Argofans

paulwoods13 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 18, 2024 4:00 pm

Argoriffic wrote: ↑Wed Sep 18, 2024 2:50 pm If you look at CFL ratings, the Argos are one of the top rating generators. People like watching the Argos on TV (maybe not going to the games in person). Better ratings = better ad revenue. This was the main reason (I believe) in why Bell bought the Argos the first time, then merged them into MLSE.

Also, the cost to run the Argos is what? 10 Million? Pocket change.

Yes, Argos draw good ratings. But there are no broadcasters other than Bell interested in CFL rights. Consequently, the CFL's broadcast rights are not going to go up significantly in value -- it's simple supply and demand. And traditional TV (including over-the-air broadcast and cable) is dying a slow death. Maybe streaming services will enter the picture some day, but the value of a nine-team league that plays different rules than the behemoths next door and has next to no following outside Canada will not be high.

As for what it costs to run the Argos, $10M is probably too low since the publicly owned teams have reported expenses quite a bit higher than that. Even with whatever synergy comes from being part of MLSE, it's extremely doubtful the Argos as a stand-alone business turn anything close to a profit. Again, I don't see why Bell would buy back in.

Ok, $20 Million. Still pocket change for Bell and MLSE.

But I think you are missing something here regarding Sports Broadcasting: It is the only content that people watch live (except for the one offs ie. the Oscars, and like Presidential Debates). Advertisers find that extremely valuable as less people will PVR it and skip through the commercials. This is true for streaming services as well - btw have you seen the ads for TSN+? Because of this we have seen sports right fees go through the roof for the major sports leagues. Now I am not stating that the CFL is in the NFL, MLB, NHL, NBA and EPL level, but in Canada for live Summer content? There are only 2 leagues: MLB (Blue Jays) and CFL - I guess golf too but whatever.

I legitimately think one of the reasons that the Jays have not merged with MLSE yet is for their content to be exclusively on Sportsnet and not have the rights shared with TSN. I also remember Sportsnet making noise about wanting to split CFL games with TSN.

If the Argos fold, it would be bad news for TSN's and now CTV's main summer live programming, and it would severely weaken the CFL as value as a live sports property. TSN would have to fill all of Thursday, Friday, Saturday and Sunday summer nights with sports that less Canadians would care about.

That is why I think Bell would re-purchase the Argos back from MLSE if the Argos where indeed put on the open market.

$20M in "pocket change" is still real money. Bell has closed all kinds of radio stations in recent years, and has laid off some of TSN's on-air personalities (and personalities for other properties it owns). Like every publicly traded corporation, it strives above all else to drive shareholder value. The idea that it would buy a money-losing entity like the Argos and keep it operating indefinitely to protect the value of one of the broadcast rights it holds strikes me as magical thinking.

Yes, people still love live sports programming. But again, there is zero evidence anyone will bid against Bell for CFL rights when they come up for renewal. I've argued before, and still believe, that a good case can be made that Bell has overpaid for those rights, given that no one else is bidding. Bell undoubtedly would be happy to hold on to CFL rights beyond the current contract (assuming its broadcast properties all still exist when that rolls around), but it can do that without buying a CFL team. The loss of the Argos from the league would definitely be a blow to the league and to ratings, but an eight-team league would still offer four games a week to a broadcaster.

paulwoods13 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 18, 2024 7:02 pm. The loss of the Argos from the league would definitely be a blow to the league and to ratings, but an eight-team league would still offer four games a week to a broadcaster.

I don’t want to come across over dramatic but I believe the loss of any franchise and a return to 8 teams would really cripple the league. And for that disappearing team to be from the biggest market in the country?

For a league that is struggling hard with credibility on a national scale as it currently sits, I think losing the Argos would mean the eventual loss of the league or at the very least a significant change where it becomes very much a regional entity. Yes they can still do four games a week but the overall inventory drops which certainly would decrease the media rights deal - especially because to your point, only one bidder appears interested in it.

I totally understand why today’s news is not only worrisome for the Argos but the entire CFL.

This is profoundly disturbing news.

The only way this could work out well is if Rogers realizes a popular and successful Argos franchise would actually increase their chances of landing an NFL franchise, but still fail in their quest to get one.

Let’s all just be positive and see how this plays out. I can see Rogers going after the broadcast rights and farming them out to CBC like they do for HNIC.
I truly believe the only reason Rogers shits on the league is because they don’t make any money off it. That would change if they get the broadcast rights.

With Rogers now owning the Leafs, Jays and Raptors as major sporting properties, I can see them divesting in TFC and the Argos unless they want the latter properties for broadcasting purposes.

AngeloV wrote: ↑Wed Sep 18, 2024 8:37 pm Let’s all just be positive and see how this plays out. I can see Rogers going after the broadcast rights and farming them out to CBC like they do for HNIC.
I truly believe the only reason Rogers shits on the league is because they don’t make any money off it. That would change if they get the broadcast rights.

There are just no other Doman's or PK Pelea-dough types out there who might think of buying the Argos, and at such an exorbitant cost likely. Totally impossible !

Hail Rogers though; such a wonderful and Canadian caring Corp = it's truly amazing & awesome. Gawd bless the "share-holders".

Bingo_Arms wrote: ↑Wed Sep 18, 2024 7:59 pm

paulwoods13 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 18, 2024 7:02 pm. The loss of the Argos from the league would definitely be a blow to the league and to ratings, but an eight-team league would still offer four games a week to a broadcaster.

I don’t want to come across over dramatic but I believe the loss of any franchise and a return to 8 teams would really cripple the league. And for that disappearing team to be from the biggest market in the country?

For a league that is struggling hard with credibility on a national scale as it currently sits, I think losing the Argos would mean the eventual loss of the league or at the very least a significant change where it becomes very much a regional entity. Yes they can still do four games a week but the overall inventory drops which certainly would decrease the media rights deal - especially because to your point, only one bidder appears interested in it.

I totally understand why today’s news is not only worrisome for the Argos but the entire CFL.

I agree, the notion of this league surviving with 8 teams after losing the franchise in their biggest market is naive at best.

On the surface this isn’t great news but we’ve been through crisis after crisis with both the Argonauts and the CFL for decades.
Let’s see how things play out.

Bingo_Arms wrote: ↑Wed Sep 18, 2024 7:59 pm I don’t want to come across over dramatic but I believe the loss of any franchise and a return to 8 teams would really cripple the league. And for that disappearing team to be from the biggest market in the country?

For a league that is struggling hard with credibility on a national scale as it currently sits, I think losing the Argos would mean the eventual loss of the league or at the very least a significant change where it becomes very much a regional entity. Yes they can still do four games a week but the overall inventory drops which certainly would decrease the media rights deal - especially because to your point, only one bidder appears interested in it.

I totally understand why today’s news is not only worrisome for the Argos but the entire CFL.

I totally agree that the death of the Argos, if it were to occur, would be terrible for the league. My point about an eight-team schedule was simply in rebuttal to the notion that Bell might buy the Argos to maximize its broadcast rights. Bell is not buying the Argos.