What were the blackout boundaries for Argo games?

[Will]

Does anyone remember what the boundaries were for the blackouts in the 1980's. Also, what year did they start them and what year did they end them?

[ArgoRavi]

Does anyone remember what the boundaries were for the blackouts in the 1980's. Also, what year did they start them and what year did they end them?

I know that the blackouts ended in 1991 after McNall, Gretzky and Candy bought the team as they did not believe in them. I believe that they began at some point in the 1960s and I know that Hamilton would be blacked out for Argo home games and vice versa.

[1argoholic]

I remember as a kid listening to CFRB and Bill Stevenson in the 70's so all games were blacked out back then and that was Port Credit. Still enjoy listening to radio as I had to for one preseason game this year. Only problem was it was Montreals radio guys.

[paulwoods13]

I believe it was a 75-mile radius, which just kept Toronto and Hamilton games blacked out in each other's markets.

[1argoholic]

Yah Paul that does sound right.

[AngeloV]

I do know that living in York region (Bayview south of 407) I was able to see Ti-cats games, but they were blacked out 10 minutes away from my house in the Finch and Bayview area.

[Invader]

In the mid 90's when I lived in Etobicoke, the Ticats games were blacked-out but Argo home games were televised. Seemed kind of backwards to me at the time?

For many years, TV blackouts were manditory even if the stadium was soldout. Then for several years the TV networks paid a fee to the home team to lift the blackouts. The league also had a secondary blackout rule back then, so if your team had a home game, all CFL games were blacked-out in that market for the entire day. So when the league used to schedule many games on Saturday's, there were few CFL games available on TV in southern Ontario. That policy is no longer in effect.

The B.C. Lions blacked-out their last home game and announced that 5 more games will be subject to blackouts this season unless they sellout. Attendance increased about 3,000 from the previous home game.

[Midnight Blue]

In the mid 90's when I lived in Etobicoke, the Ticats games were blacked-out but Argo home games were televised. Seemed kind of backwards to me at the time?

For many years, TV blackouts were manditory even if the stadium was soldout. Then for several years the TV networks paid a fee to the home team to lift the blackouts. The league also had a secondary blackout rule back then, so if your team had a home game, all CFL games were blacked-out in that market for the entire day. So when the league used to schedule many games on Saturday's, there were few CFL games available on TV in southern Ontario. That policy is no longer in effect.

The B.C. Lions blacked-out their last home game and announced that 5 more games will be subject to blackouts this season unless they sellout. Attendance increased about 3,000 from the previous home game.


I had no idea the BC Lions management are blacking out games. Wow. Do other teams still do that in the CFL? I remember reading on the old forum, about black-outs (and even decades before that), and I thought it was generally accepted (by us fans, and by the CFL), that black-outs have always hurt the interest and excitement of the game, and have always stifled attempts to get new fans, young or older, interested in Football.

[Invader]

I had no idea the BC Lions management are blacking out games. Wow. Do other teams still do that in the CFL? I remember reading on the old forum, about black-outs (and even decades before that), and I thought it was generally accepted (by us fans, and by the CFL), that black-outs have always hurt the interest and excitement of the game, and have always stifled attempts to get new fans, young or older, interested in Football.
All the 5 western teams still have a blackout policy. Even in Regina with all games nearly soldout they fret each game about a potential blackout (which covers the entire province.) Since Wpg has been selling out, or close to it, for several years, blackouts are not an issue. I think in Edm they have only a couple blackouts a year and in Calgary. In Vancouver there has usually been only 2 or 3 blackouts each year, but attendance has dropped-off since 2008 so they needed to do something.

In the east, the policy has been to televise home games regardless of attendance. In Mtl, they have exceeded the 90% sellout threshold for a decade and televise all home games. The Ticats lift all blackouts as they get a stinging rebuke from their TV fans whenever they threaten a blackout in Steeltown. The Renegades in Ottawa lifted the blackout to every home game in their existence but never had a sellout. In Toronto the theory is the Argos would get "lost" in the shuffle and become "invisible" if they didn't televise home games.

There is little evidence that televising home games in the CFL helps teams sell tickets. There is some correlation of increased ticket sales after a strong road game victory on TV...so perhaps a strong showing at home on TV might entice fans to buy tickets next time, in theory. Conversely, a poor showing on TV could have the reverse effect. That's why all CFL teams need a strong seasons ticket base to help "weather" the dips (with tickets presold regardless of standings.) Blackouts are just one tool to entice fans to buy seasons tickets but seems to have less effect on the walk-up sales than one might suspect.

[1argoholic]

Then Shaw messes the blackout area like they did to us on Vancouver Island. It wasn't until they got my nasty e-mail as our screen went black that the game came on sometime late in the second quater. By that time I was outside wandering along our lane picking rasberries letting off steam. haha. We came back into the house to have messages from our friend that the game was on. After the game I checked e-mails and had one from Shaw saying sorry for the mistake. Not to mention that you'd think TSN would put something else on rather than black. Yet my mom who lives 20 minutes from here had the game on high def. BS.

[Invader]

I don't think they blackout TSN HD. Not sure if its a technical issue or it was negotiated as part of the TV contract? With more and more fans getting HD, the league will have to do something to hang onto their fanbase...like having the ability to blackout HD if required. The league cannot exist if fans do not come out to the games.

[Midnight Blue]

I don't think they blackout TSN HD. Not sure if its a technical issue or it was negotiated as part of the TV contract? With more and more fans getting HD, the league will have to do something to hang onto their fanbase...like having the ability to blackout HD if required. The league cannot exist if fans do not come out to the games.


Speaking of HD, while I don't have an HD converter box (my Sony Wega 27" tube-tv looks better and is more controllable, colour/contrast/brightness-wise than any a' dis new-fangled LCD/Plasmer shtuff), I have noticed that I still have access to about half of all "HD" channels. Just like the Trailer Park Boys. Except I can't tell the difference. This is in Toronto, on Rogers (pardon the R word).

Anyway, this may or may not work in your corner of The Dominion of Canada, but it's worth a try.

Cheers !

[Midnight Blue]

Speaking of HD, while I don't have an HD converter box (my Sony Wega 27" tube-tv looks better and is more controllable, colour/contrast/brightness-wise than any a' dis new-fangled LCD/Plasmer shtuff), I have noticed that I still have access to about half of all "HD" channels. Just like the Trailer Park Boys. Except I can't tell the difference. This is in Toronto, on Rogers (pardon the R word).

Anyway, this may or may not work in your corner of The Dominion of Canada, but it's worth a try.

Cheers !


Ooops. I just checked and presently TSN HD is not available to me. Damn, they're fast. But I swear I could get it before (I once heard a Seventy-year-old Dude say that). Could be a spacial anomaly. Or maybe it's just me. Anyway, Good Luck! I heard it helps if one puts on a tin-foil hat, or tin-foil cover on the TV. Just have many fans, so that the TV (or you) don't overheat. But seriously, half of all HD channels work on my non-HD TV. Must be good Karma! What a great life!

Also, please forgive me for quoting myself ... but, who better to understand the depths of my brilliance, intricacies, and eloquence, than me?

...Well, at least one good Woman. I am Lucky.

Ka 'Pla !

[zontar]

I know that the blackouts ended in 1991 after McNall, Gretzky and Candy bought the team as they did not believe in them. I believe that they began at some point in the 1960s and I know that Hamilton would be blacked out for Argo home games and vice versa.

Yup, only way you could watch a Argo homegame here is if you had "cable" (the converter box with the giant remote control) and watch the CBC London, ON station. Cant recall what the CTV station would have been, CKCO Kitchener was blacked out too.

I recall having to listen to '83 Eastern Final on radio - watched '84 final at a friends. '86 was on regular TV I believe so either blackout region was reduced or lifted altogether for playoffs.

[Gill The Thrill]

Yup, only way you could watch a Argo homegame here is if you had "cable" (the converter box with the giant remote control) and watch the CBC London, ON station. Cant recall what the CTV station would have been, CKCO Kitchener was blacked out too.

I recall having to listen to '83 Eastern Final on radio - watched '84 final at a friends. '86 was on regular TV I believe so either blackout region was reduced or lifted altogether for playoffs.Don't know where you're responding from but the Eastern Finals that were hosted in Toronto in 1982,83,84, 86 and 1988 were all blacked out in Toronto.

Let me tell you that blacking out games did have a negative effect on fan interest by just looking at attendance figures for these games...In the rain and fog in 1982, there was about 48,000 for the eastern final...In 1983, there was a record 54,530 for that great game vs the Ticats and in an Argo/Ticat rematch in 1984 which was also played in wet, damp and cold weather, there was still 48,000 in attendance.

The same Argos and Ticats played to less than 40k, I believe it was 37,000 in 1986 in what was the 2nd game of a 2 game total point series. By 1988, there was so much hype about the Jays, and the sportswriters in this city other than the oldtimers like Jim Hunt, Trent Frayne or Coleman (forgot his first name) pretty much turned their backs and purposefully snubbed the Argos and the CFL....Attendance for the 1988 Eastern Final, which was the last football game at CNE stadium was a paltry 28,000. It was raining as per typical a dreary November day in Toronto, yet the same type of weather had crowds of 48k and 54k just 4 and 5 years earlier.

The 1988 game was blacked out also, but I watched it at home on TV in the West End of Toronto, less than 10 km from the CNE on CHEX Peterborough, a CBC affiliate which brought the game in with full audio and video...previously CHEX-TV video signal would be literally blacked out, while the audio could be heard in Toronto. I remember not being able to find one person to go with me, as most were also into the resurgent Buffalo Bills that season. I believe November 20, 1988 was one of the most darkest days for Canadian football in Toronto, as the Argos fizzled a 14-4 season with a disappointing Eastern Final loss, while the Bills had the praise of all media in not just Western New York as is expected, but even in Southern Ontario, when they clinched the AFC East division title on the same day.

It's why I hold onto the notion that blackouts have a bad effect in the long-term, especially in competitive markets because they give potential fans a reason to find something else to get into, like the NFL, the Jays or any other event. By de-exposing your product and forcing your potential fans to turn elsewhere, you're making them believe that they are not missing much anyways if it can't be important enough to show on TV....It may not be right, but that's the sentiment of people and the cause and effect of blacking out games in Southern Ontario and probably anywhere else for that matter.

[gilthethrill]

The 1988 game was blacked out also, but I watched it at home on TV in the West End of Toronto, less than 10 km from the CNE on CHEX Peterborough, a CBC affiliate which brought the game in with full audio and video...previously CHEX-TV video signal would be literally blacked out, while the audio could be heard in Toronto. I remember not being able to find one person to go with me, as most were also into the resurgent Buffalo Bills that season. I believe November 20, 1988 was one of the most darkest days for Canadian football in Toronto, as the Argos fizzled a 14-4 season with a disappointing Eastern Final loss, while the Bills had the praise of all media in not just Western New York as is expected, but even in Southern Ontario, when they clinched the AFC East division title on the same day.

Funny thing Gil, that Bills game you mention, I was there (only NFL game I have ever attended..I had my tickets prior to the Argos clinching the East)....anyway, I was in Rich stadium, in my Argo jacket, listening to the Argo game on my transistor radio..it was more interesting then the 9-6 game between the Bills & Jets...I really thought the Argos would be playing in the Grey Cup 7 days later.

[ArgoRavi]

Funny thing Gil, that Bills game you mention, I was there (only NFL game I have ever attended..I had my tickets prior to the Argos clinching the East)....anyway, I was in Rich stadium, in my Argo jacket, listening to the Argo game on my transistor radio..it was more interesting then the 9-6 game between the Bills & Jets...I really thought the Argos would be playing in the Grey Cup 7 days later.

I was in my first year at Carleton University, had my Grey Cup ticket (it cost $50 for an endzone sideline seat) and was all ready to watch the Argos in the Grey Cup in Ottawa. I thought that it was just a foregone conclusion but the Argos somehow lost to that Sean Salisbury-led Bombers and, even more sadly, the game wasn't even that close.

It is also true that the Bills were starting their peak of popularity in southern Ontario. Several of the people in my residence were from southern Ontario and they were all into the Bills and highly critical of the Argos and CFL as they had grown up watching the NFL while the Argos and Ticats were blacked out.

[argos1873]

I was at that dreary Novemeber 20th 1988 Eastern final at ol' Ex. It was probably the worst Argo game to date I had ever been to. I also remember being very disappointed in the size of the crowd. I also remember riding the TTC to the game with the group of friends I went with, and many of them were talking NFL football, but they were pretty excited about the Argos as well. I'm pretty sure this game in particular ruined a generation of fans. But I also believe the blackout hurt as well.

For me, going to a game or not going has always been a matter of economics, or prior commitments. I have never thought I would rather watch at home. The other thing is, if the Argos were guaranteed the majority of their games, on a Sunday for example, I would probably be a season ticket holder. But their games are all over the place, and I can't commit. The Argos and the CFL still need the blackout lifted, as they I believe they don't have the force in the market needed yet to be able to force people to buy tickets. Although, in some way I still think the blackout or lack there of is a catch 22.

I would rather be there today, but I can't afford it. Maybe they should open the 500s for 10 bucks, I would always be there. :)

[Will]

I was in my first year at Carleton University, had my Grey Cup ticket (it cost $50 for an endzone sideline seat) and was all ready to watch the Argos in the Grey Cup in Ottawa. I thought that it was just a foregone conclusion but the Argos somehow lost to that Sean Salisbury-led Bombers and, even more sadly, the game wasn't even that close.

It is also true that the Bills were starting their peak of popularity in southern Ontario. Several of the people in my residence were from southern Ontario and they were all into the Bills and highly critical of the Argos and CFL as they had grown up watching the NFL while the Argos and Ticats were blacked out.

Were you at a game earlier in the '88 season when the Argos beat Ottawa 49-7 or something like that?

[ArgoRavi]

Were you at a game earlier in the '88 season when the Argos beat Ottawa 49-7 or something like that?

No, that was on Thanksgiving weekend so I went home to northeastern Ontario instead.

[Gill The Thrill]

Were you at a game earlier in the '88 season when the Argos beat Ottawa 49-7 or something like that?

I remember that '88 Argos team whipping the Rough Riders in Ottawa by a score of 52-3 late in the season...is this the game you're talking about. They may have beaten them again as they did meet 3 teams that season, and it was an 18 game schedule. The Argos also beat them in the 1988 home opener, 34-11....in what was the first Argo home crowd that was below 20k since the mid 60's.

[ArgoRavi]

I remember that '88 Argos team whipping the Rough Riders in Ottawa by a score of 52-3 late in the season...is this the game you're talking about. They may have beaten them again as they did meet 3 teams that season, and it was an 18 game schedule. The Argos also beat them in the 1988 home opener, 34-11....in what was the first Argo home crowd that was below 20k since the mid 60's.

I believe that there were two Argo games in Ottawa that season. One was in August, I think, and the other on the Saturday of Thanksgiving weekend. The Argos won both games handily.

[Will]

<tbody>
1988 season:
Week 2 (http://shrpsports.com/cfl/stand.php?link=Y&season=1988&divcnf=div&week=Week%202)
Wed Jul 20 1988
at Tor
Toronto (http://shrpsports.com/cfl/teamseas.php?link=Y&team=Tor&season=1988) 34, Ottawa (http://shrpsports.com/cfl/teamseas.php?link=Y&team=Ott&season=1988) 11



1988 season:
Week 4 (http://shrpsports.com/cfl/stand.php?link=Y&season=1988&divcnf=div&week=Week%204)
Tue Aug 2 1988
at Ott
Toronto (http://shrpsports.com/cfl/teamseas.php?link=Y&team=Tor&season=1988) 41, Ottawa (http://shrpsports.com/cfl/teamseas.php?link=Y&team=Ott&season=1988) 7



1988 season:
Week 13 (http://shrpsports.com/cfl/stand.php?link=Y&season=1988&divcnf=div&week=Week%2013)
Sat Oct 8 1988
at Ott
Toronto (http://shrpsports.com/cfl/teamseas.php?link=Y&team=Tor&season=1988) 52, Ottawa (http://shrpsports.com/cfl/teamseas.php?link=Y&team=Ott&season=1988) 3



1988 season:
Week 14 (http://shrpsports.com/cfl/stand.php?link=Y&season=1988&divcnf=div&week=Week%2014)
Fri Oct 14 1988
at Tor
Toronto (http://shrpsports.com/cfl/teamseas.php?link=Y&team=Tor&season=1988) 49, Ottawa (http://shrpsports.com/cfl/teamseas.php?link=Y&team=Ott&season=1988) 7


</tbody>


Source: http://shrpsports.com/cfl/result.php
(http://shrpsports.com/cfl/result.php)
Gill the crowd at that home opener was announced as 20,114.