Heath Traded. Again....

[ArgoGabe22]

Argos get Guard, Ryan Bomben from Als in exchange for TJ Heath. Herb Zurkowsky broke the story.

[argolio]

Good trade.

[ArgoGabe22]

I just hope it’s official.

[R.J]

Good trade for us, but I have no idea what Kavis is thinking; even with White out.

[ArgoGabe22]

Argos get Guard, Ryan Bomben from Als in exchange for TJ Heath. Herb Zurkowsky broke the story.

Also exchanged our 3rd Rd pick for their 5th Rd pick.

[Mightygoose]

Much better return than the last time we traded him.... can't get much worse than that.

I like the move.

[R.J]

Much better return than the last time we traded him.... can't get much worse than that.

I like the move.
You just jinxed it..............

[dmont]

Ceeeeeeelebrate good times, come on!.......da da da da da da da da...... it's a celebration....

[ArgoGabe22]

So does Bomben start on the right to open up an import reciever or does he replace the struggling Tyler Holmes?

[OV Argo]

So does Bomben start on the right to open up an import reciever or does he replace the struggling Tyler Holmes?

Which import receiver? Anyone that could be air-lifted in and handed a starting job ?

[ArgoGabe22]

Which import receiver? Anyone that could be air-lifted in and handed a starting job ?

Malcolm Williams isn’t exactly lighting it up. Noel has gone quiet since Edmonton. And I’m glad they moved one of them, Ralph, out of the lineup to get Smith in. There needs to be a change at reciever.

[ArgoRavi]

Malcolm Williams isn’t exactly lighting it up. Noel has gone quiet since Edmonton. And I’m glad they moved one of them, Ralph, out of the lineup to get Smith in. There needs to be a change at reciever.

Agreed. They aren't getting production from the national receivers. I would love to see them go with four national offensive linemen and an additional international receiver plus get Coombs back. In any event, Bomben gives them options and he is a solid offensive lineman. The Argos got better on both the offensive line and the defensive backfield with this trade.

[gilthethrill]

Which import receiver? Anyone that could be air-lifted in and handed a starting job ?

I think Myles White who has been on the PR for about a month may draw in. Has some speed. As for Heaths replacement, plenty of options here...youngsters Washington, Dowling, Roberson as well as vets Ford and Sears. Bomben is a reliable vet who lives near Hamilton and has a young family should be happy about moving back.

Now Montreal has 3 major prices of that 2016 Heath/Willy deal if you include Faith Ekaketie.

[Shatto]

The problem is the check down. If the primary receiver is Green and next choice is Edwards, by the time the QB has to move to the third, he is normally swarmed by opposition DL. It is doubtful that the offensive scheme very often has Noel or Williams as the primary receiver. Having said that, William caught 2 passes in the last game.

[argotom]

He has lost more than a step and has been beaten regularly this year on deep balls.
Just like the Bombers gave up on him last year.

[Jon Gonzo]

The problem is the check down. If the primary receiver is Green and next choice is Edwards, by the time the QB has to move to the third, he is normally swarmed by opposition DL. It is doubtful that the offensive scheme very often has Noel or Williams as the primary receiver. Having said that, William caught 2 passes in the last game.

And no YAC to speak of. With all due respect, we have too many passengers on "O." We all know successful QB's spread the ball around and that is not an option in Toronto. That compounds when you introduce starters who have barely ever started.

A couple of tweeks, the return of a good YAC receiver like Coombs who has a nose for the marker, and this can be turned around.

The Redblacks were in these shoes last season after a Grey Cup, and still made the Playoffs last year.

This is do-able, but it needs to start with a win against Ottawa this week.

[Jon Gonzo]

Anytime you trade an American DB for a starting (ratio changing) O-Lineman, it's a great day. Bomben has been an All-Star too. Even better.

As for receiver; things should look much better once AC returns. Add one other vertical burner and that will take a great deal of pressure off the Line and the QB.


Jim Popp is down south right now, and he's making a list. Some names on that list would certainly include Devier Posey's and may well include the likes Terrell Sinkfield, Dontrelle Inman, Branden Zylstra and Chris Matthews.

[Shatto]

Correction-- Williams caught 3 mot 2 passes last game Sorry for wrong info

[Argo57]

[QUOTE=ArgoRavi;130332]Agreed. They aren't getting production from the national receivers. I would love to see them go with four national offensive linemen and an additional international receiver plus get Coombs back. In any event, Bomben gives them options and he is a solid offensive lineman. The Argos got better on both the offensive line and the defensive backfield with this trade.[/QUOTE

Great trade, Canadian O-Lineman with a proven track record and as you stated a classic case of “addition by subtraction” by dumping Heath.

[AngeloV]

The problem is the check down. If the primary receiver is Green and next choice is Edwards, by the time the QB has to move to the third, he is normally swarmed by opposition DL. It is doubtful that the offensive scheme very often has Noel or Williams as the primary receiver. Having said that, William caught 2 passes in the last game.

You have to be kidding me. QB's make their primary read based on the defence movement at the snap of the ball. They don't have a 1, 2 and 3 situation. Based on the coverage, they throw to an area where they read the best chance for a completion is, regardless of who the receiver is.

[R.J]

You have to be kidding me. QB's make their primary read based on the defence movement at the snap of the ball. They don't have a 1, 2 and 3 situation. Based on the coverage, they throw to an area where they read the best chance for a completion is, regardless of who the receiver is.
Sorry, but I have to disagree here. There are set plays and receivers on a lot of plays IMO. The read option is more spread out with no specific #1 option. Trevor Harris loves the "checkdown" play where a receiver would stand in place after the snap and Harris would throw to him right away - if the blocking up field worked and depending on the receiver (worked with Williams in Ottawa; not so much in Toronto though, as Harris got picked a lot on that play). Jason Maas also runs plays where his primary two receivers are the 1 and 2 options. Heck, even June Jones' run and shoot has set plays and receivers - hence why Banks is featured so much.

[Jon Gonzo]

You have to be kidding me. QB's make their primary read based on the defence movement at the snap of the ball. They don't have a 1, 2 and 3 situation. Based on the coverage, they throw to an area where they read the best chance for a completion is, regardless of who the receiver is.

Disagree. It's not that simple. They say Quarterbacks have to have the aptitude of fighter pilots. All Offenses are different, but all Offenses have primary targets, matchups desired, audibles for changing looks and 1st, 2nd and 3rd options.

Most playbooks usually have 250-300 plays in them, each with variables and options and they say the Argo offense is more complicated than most.

Here's a nice breakdown with Aaron Rogers:

s://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4KZQ187--dM

[macspectrum]

Disagree. It's not that simple. They say Quarterbacks have to have the aptitude of fighter pilots. All Offenses are different, but all Offenses have primary targets, matchups desired, audibles for changing looks and 1st, 2nd and 3rd options.

Most playbooks usually have 250-300 plays in them, each with variables and options and they say the Argo offense is more complicated than most.

Here's a nice breakdown with Aaron Rogers:

s://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4KZQ187--dM

'they say the Argo offense is more complicated than most.'
running for 3 yd, then throwing a 5yd pass, then punting is really that hard ?
[step 1 and 2 could be reversed]

[Argo57]

Disagree. It's not that simple. They say Quarterbacks have to have the aptitude of fighter pilots. All Offenses are different, but all Offenses have primary targets, matchups desired, audibles for changing looks and 1st, 2nd and 3rd options.

Most playbooks usually have 250-300 plays in them, each with variables and options and they say the Argo offense is more complicated than most.

Here's a nice breakdown with Aaron Rogers:

s://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4KZQ187--dM

I get a kick out of the old “our offence is more complex than most” routine, Kent Austin used to pump his own tires and spew that crap in Hamilton.

[OV Argo]

I get a kick out of the old “our offence is more complex than most” routine, Kent Austin used to pump his own tires and spew that crap in Hamilton.

Bingo!

A lot of CFL offences now are as simpleton/predictable as it gets in football; zero faith in a consistent run game, with one basic same old run play; deferring to mostly pass and often just dink & dunk stuff; cowardice to throw the ball well down field on more than a couple of plays a game; little variety to use strategic plays that surprise or confuse a defence - like deploying an H-back effectively (notice how Cross isn't doing much now after his big plays late last season? - another example - Ottawa runs a tight end release to H-back Beaulieu earlier this season and he is wide-open/un-covered for a big gainer TD - and they haven't gone back to it since ???) Going away from plays or formations or players that have been effective in favor of same old basic short pass plays? (notice how the Ticats have lately completely gone away from using Canadian RBs Timmis & Erlington who were so productive early in the season - to defer to an import RB only in White who is not doing much ???) No real tight ends or fullbacks deployed anymore. The Riders could have Bridge throwing lots of bombs to big play potential receivers like Duron Carter or Roosevelt or Devon Bailey even, but ego-Jones prefers Carter on defence, and hand-cuffing a strong-armed QB with mostly just dink & dunk check-downs ??? Mind boggling sometimes the stupidity and simpleton-ness of a lot of CFL offensive coaching.

Same old/ good ole boys offence is the hallmark of the CFL now (actually for decades now); this league needs an enema - in terms of offensive "thinking: (just IMO of course);o) Classic GOB LaPolice is now the big offensive "innovator" for CFL offences - at least he bangs Harris and the run game lots (leading the league in rushing), plus goes to the jet sweep to receiver run play (to shifty speedsters like Dressler & Demski) fairly consistently, plus seem to be able to have faith to throw to all the receivers in their 5 pack (but they don't deploy an H-back at all really).

:bored:

[paulwoods13]

How much did Bomben play last night?

[gilthethrill]

How much did Bomben play last night?

I think I saw him in short yardage.

[argolio]

I think I saw him in short yardage.He played more than that. They used 6 o-linemen at times.

[paulwoods13]

Was anybody able to tell how much and how well Heath played for Montreal?

[gilthethrill]

Was anybody able to tell how much and how well Heath played for Montreal?

He started and was on the field al lot....dropped an interception. He was as bad as the rest of the Montreal secondary that night.

[jerrym]

I think Bomben could really help the OL - they need it.

[Will]

He started and was on the field al lot....dropped an interception. He was as bad as the rest of the Montreal secondary that night.

I think he got beat on at least one of the TD's.

[AngeloV]

Sorry, but I have to disagree here. There are set plays and receivers on a lot of plays IMO. The read option is more spread out with no specific #1 option. Trevor Harris loves the "checkdown" play where a receiver would stand in place after the snap and Harris would throw to him right away - if the blocking up field worked and depending on the receiver (worked with Williams in Ottawa; not so much in Toronto though, as Harris got picked a lot on that play). Jason Maas also runs plays where his primary two receivers are the 1 and 2 options. Heck, even June Jones' run and shoot has set plays and receivers - hence why Banks is featured so much.

Yeah, what do I know? I only played the position at the CJFL level. On every snap of the ball, there are keys that a QB must identify from the D which tells him where to go with the ball. Yes there are primary and secondary targets. Yes, QB’s get tunnel vision at times, but it is the D that should dictate where a QB goes with the ball. Hence the reason for check downs, that oh so many can’t seem to understand.

[macspectrum]

Yeah, what do I know? I only played the position at the CJFL level. On every snap of the ball, there are keys that a QB must identify from the D which tells him where to go with the ball. Yes there are primary and secondary targets. Yes, QB’s get tunnel vision at times, but it is the D that should dictate where a QB goes with the ball. Hence the reason for check downs, that oh so many can’t seem to understand.

its why i think a mobile qb is so important
rolling out of pocket creates havoc for d and gives qb options
he can run or id db's come up on him he can pass especially to a guy like cross in flats

[AngeloV]

its why i think a mobile qb is so important
rolling out of pocket creates havoc for d and gives qb options
he can run or id db's come up on him he can pass especially to a guy like cross in flats

The best QB's in the league, Reilly and Mitchell do not roll out. Reilly runs from the pocket when he has to, Mitchell moves subtly in the pocket to buy more time to find receivers. The number of designed roll outs either of those QB's do is likely 1 or 2% of snaps. You are wrong.

[macspectrum]

The best QB's in the league, Reilly and Mitchell do not roll out. Reilly runs from the pocket when he has to, Mitchell moves subtly in the pocket to buy more time to find receivers. The number of designed roll outs either of those QB's do is likely 1 or 2% of snaps. You are wrong.

perhaps i used the phrase 'roll out' erroneously when i should said 'step outside the pocket'
i think that gives the qb more options and makes the defence think about it
mby is a big boy and i would love to see him run more often

[AngeloV]

perhaps i used the phrase 'roll out' erroneously when i should said 'step outside the pocket'
i think that gives the qb more options and makes the defence think about it
mby is a big boy and i would love to see him run more often

I fail to see the point you are trying to make. He's only played 1 game and had over 50 yards rushing. That would put him on par or even ahead of Reilly if he were to keep that pace up (which by the way, I wouldn't count on). How much more do you really want him to run?

[Argo57]

perhaps i used the phrase 'roll out' erroneously when i should said 'step outside the pocket'
i think that gives the qb more options and makes the defence think about it
mby is a big boy and i would love to see him run more often

If your QB runs periodically because the opening is there that is one thing but MBT is not that fleet of foot to the point that you would have designed plays for him to run.
He really needs to pick his spots or injury will be an issue.