Argos Stadium Update

[Mulder]

Well it's nice to hear Beeston actually care about the Argonauts. So it looks like the Argos better get on a plan for a stadium ASAP.
As far as the real sod the Jays will have a serious construction site on their hands there. I guess money is no option but the constuction crews will be glad the roof is closed as I'm sure it'll be a 24 hour a day job site. It won't be as matter of fact as Beeston makes it sound. They'll need most if not all of an offseason for that.
Interesting times ahead.

What I got out of it is that it isn't a question of if it's going to happen but when.

[gilthethrill]

What I got out of it is that it isn't a question of if it's going to happen but when.

I heard the interview as well & agree with you Mulder that it is only a matter of time. I still however agree with 1argoholic in the sense that Rogers are pretty much pigheaded in making all the changes required.

[1argoholic]

Beeston spoke well about the topic and if they are one of only two MLB teams that still play on turf I can see why they want to get back to real grass. Oh it's going to be done according to Beeston. I still think although it can be done in that dome it'll be a very costly to not only build but maintain. Should be very interesting to see if they have to install new grass year in and year out. He talked about removing it after year end. It would be crazy to store it in a huge facility and keep it alive and maintained. I don't know how it'll all pan out but it looks like we'll be in a new stadium somehow. Our Canadian weather and that dome makes live grass a whole different kettle of fish year round. I can't wait to see how they deal with it all. Some unique problems for the Jays.

Nice to have that kind on money to toss around.

[Argocister]

Nice article...

http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/blogs/cfl...232200351.html

Could we see a Ford Football Complex? .... May stop his NFL dream....

[Argo57]

The Blue Jays better be careful themselves, baseball in Toronto has been on a steady decline since the glory days 20 years ago. It is no sure thing that the resurgence of interest in them will be sustained if they continue to fall flat as they have so far this year.
As a diehard Argonaut fan I would love to see them find a new home with 25-30000 seats, too bad the previous ownership missed the boat at BMO field, location and stadium size would have been perfect.
The Argonauts may still end up at BMO as I am not convinced that Toronto FC will maintain their following if they continue to flounder year after year.

[ArgoRavi]

The Blue Jays better be careful themselves, baseball in Toronto has been on a steady decline since the glory days 20 years ago. It is no sure thing that the resurgence of interest in them will be sustained if they continue to fall flat as they have so far this year.
As a diehard Argonaut fan I would love to see them find a new home with 25-30000 seats, too bad the previous ownership missed the boat at BMO field, location and stadium size would have been perfect.
The Argonauts may still end up at BMO as I am not convinced that Toronto FC will maintain their following if they continue to flounder year after year.

FC doesn't seem to sell out much anymore and there always seem to be a decent number of empty seats at BMO Field whenever I tune into one of their games so interest appears to have declined somewhat over the last couple of years.

[Will]

I tuned into the TFC home game last weekend and the sideline grandstands were only about 1/3rd full, well into the game. While one endzone was packed, the other endzone was only half full. They claimed 16,100 attendance but that was probably ticket sales, with about 8,000-10,000 actual fans in the park. I realize it was an inclement day in Toronto but the league does start-up in March, so it goes with the territory. Their season drags on all year with the title game being played after the Grey Cup (not that anyone would notice, the ratings were terrible in Canada & U.S.)

Yes, despite the ballooning player salaries and the media adoration, the Blue Jays have been in decline for many years. Ted Rogers admitted in a 2008 Macleans article, that he'd lost $300,000,000 on the Blue Jays since he bought the team. It was widely reported the Jays were losing $50 million a year when Rogers bought the franchise in 2000. Even with increased attendance the Jays will likely lose substantially more money this season. These losses may be acceptable for a huge corporation like Rogers but it doesn't change the fact that interest in baseball is declining across North America.

BMO does seem the best option for the Argos. I realize it's a "football"-only stadium at this time, but Soccer Canada did spend nearly $1 million on an architectural-design for a multi-purpose stadium on the site, to be shared by the Argos and TFC. The Argos did back-out of that project but Soccer Canada did change their mind once, so perhaps they could change it again and accommodate the Argos at the city-owed stadium.

I highly doubt it.

[T-Bone]

FC doesn't seem to sell out much anymore

Which one? AFC or TFC?

BMO does seem the best option for the Argos. I realize it's a "football"-only stadium at this time, but Soccer Canada did spend nearly $1 million on an architectural-design for a multi-purpose stadium on the site, to be shared by the Argos and TFC. The Argos did back-out of that project but Soccer Canada did change their mind once, so perhaps they could change it again and accommodate the Argos at the city-owed stadium.

It's not a matter of the CSA changing their mind. It's a matter of cost to renovate the stadium. I highly doubt the stadium will be renovated unless the Argos come up with the funds to do it, then it would be up to the city to make the decision as they own the building. The Argos would still be the second tenants in the building as MLSE is still in control of management.

[Argo57]

It's just a matter of negotiation. BMO is being under-utilized with the waning interest in TFC and sporadic use by the national Soccer team. Certainly 10 football games a year could be accommodated there. It's not like sharing with a baseball team which plays 29 days a month. MLS teams can go on 5-week road trips, like the Whitecaps have just endured.[/QUOTE]


100% agree with Invader an idle stadium does no one any good. Long term would be an extremely viable option for all involved!!

[Midnight Blue]

It's just a matter of negotiation. BMO is being under-utilized with the waning interest in TFC and sporadic use by the national Soccer team. Certainly 10 football games a year could be accommodated there. It's not like sharing with a baseball team which plays 29 days a month. MLS teams can go on 5-week road trips, like the Whitecaps have just endured.

100% agree with Invader an idle stadium does no one any good. Long term would be an extremely viable option for all involved!![/QUOTE]

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I keep reading that the move to the Skydome was because of a few rain-soaked/ windy games. I was at a few of those games, but I was boozing, and whenever I'm boozing, the weather takes a low priority. Mind you I've ridden through rain-storms on a motorcycle many times in the past (just one beer, before leaving) while going up north camping, and my great ancestors were Vikings, who formed what is now the Ukraine. So naturally, I am tougher than most men. But I suspect that perhaps the fans of the late Seventies and early Eighties were just getting spoiled. The Argos had great attendance back then, and then many became yuppies, and started to have kids, and their parents were getting older too, so the "waaah, waaah, we don't want to get rained on" chant was probably at the height of its infamy.

Put on an effin' raincoat! Grow some cohones! Bring a flask of Whiskey, or Whisky, and your favourite wicked Kitten. But no. The fans were spoiled, and there was no going back.


My point is, that after years in the sterile Skydome, this city may be ready for an outdoor Stadium. It would be a novelty, while at the same time a throw-back to a glorious tradition. Or maybe it's just me.

There's gotta be somewhere, on those hallowed grounds, where a Stadium can be built.

Tear down BMO field, and put in a proper Stadium. If it is walled in, then the wind in November shouldn't be a problem. Put some roof-covers over the back three-quarters of the seating area, to accommodate whiners. Funding will be a concern, but then funding is always a concern, at most new Stadiums. It can be done.

Sponsors can be found. Make it a 60,000+ arena, natural grass, for Football and Soccer. And Cricket. And Aussie Rules Football. Now there's a sport. Also, I'm one of the few, if not the only fan on this site, who isn't afraid of an NFL team in Toronto. We all keep talking about how our CFL game is more exciting, so why are people afraid of the NFL? The Gods of Football are not thrilled about timidity. Let's flood this town with Football!

Fortune favours the Bold !


Ka' Pla !

[Argo57]

I always enjoyed the games at exhibition stadium back in the day. Picture the Argonauts playing outside in the elements in a smaller stadium (On natural Grass)!!!!
Doesn't get any better than that!!!

[bluto]

...Ted Rogers admitted in a 2008 Macleans article, that he'd lost $300,000,000 on the Blue Jays since he bought the team...

anyone who believes this, please PM me as i have a great opportunity for you to purchase the Bloor Viaduct.

[Will]

Toronto FC is 1-2-2 so far this year making it too early to form any conclusions about how they may or may not perform, but yes the empty seats do seem to be getting more frequent at BMO.

[tc23]

Pro sports also appeared on Rogers’s radar, despite the fact that Rogers himself wasn’t a sports fan. He bought the Toronto Blue Jays in 2000 and later the SkyDome stadium where they played, renaming it the Rogers Centre. Again, it was despite the better judgment of some board members and close advisers. Though the team continued to be a massive money-loser—roughly $300 million in losses by 2008—he would later explain it was about more than the bottom line. “Don’t get me wrong: $300 million is a lot of money,” Rogers stated. “But I take a broader view. We would have paid the same money just for the equivalent branding opportunity.” Ownership of the stadium also opened the door to a five-year, US$78-million deal in 2008 to bring the NFL Buffalo Bills to play eight games in Toronto.

http://www2.macleans.ca/2011/05/18/t...of-ted-rogers/

In addition, Rogers has lost their shirt on the Bills Series.

[T-Bone]

the federal government did buy new FIFA-approved FieldTurf for BMO, that they probably have in storage?

I believe that FieldTurf was donated to a school as it was demand to be at the end of its lifespan for professional use. They were going to replace it if the grass wasn't approved. Either way it was to small for CFL use and FieldTurf is a minor expense in the overall picture of renovating BMO Field. The question is would the city vote to have a 5 million dollar natural surface system that their tenant paid for in favour of putting FieldTurf back in to the building again.

[Argocister]

........... The question is would the city vote to have a 5 million dollar natural surface system that their tenant paid for in favour of putting FieldTurf back in to the building again.

Would the city council really need to vote on that? I would think that if a contract was drawn up that allowed for renovation to the BMO , it would be an all inclusive contract.... otherwise, if the council is voting piecemeal..... forget it. Never know with T.O

[Treblecharger1]

BMO field is not used for concerts for the simple reason that it is a city owned buliding and they have to use unionized employees when putting events on. Toronto has a real need for a midsized concert venue between 20-30,000 fans. Molson Ampitheater has 16k and Rogers Centre is 55k

[mchesher03]

For the new stadium and Khalif Mitchell related discussion alone I am very interested in what will be said during the Town Hall next month.

[Midnight Blue]

Ruling out Downsview and the Portlands (both hard to get to {during rush-hour} on weekday games --- which we should have during July/August, since many people head up north during weekends), and ruling out Varsity (on the subway line, but no parking, and U of T plus local resident opposition), at least three possible previously unmentioned sites may be considered: a stadium somewhere else on the Exhibition grounds, such as west of Dufferin St., or east of the the present BMO stadium (both are parking lots, and are needed for parking during the annual Canadian National Exhibition -- around August 18 to Labour Day) though a stadium on either of these sites, would have to have at least three serious levels of underground parking.

Alternately, the third option would be a stadium on new re-claimed land on the lake, on Ontario Place, or on newly built-up land just beside/attached to, Ontario Place. And if a casino is built somewhere in this vicinity (Downtown Toronto), perhaps a stipulation might be a promise to build a multi-purpose, open air with some covered seating, grass Stadium, 60,000+, for Football and Soccer (as well as Cricket and Aussie Rules Football, and possibly NFL --- of which I'm not afraid of, as mentioned earlier in this thread, and maybe some concerts), using a portion of the Casino profits, in say 5-7-10 years.

Parts of the sides of this stadium (perhaps the corners) can be walled in with a heavy-duty plexi-glass-like removable material (attached to a vertical skeleton grid), to keep out late-autumn winds, allow summer breezes, and give a beautiful view of the lake, no matter what the season.

Parking would at one of the two present CNE lots, or at both, if the stadium is built on or adjacent to Ontario Place. A boat-load of buses can be rented/chartered from the TTC, to come from the Dufferin and Bathurst and Union subway stations, and let's not forget that the GO Train has a stop right at the CNE.

Furthermore, anywhere on the CNE grounds or at Ontario Place, or on new ground on the actual Lake (perhaps a stadium in the shape of an Argonaut boat), would have the advantage of having people driving into the city during weekday evening rush-hour (hence against the outgoing traffic flow). On weekends during September, October and November (playoffs), getting there would be even less of a hassle. Of course, if the Argos were the principal tenants or owners of such a hypothetical stadium, they could even play some games during July/August on weekends, which might work, even though many people head up north in the summer, as mentioned above. Just a few thoughts. But in several years, this situation will be much more poignant than these mere hypothetical musings. The time for serious thought on this matter, begins now.


To summarize : A portion of Casino profits = no new taxes/road tolls, plus an Argonaut Stadium in the near future.



Ka' Pla !

[jerrym]

I think the Animals summed it up best:

In this dirty old part of the city

Where the sun refused to shine

People tell me, there ain't no use in tryin' ...
We gotta get out of this place!
If it's the last thing we ever do ...
There's a better life for me and you ...
Somewhere, ... somehow, I know it
Believe me, ... I know it, you know it too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUpBSvN1a50