Why did the Argos struggle (off the field) in 2016 and how can it improve?

[ArgoGabe22]

This article covers a lot. I believe the article having it's own thread is justified based on the many points brought up by Wright, Cohon, Sokolowski and Copeland.

http://news.nationalpost.com/sports/cfl/torontos-grey-cup-week-overshadowed-by-troubled-argonauts-last-in-cfl-wins-and-attendance

[Ron]

“I don’t have the solution,” said former CFL commissioner Tom Wright. “But even if I did, they wouldn’t listen. They didn’t listen to me when I was commissioner. Why would they listen to me now?”

Why would they listen to you when you admit you have nothing to offer.

[AngeloV]

“I don’t have the solution,” said former CFL commissioner Tom Wright. “But even if I did, they wouldn’t listen. They didn’t listen to me when I was commissioner. Why would they listen to me now?”


Why would they listen to you when you admit you have nothing to offer.

I guess nobody told him that there are new owners here and the man that couldn't stand him (Braley) has significantly less power these days. Personally, I hate that quote from Wright. Coimes off as a crybaby.

[Argoknot]

Admittedly my memory ain't so good but I don't recall Wright doing anything of consequence as commish. It seems all the good things happpened (or the perception of such) came under the team of Cohon and Copeland.

[ArgoRavi]

Admittedly my memory ain't so good but I don't recall Wright doing anything of consequence as commish. It seems all the good things happpened (or the perception of such) came under the team of Cohon and Copeland.

The Ottawa Renegades also folded after Wright spent an off-season doing nothing about their sorry situation.

[R.J]

http://www.tsn.ca/radio/hamilton-1150/naylor-argonauts-ownership-could-learn-from-ottawa-1.613386
http://www.tsn.ca/radio/toronto-1050/scianitti-ottawa-a-cfl-success-lesson-for-argos-1.613302

So, clearly Wright is still bitter about his time with the CFL and how it ended - it's been about a decade, probably time to let go.

I think Wright, Sokolowski, and especially Cohon are spot on. IMO Rogers coming on board and having the full might of MLSE would be a big help to the Argos. The problem with the Argonauts and CFL is the perception of it, BMO as never going to be the cure all, and because of that it's going to take time (minimum 5 years IMO). Was I expecting sellouts this season ? No, minus the home opener. Was I expecting it to be as bad as it was ? No, but I think some had unrealistic expectations. Even if the team starting marketing in September 2015, would the fans really have come out in droves ? I highly doubt it, so I'm actually really surprised that some are so shocked about the Argos first season in BMO.


The Ottawa Renegades also folded after Wright spent an off-season doing nothing about their sorry situation.
???
There were 3 potential buyer groups, Jeff Hunt was a part of the Golden Gate group, and had Mr. Anderson not been diagnosed with cancer, who knows what would have occured. The League didn't want to take over ownership of the team either, so hence the team folding - not sure how Wright is blamed for that.

[Neely2005]

http://www.tsn.ca/radio/hamilton-1150/naylor-argonauts-ownership-could-learn-from-ottawa-1.613386
http://www.tsn.ca/radio/toronto-1050/scianitti-ottawa-a-cfl-success-lesson-for-argos-1.613302

So, clearly Wright is still bitter about his time with the CFL and how it ended - it's been about a decade, probably time to let go.

I think Wright, Sokolowski, and especially Cohon are spot on. IMO Rogers coming on board and having the full might of MLSE would be a big help to the Argos. The problem with the Argonauts and CFL is the perception of it, BMO as never going to be the cure all, and because of that it's going to take time (minimum 5 years IMO). Was I expecting sellouts this season ? No, minus the home opener. Was I expecting it to be as bad as it was ? No, but I think some had unrealistic expectations. Even if the team starting marketing in September 2015, would the fans really have come out in droves ? I highly doubt it, so I'm actually really surprised that some are so shocked about the Argos first season in BMO.


???
There were 3 potential buyer groups, Jeff Hunt was a part of the Golden Gate group, and had Mr. Anderson not been diagnosed with cancer, who knows what would have occured. The League didn't want to take over ownership of the team either, so hence the team folding - not sure how Wright is blamed for that.

The only way that Rogers gets involved is if they have some television rights. Even then there would be conflicts with the Jays.

Also MLSE isn't exactly a cohesive unit, Rogers and Bell are always butting heads.

[ArgoRavi]

There were 3 potential buyer groups, Jeff Hunt was a part of the Golden Gate group, and had Mr. Anderson not been diagnosed with cancer, who knows what would have occured. The League didn't want to take over ownership of the team either, so hence the team folding - not sure how Wright is blamed for that.

Wright was to blame, at least in part, because he let that franchise go down the drain beginning in the off-season following the 2004 Grey Cup. If you go back and read articles from that time in the Ottawa papers, you will see a lot of criticism of Wright for neglecting that franchise from January of 2005 until they folded.

[BATKINSON001]

why would rogers want the team? They are trying to kill it and the league...

[Argo57]

why would rogers want the team? They are trying to kill it and the league...

Turned on the FAN590 this afternoon and heard Andrew Walker bashing the Argonauts and calling for the CFL to fold the team or move them to the Maritimes.
Class act!!

[Mightygoose]

Turned on the FAN590 this afternoon and heard Andrew Walker bashing the Argonauts and calling for the CFL to fold the team or move them to the Maritimes.
Class act!!

That's too bad but not unexpected.

Unfortunately, the reality that this Argo hate (as opposed to ignore) stems more from a telecommunication battle between Bell and Rogers. Rogers was actually on pretty good terms with the Argos and the CFL before the league went exclusive with Bell.

2008 was the first year of the exclusive arrengements. It was also the first year of the ill-fated Bills in Toronto series...brought to you by....guess who...

I would agree it would be better if Rogers had a piece of the action and there will less negative press.

Too bad...you never hear TSN bashing the CHL or U Sports....both Rogers properties.

[Antwon]

Turned on the FAN590 this afternoon and heard Andrew Walker bashing the Argonauts and calling for the CFL to fold the team or move them to the Maritimes.
Class act!!

Well then will Walker ask why the NHL is expanding when Carolina, Florida, and Phoenix draw flies??? He should point out the NHL should just fold or move these teams!!!!!
And will he talk about the Vegas Golden Knights and the joke of a launch?? Someone couldn't work the video??? Looked like it should have been held in a strip joint!
I think not!!!!

[Argoknot]

Turned on the FAN590 this afternoon and heard Andrew Walker bashing the Argonauts and calling for the CFL to fold the team or move them to the Maritimes. Class act!!Just one question, who is Andrew Walker and why should I listen to him?

[AngeloV]

Just one question, who is Andrew Walker and why should I listen to him?

Technically, that's 2 questions. Answer to the 2nd question is, there is no reason to listen to him (or anyone at that station).

[R.J]

why would rogers want the team? They are trying to kill it and the league...
At this point Rogers clearly doesn't want the team, but from previous reports it seems as though Bell and Tanenbaum have left the door open for Rogers to come on board eventually. Like it or not, we need Rogers to be our ally, not our enemy.

[BATKINSON001]

At this point Rogers clearly doesn't want the team, but from previous reports it seems as though Bell and Tanenbaum have left the door open for Rogers to come on board eventually. Like it or not, we need Rogers to be our ally, not our enemy.

Which won't happen unless Rogers gets some sweet deal where they own the league or sonething ...

Again, I say, Rogers as a media corporation has a real hatred for Canadian football and the Argos specifically. They only want NFL and the big money that brings...

[Will]

Which won't happen unless Rogers gets some sweet deal where they own the league or sonething ...

Again, I say, Rogers as a media corporation has a real hatred for Canadian football and the Argos specifically. They only want NFL and the big money that brings...

I'd have to come up with better evidence, but sometimes I do wonder if Rogers shows as much hatred towards the CFL in other markets aside from Toronto?

[BATKINSON001]

I'd have to come up with better evidence, but sometimes I do wonder if Rogers shows as much hatred towards the CFL in other markets aside from Toronto?. I only know what they have done here in the GTA these last several years.

[ArgoRavi]

That's too bad but not unexpected.

Unfortunately, the reality that this Argo hate (as opposed to ignore) stems more from a telecommunication battle between Bell and Rogers. Rogers was actually on pretty good terms with the Argos and the CFL before the league went exclusive with Bell.

2008 was the first year of the exclusive arrengements. It was also the first year of the ill-fated Bills in Toronto series...brought to you by....guess who...

I would agree it would be better if Rogers had a piece of the action and there will less negative press.

Too bad...you never hear TSN bashing the CHL or U Sports....both Rogers properties.

TSN doesn't treat the Jays the same way that Rogers treats the Argos/CFL either.

[Neely2005]

I'd have to come up with better evidence, but sometimes I do wonder if Rogers shows as much hatred towards the CFL in other markets aside from Toronto?

Probably not, they wouldn't be able to get away with it in other markets. Torontonians are special that way.

[ArgoRavi]

Probably not, they wouldn't be able to get away with it in other markets. Torontonians are special that way.

Toronto is a distinct society within Canada.

[Shipyard]

Probably not, they wouldn't be able to get away with it in other markets. Torontonians are special that way.

Its gotta hurt their cell phone sales in parts of the country alot.

[Argo57]

Just one question, who is Andrew Walker and why should I listen to him?

I didn't know who he was either, heard his rant and had to wait until the end of the show to get his name.

[gilthethrill]

I didn't know who he was either, heard his rant and had to wait until the end of the show to get his name.

I give you credit for listening to this goof until his show was up.

[Argo57]

I give you credit for listening to this goof until his show was up.

Listened to part of it yesterday, he is from Saskatchewan.
Walker loves the Riders and the CFL but hates the fact that a city like Toronto has the Grey Cup, as for the Argonauts they are being run by a bunch of "interns".
Maybe he should go back to Riderville and take a high paying radio job there.
The FAN590 really sucks compared to the old days but TSN1050 isn't much better at times.

[PullTogether73]

The FAN590 really sucks compared to the old days but TSN1050 isn't much better at times.

Agreed.
Toronto sports radio can be frustrating a lot of the time.:sick:

[AngeloV]

The FAN590 really sucks compared to the old days but TSN1050 isn't much better at times.

You gotta start listening to TSN1150 from noon to 7 daily. Very CFL friendly, and I find the Tatti and Marsh show to be very entertaining. Producer Louie B is quite good when he joins in too.

[BATKINSON001]

You gotta start listening to TSN1150 from noon to 7 daily. Very CFL friendly, and I find the Tatti and Marsh show to be very entertaining. Producer Louie B is quite good when he joins in too.

We shouldn't have to listen to a Hamilton station to get cfl news and discussion, The Toronto one should be providing coverage, especially during grey cup, I don't give a crap what the haters say.

[R.J]

We shouldn't have to listen to a Hamilton station to get cfl news and discussion, The Toronto one should be providing coverage, especially during grey cup, I don't give a crap what the haters say.
You're right, we shouldn't have to. But as it stands right now, if you want CFL coverage it's 1150 or 1290 (WPG).

[1971GreyCup]

You gotta start listening to TSN1150 from noon to 7 daily. Very CFL friendly, and I find the Tatti and Marsh show to be very entertaining. Producer Louie B is quite good when he joins in too.

I've been listening to them for a while. I enjoy CFL talk and can't get much, if any in Toronto. I sure envy Buffalo with AM 550 where you get hours of Bills talk year round. Man do they want heads to roll after a couple losses.

[Argo57]

You gotta start listening to TSN1150 from noon to 7 daily. Very CFL friendly, and I find the Tatti and Marsh show to be very entertaining. Producer Louie B is quite good when he joins in too.

I periodically have listened but will take your advise and tune in more often.

[AngeloV]

I periodically have listened but will take your advise and tune in more often.

I listen on my drive home from work every night through my TSN app.


We shouldn't have to listen to a Hamilton station to get cfl news and discussion, The Toronto one should be providing coverage, especially during grey cup, I don't give a crap what the haters say.

I don't disagree, but rather than get pissed off, I just found an alternative that I really enjoy.

[Neely2005]

We shouldn't have to listen to a Hamilton station to get cfl news and discussion, The Toronto one should be providing coverage, especially during grey cup, I don't give a crap what the haters say.

Honestly I think that this is the TSN strategy. Just put the CFL talk on 1150.

[AngeloV]

Honestly I think that this is the TSN strategy. Just put the CFL talk on 1150.

I'm good with that....even if it is heavily Ti-Cat slanted. Hopefully they can eventually have a local morning and evening show.

[R.J]

I'm good with that....even if it is heavily Ti-Cat slanted. Hopefully they can eventually have a local morning and evening show.
1050 doesn't even have an evening show anymore. If it ain't Raps, Leafs or Argos, it's usually Fox sports now.

[PullTogether73]

Honestly I think that this is the TSN strategy. Just put the CFL talk on 1150.

No.
I think it's the fact that Hamilton's only professional sports team is the Tiger-Cats, therefore they get extensive (over)coverage.
Plus, the audience is rabid about their Tiger-Cats, so it all works.
The only other teams in Hamilton are the McMaster Marauders and Hamilton Bulldogs. Short season for the Marauders, and the Bulldogs are still new and partially at least overshadowed by the Maple Leafs.

And as we all know, interest in the Argonauts in Toronto is negligible, so minimal radio coverage.

[mint83]

I'd have to come up with better evidence, but sometimes I do wonder if Rogers shows as much hatred towards the CFL in other markets aside from Toronto?


I think the only other Rogers sports radio station is in Calgary. I listen to the morning show and they talk some CFL but not as much as TV ratings shows it deserves. They don't hold back taking cheap shots at the CFL and have one host who has a I'm too cool for the CFL kind of attitude.

[mint83]

TSN doesn't treat the Jays the same way that Rogers treats the Argos/CFL either.Rogers knows they can dis the CFL because there is only one other sports network that covers the league. I think that is bound to have some impact on perceptions even if the younger generation tends to tune out traditional media. That Rogers tries to damage a Canadian institution as well as a great game speaks to their pettiness.

MLB has the hype from U.S. networks so Toronto wannabes follow. TSN in Toronto just joins along with non stop Blue Jay talk but it really just makes them a second rate 590 with crappy ratings.

[ArgoTD]

While I guess I understand what TSN1050 does, it is still unbeleivably frustrating that they give the CFL such limited coverage. They didn't even carry either semi-final last weekend which is mind boggling given their investment in the league. Very short sighted on their part! From a business perspective, if they want to see the product they make money on continue to grow, they need to help facilitate the GTA market becoming viable. Exposure and focus on the league and the Argos needs to be set as a priority so that it becomes something people in the GTA are exposed to and at least listen to.

[BATKINSON001]

While I guess I understand what TSN1050 does, it is still unbeleivably frustrating that they give the CFL such limited coverage. They didn't even carry either semi-final last weekend which is mind boggling given their investment in the league. Very short sighted on their part! From a business perspective, if they want to see the product they make money on continue to grow, they need to help facilitate the GTA market becoming viable. Exposure and focus on the league and the Argos needs to be set as a priority so that it becomes something people in the GTA are exposed to and at least listen to.this would be good for us but I suspect they don't do this because there is very little money to be made so they don't even bother.

It's all about the money.

[Neely2005]

Toronto is a distinct society within Canada.

Yes a Canadian city where a large portion of the population claims to hate the USA but follows everything American.

[Argo57]

I listen on my drive home from work every night through my TSN app.



I don't disagree, but rather than get pissed off, I just found an alternative that I really enjoy.

Listened to 1150 on the way home today, great Grey Cup coverage!!