Does the success of the Herdmans suggest teams pay too much attention to test results

[jerrym]

Jordan and Justin Herdman did not do well in football tests and as a result did not get drafted until in the seventh round despite Jordan being the Great NorthWest Athletic Conference's all-time leader in career (428), single season (165) and single game tackles, being a second team Division II All-American, and winning the GNAC Defensive Player of the Year twice, while Justin was a three time GNAC all-star.
Jordan is now second in the CFL it total tackles with 41, in addition to one sack and one forced fumble.
While it took longer for Justin to become a starter, he led the Argos in DTs in the last game with nine.

Has the CFL become too focused on test results in selecting who to draft?

[Wobbler]

This seems like an off-season question.

[argolio]

We've got the better Herdman.

[Argo57]

We've got the better Herdman.

Agree, and to think the BC Herdman got most of the hype prior to the draft.

[AngeloV]

Jordan and Justin Herdman did not do well in football tests and as a result did not get drafted until in the seventh round despite Jordan being the Great NorthWest Athletic Conference's all-time leader in career (428), single season (165) and single game tackles, being a second team Division II All-American, and winning the GNAC Defensive Player of the Year twice, while Justin was a three time GNAC all-star.
Jordan is now second in the CFL it total tackles with 41, in addition to one sack and one forced fumble.
While it took longer for Justin to become a starter, he led the Argos in DTs in the last game with nine.

Has the CFL become too focused on test results in selecting who to draft?

I don't think so. Jordan is great at tacking inside the tackle box, but if you've watched their last 2 games, his lack of quickness is pretty evident when it comes to pass coverage and tacking in space. Justin had a great game against Edmonton, but it was just 1 game. Personally, I'm disappointed to see him out of the starting line-up after such a good performance, but let's not take a few games and declare that testing numbers mean nothing. Sometimes it's stats that mean nothing. BC and Toronto's defenses have been on the field so much, and teams are running the ball late in games, MLB tackle numbers will naturally go up.

Nick Shorthill for Hamilton is far better than either of them IMO. Great range and a great tackler too.

[jerrym]

I don't think so. Jordan is great at tacking inside the tackle box, but if you've watched their last 2 games, his lack of quickness is pretty evident when it comes to pass coverage and tacking in space. Justin had a great game against Edmonton, but it was just 1 game. Personally, I'm disappointed to see him out of the starting line-up after such a good performance, but let's not take a few games and declare that testing numbers mean nothing. Sometimes it's stats that mean nothing. BC and Toronto's defenses have been on the field so much, and teams are running the ball late in games, MLB tackle numbers will naturally go up.

Nick Shorthill for Hamilton is far better than either of them IMO. Great range and a great tackler too.

First of all, I did not say test results mean nothing. I asked a question (the reason there is no question mark is simply that there was I ran out of space). There are four possible answers to the question: an unqualified yes, a qualified yes, a qualified no, an unqualified no.

[Foxhound]

Has the CFL become too focused on test results in selecting who to draft?

Yes, absolutely!

:(

[AngeloV]

First of all, I did not say test results mean nothing. I asked a question (the reason there is no question mark is simply that there was I ran out of space). There are four possible answers to the question: an unqualified yes, a qualified yes, a qualified no, an unqualified no.

Sorry Jerry, my comment was made in a general sense as a few people on here don't put any stock in testing numbers. My personal opinion is they are very important. Football has become a speed sport, even in the American game. I wasn't trying to get testy with you.

[CrazyCanuck89]

Numbers aren't as important as game film and technique. Jerry Rice ran a 4.71 and ended up being the best reciever in NFL history.

[AngeloV]

Numbers aren't as important as game film and technique. Jerry Rice ran a 4.71 and ended up being the best reciever in NFL history.

Some people don’t believe Rice ran that slow a time, myself included. Bill Walsh claimed it was actually 4.59 which in 1985 was a very fast time.


https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.reddit.com/r/NFL_Draft/comments/4chp3i/no_jerry_rice_did_not_run_a_471_40_in_1985/

Others, including Rice himself, say he ran a 4.4.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/211041-debunking-10-nfl-myths

[Will]

Terrell Davis also didn't test well but became a 2,000-yard rusher. Sometimes you can't measure game speed in the combine.

[Jon Gonzo]

Speed and size are god-given but give me a baller first everytime.
Eyeballs first.
I consider the Herdman-Reed's both ballers.
Same with guys like Declan Cross, Jordan Hoover, Antoine Pruneau, Kwaku Boeteng, Sean Thomas-Erlington, Alex Singleton, Taylor Loffler and Jermaine Gabriel.
Some of these players were lacking metrics, and some went as low as the 7th Round, but all of them have been valuable contributors. And all of them are flat out ballers.

[jerrym]

Speed and size are god-given but give me a baller first everytime.
Eyeballs first.
I consider the Herdman-Reed's both ballers.
Same with guys like Declan Cross, Jordan Hoover, Antoine Pruneau, Kwaku Boeteng, Sean Thomas-Erlington, Alex Singleton, Taylor Loffler and Jermaine Gabriel.
Some of these players were lacking metrics, and some went as low as the 7th Round, but all of them have been valuable contributors. And all of them are flat out ballers.

I agree. I can understand why their test numbers meant they were not going to be early round draft choices but I felt that their dropping to the seventh round meant their outstanding college careers were totally discounted because of the test numbers while some pretty marginal players were selected in front of them.

[Argo57]

Speed and size are god-given but give me a baller first everytime.
Eyeballs first.
I consider the Herdman-Reed's both ballers.
Same with guys like Declan Cross, Jordan Hoover, Antoine Pruneau, Kwaku Boeteng, Sean Thomas-Erlington, Alex Singleton, Taylor Loffler and Jermaine Gabriel.
Some of these players were lacking metrics, and some went as low as the 7th Round, but all of them have been valuable contributors. And all of them are flat out ballers.

Agreed Gonzo, sometimes old school game film tells you more about a player than splitting hairs over tenths of a second in a 40 yard dash or # of bench press reps, it’s football not the Olympics.

[AngeloV]

For me it simple. Any player invited to these combines was a great player at the previous level. If we’re talking about players that hadn’t accomplished anything in games, then yeah, I would agree that testing wouldn’t be important. But if you have 2 good players at the same position and one tests better than the other, you have to pick the one that tests better.

[doubleblue]

Jordan and Justin Herdman did not do well in football tests and as a result did not get drafted until in the seventh round despite Jordan being the Great NorthWest Athletic Conference's all-time leader in career (428), single season (165) and single game tackles, being a second team Division II All-American, and winning the GNAC Defensive Player of the Year twice, while Justin was a three time GNAC all-star.
Jordan is now second in the CFL it total tackles with 41, in addition to one sack and one forced fumble.
While it took longer for Justin to become a starter, he led the Argos in DTs in the last game with nine.

Has the CFL become too focused on test results in selecting who to draft?

No. But it just shows OV got this one right. :)

[OV Argo]

No. But it just shows OV got this one right. :)


Herdman brothers are both solid LBs who have shown they can play in the CFL.

Moron CFL scouts writing off Jordan Herdman's outstanding/awesome college ball D play-making = shows there definitely are myopic clown pro scouts who live in modern fantasy football land - all ga ga over measureables instead of looking at "ballers" as Gonzo aptly names those types. Combine this with GOB lack of respect for Canadian talent in general and often at specific positions (see that goof Desjardins in Ottawa) - and plenty of top notch Canadian talent gets under-rated or little respect/use from the pro league in their own country.


Hey - i believe i wuz right about QBs Dominique Davis (useless stiff) and Vernon Adams (QB talent galore, needed a shot with some consistent playing time) too. ? ;o)

[Foxhound]

Combine test results? Ffffftttt!!!! Tom Wilkinson couldn't run, couldn't pass and couldn't kick. All he could do was beat you.

:sick: