me too.

[Will]

I'll throw this out there, do we waste a PR spot on him once Swayze is healthy?

[AngeloV]

I'll throw this out there, do we waste a PR spot on him once Swayze is healthy?

I think you have to. Either that or injury list. I can't imagine he's making more than the league minimum, so to continually 1 game him, won't be a financial burden.

[ArgoRavi]

I'll throw this out there, do we waste a PR spot on him once Swayze is healthy?

You definitely have to keep Pfeffer around either on the PR or perhaps on the IR or even as one of the two non-actives on the active roster if you are afraid of losing him to another team. He certainly has a live leg.

[paulwoods13]

You definitely have to keep Pfeffer around either on the PR or perhaps on the IR or even as one of the two non-actives on the active roster if you are afraid of losing him to another team. He certainly has a live leg.

Yep -- have to keep him for sure. IR is fine with me.

[argotom]

You definitely have to keep Pfeffer around either on the PR or perhaps on the IR or even as one of the two non-actives on the active roster if you are afraid of losing him to another team. He certainly has a live leg.

We all agree, however if the kid keeps playing and his punting and FG numbers remain consistent we may lose him to another team.
Swayze is the best in the league so there is no issue there.


I'd trade Emry for Foley 100 times out of 100, despite the fact Foley has not shown much yet this season. Greenwood and Jones are both substantial upgrades over Emry.

What really galled me about the d-ends was the fact they kept letting Mitchell break contain. He was deadly when rolling out of the pocket but we never really adjusted (altho we did give up only 3 pts in second half).


There is not much difference between Emery of last year and Foley this year.
From recollection, Foley was pretty much let go the last time around as the team did not want to sign him during FA.
At least he had a good GC in 12, however he is just a non factor and is being manhandled by the opposing players.
Greenwood coming out party yesterday was truly awesome.
As for Chad, probably his worst game as an Argo, even considering all those fumbles during the early years.

[paulwoods13]

There is not much difference between Emery of last year and Foley this year.
From recollection, Foley was pretty much let go the last time around as the team did not want to sign him during FA.
At least he had a good GC in 12, however he is just a non factor and is being manhandled by the opposing players.
Greenwood coming out party yesterday was truly awesome.

Emry would not be starting in a lineup with Greenwood and Jones. Foley does start. If we'd kept Emry he'd be backing up and we'd be playing an INT at DE. Lose-lose.

[Argo]

Yep -- have to keep him for sure. IR is fine with me.

Agree.

[doubleblue]

We all agree, however if the kid keeps playing and his punting and FG numbers remain consistent we may lose him to another team.
Swayze is the best in the league so there is no issue there.




There is not much difference between Emery of last year and Foley this year.
From recollection, Foley was pretty much let go the last time around as the team did not want to sign him during FA.
At least he had a good GC in 12, however he is just a non factor and is being manhandled by the opposing players.
Greenwood coming out party yesterday was truly awesome.
As for Chad, probably his worst game as an Argo, even considering all those fumbles during the early years.

In defense of Foley I noticed that they had him dropping back in short coverage sometimes. Similar to what Jones had him doing back in 2012. Ricky wasn't to keen on that back then but maybe he has bought into it now. I always thought he could have been a good MLB with his quickness and pursuit. They seemed to have had Greenwood keying on Cornish, so maybe they had Foley dropping back to fill in for Greenwood's drop backs.
Chad Owens I agree was not very good last night. He head didn't seem to be into the game for some reason.
Harris was ok, but showed he is not in Ricky Ray's league just yet. IMO. But it is going to be interesting what Barker does going forward with two free agent QB's.

[Mookie Fan]

Again (just like last year) the Argos didn't run the ball enough, and again they lost. There were a lot of other reasons they lost, of course, but that was one of the biggest reasons.

10 rushing attempts (for all 3 RBs combined) and 34 passing attempts. Calgary's defence looked good at times, but Whitaker was averaging over 5 yards a carry and had only 6 carries all game. 1.5 carries a quarter is not going to get it done. That is not a balanced attack. No RB was given enough carries to get in a rhythm and get involved in the offence.

I don't get the play calling of this coaching staff at all. They have a young QB in Harris and do not call almost any running plays to take some of the pressure off him. Instead they expect him to beat the defending Grey Cup Champions by almost universally throwing the ball. That worked against an Ottawa team that didn't want to be there in their last regular season game of 2014, but it won't work consistently this year. There is too much parity in the league and most of the games are too important. Even games before Labour Day do often matter quite a bit. If the Argos had won more of those last year, they would have been in the playoffs.

[Rich]

But it is going to be interesting what Barker does going forward with two free agent QB's.

Ricky's the better QB. Let's get rid of Harris' sorry ass, and let some other team have 6 or 7 years of success with him. We don't care about the future. The future is now. So what if the next 2 or 3 years are the most important years in the history of the franchise? So what if one big hit will likely end Ricky's career? Mitchell Gale will probably be better than Harris anyway. We've already developed two great CFL QBs, who says we can't develop another one?

[Argo57]

I agree three games in Foley has been bad, no impact and no idea why they would have traded Emery for him.
Conversely our 3 new receivers are awesome.

I'd make the Foley deal anytime, Emry was rather unimpressive during his time in Toronto, Argos are loaded at LB and needed a good pass rusher (and got one).

[argolio]

Ricky's the better QB. Let's get rid of Harris' sorry ass, and let some other team have 6 or 7 years of success with him. We don't care about the future. The future is now. So what if the next 2 or 3 years are the most important years in the history of the franchise? So what if one big hit will likely end Ricky's career? Mitchell Gale will probably be better than Harris anyway. We've already developed two great CFL QBs, who says we can't develop another one?Paranoia for 500, Alex!

[T-Bone]

Ricky's the better QB. Let's get rid of Harris' sorry ass, and let some other team have 6 or 7 years of success with him. We don't care about the future. The future is now. So what if the next 2 or 3 years are the most important years in the history of the franchise? So what if one big hit will likely end Ricky's career? Mitchell Gale will probably be better than Harris anyway. We've already developed two great CFL QBs, who says we can't develop another one?
http://cdn.meme.am/instances/500x/62355925.jpg

[1argoholic]

Harris looked like a qb that needs more game time after this game. A few games doesn't make a career and although he's been good he made some bad choices on Monday. He wasn't as crisp is probably the better term.

Good issues to have with Harris and Ray.

[ArgoRavi]

It was interesting to see how often Harris went deep on Monday. Some on here in the past have criticized this offence for not going deep often enough but I don't think that anyone can complain about that in the Calgary game. Unfortunately, it really only paid off the one time with Gurley's TD.

[AngeloV]

It was interesting to see how often Harris went deep on Monday. Some on here in the past have criticized this offence for not going deep often enough but I don't think that anyone can complain about that in the Calgary game. Unfortunately, it really only paid off the one time with Gurley's TD.

It all depends on reads. Any QB that sees man with no over the top help, will take the deep ball almost every time. If there is over the top help, that is when we see the check downs that so many love to complain about.

[argotom]

It was interesting to see how often Harris went deep on Monday. Some on here in the past have criticized this offence for not going deep often enough but I don't think that anyone can complain about that in the Calgary game. Unfortunately, it really only paid off the one time with Gurley's TD.


Sometimes a QB has to go deep even with no receivers really open in order to stretch the D and keep them honest.
I have noticed Harris is not afraid and will sling it out, good on him.

[AngeloV]

Sometimes a QB has to go deep even with no receivers really open in order to stretch the D and keep them honest.
I have noticed Harris is not afraid and will sling it out, good on him.

Not if the d is playing an over the top zone coverage. If you noticed every deep ball Harris threw was 1 receiver vs 1 DB. In pro football, that is considered an open reciever.

[paulwoods13]

It was interesting to see how often Harris went deep on Monday. Some on here in the past have criticized this offence for not going deep often enough but I don't think that anyone can complain about that in the Calgary game. Unfortunately, it really only paid off the one time with Gurley's TD.

Also threw quite a few deep balls in Week 1. I think all three games -- the good mix of ranges in Weeks 1 and 3, the heavy emphasis on underneath in Week 2 -- is indicative of a QB who has learned how to read and react.

[Wobbler]

Even though Harris missed most of those long balls, I liked the fact he (deliberately, I assume) overthrew rather than underthrew. He really does protect the ball well.

[PullTogether73]

Even though Harris missed most of those long balls, I liked the fact he (deliberately, I assume) overthrew rather than underthrew. He really does protect the ball well.

Completely agree.
Tha fact that the Argos are starting to throw deep again is encouraging. Furthermore, Harris has done an excellent job protecting the ball, with long throws, knowing when to step up in the pocket, when to tuck and run, when to check down.
I am quite surprised (and pleased) at how well he has performed overall. Very composed.

[OV Argo]

Emry would not be starting in a lineup with Greenwood and Jones. Foley does start. If we'd kept Emry he'd be backing up and we'd be playing an INT at DE. Lose-lose.


Ummm - not so sure there; I like Greenwood's play so far and great he has been able to play at OLB to allow Jones to play middle; and Jones has been good as well but hardly outstanding or dominant as a MLB; let's see his whole season play and stats and see if it measures up against Emry's best CFL D-play-making seasons - and not just total tackles but sacks, INTs and forced & recovered fumbles. Maybe Emry is old or washed-up or damaged goods now, but in his best CFL days he's shown wayyyyy more as a play-making MLB than Jones has in the CFL so far.

And Foley has been disappointing a bit to me so far - still got that good motor and one of the best run-stopping DEs in the league (as he has been for years now), but his pass rush seems to be weak. Like to see the rotation of D-linemen - a trio of Foley, Okpo and Vega (I guess, but not sold on him after he did little with the Bombers last year after his NFL return) should be solid or outstanding and maybe they will get there in the new D; get Waud some time at DT to help keep it fresh there too.

[Mookie Fan]

Ummm - not so sure there; I like Greenwood's play so far and great he has been able to play at OLB to allow Jones to play middle; and Jones has been good as well but hardly outstanding or dominant as a MLB; let's see his whole season play and stats and see if it measures up against Emry's best CFL D-play-making seasons - and not just total tackles but sacks, INTs and forced & recovered fumbles. Maybe Emry is old or washed-up or damaged goods now, but in his best CFL days he's shown wayyyyy more as a play-making MLB than Jones has in the CFL so far.

And Foley has been disappointing a bit to me so far - still got that good motor and one of the best run-stopping DEs in the league (as he has been for years now), but his pass rush seems to be weak. Like to see the rotation of D-linemen - a trio of Foley, Okpo and Vega (I guess, but not sold on him after he did little with the Bombers last year after his NFL return) should be solid or outstanding and maybe they will get there in the new D; get Waud some time at DT to help keep it fresh there too.

I think the defensive linemen we have are solid but personally I wish the Argos had found a way to keep Aston Whiteside and/or Dontay Moch. I don't know much about Dontay Moch or how he performed in training camp, but he was an intriguing player and I don't believe he had enough time to show what he could do.

As for Whiteside, he is lighter than Moch but is quite strong and I believe plays bigger than he is. Both of these players are only 26 and I think they maybe could have helped Toronto. Whiteside didn't have that many sacks last year but he was a beast late last season and I think the Argos were too quick to give up on him.

As for the Argo-Calgary game, I think the Calgary O-Line stepped up and played well despite the team's difficult circumstances with the injuries they suffered.

[AngeloV]

Even though Harris missed most of those long balls, I liked the fact he (deliberately, I assume) overthrew rather than underthrew. He really does protect the ball well.

Funny thing is, in man coverage, an under thrown ball is often the hardest one to cover, because the receiver sees the ball all the way, and if he does a good job not giving away that the ball is under thrown, more often than not you get a big play. That definitely happened on Gurley's TD. Under thrown ball, and Bennett never found the ball.

I'm almost 100% sure that teams started the throw behind based on this.


I think the defensive linemen we have are solid but personally I wish the Argos had found a way to keep Aston Whiteside and/or Dontay Moch. I don't know much about Dontay Moch or how he performed in training camp

Agree on Moch, but I thought Whiteside did a whole lot of nothing last year. Vega is definitely an upgrade there. Bottom line though, the Ends need to play better. They've gotten great play from the entire DT rotation. They are the only ones with any sacks, and the avg yards per rush by opposing RB's has been outstanding.

[argotom]

Not if the d is playing an over the top zone coverage. If you noticed every deep ball Harris threw was 1 receiver vs 1 DB. In pro football, that is considered an open reciever.


I said sometimes, but if the D is playing back in a zone then definitely the underneath from short to mid range will be available.
Bottom line you want to keep the D honest which is an advantage to an offense especially with the majority of teams being pass oriented.
On top of which, the new rules for PI is again beneficial to the receivers.
Harris was making and has completed some deep throws.
The thing I like about him is the tight spiral he throws, leads the receiver and rarely has under thrown which as we know more times then not leads to pics.

[paulwoods13]

Ummm - not so sure there; I like Greenwood's play so far and great he has been able to play at OLB to allow Jones to play middle; and Jones has been good as well but hardly outstanding or dominant as a MLB; let's see his whole season play and stats and see if it measures up against Emry's best CFL D-play-making seasons - and not just total tackles but sacks, INTs and forced & recovered fumbles. Maybe Emry is old or washed-up or damaged goods now, but in his best CFL days he's shown wayyyyy more as a play-making MLB than Jones has in the CFL so far.

Emry's best days were at least three years ago, if not longer. He was average to below average most of last season. Jones was way better than him whenever he was in the lineup last season. I appreciate that Emry was great at one time, but he ain't great now and I would bet there is not a single good ole boy in the league (other than Taman, maybe) who would take him over Jones even before Emry suffered an injury that put him on IR.

[Wobbler]

Foley may not have helped us much yet this year, but I don't think he has hurt us. Emry's questionable decision making hurt us quite often against the run last year, IMO.

[Wobbler]

Funny thing is, in man coverage, an under thrown ball is often the hardest one to cover, because the receiver sees the ball all the way, and if he does a good job not giving away that the ball is under thrown, more often than not you get a big play.
Maybe I'm giving him too much credit, but I didn't think any of those long throws were interceptable. It could just be a consequence of being poorly thrown with a consistent error, but I don't think he's thrown a truly interceptable ball yet. Owens' deflection doesn't count, and the one that Sask picked off required a pretty athletic move by the defender.

[OV Argo]

Funny thing is, in man coverage, an under thrown ball is often the hardest one to cover, because the receiver sees the ball all the way, and if he does a good job not giving away that the ball is under thrown, more often than not you get a big play. That definitely happened on Gurley's TD. Under thrown ball, and Bennett never found the ball.

I'm almost 100% sure that teams started the throw behind based on t



Agree on Moch, but I thought Whiteside did a whole lot of nothing last year. Vega is definitely an upgrade there. Bottom line though, the Ends need to play better. They've gotten great play from the entire DT rotation. They are the only ones with any sacks, and the avg yards per rush by opposing RB's has been outstanding.


Disagree - big-time - on Whiteside - the guy has a motor and was around the ball lots when he played DE last year - I'd take him over Vega hands down.

[OV Argo]

Emry's best days were at least three years ago, if not longer. He was average to below average most of last season. Jones was way better than him whenever he was in the lineup last season. I appreciate that Emry was great at one time, but he ain't great now and I would bet there is not a single good ole boy in the league (other than Taman, maybe) who would take him over Jones even before Emry suffered an injury that put him on IR.


IF Emry's best days are long behind him and if he is damaged goods, I'd be happy with Jones over him; but IF Emry is not washed-up (and not sure he is), then any gob who favored Jones over him and discounted Emry's former ability, would be, well, a gob; sorry, I have to go with best form shown in the league, but yeah, age and recent playing form should be considered too: would you be good with some suggesting Owens be let go or traded away now? - cause really, I think it could easily be argued that Owens best days were at least 2 seasons ago and lately he looks sub-par - not dangerous on punt returns, coughs up the ball, drops passes - I still have faith he can rebound and be very good again though.

[argos1873]

Here's a question, I know Swayze Waters is money when it comes to kicking, and was basically the best player for the Argos last season, but if a guy like Pfeffer comes along and puts up near Waters numbers, do the Argos go in favour of a guy like Pfeffer, because Waters is an international? I mean everyone knows that a very good kicker is important, but so is a coveted international spot in other areas. Kickers are generally nationals when you have a good one, although the 32 yard convert might sway that a little bit this year. Just wondering.

[Will]

Nope, Swayze is still #1. The cliche that special teams are important in the CFL remains true and he is the best at it.

I'm not overly concerned about having or needing an extra import right now.

[paulwoods13]

IF Emry's best days are long behind him and if he is damaged goods, I'd be happy with Jones over him; but IF Emry is not washed-up (and not sure he is), then any gob who favored Jones over him and discounted Emry's former ability, would be, well, a gob; sorry, I have to go with best form shown in the league, but yeah, age and recent playing form should be considered too: would you be good with some suggesting Owens be let go or traded away now? - cause really, I think it could easily be argued that Owens best days were at least 2 seasons ago and lately he looks sub-par - not dangerous on punt returns, coughs up the ball, drops passes - I still have faith he can rebound and be very good again though.

Owens is still an outstanding receiver. One bad game does not mean he's near the end. Emry had one bad season, and the one before that was no better than OK. I have little faith Emry will ever again play like he did in 2011-12.

[argotom]

Owens is still an outstanding receiver. One bad game does not mean he's near the end. Emry had one bad season, and the one before that was no better than OK. I have little faith Emry will ever again play like he did in 2011-12.


Maybe so but in the same reasoning Foley in my opinion is done, will never be the force he was with BC.

[AngeloV]

Maybe I'm giving him too much credit, but I didn't think any of those long throws were interceptable. It could just be a consequence of being poorly thrown with a consistent error, but I don't think he's thrown a truly interceptable ball yet. Owens' deflection doesn't count, and the one that Sask picked off required a pretty athletic move by the defender.

No, you are right. It usually is safer to overthrow. I was just commenting that a lot of big plays come from underthrown balls.


Maybe so but in the same reasoning Foley in my opinion is done, will never be the force he was with BC.

Foley hasn't played for BC in 6 years. You do know that he's had 20 sacks the last 2 season's, don't you? In fact, he had 12 last year which tied his career high with BC and had his 2nd career high in tackles with 54 (more than any season with BC). Doesn't sound like someone that was done to me. Or did you conveniently not watch when he wasn't wearing double blue?


Disagree - big-time - on Whiteside - the guy has a motor and was around the ball lots when he played DE last year - I'd take him over Vega hands down.

I don't know. He kind of reminded me of David Lee. Always on the cusp of making a play, but not quite getting there.

Vega is a proven playmaker in this league, and in the Saskatchewan game at least, made a couple of stops on 2nd and short running plays causing the Riders to have to go for 3 rather than 7.

[argotom]

"Foley hasn't played for BC in 6 years. You do know that he's had 20 sacks the last 2 season's, don't you? In fact, he had 12 last year which tied his career high with BC and had his 2nd career high in tackles with 54 (more than any season with BC). Doesn't sound like someone that was done to me. Or did you conveniently not watch when he wasn't wearing double blue?"





Have you watched him the last 3 games?
What about the last time around with the Argos, despite having a good GC game, the team let him go and wanted no part of him as a FA.
No one won this trade of Emery vs Foley, both players no longer have the impact with their best before dates long passed.

[AngeloV]

"Foley hasn't played for BC in 6 years. You do know that he's had 20 sacks the last 2 season's, don't you? In fact, he had 12 last year which tied his career high with BC and had his 2nd career high in tackles with 54 (more than any season with BC). Doesn't sound like someone that was done to me. Or did you conveniently not watch when he wasn't wearing double blue?"





Have you watched him the last 3 games?
What about the last time around with the Argos, despite having a good GC game, the team let him go and wanted no part of him as a FA.
No one won this trade of Emery vs Foley, both players no longer have the impact with their best before dates long passed.

You clearly stated that he was done after he left BC. I pointed out that his best season statistically was last year, some 6 seasons after he left BC. Now you base everything over a 3 game period. Just like your great claim after seeing him play once that Harris had "happy feet"..whatever that means.

I really can't wait for the next time you contradict yourself. It's quite humourous.

[paulwoods13]

"Foley hasn't played for BC in 6 years. You do know that he's had 20 sacks the last 2 season's, don't you? In fact, he had 12 last year which tied his career high with BC and had his 2nd career high in tackles with 54 (more than any season with BC). Doesn't sound like someone that was done to me. Or did you conveniently not watch when he wasn't wearing double blue?"

Have you watched him the last 3 games?
What about the last time around with the Argos, despite having a good GC game, the team let him go and wanted no part of him as a FA.
No one won this trade of Emery vs Foley, both players no longer have the impact with their best before dates long passed.

We won the trade if for no other reason than we were able to start two NATs as a result of it: at LB and DE. If we keep Emry we still start only one NAT at LB and two INTs at DE. And that means we can't start all three new INT receivers. That trade allows Gurley to play in our offence.

[AngeloV]

We won the trade if for no other reason than we were able to start two NATs as a result of it: at LB and DE. If we keep Emry we still start only one NAT at LB and two INTs at DE. And that means we can't start all three new INT receivers. That trade allows Gurley to play in our offence.

Agree that we won the trade Paul, but you don't think that both Emery and Greenwood would start at LB if we didn't make the trade? You're not keeping Emery to be a back up that's for sure.

[paulwoods13]

Agree that we won the trade Paul, but you don't think that both Emery and Greenwood would start at LB if we didn't make the trade? You're not keeping Emery to be a back up that's for sure.

I don't think you start both of them and Jones because one "cover" LB is needed. So I will amend my statement to read that the trade allows us to start four INT receivers (Owens plus the three new guys) AND Jones. Without the trade we probably could have had only four of those five in the starting lineup.

[AngeloV]

I don't think you start both of them and Jones because one "cover" LB is needed. So I will amend my statement to read that the trade allows us to start four INT receivers (Owens plus the three new guys) AND Jones. Without the trade we probably could have had only four of those five in the starting lineup.

I agree with that (needing a cover back), but I think that if you keep Emery, he's starting ahead of Jones, not because he's better, but because you get more flexibility. How else can you explain Jones backing him up last year? Personally, I like Thomas Miles and James Yurichuk better. Yurichuk had 1 start last year and was better in that one game against Hamilton than Emery in any of the games he played last year, and Miles because he is younger and has more upside.

[argotom]

You clearly stated that he was done after he left BC. I pointed out that his best season statistically was last year, some 6 seasons after he left BC. Now you base everything over a 3 game period. Just like your great claim after seeing him play once that Harris had "happy feet"..whatever that means.

I really can't wait for the next time you contradict yourself. It's quite humourous.


Can you read, obviously not.
I said his best years were in BC.
Based on the 3 games so far, a non factor and yes for me he would be replaced on the line as there is no pressure and he is being manhandled.

[Stevoman]

Owens had a rare bad game. Foley is doing fine and these guys bring a lot to the sideline and locker room and that needs to be accounted for in your assessment. The team as a whole did not do as well in this game but I was impressed with their resolve after a disastrous 2nd quarter. Other than those minutes and Calgary's final drive (showing why they are defending champs) the Argos outplayed them in their stadium. If you had said they'd start out the season at 2-1 given the schedule and injuries, I would've gladly taken it. Now hopefully, some time at home and extra prep has them winning in BC for the second time in a row!

[AngeloV]

Can you read, obviously not.
I said his best years were in BC.
Based on the 3 games so far, a non factor and yes for me he would be replaced on the line as there is no pressure and he is being mishandled.

Pretty sure I can read pretty well..just that I don't change my point of view with the wind. I guess someone hacked your account when you posted this:


Maybe so but in the same reasoning Foley in my opinion is done, will never be the force he was with BC.

And I said he had the best year of his career last year. You would have been a lot more accurate if you said he will never be the force he was last year again. But that would mean you making sense, so I guess I am asking way too much.

Nobody said that Foley has been great thus far, but neither has Okpalaugo. Point being, it's only been three games, and a horrible schedule flying out west and back every week thus far. I'm willing to give him a chance to turn things around.

[argotom]

Ok that's fine I can deal with that.
But it's the DC and the line coach that no doubt have evaluated Foley and the rest on film to include the DB's whose back end coverage has been equally as bad.

[ArgoRavi]

Ok that's fine I can deal with that.
But it's the DC and the line coach that no doubt have evaluated Foley and the rest on film to include the DB's whose back end coverage has been equally as bad.

I don't think that the defensive backs have been that bad at all, especially considering that they haven't gotten as much pressure from their defensive line over the last two weeks as they would have liked.

[D-Gap-Willie]

Fines for the Calgary game. Cleyon Laing gets dinged for a late hit, which was penalized for unnecessary roughness. He'll probably be a strong candidate for a fine now, anytime he gets a roughing penalty. Devin Smith was fined for unnecessary roughness on the last play of the gamed -- play was not penalized. Does anyone know what he did/what happened ?

[argolio]

Because I'm a masochist, I just re-watched this game before erasing it. To put it nicely, the officials were very Argo-friendly. The only bad call was an offside against Isaac in the 3rd quarter (he wasn't offside), but it made little difference since we forced them to punt a few plays later.

[ArgoRavi]

Because I'm a masochist, I just re-watched this game before erasing it.

I usually try not to re-watch losses although I did re-watch the second half of the 2013 East Final a few times to try to figure out where it all went wrong.

[argolio]

I usually try not to re-watch losses although I did re-watch the second half of the 2013 East Final a few times to try to figure out where it all went wrong.If we lose badly, I always erase it right away.

[paulwoods13]

Win or lose, pretty or ugly, I rip it to DVD. Gotta sustain the archive!

[AngeloV]

Good work Paul. I wish I had you patience.

[gilthethrill]

Just got done watching the game on PVR after cottaging on the set of the movie "Deliverance" for the past week. Really give Calgarys coaches a lot of credit with play calling after losing both their Tackles in the 2nd quarter. Argos showed good discipline but just did not find a way to get it done on the road this time. Sitting at 2-1 on this road trip getting ready for a BC team that can be defeated, I really like where the Argos are at right now. With Josey getting more game time, I wonder if Chad Kackert will ever dress for a game. Nice looking DB's we have & our receivers are looking really good. Hope our DE's can start getting more pressure.