TSN poll: best Canadian receiver of all-time [Archive]

OV Argo

07-19-2018, 10:53 PM

Cahoon - "Canadian" or not, IMO had the best set of hands - all-time - for receivers in football (NFL included).

Gabriel (started as a tight end, when the position mattered in the CFL, but morphed into a slotback) and Elgaard were all-time great reliable hands, big targets - both almost unstoppable in their primes.

Poplawski & Fantuz were fantastic all-around receivers - great hands and could get open deep.

Masotti is more like criminally under-rated IMO; solid all-around, great hands with sneaky speed and big play ability.

Whit Tucker could have been on this list with Evanshen IMO - blazing speed deep threat and one of the all-time best yards/catch averages.

I believe that vote reflects more the average age of voters = Cahoon had tons of great seasons in more recent history (plus played for years with an all-time veteran accurate passer in Calvillo).

IF you had to build a CFL offence with just one of those guys in the receiving corps? = tough call, but I might go with Gabriel or Elgaard or maybe Poplawski too, over Cahoon.

paulwoods13

07-20-2018, 02:29 AM

It is ridiculous that someone who was NEVER CANADIAN is being ranked as the greatest Canadian receiver of all time. Cahoon was great, but he was a non-import, not a Canadian.

halifaxguy

07-20-2018, 07:49 AM

What about Brad Sinopoli? the converted QB has 3 seasons in a row of 1,000 yards. Is the poll only for "retired" receivers?

Foxhound

07-20-2018, 10:07 AM

Poplawski is #1 for me from this list. Criminally underrated.

No Masotti, Sapunjis or Clermont?

Poplawski & Fantuz were fantastic all-around receivers - great hands and could get open deep.

Masotti is more like criminally under-rated IMO; solid all-around, great hands with sneaky speed and big play ability.

Whit Tucker could have been on this list with Evanshen IMO - blazing speed deep threat and one of the all-time best yards/catch averages.

What about Brad Sinopoli? the converted QB has 3 seasons in a row of 1,000 yards. Is the poll only for "retired" receivers?

I agree. The omission of all the fellows mentioned above is truly shameful. Another incredible oversight is the omission of Rocky Dipietro who I believe retired as the leading pass catcher of all-time in the CFL:

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/07/fc/c4/07fcc4394f52245d6783f134b295992a.jpg

I believe that vote reflects more the average age of voters....

Precisely! Always a problem.

:(

Foxhound

07-20-2018, 10:21 AM

It is ridiculous that someone who was NEVER CANADIAN is being ranked as the greatest Canadian receiver of all time. Cahoon was great, but he was a non-import, not a Canadian.

Well....

Cahoon was born in Utah but qualified as a Canadian in the CFL because his parents were Canadian and he spent ... part of his childhood in Cardston, Alberta and is therefore considered a non-import under the CFL's import/non-import ratio rule.

Cahoon played his high school sports at Mountain View High School in Orem, Utah where he earned All-Region and All-State honors in football, basketball, and soccer.Throughout his career Cahoon steadfastly maintained he felt he was Canadian despite being born in the U.S. and attending both high school and college in Utah.

Hmmmmm. He would have had to attend a Canadian university to firmly establish Canadian credentials in my book.

:sick:

paulwoods13

07-20-2018, 11:08 AM

He felt so Canadian that he made Canada his permanent home after retiring. Oh wait ...

That was a convenient thing to say when was winning all those MOCs tho.

Unrelated, DiPietro was good but I'd take Paul Pearson over him when both were in their prime.

AngeloV

07-20-2018, 11:32 AM

My top 5: (quickly of the top of my head)
Sapunjis
Poplawski
Gabriel
Evanshin
Elgaard

I too would not count Cahoon. Hell, Pinball is more Canadian than him. Bring back the naturalization rule dammit.

R.J

07-20-2018, 12:27 PM

I wouldn't have Cahoon on my Canadian list either, but he's in my top 5 all time receivers though. Cahoon and Fantuz were the most sure handed receivers in the last decade or so IMO.

I still think the League needs to tweak the Canadian definition again - IMO Canadian birth certificate or CDN Citizenship are the only two ways someone should be able to be a designated "National". I wouldn't mind seeing the names for National and International changed to Domestic and Import either - makes sense for Beer lol.

ArgoGabe22

07-20-2018, 03:13 PM

Isn’t Cahoon a duel citizen though?

OV Argo

07-20-2018, 04:19 PM

It is ridiculous that someone who was NEVER CANADIAN is being ranked as the greatest Canadian receiver of all time. Cahoon was great, but he was a non-import, not a Canadian.

And yet - some Canadians were all over celebrating Jamaican born Canadian sprinters who won medals as great Canadian athletes?; or Lennox Lewis as a boxer?; that Greg Joy guy (American born high jumper who completed for Canada and won a silver medal (whoop de do) in the Olympics) was featured in an old TV station sign-off clip celebrating great things about Canada (Joy's moment selected for that was an embarassing joke IMO) ???

Ben Cahoon is IMO as Canadian as any of those examples; and his top football accomplishments - that got him recognized as an all-time great receiver - were all done in Canada, in the CANADIAN Football League.

It was an outstanding thing IMO for Jon Cornish to be recognized as the top Canadian athlete in winning that award/trophy (Lou Marsh ?) a few years back - Canadian football players have been dis-respected, shunned or ignored as outstanding, top athletes in their own country for a long time IMO. Maybe Cornish should have been disqualified though for playing US college ball ?

jerrym

07-20-2018, 04:35 PM

It is ridiculous that someone who was NEVER CANADIAN is being ranked as the greatest Canadian receiver of all time. Cahoon was great, but he was a non-import, not a Canadian.

I think OV is right: the poll reflects the age of those voting to a significant extent. Fantuz is the only one who played more recently than Cahoon, so Cahoon benefits enormously from that. I would put Tony Gabriel first not only for his pass catching ability but because he revolutionized the tight end position, helping to bring about the creation of the modern slotback. Ray Elgaard, who not only accumulated more than 13,000 yards but was a beast to bring down, was next IMO. I would rank Terry Evanshen third because he was a dominant receiver at the peak of his career. Sapunjis and Sinopoli should be added to the list IMO.

halifaxguy

07-20-2018, 04:39 PM

And yet - some Canadians were all over celebrating Jamaican born Canadian sprinters who won medals as great Canadian athletes?; or Lennox Lewis as a boxer?; that Greg Joy guy (American born high jumper who completed for Canada and won a silver medal (whoop de do) in the Olympics) was featured in an old TV station sign-off clip celebrating great things about Canada (Joy's moment selected for that was an embarassing joke IMO) ???

Ben Cahoon is IMO as Canadian as any of those examples; and his top football accomplishments - that got him recognized as an all-time great receiver - were all done in Canada, in the CANADIAN Football League.

It was an outstanding thing IMO for Jon Cornish to be recognized as the top Canadian athlete in winning that award/trophy (Lou Marsh ?) a few years back - Canadian football players have been dis-respected, shunned or ignored as outstanding, top athletes in their own country for a long time IMO. Maybe Cornish should have been disqualified though for playing US college ball ?

Greg Joy? that is really unfair. He was born in the US to CANADIAN parents, his dad was working in Portland at the time. He went to high school in Vancouver.
He lives in Ottawa and has run the Ottawa food bank for many years, he's an adjudicator for the landlord and tenant board in Ottawa. Back in 96 he ran for the Ontario PCs in Ottawa west.

paulwoods13

07-20-2018, 04:42 PM

halifaxguy

07-20-2018, 04:43 PM

As far as I know, Donovan Bailey (to name one sprinter born elsewhere) chose to both live in Canada and become a Canadian citizen. As far as I know, Cahoon never lived in Canada year round and did not take out citizenship. And yet he won the Most Outstanding Canadian award. Go figure. (Bailey and everyone else in ov's list of "equally as Canadian" athletes were not competing for awards presented to the best Canadian -- they were seeking international awards on behalf (proudly) of a country they chose to call home. Somewhat different than anything Cahoon did imo.

Donovan Bailey is another one that came to Canada as a kid, he went to school in Oakville. Even though he was born in Jamaica he could've run for them but chose Canada.

Lennox Lewis was NOT Jamaican he was born in London England, but had dual Canadian/British citizenship but boxed at the Olympics for Canada. He did move ack to the UK and boxed as a Brit.

Foxhound

07-20-2018, 04:46 PM

Chris Getzlaf merits a mention here as well for his 6192 career receiving yards.

:)

Foxhound

07-20-2018, 04:48 PM

paulwoods13

07-20-2018, 04:49 PM

Maybe he did. It doesn't change my belief that someone who chooses to become a Canadian and is honoured to represent Canada internationally deserves more appreciation as a Canadian than someone who happily accepts recognition as a Canadian yet does nothing to actually affiliate with this country except accept a paycheque for five months of the year.

jerrym

07-20-2018, 05:05 PM

I would like to see Paul Masotti (second all-time Argo receiver), Whit Tucker (second all-time Ottawa Rough Rider receiver) and Bob Simpson (third all-time Ottawa Rough Rider receiver who played two ways primarily in the 1950s when rushing was still dominant) to the list although I wouldn't put them at the top of the list. It is interesting that the top three Rough Rider receivers in yardage were all Canadian (Gabriel, Tucker and Simpson), a reflection of the deep Canadian talent they had that also included Russ Jackson, Ronnie Stewart, and Moe Racine from the late 1950s to the mid 1970s.

OV Argo

07-20-2018, 11:31 PM

Greg Joy? that is really unfair. He was born in the US to CANADIAN parents, his dad was working in Portland at the time. He went to high school in Vancouver.
He lives in Ottawa and has run the Ottawa food bank for many years, he's an adjudicator for the landlord and tenant board in Ottawa. Back in 96 he ran for the Ontario PCs in Ottawa west.

Greg Joy might be a great guy and all, but the point is he was American born (to Canadian parents = same as Cahoon), and his big accomplishment was winning a silver medal for Canada in an ultra limited sports discipline (high-jump); sorry, but IMO he is not even in the same area code as Ben Cahoon in terms
of sport accomplishment.

Football is a Canadian game (invented and played here for over a century) - and Cahoon proved to be one of the best all-time in a Canadian sport, playing for over a decade in a league that is exclusively in Canada. No disrespect intended for track& field and the high-jump.

ArgoRavi

07-21-2018, 03:17 AM

Greg Joy might be a great guy and all, but the point is he was American born (to Canadian parents = same as Cahoon), and his big accomplishment was winning a silver medal for Canada in an ultra limited sports discipline (high-jump); sorry, but IMO he is not even in the same area code as Ben Cahoon in terms
of sport accomplishment.

Football is a Canadian game (invented and played here for over a century) - and Cahoon proved to be one of the best all-time in a Canadian sport, playing for over a decade in a league that is exclusively in Canada. No disrespect intended for track& field and the high-jump.

I get what you are saying, OV, but the reason why Joy gets acclaim is because he had, arguably, the most memorable moment for a Canadian athlete during the Montreal Olympics. I was a wee lad of 6 at the time and I still remember watching him in the high jump live on TV.

paulwoods13

07-21-2018, 03:20 AM

Greg Joy might be a great guy and all, but the point is he was American born (to Canadian parents = same as Cahoon), and his big accomplishment was winning a silver medal for Canada in an ultra limited sports discipline (high-jump); sorry, but IMO he is not even in the same area code as Ben Cahoon in terms
of sport accomplishment.

Football is a Canadian game (invented and played here for over a century) - and Cahoon proved to be one of the best all-time in a Canadian sport, playing for over a decade in a league that is exclusively in Canada. No disrespect intended for track& field and the high-jump.

I don't disagree with any of that. But there is still a difference. One guy chose to be Canadian, one didn't.

halifaxguy

07-21-2018, 07:54 AM

What about Brad Sinopoli? the converted QB has 3 seasons in a row of 1,000 yards. Is the poll only for "retired" receivers?

I will say it again "Brad Sinopoli" - last night he catches 12 passes for 170 yards. None of the other guys listed ever had a 170 yard game.
Right now he's the number one receiver in the league with 36 catches and after only 5 games.

ArgoGabe22

07-21-2018, 10:01 AM

I don't disagree with any of that. But there is still a difference. One guy chose to be Canadian, one didn't.

But how much does it have to do with his faith? Not everyone wants to live to Utah. That’s probably why his parents took their family there. I find the Cahoon story a little more unique than the other cases like Singleton etc.

Foxhound

07-21-2018, 10:23 AM

Well that would clearly indicate that being a Mormon was important to Ben Cahoon, while being a Canadian was not.

OV Argo

07-21-2018, 10:56 AM

I get what you are saying, OV, but the reason why Joy gets acclaim is because he had, arguably, the most memorable moment for a Canadian athlete during the Montreal Olympics. I was a wee lad of 6 at the time and I still remember watching him in the high jump live on TV.

I was bringing up Joy because the clip of him jumping in that Montreal Olympics was included in that old Canadian TV network sign-off clip of great things about Canada (including stuff like landscapes, Canadian animals, scenery, etc.)- do you recall what I'm talking about Ravi? It was a nice moment at the Montreal games for Canada, but IMO it also shows a bit of the Canadian inferiority/wannabe complex : they used an American born guy winning only a Silver Medal as their big sports moment to represent Canada ??? I'd suggest the Paul Henderson Summit Series winning goal, or the Tony Gabriel Grey Cup winning TD catch in 76, as two examples, blow away what Joy did - in terms of sport accomplishment AND Canadian-ness. And a lot of Canadians - including some big media exec. / decision maker types, don't get that football is a true Canadian sport; but those types would be oh so proud that Canada got to host an Olympics and won a silver medal.

argolio

07-21-2018, 12:58 PM

I have no issue with Greg Joy. The Olympics is a regular, worldwide competition, and amateurs really were amateurs back then. The Summit Series was a one-off between NHL and Soviet league all-stars that was promoted as an exhibition prior to the event, and Gabriel was representing a club team, not Canada.

Bobby Taylor was another productive Canadian receiver who could probably be slotted in the 11-20 range.

ArgoGabe22

07-21-2018, 12:58 PM

Well that would clearly indicate that being a Mormon was important to Ben Cahoon, while being a Canadian was not.

You do realize he grew up there and maybe has his wife's side of the family there too? If that's considered "home" for him, then let it be. I don't see why Cahoon needs to live in Canada to show his love for Canada. And choosing to return to the area he grew up in, is him taking a shot at Canada? There are some Canadian born players who retired south. Cahoon has "Canadian blood", whatever that means, but grew up in Utah. Might not make him a Canadian trained football player but I don't see why he needs to live in Canada year round. That is his and his family's choice.

doubleblue

07-21-2018, 01:06 PM

Former Argo all time great Royal Copeland was the best.

argolio

07-21-2018, 01:12 PM

Former Argo all time great Royal Copeland was the best.Don't think he caught many passes.

paulwoods13

07-21-2018, 02:27 PM

The issue to me is not Cahoon's choices in life, it's the fact he won the Most Outstanding Canadian award despite what would seem to be a bare minimum requirement -- that nominees be Canadian. It's not the Most Outstanding Non-Import award, and in fact if the Canadian aspect isn't required, I don't see why the award even exists. Whatever one thinks of Cahoon (or Lennox Lewis, Greg Joy or whomever), shouldn't an award celebrating Canadians in the Canadian Football League be bestowed upon a Canadian?

Argo

07-21-2018, 04:40 PM

And yet - some Canadians were all over celebrating Jamaican born Canadian sprinters who won medals as great Canadian athletes?; or Lennox Lewis as a boxer?; that Greg Joy guy (American born high jumper who completed for Canada and won a silver medal (whoop de do) in the Olympics) was featured in an old TV station sign-off clip celebrating great things about Canada (Joy's moment selected for that was an embarassing joke IMO) ???

Ben Cahoon is IMO as Canadian as any of those examples; and his top football accomplishments - that got him recognized as an all-time great receiver - were all done in Canada, in the CANADIAN Football League.

It was an outstanding thing IMO for Jon Cornish to be recognized as the top Canadian athlete in winning that award/trophy (Lou Marsh ?) a few years back - Canadian football players have been dis-respected, shunned or ignored as outstanding, top athletes in their own country for a long time IMO. Maybe Cornish should have been disqualified though for playing US college ball ?

As a huge Lennox "The Last Man Standing" Lewis fan, I would note that Lennox did grow up in KW (and has a street named after him).

I see that Lennox will be back in KW this month and doing good work: http://locfoundation.org/news-events

ArgoRavi

07-22-2018, 01:02 AM

I was bringing up Joy because the clip of him jumping in that Montreal Olympics was included in that old Canadian TV network sign-off clip of great things about Canada (including stuff like landscapes, Canadian animals, scenery, etc.)- do you recall what I'm talking about Ravi? It was a nice moment at the Montreal games for Canada, but IMO it also shows a bit of the Canadian inferiority/wannabe complex : they used an American born guy winning only a Silver Medal as their big sports moment to represent Canada ??? I'd suggest the Paul Henderson Summit Series winning goal, or the Tony Gabriel Grey Cup winning TD catch in 76, as two examples, blow away what Joy did - in terms of sport accomplishment AND Canadian-ness. And a lot of Canadians - including some big media exec. / decision maker types, don't get that football is a true Canadian sport; but those types would be oh so proud that Canada got to host an Olympics and won a silver medal.

OV, I remember this well: <iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/qqmXyWbrD0I" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>

OV Argo

07-22-2018, 12:57 PM

OV, I remember this well: <iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/qqmXyWbrD0I" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen=""></iframe>

Thanks for that Ravi; so, for Canadian sports scenes in that clip, they had a brief old NFL hockey (Montreal Canadians game i think?) shot; a shot of a high diver (could that have been Cindy Shatto ?); and - their longest bit, was of an American guy winning only a Silver Medal for Canada at the Montreal Olympics (and yeah it was a nice moment at the Big Owe). WTF ??? - wouldn't they have Paul Henderson's winning goal, or Tony Gabriel's GC winning TD grab - 2 outstanding Canadian athletes excelling in huge moments in the 2 most Canadian sports, instead ???

paulwoods13

07-22-2018, 02:37 PM

Henderson's goal was broadcast by CTV, so CBC would not have had the rights to show it. Gabriel's TD was a happy memory for Ottawa fans, not Canadians as a whole.

Foxhound

07-22-2018, 04:20 PM

Hey! Nobody's mentioned "Dirty Thirty" Hall of Famer Jim Young!

https://i.pinimg.com/736x/4c/5a/e7/4c5ae77fc33421bddd5fdb36d51eb947--canadian-football-football-cards.jpg

:ohno:

OV Argo

07-22-2018, 06:36 PM

Henderson's goal was broadcast by CTV, so CBC would not have had the rights to show it. Gabriel's TD was a happy memory for Ottawa fans, not Canadians as a whole.

Again; Gabriel was a proven Canadian athlete, scoring the winning points in the big game in a storied league with (even back then) around 100 years of history, that featured big crowds in the stands and huge TV #s (GC game in particular) watching a very Canadian game.

Now maybe some Canadians liked it more and had more pride in an American winning 2nd place in an ultra limited sport, representing Canada. That would not surprise me in the least; just like some typical homer sport fans who can't have respect for outstanding athletes or teams cause they ain't their guys who beat their homer team, continue to not surprise me at all.

Yep, the Joy moment deserved to be featured way more than the Gabriel GC TD. At least to some "world class" wannabes who produced that spot for the CBC ;o)

:fart:

argolio

07-22-2018, 09:32 PM

Hey! Nobody's mentioned "Dirty Thirty" Hall of Famer Jim Young!

https://i.pinimg.com/736x/4c/5a/e7/4c5ae77fc33421bddd5fdb36d51eb947--canadian-football-football-cards.jpg

:ohno:Good one! Forgot about him.

Put up really good numbers playing for a lot of bad teams.

Argo57

07-23-2018, 07:04 PM

Honourable mention to Paul Pearson, Mr. Clutch for the Argonauts in the 1980’s.

MikeT

07-24-2018, 08:09 AM

Again; Gabriel was a proven Canadian athlete, scoring the winning points in the big game in a storied league with (even back then) around 100 years of history, that featured big crowds in the stands and huge TV #s (GC game in particular) watching a very Canadian game.

Now maybe some Canadians liked it more and had more pride in an American winning 2nd place in an ultra limited sport, representing Canada. That would not surprise me in the least; just like some typical homer sport fans who can't have respect for outstanding athletes or teams cause they ain't their guys who beat their homer team, continue to not surprise me at all.

Yep, the Joy moment deserved to be featured way more than the Gabriel GC TD. At least to some "world class" wannabes who produced that spot for the CBC ;o)

:fart:

What? Greg Joy grew up in Vancouver went to school and University in Canada, he chose UBC, it's not his fault that his parents, who were Canadian, were working in the US when he was born.
He obviously "chose" Canada, he went to the Olympics and was representing CANADA. The big deal about Joy at the time was that he was the ONLY Canadian to win a track&field medal at the 76 Olympics.
Gabriel and a few other CFL "Canadians" did not choose Canadian universities, they chose to attend American universities, Gabriel went to Syracuse. They were "wannabes" they wannabe trained by US coaches!!

Joy was representing Canada ,that jump was seen all over the world., track and events like the high jump are recognized all over the world. CFL football is only played here in Canada and none of the CFL players were representing their country.