GAME THREAD / Week 5 / Friday the Thirteenth edition / Toronto @ Edmonton

[Wobbler]

https://s8.postimg.cc/c7popdtm9/image.png (https://postimages.org/)https://s8.postimg.cc/5vajfc8ht/image.png (https://postimages.org/)https://s8.postimg.cc/z7wc21rjl/image.png (https://postimages.org/)
Friday, July 13th
Commonwealth Stadium

- Broadcast on the usual places plus ESPN+
- A chance to start our first winning streak of the year...

[mchesher03]

Think some pressure if off with the win last week but regardless, would be a nice one to have. Offensively, I still think the key is to get Wilder going to take some heat off the passing game and keep our offence on the field (as we saw on Saturday, the esks offence can stay on the field for long drives). Like the zip that Franklin had on his passes and he was letting his receivers go get passes – which was great.

Defensively, gotta get heat on Reilly. If he has time, he will give those receivers catchable passes and keep moving the sticks. Thought our D did a great job containing Gable and hope they can do so again.

[RB957]

Think some pressure if off with the win last week but regardless, would be a nice one to have. Offensively, I still think the key is to get Wilder going to take some heat off the passing game and keep our offence on the field (as we saw on Saturday, the esks offence can stay on the field for long drives).Like the zip that Franklin had on his passes and he was letting his receivers go get passes – which was great.

Defensively, gotta get heat on Reilly. If he has time, he will give those receivers catchable passes and keep moving the sticks.Thought our D did a great job containing Gable and hope they can do so again.


Not only do we need to get pressure on Reilly, the secondary has to play much better. I have been seriously underimpressed with the play of our secondary, in particular Heath and Yell. Heath especially for his bone-head lack of discipline resulting in penalties. It's good that Trestman called him on it, but if that continues, he should sit.

Very impressed with Franklin's debut. He showed a lot of poise and can throw a nice ball into tight coverage. Hoping he continues to gain confidence and that the offence can move the ball consistently. Best way to beat Reilly is to not let him on the field.

Can't wait to see what happens this game.

[Argo57]

Not only do we need to get pressure on Reilly, the secondary has to play much better. I have been seriously underimpressed with the play of our secondary, in particular Heath and Yell. Heath especially for his bone-head lack of discipline resulting in penalties. It's good that Trestman called him on it, but if that continues, he should sit.

Very impressed with Franklin's debut. He showed a lot of poise and can throw a nice ball into tight coverage. Hoping he continues to gain confidence and that the offence can move the ball consistently. Best way to beat Reilly is to not let him on the field.

Can't wait to see what happens this game.

The play of the secondary is hands down my biggest concern, as you mentioned Heath and a Yell are the main culprits.
If their play doesn’t improve soon I could see change coming.

[Ron]

Not looking good for the double blue this week. Can't see that Eskie offense leave as many points on the floor as they did last week.

[AngeloV]

Not looking good for the double blue this week. Can't see that Eskie offense leave as many points on the floor as they did last week.

But at the same time, I can't see the Argos squandering as many 2nd/3rd and short situations on offence. After getting stuffed on 3rd and short, Franklin seemed to change the way he was doing the sneaks and was much more efficient. I see a close game again that can go either way. As long as Edmonton doesn't somehow get to run 4 plays in 6 seconds at the end of a half (anybody remember this from a few years ago?), Argos should be all right.

[doubleblue]

But at the same time, I can't see the Argos squandering as many 2nd/3rd and short situations on offence. After getting stuffed on 3rd and short, Franklin seemed to change the way he was doing the sneaks and was much more efficient. I see a close game again that can go either way. As long as Edmonton doesn't somehow get to run 4 plays in 6 seconds at the end of a half (anybody remember this from a few years ago?), Argos should be all right.

I haven't been too impressed with the Argo offensive line surge on those short yardage plays. Edmonton's line was blowing the Argo D Line back a couple of yards every time. Maybe because the 3rd and 1 situations seem to be so common any more some teams have gone to very large offensive guards. Edmonton moved their 6' 10 330+ guard out to tackle this year but then brought in Bond at 6'7 330. Size matters on the 3rd and short plays apparently.

[mchesher03]

But at the same time, I can't see the Argos squandering as many 2nd/3rd and short situations on offence. After getting stuffed on 3rd and short, Franklin seemed to change the way he was doing the sneaks and was much more efficient. I see a close game again that can go either way. As long as Edmonton doesn't somehow get to run 4 plays in 6 seconds at the end of a half (anybody remember this from a few years ago?), Argos should be all right.

I do recall that one and it was a classic “oops”!

If I recall correctly the argos had to come back on the field for a final play or the clock didn’t start after a play or two. No big deal just waiting for the esks to punch it in hah.

[AngeloV]

I do recall that one and it was a classic “oops”!

If I recall correctly the argos had to come back on the field for a final play or the clock didn’t start after a play or two. No big deal just waiting for the esks to punch it in hah.


Exactly. I had never seen Jim Barker more pissed.


I haven't been too impressed with the Argo offensive line surge on those short yardage plays. Edmonton's line was blowing the Argo D Line back a couple of yards every time. Maybe because the 3rd and 1 situations seem to be so common any more some teams have gone to very large offensive guards. Edmonton moved their 6' 10 330+ guard out to tackle this year but then brought in Bond at 6'7 330. Size matters on the 3rd and short plays apparently.

While I agree the line hasn't being blowing guys off the ball on these short yardage plays, I believe the bigger problem was with Franklin on the sneak, trying to go straight ahead, and not getting low enough to drive his body with any leverage. When he started moving a bit to his left, he started getting the first downs with ease.

[Wobbler]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Full Depth. <a href="https://t.co/EJ3uJ9NwYY">pic.twitter.com/EJ3uJ9NwYY</a></p>&mdash; Toronto Argonauts (@TorontoArgos) <a href="https://twitter.com/TorontoArgos/status/1017424727730556928?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">July 12, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Interesting to see Tuggle at MLB.

[Will]

So all of Woods, Reed, Plummer and Jordan are all injured?

Dowling makes his debut and I see Smith has been added to the lineup to backup Noel.

[lazycro]

So all of Woods, Reed, Plummer and Jordan are all injured?

Dowling makes his debut and I see Smith has been added to the lineup to backup Noel.

Woods still not 100% from his injury

Source;
When I spoke to him briefly at BMO last week he said little while longer, not 100% cleared

[mchesher03]

Yeah we’ve started a different MLB every game so far this year. Injuries happen though and hopefully this solidifies itself as the year goes on.

Looking forward to it.

[mchesher03]

Speaking of Jim Barker getting pissed there, I have never seen Trestman as angry as he was on the phantom defensive PI call on Saturday. He went right after that ref (#87) which is very unlike him. I’m not complaining either that was a brutal call.

[AngeloV]

Speaking of Jim Barker getting pissed there, I have never seen Trestman as angry as he was on the phantom defensive PI call on Saturday. He went right after that ref (#87) which is very unlike him. I’m not complaining either that was a brutal call.


That play happened directly in front of where I sit. The way I saw it, 87 was back peddling down the sidelines, and actually fell down as the play was being made. He obviously never saw what happened and guessed that it was PI. That's brutal officiating. Guessing. If you don't actually see anything, you can't call it. A missed call is better than the absolute wrong call. The result being the Argos had to burn their only challenge. Thank goodness they didn't need to make a challenge at a key point later in the game.

[gilthethrill]

But at the same time, I can't see the Argos squandering as many 2nd/3rd and short situations on offence. After getting stuffed on 3rd and short, Franklin seemed to change the way he was doing the sneaks and was much more efficient. I see a close game again that can go either way. As long as Edmonton doesn't somehow get to run 4 plays in 6 seconds at the end of a half (anybody remember this from a few years ago?), Argos should be all right.

Oh don't bring that up....the disbelief on the Argos as they returned from the alley...Oh that still irks me ....

[ArgoZ]

I think we’re in for a tough one. Home team’s seem to always have an edge, hence our win last week. Riley shreds our defence with all the time he has. I wish we had Butler (glad I didn’t say that on Twitter). This game will be a real indication what the Argos are all about. I’ll be happy with a close game, with a chance for a win.

[Rich]

Riley shreds our defence with all the time he has. I wish we had Butler (glad I didn’t say that on Twitter).

I'm excited to see if Striker might make a difference on the pass rush, and/or Dowling in pass coverage.

[OV Argo]

I'm excited to see if Striker might make a difference on the pass rush, and/or Dowling in pass coverage.

Striker getting into the line-up and handed playing time (based on exactly what?) - yeah, could maybe be interesting.

[jerrym]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Depth chart day!<br><br>Here is how we will line-up tomorrow against the <a href="https://twitter.com/TorontoArgos?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@TorontoArgos</a>.<br><br>📈👇 <a href="https://t.co/eomAWsD8Tx">pic.twitter.com/eomAWsD8Tx</a></p>&mdash; Edmonton Eskimos (@EdmontonEsks) <a href="https://twitter.com/EdmontonEsks/status/1017423470752301057?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">July 12, 2018</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[lazycro]

I think we’re in for a tough one. Home team’s seem to always have an edge, hence our win last week. Riley shreds our defence with all the time he has. I wish we had Butler (glad I didn’t say that on Twitter). This game will be a real indication what the Argos are all about. I’ll be happy with a close game, with a chance for a win.

I'll disagree with the butler comment. He was pretty much a non factor after return from injury unfortunately last year. All of his sacks save for 2 coming before that and one of those was vs BC and one vs the Als

[AngeloV]

I'll disagree with the butler comment. He was pretty much a non factor after return from injury unfortunately last year. All of his sacks save for 2 coming before that and one of those was vs BC and one vs the Als

You're making the mistake of solely looking at stats. His early success made other teams game plan around stopping him, which in turn opened things up for Wynn, Laing and Lemon. Personally, as the roster stands, I would move Wynn to Butler's old spot and start Bishop at Wynn's. I think Wynn is plenty quick enough to play end. You can get DT rotation with Finlay and DE rotation with Davis or Striker.

[jerrym]

I fully expect the Eskimos to key off Wilder in order to stop him early in the game. Hopefully the Argos will not stop using him even if the Eskimos do keep him to short gains at the start of the game as happened last week, because he gets stronger with more rushes. Using him in play action also slows down the QB rush on Franklin if the Eskimos continue to expect another carry by Wilder.

[marcwagz]

I'll be at the game tonight. Hope the argos bring a winning effort again tonight

[gilthethrill]

If this team can put 60 minutes of football together...they win.

[jerrym]

Great to see the Argos get off to a good start with a FG after a Heath interception and moving down the field using Wilder as a rusher and pass catcher.

[ArgoZ]

If this team can put 60 minutes of football together...they win.

Only 45 now. Good first 15.

[Argo57]

Take the points when you can, didn’t like that call.

[jerrym]

I agree. Frustrating to see the Argos stopped on third and six near the ten.

[Argo57]

Not sure how the Argos got the short end of that penalty, officials judgement embarrassing at times.

[jerrym]

Retaliator, even a minor one, gets the penalty 9 times out of 10. Totally unnecessary roughing penalty helps Edmonton get its first points.

[Will]

Franklin INT, Pfeffer punt and now Edmonton is up 7-3. Argos were in EDM zone 3 or 4 times with little to show for it.

[dmont]

Blame Cassius Vaughn for that touchdown. Bonehead retaliation penalty followed by weak tackle attempt on the receiver.

Tackling has not been good, especially on Reilly's runs.

[ArgoZ]

Retaliator, even a minor one, gets the penalty 9 times out of 10. Totally unnecessary roughing penalty helps Edmonton get its first points.
That and then the terrible tackle attempt by the same player. Why is it so hard to wrap a guy or grap his legs? Players always going for the Madden “hit stick”.

[Argo57]

Nice hit Yell!

[Argo57]

Argo receivers letting Franklin down, too many drops.

[Will]

Argos started losing field position battle as 2nd Q went on. After the Franklin INT, the Eskimos managed to get it out to midfield and the Argos haven't really gotten out of field position hell since that time.

[jerrym]

I love to see the Argos going deep downfield with Franklin rather than the five yarders. Several balls should have been caught even in the rain.

[Will]

They got to get Wilder going: 6 for 16 yards!

[Will]

All in all...only down 5.

[gilthethrill]

Blame Cassius Vaughn for that touchdown. Bonehead retaliation penalty followed by weak tackle attempt on the receiver.

Tackling has not been good, especially on Reilly's runs.

Vaughn had every reason to be upset. Sorenson pulled a tourist hit that could have caused an injury. Horrible call.

[Will]

Pfeffer

[dmont]

Vaughn had every reason to be upset. Sorenson pulled a tourist hit that could have caused an injury. Horrible call.

Oh, he was upset? I didnt realize that.... well, in that case...

[dmont]

Absolute garbage defense on second down. Does not matter how long it is, the secondary cant stop anything.

[Will]

...and the floodgates are open I fear...

[PullTogether73]

Pfeffer

Yah, he’s done as field goal kicker after tonight imo.
Not sure who is available to replace him, but they have to find someone more reliable on these moderate yard attempts.

[jerrym]

Hopefully, Martese's kick return puts some spark in the Argo offence.

[Will]

Argos have shot themselves in the foot several times in this game and the Eskimos are taking complete advantage.

[ArgoZ]

Yah, he’s done as field goal kicker after tonight imo.
Not sure who is available to replace him, but they have to find someone more reliable on these moderate yard attempts.

Well that extra INT we keep talking about would come in useful here. Pfeffer has been an amazing punter and kickoff specialist...

[jerrym]

Wilder smashes into the end zone after Martese's spark!

[jerrym]

SJ brings team within FG with two pointer!

[Will]

The defence is going to have to come up with some crucial stops here in the 4th.

[Will]

Pfeffer's punting

[gilthethrill]

Oh, he was upset? I didnt realize that.... well, in that case...

Gimme a break....his reaction was minimal as best

[1971GreyCup]

Hugh’s punting advantage over Pfeffer is 10 yards per punt. According to CFL stats, Eskies averaging 47 yards vs 37 yards for Argos.

[dmont]

I was about to post "Ronnie's kicking like crap, maybe go for it on 3rd?".......... phew very much an argo bounce.

[jerrym]

Another chip shot that Pfeffer should have easily had, but only scores on the bounce off the upright.

[PullTogether73]

As I said, we need a reliable field goal kicker.
These distances should be automatic.

[jerrym]

I don't like the Argos not going for it on third down with only 2:30 to go as even if they did stop the Eskimos right away after the kick they were likely going to get the ball back deep in their end.

[PullTogether73]

Time for the league to step in and mandate that Yell tighten his helmet or not play.
Lost his bucket AGAIN!

[dmont]

Well, that's game.

Glad to see SJ have a breakout game. Always love Declan. Franklin's growing and improving, still liking his game.

I worry about Wilders consistency, though I think the o line shares more of the blame than usual tonight. Whenever Wilders running with his head up, hes not productive.

Wynn's getting fined and/or suspended.

I think our biggest problem is the secondary on second down. Cannot be that automatic. Looked better in the fourth, but lousy in the second and third.

Tackling was bad tonight. Tuggle wasnt particularly bad, but we could really use Woods or Reed to kick some ass. Too soft.

Unless the film puts a lot of blame on the holder, the Ronnie Pfeffer experiment is over... probably in all phases but at the very least for field goals and points after.

I'm glad they made it interesting, but this was again a game that probably shouldn't have been this close.

[Will]

I almost feel like with a few more bounces their way that the Argos could (and I emphasize could) be 3-1 instead of 1-3, but you got to roll with the punches and unfortunately that's the situation the Argos find themselves in right now. It is unfortunate that it came down to Pfeffer's missed FG and the failed 3rd down gamble early in the game.

[Will]

Either the coaching will get them back on track or it won't...profound I know...but they need a spark.

You don't want 3 losses to turn into 4 and then into 5, etc etc

[ArgoZ]

Time for the league to step in and mandate that Yell tighten his helmet or not play.
Lost his bucket AGAIN!

It's a comfort thing. He probably hates the way a proper fitting one presses against his temple or other various areas. Can't say I blame him, I hated wearing a helmet.

[ArgoRavi]

I don't like the Argos not going for it on third down with only 2:30 to go as even if they did stop the Eskimos right away after the kick they were likely going to get the ball back deep in their end.

I would've liked to see them go for it there too. I understand why they didn't, as the defence had been playing well, but the game rested on that last Argo possession IMO. Sadly, the tackling was atrocious on that last Edmonton possession, as well.

[PullTogether73]

It's a comfort thing. He probably hates the way a proper fitting one presses against his temple or other various areas. Can't say I blame him, I hated wearing a helmet.

Perhaps, but he will be more uncomfortable with a concussion or worse when he gets hit in the head without that uncomfortable helmet.
He should have to forfeit any claims against the league for future lawsuits as well.

[Will]

I would've liked to see them go for it there too. I understand why they didn't, as the defence had been playing well, but the game rested on that last Argo possession IMO. Sadly, the tackling was atrocious on that last Edmonton possession, as well.

Eskimo fans believed that Maas should've done the same thing late in the game last Saturday.

[macspectrum]

in 1st quarter argos had the ball deep inside eskimo territory [inside the 10 if memory serves] and settled for an FG instead of getting a TD
it was a very notable sequence
that and a missed FG by argos also cost then
.
defences are keying on the wilder off tackle run on 1st down and argos only get 2 yd
stop doing that
.
i think wilder has been a bit of a bust this yr running the ball on 1st down
better to keep him in to block throw the ball to cross instead
him and jerome messam would have made a great duo in pass blocking - franklin would have all day to throw

[Stevoman]

Happy to see Franklin play with poise and leadership. Good to have SJ Green back to his usual self and that may also be because Franklin had enough of the other receivers dropping the ball. We need consistency in kicking and better production on first down (as well as the defence creating more second and long).

I have faith. The most brutal part of the schedule is almost over, the Argos lost their starting quarterback, and were one point away from being .500. They will improve and win more than they lose from here on out.

[Rich]

Happy to see Franklin play with poise and leadership. Good to have SJ Green back to his usual self and that may also be because Franklin had enough of the other receivers dropping the ball. We need consistency in kicking and better production on first down (as well as the defence creating more second and long).

I have faith. The most brutal part of the schedule is almost over, the Argos lost their starting quarterback, and were one point away from being .500. They will improve and win more than they lose from here on out.

I'm with you. More good than bad in this one. It's very hard to win back-to-back and we very nearly did, against a very good team.

When's the last time a young QB played as well in his first start for the Argonauts? Franklin had a couple of hiccups, but he is just going to get better and better. I wish they would try to get him out of the pocket more and take advantage of his mobility, Reilly rolls out more than Frankiin does at this point. It was great to see him establish some chemistry with Green, but he needs another weapon on offence. I'd love to see Rodney Smith take a regular shift instead of Jimmy Ralph, who's a gamer but simply too small and too slow, but they probably can't ratio-wise. I like the continued commitment to the run, but they need to give Wilder some different looks and bounce him outside once in a while too. Martese jackson has been a disappointment -- I'd love to see what McCluster could do with those plays Jackson ran tonight.

I liked what I saw on defence too for the most part, but they're still not getting enough pressure, did Striker even play? Vaughan had a bad game and that was an incredible bonehead move by Winn, but it's starting to look like a big play defence with some huge plays from Tuggle, Yell, Darby and Dowling. I will always trade the occasional soft tackle for a big defensive play, but i agree it will be good to see Woods back in form to clean up the tackling a little more.

[Argo]

Hopefully some quality players become available as NFL cuts and at least two areas of this team that simply lack the necessary talent can be upgraded.

[ArgoZ]

Hopefully some quality players become available as NFL cuts and at least two areas of this team that simply lack the necessary talent can be upgraded.
We might get Posey back, but the NFL cuts usually don't make a big impact like they used to. It's not like a Mike O'Shea is going to land here. I think this team is OK. As "The Don" mentioned, we could easily be 3-1. It's been a combination of tough scheduling, injuries and bad luck. I see the Argos fighting for top spot in the East come seasons end.

[hugoagogo]

Franklin is looking good. Seems to be fitting in nicely with this offense. I'm not sure what Edmonton really has for a defense, so he will probably get a good "measuring stick" of where he's at next week against the Bomber D.

[OV Argo]

Similar game from the 2 offences; mostly pass - but mixed in a bit of run (Gable more effective than Wilder) - and big time over reliance on one main target in the passing game (Argos to Green; Esks to Williams) = didn\t exactly produce a lot of points did it; And Reilly's timely scrambles helped the Esks offence out. I'd suggest both offences need to learn and show a lot more variety: more run game; more H-back; spread the ball around to all receivers. But same old is a hallmark of a lot of the CFL game now.

Again - IMO - Argos need way more pass rush out of the DEs (Davis & Striker did zip this game); audition another new guy. and not sure why Evan Foster - a top notch natural DE in college ball - continues to rate zero playing time - even a few plays - to see if he can make an impact; and when the favored American guys getting to play there continue to do next to nothing ?

[Argofan_1000]

Happy to see Franklin play with poise and leadership. Good to have SJ Green back to his usual self and that may also be because Franklin had enough of the other receivers dropping the ball. We need consistency in kicking and better production on first down (as well as the defence creating more second and long).

I have faith. The most brutal part of the schedule is almost over, the Argos lost their starting quarterback, and were one point away from being .500. They will improve and win more than they lose from here on out.

I like they way the team looks. Franklin's tool box has run and deep ball. It shows as he can control the game and did very well against a good football team.

Season looks exciting as the teams are good and anyone can beat anybody.

[paulwoods13]

Random thoughts:

Ralph got replaced as holder by Bethel Thompson after the terribly missed FG attempt. I don't know if we have been having problems with snaps or holds (altho the one he missed against Calgary looked like a bad snap to me), but regardless, this needs to be sorted out pronto.

I think the absence of Woods is being felt in more ways than one. In addition to missing his presence and big-play ability, I suspect his absence is forcing Ball to backfill in a way; Ball does not seem to be making the kinds of big plays he's capable of.

The secondary remains a trouble spot; Yell and Heath each had moments of brilliance but also several instances of lousy play. The only DB who seems to be playing really well is Darby (whose side does not get thrown to often). If Vaughan is not seriously injured, maybe he can replace Kanneh, allowing Dowling (who made one really good play on a blitz) to stay at LB. I still think Heath is playing out of position at CB.

Little to no pass rush, again. This can't continue. If Wynn gets suspended, we will be in trouble again next week along the line.

The o-line did a very nice job of pass blocking, a very poor job of run blocking. Popp has got to be looking for some new INTs (since we can't replace the NATs before next season). (BTW, Mason Woods was in civvies last night, just as he was all of last season.)

Trestman was pissed about defensive personnel deployment late in the first half. "Why wouldn't Cleyon be in there with 2:45 left"? Archer's defence has achieved the remarkable feat of allowing Edmonton to score just 33 points in two games while giving up play after play after play. I can't tell if I should be feeling optimistic or pessimistic based on that, but leaning to pessimism.

Despite the disappointment of being 1-3 and with all of these issues cropping up, I feel optimistic overall because of Franklin. He looks poised and confident, and he chucks the ball all over the field. He was let down big-time by his receivers last night, especially Noel who dropped a TD pass and failed to snag a couple of other catchable balls.

[paulwoods13]

I'd love to see Rodney Smith take a regular shift instead of Jimmy Ralph, who's a gamer but simply too small and too slow, but they probably can't ratio-wise.

They should have no ratio issues if they start Smith at SB. They started eight NATs last night: one DB, one DT, three o-linemen, two WRs, and one SB/FB. Could go back to seven with Smith in there. When Smith was in the game briefly, it appeared to me that he had in fact replaced Ralph.

[Argo57]

Biggest improvement in 2017 was the D which has turned into the biggest disappointment in 2018 (so far).
Poor coverage and tackling are becoming the norm, first play last night (Reilly 40 yard completion) was largely due to Heath’s confusion on the play.
Corey Chamblin is missed big time, hopefully they get it figured out.
On a positive note really like Franklin, looks like a natural leader who will only improve with time.
Nice to see SJ Green and Franklin starting to develop some chemistry but the Argos need all receivers contributing to be effective.
Williams and Noel simply need to be better than they showed last night.
Agree with all of OV’s (post#74) including the fact the D line needs to be much better.
All in all there seems to be improvement but still much work to be done before this team becomes a factor this season.

[Mightygoose]

Wynn suspended 1 game for hit on Gable.

https://www.cfl.ca/2018/07/14/argos-dylan-wynn-receives-1-game-suspension/

I think it's a bit on the light side. Can't have these hits....was thinking 2 IMO.

[argolio]

Vaughn had every reason to be upset. Sorenson pulled a tourist hit that could have caused an injury. Horrible call.Unfortunately they missed Sorensen's shenanigans and called the "retaliation".

Hard-hitting game, and I thought we played pretty well overall. Franklin showed growth, which bodes well for the future.

Rough games for Pfeffer and Noel, and we had some tackling issues on D. Those need to be cleaned up.

[ArgoRavi]

Wynn suspended 1 game for hit on Gable.

https://www.cfl.ca/2018/07/14/argos-dylan-wynn-receives-1-game-suspension/

I think it's a bit on the light side. Can't have these hits....was thinking 2 IMO.

Other than for a doping infraction, I can't recall anyone being suspended for more than one game in the CFL. If Hebert only got one recently, I don't see why Wynne would merit any more than that. Further, missing one game cheque out of 18 is not insignificant.

[halifaxguy]

Other than for a doping infraction, I can't recall anyone being suspended for more than one game in the CFL. If Hebert only got one recently, I don't see why Wynne would merit any more than that. Further, missing one game cheque out of 18 is not insignificant.

3downnation.com/2018/07/14/speedy-justice-wynn-suspended-one-game-cfl/

Check out the video, that was nasty, you can not defend that. Gable was laying on the ground already and Wyn speared him, helmet to helmet.

[AngeloV]

I have no issue with the Wynn suspension. It was late on a guy that was on the ground and he led with the crown of the helmet. The sooner they get those types of hits out of the game the better.

As far as the game went, I think considering the rain, Franklin was outstanding. Rough game for Noel, maybe not ready for prime time yet. I still would like to see him get his reps though. Maybe a rotation with Smith and Williams at the 2 wide out spots. Can't wait for Coombs to return. As far as the running game, it was clear to me that Edmonton game planned to stop it. My issue with it at this point is every run with Wilder is straight up the gut between the guards. The need to try the occasional stretch run and let him get to the edge. Either that or Franklin needs to occasionally hold the ball and take the corner himself. That will put less defenders in the box.

Still not worried though. The Argos are a very good team. The also held Reiley to 250 yards passing this week. Darby as Paul said is fantastic.

.Sorry, despite his gift INT, Heath has to go when Ford returns from injury. He's been brutal. Yell hasn't been great either, but I have seen some progress there.

[paulwoods13]

The need to try the occasional stretch run and let him get to the edge. Either that or Franklin needs to occasionally hold the ball and take the corner himself. That will put less defenders in the box.


I agree completely. We have to give defences different things to think about than runs up the middle.

[ArgoRavi]

3downnation.com/2018/07/14/speedy-justice-wynn-suspended-one-game-cfl/

Check out the video, that was nasty, you can not defend that. Gable was laying on the ground already and Wyn speared him, helmet to helmet.

Not defending it but I have seen hits just as bad or worse get one game suspensions also and one game in an 18 game regular season is not insignificant. Further, Wynn has no history of being a dirty player, unlike Kyries Hebert.

[Rich]

Rough game for Noel, maybe not ready for prime time yet.

I was a little surprised when Suitor singled out Noel for criticism on the broadcast, I thought it was a little unfair. His first drop in the endzone would have been a very difficult catch, the kind he's made a couple of times already but not this time. The second "drop" on the crossing pattern looked to be way over his head, Suitor said he should have caught it but to me he looked like he could barely touch it. I think Suitor was revealing a bit of an anti-Canadian bias, and i'm only half joking.

[OV Argo]

I was a little surprised when Suitor singled out Noel for criticism on the broadcast, I thought it was a little unfair. His first drop in the endzone would have been a very difficult catch, the kind he's made a couple of times already but not this time. The second "drop" on the crossing pattern looked to be way over his head, Suitor said he should have caught it but to me he looked like he could barely touch it. I think Suitor was revealing a bit of an anti-Canadian bias, and i'm only half joking.

I thought that too; or maybe that I didn't see those attempts clear enough, cause all those Noel "drops" seemed like difficult catch attempts; as opposed to blatant, right in the hands drops - like Darvin Adams showed twice last Bomber game.

Suitor is a tired old dullard of a CFL commentator IMO - liked the guy as a player, and he obviously loves the league, but he's redundant, cliched, boring as a TC commentator; TSN should give him and Rod Black the boot, and they'd have way better broadcasts just by that. Rod Smith is far superior to Black as a play by play guy, and they could find dozens of well spoken & knowledgeable football people to replace Suitor.

[Wobbler]

Noel has done pretty well with the balls thrown to him, but he never seems to get separation. His numbers would be better if every target wasn't contested.

[paulwoods13]

I really like Noel, but iirc he dropped three passes, not two. One was a potential TD and one went off his hands and became an interception. The third one I give him a pass on as it was a very high throw, but the other two were catchable and should have been caught. However, that's not to say he should be cut (cough Declan Cross cough).

[OV Argo]

I really like Noel, but iirc he dropped three passes, not two. One was a potential TD and one went off his hands and became an interception. The third one I give him a pass on as it was a very high throw, but the other two were catchable and should have been caught. However, that's not to say he should be cut (cough Declan Cross cough).


Your definition of "dropped" passes might be different than some others (see Rich above) - and i guess it could be a matter of opinion, and I suppose any pass directed towards a receiver and not caught could be called a drop (???); but again - you could compare any of Noel's 3 "drops" last game to the 2 blatant Darvin Adams drops in the last Bomber game = world of difference - between a guy wide-open and the ball hits hit right in the hands and he drops it, and a receiver unable to come up with a pass somewhere close to him and with coverage right there.

[Rich]

One was a potential TD and one went off his hands and became an interception.

I forgot about that one, that was on the 3rd down gamble play that was a total mess, even if he caught the ball he would have been short. Surely Trestman and Franklin should share the blame for that terrible play.

[AngeloV]

I was a little surprised when Suitor singled out Noel for criticism on the broadcast, I thought it was a little unfair. His first drop in the endzone would have been a very difficult catch, the kind he's made a couple of times already but not this time. The second "drop" on the crossing pattern looked to be way over his head, Suitor said he should have caught it but to me he looked like he could barely touch it. I think Suitor was revealing a bit of an anti-Canadian bias, and i'm only half joking.

It was fair. He was fighting the ball no doubt. The ball in the end zone he definitely has to catch. The one that turned into an interception in the end had no difference in result because he was short of the sticks, but he has to catch that one too. 2 passes his way and 2 drops. The third one I don't count as a drop. He barely touched it.



I thought that too; or maybe that I didn't see those attempts clear enough, cause all those Noel "drops" seemed like difficult catch attempts; as opposed to blatant, right in the hands drops - like Darvin Adams showed twice last Bomber game.

Suitor is a tired old dullard of a CFL commentator IMO - liked the guy as a player, and he obviously loves the league, but he's redundant, cliched, boring as a TC commentator; TSN should give him and Rod Black the boot, and they'd have way better broadcasts just by that. Rod Smith is far superior to Black as a play by play guy, and they could find dozens of well spoken & knowledgeable football people to replace Suitor.

LMFAO!!!

[OV Argo]

How many starts was Jeff Fuller handed last season?

But Noel should probably now be banished back to the bench or just playing STs where he belongs ? Maybe Noel is still needing more time to learn to run routes - LOL? And interesting that some usual suspect types had little recognition or zip-o to say for Noel the game before where he had 2 excellent grabs for 80 some yards. Just priceless - sort of like Clown, er, Glenn, Suitor.

[AngeloV]

How many starts was Jeff Fuller handed last season?

But Noel should probably now be banished back to the bench or just playing STs where he belongs ? Maybe Noel is still needing more time to learn to run routes - LOL? And interesting that some usual suspect types had little recognition or zip-o to say for Noel the game before where he had 2 excellent grabs for 80 some yards. Just priceless - sort of like Clown, er, Glenn, Suitor.

I'm not saying don't give him any playing time at receiver, but I don't think he's ready to be an every down player there. I would have no issue for now trying a rotation at the 2 WR spots with him, Malcolm Williams and Rodney Smith.

[paulwoods13]

For the record, I don't think Noel should be benched. But he has to catch passes thrown his way, especially when we are working in a new qb. (And so do Green, Edwards, Wilder etc).

Also for the record, I didn't see whatever passes Adams dropped, and I really don't care. It's convenient to call out an INT for getting a lot of rope, but I honestly don't care what the Bombers do with their personnel. And again for the record, I'm not a big fan of Adams and feel he has been overrated.

[OV Argo]

For the record, I don't think Noel should be benched. But he has to catch passes thrown his way, especially when we are working in a new qb. (And so do Green, Edwards, Wilder etc).

Also for the record, I didn't see whatever passes Adams dropped, and I really don't care. It's convenient to call out an INT for getting a lot of rope, but I honestly don't care what the Bombers do with their personnel. And again for the record, I'm not a big fan of Adams and feel he has been overrated.

Ok, so FYI - Adams had 2 passes last game that were dead on, right in his hands, with no defender what-so-ever around to contest, and he flat out dropped them. That, IMO, is a very different category of attempt or drop compared to 2 of the passes directed at Noel last game. Agreed though that Adams is (very IMO) over-rated; and you wouldn't see a Suitor type call-out of the guy even though he's dropped pass after pass as a feature receiver for the Bombers.

[Rich]

The third one I don't count as a drop. He barely touched it.

That's the one Suitor said Noel "should have caught". Watch the tape. I thought it was so bizarre at the time because the pass looked uncatchable. I guess Suitor had already made up his mind about Noel after the first two "drops", and it looks like he wasn't the only one who did. It reminds me of the time Declan Cross dropped a couple in a row early in his Argo career and some poster really embarrassed himself on this site by insisting what a terrible player Cross was.

[AngeloV]

That's the one Suitor said Noel "should have caught". Watch the tape. I thought it was so bizarre at the time because the pass looked uncatchable. I guess Suitor had already made up his mind about Noel after the first two "drops", and it looks like he wasn't the only one who did. It reminds me of the time Declan Cross dropped a couple in a row early in his Argo career and some poster really embarrassed himself on this site by insisting what a terrible player Cross was.

Difference being nobody is calling for Noel to be cut. I still believe he needs playing time, and perhaps he should have received more prior to this season, but none of us really know if he is going to be a good every down receiver. I'm good with a rotation of him, Williams and Smith for the 2 outside positions.

[Ron]

Further, Wynn has no history of being a dirty player,

he does now

[AngeloV]

Ok, so FYI - Adams had 2 passes last game that were dead on, right in his hands, with no defender what-so-ever around to contest, and he flat out dropped them. That, IMO, is a very different category of attempt or drop compared to 2 of the passes directed at Noel last game. Agreed though that Adams is (very IMO) over-rated; and you wouldn't see a Suitor type call-out of the guy even though he's dropped pass after pass as a feature receiver for the Bombers.

Of course it's different to you. You see things how you want to see them. Canadians are great. Americans suck.


I'm not a big fan of Adams and feel he has been overrated.

Darvin Adams is not overrated. He had a monster year and missed 3 games last year. I don't care if a receiver drops the odd pass when he produces like Adams does. Allen Pitts dropped a lot of catchable balls over his career, but because he made so many plays, nobody remembers it.

Bombers sure weren't that good after Adams went down last year. TSN also illustrated a great job he did of coming down the line and sealing and inside block which allowed Harris to score a long TD last game. He's a stud receiver in my books.

[OV Argo]

Of course it's different to you. You see things how you want to see them. Canadians are great. Americans suck.



Darvin Adams is not overrated. He had a monster year and missed 3 games last year. I don't care if a receiver drops the odd pass when he produces like Adams does. Allen Pitts dropped a lot of catchable balls over his career, but because he made so many plays, nobody remembers it.

Bombers sure weren't that good after Adams went down last year. TSN also illustrated a great job he did of coming down the line and sealing and inside block which allowed Harris to score a long TD last game. He's a stud receiver in my books.


You're entitled to your opinion on any players, as am I; so you think Adams is a stud receiver and I think he's an over-rated mediocre; big deal.

And sorry to alarm your types by sticking up for some Canadian talent; more like you always rate American players higher than Canadians = automatically superior to your types = good for you in believing what you were taught/told.